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#1 Posted by laserbolts (5319 posts) -

This is indeed a sad day for many hockey fans around the world. Tonight is the deadline for the NHL and the NHLPA to come to some sort of agreement so that the NHL will have a season. I do not know the specifics but it has to do with players not getting a big enough cut from the league's revenue and the owners saying fuck you guys. This all means that the league will be in a lockout and we get no hockey until this is sorted out. The last time this kind of thing happened we went a full season with no hockey. This is horrible for me. God dammit. Anyways sports fans what are your views on this kind of stuff? Should players just take a pay cut and suck it up? Should the owners stop being such greedy pricks?

#2 Posted by Bocam (3721 posts) -

Both sides are greedy fucks.

#3 Posted by csl316 (8458 posts) -

After spending a week talking about the Chicago teacher strike here, I've realized that strikes or work stoppages of any kind make all the sides look like bastards.

#4 Edited by SmilingPig (1337 posts) -

Watch junior hockey its way better anyway.

#5 Posted by Little_Socrates (5675 posts) -

Man, I guess NHL 13 will continue to sell, huh?

#6 Posted by Patman99 (1579 posts) -

The owners are made out to be the bad guys but in reality they are the ones talking sense. Players should fight for their salaries but they should also realise that if the owners do not get a bigger slice of the pie, some of the poorer teams may slowly fade away. I don't think the owners are being that diplomatic but the players do not seem to quite grasp the severity of the situation.

#7 Posted by laserbolts (5319 posts) -

Wish I could reply but I can't. I'm not taking sides here they're all pricks and basically giving the fans that make the league what it is a huge fuck you. I have watched NHL and junior hockey. Junior is great and very entertaining but NHL games blow it away.

#8 Posted by nick_verissimo (1383 posts) -

@Patman99 said:

The owners are made out to be the bad guys but in reality they are the ones talking sense. Players should fight for their salaries but they should also realise that if the owners do not get a bigger slice of the pie, some of the poorer teams may slowly fade away. I don't think the owners are being that diplomatic but the players do not seem to quite grasp the severity of the situation.

Definitely agree with you, but by the same token, the league is far too big and can't support those small market teams. Either teams need to fold or be re-located in order to have a healthy league; look at what moving Atlanta to Winnipeg has done for a team that always qualified for revenue sharing. I can understand the league being fearful of moving more teams to Canada, based on whether or not the Canadian dollar can stay as strong as it is currently, but all this pussy footing isn't going to keep the bottom ten teams viable much longer.

#9 Posted by me3639 (1753 posts) -

Yea i agree, but there is always the WCHA which has the best college Hockey.

#10 Posted by Bulby33 (589 posts) -

Yeah it's a bummer.

#11 Posted by Sanity (1896 posts) -

It sucks and no matter who wins we lose.

#12 Posted by the_OFFICIAL_jAPanese_teaBAG (4308 posts) -

So the players arent getting the money that the owners agreed to get?  Im not really educated when it comes to the situation but a deal is a deal.  Arent the owners rich motherfuckers anyway?

#13 Posted by Atlas (2436 posts) -

Maybe somebody with more knowledge on the situation and of ice hockey in general - I'm not a fan - can elaborate on this, but the case of the Phoenix Coyotes is very interesting to me, and I wonder if its symptomatic of the clash between players and owners that is causing the potential lockout.

For the past three seasons the Phoenix Coyotes have been owned by NHL after the previous owner declared bankruptcy. The team has failed to find a new home owner for the franchise in Arizona, nor settled on a plan to relocate the franchise, however the clock seems to be ticking as the franchise remains in the red. And how did the Coyotes do competitively during this time? Three straight playoff appearances, and this past season they made it to the Conference finals for the first time, losing to the Kings who then went on to be Stanley Cup winners. And they still can't put enough butts in the seats to survive, nor attract significant interest from potential new owners.

So with this in mind, is this why the owners are playing hard ball with the players and refusing to let them have their concessions? Are they concerned about more teams going the way of the Coyotes?

#14 Posted by ssj4raditz (1125 posts) -

I was planning on going to a couple of games this season too! Bummer.

