#1 Posted by VACkillers (1060 posts) -

Is there going to be one? if so then when? and any guess estimates on how much this puppy will be? Seems as the GTX 6 series haven't dropped in price what so ever since the release of the 7 series cards, can we expect any sort of price drop soon-ish?

#2 Posted by JJWeatherman (14558 posts) -

@vackillers: There will be one. In fact, you should see them going up for sale within days. Seems they'll likely cost $299.

You'll have to watch vendors for price-drops on the 600 series.

#3 Posted by Starfishhunter9 (369 posts) -

It going to be similar in performance to the 670. The 700 series are basically rebranded 600 series cards. If you can get a good price for a 670/680 I would get it over the 760.

#4 Posted by LiquidPrince (15912 posts) -

@jjweatherman: Why is the 770 clocked much higher then the 780?

#5 Edited by ch3burashka (5041 posts) -

@jjweatherman: Why is the 770 clocked much higher then the 780?

'Cause fucking graphics cards numbers don't mean shit, from what I understand.

#6 Posted by GiroMindTricks (63 posts) -

@jjweatherman: Why is the 770 clocked much higher then the 780?

Because the 780 is using the GK110 chipset, which is what the Titan uses. The 770 uses the GK104 chipset, which is the same as the 680. The 770 is basically an overclocked 680, and the 780 is an underclocked Titan to put it simply.

#7 Posted by Devildoll (879 posts) -

It going to be similar in performance to the 670. The 700 series are basically rebranded 600 series cards. If you can get a good price for a 670/680 I would get it over the 760.

770 is a 680 running at higher frequencies, the 780 though, is not something found in the 600 series.Who knows what the 760 will turn out to be.

@liquidprince said: Why is the 770 clocked much higher then the 780?

because clock speeds aren't everything.

how come im going faster on my bicyle than you are, even though you are pedaling 5 times quicker than me...
Cause you are in first gear and im in 18th, and on top of that my tires and gears are bigger, thats why ;)

@liquidprince said:

@jjweatherman: Why is the 770 clocked much higher then the 780?

'Cause fucking graphics cards numbers don't mean shit, from what I understand.

They are actually meaningful, but only when comparing within a series, for example a 780 is guaranteed to be better than a 770.

But you cant say what card is more powerful just by looking at their label, if they are from two different series (570 vs 750 ) , let alone the other manufacturer.

#8 Posted by zenmastah (891 posts) -

Wouldnt the 780 produce much more heat if it was running at the same clocks as the 770?
You know, more transistors and shit on the 780.

#9 Edited by Devildoll (879 posts) -

Wouldnt the 780 produce much more heat if it was running at the same clocks as the 770?

You know, more transistors and shit on the 780.

the 780 has a TDP of 250 watts which is the limit of the PCI-E spec, if you make a card thirstier than this, it not only draws more power from its pci-e 6/8 pin connectors, but from the motherboard, which can be an issue on budget boards.

#10 Edited by LiquidPrince (15912 posts) -

@devildoll said:

@starfishhunter9 said:

It going to be similar in performance to the 670. The 700 series are basically rebranded 600 series cards. If you can get a good price for a 670/680 I would get it over the 760.

770 is a 680 running at higher frequencies, the 780 though, is not something found in the 600 series.Who knows what the 760 will turn out to be.

@liquidprince said: Why is the 770 clocked much higher then the 780?

because clock speeds aren't everything.

how come im going faster on my bicyle than you are, even though you are pedaling 5 times quicker than me...

Cause you are in first gear and im in 18th, and on top of that my tires and gears are bigger, thats why ;)

Thanks for the incredibly condescending explanation =P

I get that much. But architecturally, the 770 and 780 are fairly similar, with the only differences being the memory bus being 384 bit versus 256 and the bandwidth being smaller. That and the difference in ROP's. However with the stock boost in clock speeds, the 770 should be performing similarly to the 780 just by brute forcing it.

#11 Posted by JJWeatherman (14558 posts) -

@liquidprince: I'm not an expert when it comes to this stuff, but I think, architecturally, the gk104-based 770 and the gk110-based 780 are more different than is immediately apparent. I found a pretty good article here from mid 2012, before gk110 cards were released. It describes the gk110 architecture and compares it to gk104.

This paragraph seems to address your main question on clock speed:

"The GK110 is divided into five of the deep green structures above, which are almost certainly GPCs, or graphics processing clusters, nearly complete GPUs unto themselves. Each of those GPCs houses three SMX cores, and Nvidia has confirmed the chip hosts a total of 15 of those. By contrast, the GK104 has four GPCs with two SMX cores each, so the GK110 nearly doubles its per-clock processing power."