#15 Posted by Rabid619 (1095 posts) -

Fuck, dudes, this sucks. As someone who watches 100+ games per season, not including playoffs, this is not going to be fun at all. Hockey is the only sport I watch (unless you include wrestling), so I really don't have any other things to fall back on.

Who will I put my hopeless dreams into this year now that my Maple Leafs aren't playing?

#16 Posted by AjayRaz (12424 posts) -

this sucks, but i don't know the details. i only occasionally watch hockey, and i'm definitely not as big of a follower as most of the people around me. i was going to a pre-season game, too which isn't a big deal i guess but i love watching hockey live.

#17 Posted by Patman99 (1579 posts) -

@Atlas said:

Maybe somebody with more knowledge on the situation and of ice hockey in general - I'm not a fan - can elaborate on this, but the case of the Phoenix Coyotes is very interesting to me, and I wonder if its symptomatic of the clash between players and owners that is causing the potential lockout.

For the past three seasons the Phoenix Coyotes have been owned by NHL after the previous owner declared bankruptcy. The team has failed to find a new home owner for the franchise in Arizona, nor settled on a plan to relocate the franchise, however the clock seems to be ticking as the franchise remains in the red. And how did the Coyotes do competitively during this time? Three straight playoff appearances, and this past season they made it to the Conference finals for the first time, losing to the Kings who then went on to be Stanley Cup winners. And they still can't put enough butts in the seats to survive, nor attract significant interest from potential new owners.

So with this in mind, is this why the owners are playing hard ball with the players and refusing to let them have their concessions? Are they concerned about more teams going the way of the Coyotes?

You basically have it right. The owners are claiming that if they do not cut players' salaries and increase the amount of revenue sharing between the teams, then the smaller markets will not be able to survive. The real problem is that there is a "salary cap" which is the max a team can spend on salaries, and a "salary floor" which is the minimum teams must spend on salaries. If I understand it correctly, the poor teams are not able, in some cases, to make the salary floor. The NHL is worried that the 15 or so teams that are considered "small market" will be in similar situations of Atlanta a few years ago and Phoenix today. The Coyotes remained competitive because they had a core group of 'ok' players that stayed with the team.

The owners are playing hard ball because they know that they can use the lockout as a leverage tool AND because they are right to a certain extent. If I am not mistaken the owners want the players to have 47% market share and the players want 52% market share. I am not an economist but split the damn difference and say 50%. Another issue is that the players, for the most part, do not really understand the financial aspects of the NHL and essentially just listen to whatever the head of the NHLPA tells them. A good point I heard was that if the players accept the owners 47% term now and avoid a lockout then they would still make more money in the long run than in if they miss half or even a whole NHL season.

The owners will never cave. The players are the reason we watch the game but at the end of it, they are all fairly expendable. If they all moved to the KHL in Russia, I doubt that all NHL fans would move their allegiance.

#18 Posted by Dagbiker (6972 posts) -

I think that all sports are dumb. And will continue to think that until something that I would like to do is considered a sport. Like Gaming, or Looking up porn, or something.

#19 Posted by laserbolts (5319 posts) -

Thank you for that Dagbiker. Hopefully making irrelevant useless comments or padding post count will become a sport.

#20 Posted by Bocam (3721 posts) -

@Dagbiker said:

I think that all sports are dumb. And will continue to think that until something that I would like to do is considered a sport. Like Gaming, or Looking up porn, or something.

There's a masturbation competition in Japan.

#21 Posted by busted1der (199 posts) -

I've actually started watching football. Hopefully we get some hockey because hockey is the only sport that I regularly watch.

#22 Posted by Dagbiker (6972 posts) -

@Bocam said:

@Dagbiker said:

I think that all sports are dumb. And will continue to think that until something that I would like to do is considered a sport. Like Gaming, or Looking up porn, or something.

There's a masturbation competition in Japan.

You just reminded me why porn should never be a sport.

#23 Posted by bigsmoke77 (788 posts) -

@Patman99: The owners have blown off any idea of revenue sharing. I agree that the owners are being made out to be worse than they actually are but its REALLY hard to see their point of view when the Philadelphia Flyers (which have unlimited amount of money behind them because they are owned by comcast) give a contract offer of 110 million dollars to a RFA which forced Nashville to match it. Nashville lost money last year, how are they suppose to make a profit now when they have to pay 13 million dollars to a player at the start of each season. The players have to give up some of their piece of the pie but the rich owners are going to have to spread their wealth around.

#24 Posted by rcath (364 posts) -

I think the owners are more at fault here. Season would have gone on fine if they did not want more from the players.

#25 Posted by Patman99 (1579 posts) -

@bigsmoke77: I totally agree. Both sides need to give in. Unfortunately, the owners always seem to hold the higher ground when it comes to negotiating.

#26 Posted by jonnyboy (2920 posts) -

@Bocam said:

@Dagbiker said:

I think that all sports are dumb. And will continue to think that until something that I would like to do is considered a sport. Like Gaming, or Looking up porn, or something.

There's a masturbation competition in Japan.

If ever there was a sentence with the power to surprise absolutely nobody, that was probably it.

#27 Posted by bigsmoke77 (788 posts) -
#28 Posted by devilzrule27 (1239 posts) -

They wont.

#29 Edited by Fredchuckdave (5353 posts) -

Hockey isn't an era of unprecedented success like the NFL so narrowing it down to "greed" is a bit more difficult (NFL is just horrible greedy fuckbags by comparison, way to not have the actual refs and kill the first 3 games of the season); they need to have some balance between the two parties, but it is always a shame when there's a cancelled season and the NHL will take quite the popularity hit despite being relatively successful since the previous labor agreement.

Edit: If they don't take the 50/50 you can call the players assholes all you like, that's as good as you can hope for non NBA's previously ridiculous split.

#30 Posted by c0l0nelp0c0rn1 (1807 posts) -

@laserbolts said:

Anyways sports fans what are your views on this kind of stuff?

I think that players should seriously reconsider the lifestyle they are living if six figures doesn't suit their fancy. On the other hand, these owners are usually going to make money hand-over-fist anyways...so...insure your players better? That sounds like something that should happen.

#31 Posted by GrantHeaslip (1565 posts) -

The Leafs haven't made it to the playoffs for nearing on a decade, so this is just staving off another year of inevitable disappointment (or in my case, not caring since I know better).

#32 Posted by Ravenlight (8040 posts) -

Stop paying these fuckers to do anything. If they win, they get to live. If their team takes the cup, the owners get to live.

Losers get zamboni'd into the ice as a permanent reminder of failure.

#33 Posted by devilzrule27 (1239 posts) -

@Ravenlight said:

Stop paying these fuckers to do anything. If they win, they get to live. If their team takes the cup, the owners get to live.

Losers get zamboni'd into the ice as a permanent reminder of failure.

I like your idea

#34 Posted by tripmills (25 posts) -

@Bocam said:

@Dagbiker said:

I think that all sports are dumb. And will continue to think that until something that I would like to do is considered a sport. Like Gaming, or Looking up porn, or something.

There's a masturbation competition in Japan.

Why do I believe that.

Born and bread Phila Flyers fan here. Old enough to have taken part in our 2 cup parades even.

You know what really sucks about the lockout? I use the ScoreBoard widget on my phone and it has been reminding me of the next scheduled game(s)....that aren't happening. Its like a kick in the teeth.

#35 Posted by Revan_NL (336 posts) -

Why cancel the entire season if they can't reach an agreement? I don't really follow hockey, but last year the NBA cancelled the first month of the season. The new CBA was agreed upon a week or so before the shortened season kicked off

#36 Posted by CaLe (3959 posts) -

I can't even imagine how I would feel if a season of Breaking Bad was cancelled. Maybe this is like that for you. If so, that sucks.

#37 Posted by bigsmoke77 (788 posts) -

@Revan_NL: Because the NHL wanted to reduce player salaries by 13 percent and put a cap on contract length, there was no limit before. They have now changed the number to a 7% decrease and it looks like they will get a deal and still play the whole season.