#12 Edited by GaspoweR (2960 posts) -
@jjweatherman said:

@liquidprince: I'm not an expert when it comes to this stuff, but I think, architecturally, the gk104-based 770 and the gk110-based 780 are more different than is immediately apparent. I found a pretty good article here from mid 2012, before gk110 cards were released. It describes the gk110 architecture and compares it to gk104.

This paragraph seems to address your main question on clock speed:

"The GK110 is divided into five of the deep green structures above, which are almost certainly GPCs, or graphics processing clusters, nearly complete GPUs unto themselves. Each of those GPCs houses three SMX cores, and Nvidia has confirmed the chip hosts a total of 15 of those. By contrast, the GK104 has four GPCs with two SMX cores each, so the GK110 nearly doubles its per-clock processing power."

So essentially the 780/Titan don't need to exert as much effort since they have more clusters compared to the GK104 architecture cards that have less so they have to clock at a higher speed. Man PC gaming is a cruel mistress. Sooner or later I might have to sell my current card and maybe get a 770 down the line...hmmm.... Hopefully this doesn't F up my computer since I'll be upgrading from an AMD card.

#13 Posted by JJWeatherman (14558 posts) -
@gaspower said:
@jjweatherman said:/

@liquidprince: I'm not an expert when it comes to this stuff, but I think, architecturally, the gk104-based 770 and the gk110-based 780 are more different than is immediately apparent. I found a pretty good article here from mid 2012, before gk110 cards were released. It describes the gk110 architecture and compares it to gk104.

This paragraph seems to address your main question on clock speed:

"The GK110 is divided into five of the deep green structures above, which are almost certainly GPCs, or graphics processing clusters, nearly complete GPUs unto themselves. Each of those GPCs houses three SMX cores, and Nvidia has confirmed the chip hosts a total of 15 of those. By contrast, the GK104 has four GPCs with two SMX cores each, so the GK110 nearly doubles its per-clock processing power."

So essentially the 780/Titan don't need to exert as much effort since they have more clusters compared to the GK104 architecture cards that have less so they have to clock at a higher speed. Man PC gaming is a cruel mistress. Sooner or later I might have to sell my current card and maybe get a 770 down the line...hmmm.... Hopefully this doesn't F up my computer since I'll be upgrading from an AMD card.

Right. So theoretically, all other variables being equal, a gk110 card running at half the clock speed of a gk104 card would perform just as well. Of course in reality things are likely much more nuanced. So yeah, it may not be as quick, but it's doing quite a bit more per clock cycle.

Also, you should be fine upgrading from AMD. Just uninstall Catalyst Control Center and any other AMD-specific things you wouldn't be using anymore and download the Nvidia drivers and software. Which card do you have currently?

#14 Edited by Devildoll (879 posts) -

@liquidprince: well the differences in bandwidth etc arent exactly neglectable.

ChipGTX 780GTX 770
Stream Processors23041536
Texture Units192128
ROPs4832
Core Clock863MHz1046MHz
Boost Clock900Mhz1085MHz
Memory Clock6GHz GDDR57GHz GDDR5
Memory Bus Width384-bit256-bit
Memory bandwidth
288 GB/s224 GB/s
VRAM3GB2GB
TDP250W230W

that's about it.

the shader count and bandwidth increase is pretty big, compared to the lack of frequency.
and since it is running kind of slow you can crank it up to 770 frequency on your own if you would like.
and since it is a lot of hardware you are speeding up, all those 2304 shaders etc, the performance gains will be substantial.

where as the 770 is an overclocked 680, and probably doesnt have as big a headroom in frequency as the 780 has.

#15 Edited by GaspoweR (2960 posts) -

@jjweatherman: Radeon HD 7870 (XFX Black Edition). I bought it recently, back in late March when I was building my rig. Right now it's doing a good enough job since I only have a single monitor, 1920x1080 set-up and I'm one of the weirdos who play games windowed since I kinda just play in spurts at a time during weekends and I can't really play in long stretches, just in between breaks while I'm reviewing. My backlog right now is incredibly stacked. I've yet to go through Bioshock Infinite and Metro: Last Light.


#16 Edited by VACkillers (1060 posts) -

GTX 760s are out now... and at an amazing price as well, $249. Thats just such a good price bracket...

#17 Edited by Devildoll (879 posts) -

GTX 760s are out now... and at an amazing price as well, $249. Thats just such a good price bracket...

i dont think its that exciting, atleast here in sweden it is priced just above the 660 ti, and it does perform slightly better as well.

however, they are both built on GK104, and the 760 is gimped on pretty much everything cept busswidth, giving it an edge in bandwidth, as well as every frequency on it being higher than the 660 ti.

the 760 has a tdp that is 20 watts higher than the 660 ti, because of these higher frequencies mostly.

looking around at some oc results, both cards oc to about the same freqencies, with the 760 having a slight edge.
I'd almost bet that a 660 ti might outperform it in general when both cards are running max frequencies.

#18 Edited by Barrock (3525 posts) -

Curious if I should upgrade my 570 or wait.

#19 Posted by Devildoll (879 posts) -

@barrock: to a 760? that would give you about 30% boost on average.

whether that is worth $249 or not is personal.

#21 Edited by Scroll (594 posts) -

@devildoll: Well its never really a great idea to upgrade from one series directly to another. The 760 looks mighty pretty to me compared to my 560ti.

But I have an expensive new build to do later this year so I'll wait till the next generation.

#22 Edited by VACkillers (1060 posts) -

@devildoll said:

@vackillers said:

GTX 760s are out now... and at an amazing price as well, $249. Thats just such a good price bracket...

i dont think its that exciting, atleast here in sweden it is priced just above the 660 ti, and it does perform slightly better as well.

however, they are both built on GK104, and the 760 is gimped on pretty much everything cept busswidth, giving it an edge in bandwidth, as well as every frequency on it being higher than the 660 ti.

the 760 has a tdp that is 20 watts higher than the 660 ti, because of these higher frequencies mostly.

looking around at some oc results, both cards oc to about the same freqencies, with the 760 having a slight edge.

I'd almost bet that a 660 ti might outperform it in general when both cards are running max frequencies.

Dunno which benchmarks you've been looking at, or where you have got your info from, but thats false. A GTX 760 is more powerful then a 660, its performance is on par with a GTX 670, its litterly neck and neck with every benchmark that i've seen of this card and at a price point of $249, that is around 20-40$ cheaper then a GTX 660 ti, and 100$ or more cheaper then a 670 for the same performance, so its an obvious choice if a card is cheaper, AND performs better, then that should be what your getting no questions asked. With a single 760 basically stripping out the 660 ti and the 670, and with the GTX 780 out performing a 680 and 20-50$ cheaper as well, its insane to pick up a 6 series card now, there is litterly no point, i've tried to get answers on the Nvidia facebook page as to why the 6 series have not simply come down in price without any answers.

Here is one benchmark.........

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7103/nvidia-geforce-gtx-760-review/10

Here is another :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zz30DhmTR4o&list=PLED2A46E2F2265E1D&feature=player_embedded

and another... actually beats the 670 in batman here:

http://benchmarkreviews.com/569/nvidia-geforce-gtx-760-graphics-card-review/6/

There are plenty of benchmarks out there and all show it out performances the 660 ti at a cheaper pricepoint as well. If its more expensive in sweden then thats unfortunate but it is better then the 660 ti. fact.

#23 Edited by Devildoll (879 posts) -

@vackillers said:

Dunno which benchmarks you've been looking at, or where you have got your info from, but thats false. A GTX 760 is more powerful then a 660, its performance is on par with a GTX 670

......................

There are plenty of benchmarks out there and all show it out performances the 660 ti at a cheaper pricepoint as well. If its more expensive in sweden then thats unfortunate but it is better then the 660 ti. fact.

i think you misinterpreted me, what is said was, in Sweden the 760 is slightly more powerful, as well as slightly more expensive, than a 660 ti.
also, i think the 780 usually sits about 100 bucks above the 680, the 770 on the other hand, which is an overclocked 680, can be found cheaper.

the reason for the 600 series cards not dropping in price is probably because all the retailers bought them at a certain price, and dont want to take a loss on em.
where as the 700 series cards were bought for cheaper.

#24 Posted by VACkillers (1060 posts) -

yep very good point on the retailers... but it would be nice if nvidia would just right out and say that or something lol.... I would think taking a loss rather then loosing a sale completely would be much more beneficial anyway though coz no one in their right mind would get a 6 series card now... not at the current prices anyway... and yeah i know it was stated about sweden and i did mention that it is unfortunate if it was more expensive there, but I'm talking about the U.S / U.K price bracket mostly anyway. Just out of curiosity, how much are those cards in Sweden?