#38 Posted by bigsmoke77 (788 posts) -

Well I hope you guys like watching CHL and other kinds of hockey because the NHL players are idiots.

#39 Posted by Hockeymask27 (3683 posts) -

Turning down a the 50/50 deal is one thing if its because of secondary issues. But to throw out new split ratio's shows the players are no better than the owners.

#40 Posted by Yadilie (380 posts) -

At first I was mad that there would be no NHL this year. Then I realized I could go a year without having to watch a terrible overpaid goalie flounder leads and be unable to stop easy shots.

Fuck you Holgrem. And especially fuck you Bryzgalov. Now with terrible goalie backup Leighton! Woo hoo. Flyers sure are going places!

#41 Edited by Sanity (1896 posts) -

Yea, after yesterday im really losing hope of there being a season. Its ridiculous, they should just lock themselves in a room and get it done instead of this constant back and forth bullshit.

The owners have to realize that there not going to weasle out of paying on contracts in full that they already signed. Its really disgusting.

#42 Posted by MocBucket62 (1203 posts) -

This really sucks! I was hoping to see a Tampa Bay Lightning game this year with some college friends and now I'm not sure about that! Also, I want more Jonathan Quick! Best hockey player to come out of CT since Chris Drury! (I'm actually from CT, but go to college in Florida)

#43 Posted by beepmachine (618 posts) -

I think the league might need to downsize, even though they're doing everything they can to stop that from happening. Like someone said, the Coyotes had a great (for them) season last year and have been pretty solid underdogs for a while now, and they still can't get people to attend. I'm a Habs fan, and they've sucked ass for years now, for various reasons, but they sell out every game. I admire the league trying to bring hockey to other parts of the continent, but it just isn't going to work in some places. I remember watching Atlanta play and there was an ocean of empty seats.

I love the sport but I honestly don't give a shit if there's no season now. Every year there's some new bullshit happening in the league. Maybe I'll just watch basketball, I dunno.

#44 Posted by shinboy630 (1135 posts) -

@dennisthemennis: Just do what I'm doing and pick a KHL team to ironically become a massive fan of.

#45 Posted by mosespippy (4121 posts) -

Remember in 2005 when the owners offered a cap of $47 mil and the players turned it down? A canceled season later they accepted 32. I'd expect something similar to happen this time. So in the mean time I'm gonna cheer for Medicine Hat, HC Davos and St. John's.

#46 Posted by Gladiator_Games (444 posts) -
@Bocam And yet... Not suprised! :D
#47 Posted by Hunkulese (2699 posts) -
@dudy80

Yea, after yesterday im really losing hope of there being a season. Its ridiculous, they should just lock themselves in a room and get it done instead of this constant back and forth bullshit.

The owners have to realize that there not going to weasle out of paying on contracts in full that they already signed. Its really disgusting.

The owners aren't trying to weasel out of anything. Their last offer included honoring all contracts previously signed.

It's on the players now because the NHL's last offer was more than fair.
#48 Posted by haffy (673 posts) -

So, I'm European and pretty ignorant about American sports. But what's with all these leagues having trouble, and why is it only happening in America? I think I remember reading about basketball and American football having problems similar to this as well? To my knowledge, the only other times I hear about leagues stopping is during war time.

#49 Posted by MikkaQ (10283 posts) -

Sports players probably have the highest ratio of income-versus-their-contribution-to-society of any occupation ever, so yeah I think they should probably get a pay cut. They're basically doing what people do in their free time for millions of dollars. It creates cocky players who are only in it for the money too which makes the game worse in general. Also these situations happen and normal people get deprived of their entertainment because of greed, so that sucks.

@Rabid619 said:

Fuck, dudes, this sucks. As someone who watches 100+ games per season, not including playoffs, this is not going to be fun at all. Hockey is the only sport I watch (unless you include wrestling), so I really don't have any other things to fall back on.

Who will I put my hopeless dreams into this year now that my Maple Leafs aren't playing?

You could become one of those weird Toronto FC fans.

#50 Posted by mosespippy (4121 posts) -