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#51 Edited by HurricaneIvan29 (582 posts) -

HAZZAH

#52 Edited by Joeyoe31 (820 posts) -

I welcome the new triggers. DS3 triggers never bothered me that much but they were a problem for a lot of people.

@nezza: That looks incredibly clumsy. How do you even play games?

#53 Posted by BRich (436 posts) -

Now if only they'd put the left stick in the proper spot.

The most used section on each side of the controller should be in the upper quadrant (thumbstick on the left and buttons on the right). Until they fix this it will always be more awkward to use than the xbox layout.

But getting rid of the worst triggers of all time is a huge improvement! Those things were dangerous..

#54 Posted by Reisz (1490 posts) -

Gran Turismo on a game pad was a hideous experience. I applaud and welcome new triggers with open arms.

Also, hands are weird guys, controllers don't work for everybody, and if it feels comfortable no method of holding one is wrong.

#55 Edited by dsi1 (161 posts) -

FYI the bad thumb placement causing them to collide issue is fixed now.

#56 Posted by Nezza (358 posts) -

@churrific: @joeyoe31 As I mentioned in one of the replies above, I think some people are looking at the low angle of the photograph (due to need to put the camera on a desk thanks to lack of a third hand) and reading it as some kind of weird grip. As I said to Evo in that reply, if you were to stand over my shoulder and look down then the way I hold a PS3 controller is near on identical to his top photograph, except for the size of my hands in comparison. But alas, it seems some are choosing to ignore that reply. I also suspect that the majority that have commented have also completely overlooked that I've stated that the photos were taken with the thumbsticks at full lock towards each other - ie demonstrating my issue with the controller for my use scenario at its worst which is always going to look a little odder then a photo in the 'neutral' non-contacting position, but then what would have been the point of a photograph that didn't show the problem.

To answer your specific questions: I'm really not sure what you'd mean by the sticks sliding up and down, but I think your asking if I need to really press down hard them to prevent them from returning to centre without using 'normal' force. If that is the case, then the answer is no. I don't need to press harder, I don't feel them slipping around under my thumbpad, and I've never had a blister from gaming with any controller since the old insane joystick wagglers on the C64!

This has been derailed enough from the original topic, so I'm just going to leave it at this.

1. We're talking about a controller that is about to become obsolete, and by all accounts is being replaced by one that is far better in every regard. So if you never really got on with the DS3/Sixaxis then there is something better just around the corner. If you love the controller as it is now, then great news - it's about to get even better.
2. There is not a one size fits all solution to the human body whether that is for a game controller or a pair of shoes.
3. Some people seem to be a little freaked out by how a person they don't know is holding a game controller... on... the... internet.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to getting my giant sized bear paws on the new controller and trying out those new triggers for myself.

#57 Edited by Strife777 (1574 posts) -

I need more pics of people holding their controllers.......I need this.

#58 Posted by Shirogane (3571 posts) -

@nezza: Huh well, it looks a lot tighter than my hold on the controller, it basically barely rests in my fingers, and my fingers at the top reach about the middle of the shoulder buttons. Also another reason why that looked strange was just the way you use the analogues, i find pushing them from the opposite side usually the easiest way, not actually having your thumbs on it, that just doesn't feel comfortable. Though yeah, you'd probably be able to just grab the controller out of my hands with little effort with my grip.

I guess i'm your opposite, i find the 360 controller to be massive and chunky, also kinda heavy. reaching a lot of the buttons takes way too much effort. Also, thumbsticks in the lower position feel easier for me, probably cause i'm more used to having my thumbs downward, i think from all the time i spend on a keyboard with them resting on the spacebar.

Just goes to show how everyone's different. Nice to see how some other people hold controllers though, i just found it interesting, nothing wrong with it.

#59 Posted by PillClinton (3291 posts) -

Like Brad's said a few times now, I'm just glad that in 2013, good controllers are now standard. The Dualshock is bigger with better triggers; the Xbone has a solid d-pad. Finally, they both just got it right. Controllers aren't something we have to bitch about anymore.

#60 Posted by HerbieBug (4212 posts) -

Yeah, really happy about this change. During this gen there was always the problem of PS3 controller having the best d-pad but crap triggers and the 360 controller having the better triggers but damned near inoperable d-pad (not counting the twisty, which I haven't had opportunity to try). So for PC games I wanted to use a pad with, my controller choice depended on the type of game I intended to play, which was less than ideal.

#61 Posted by WickedFather (1733 posts) -

Like Brad's said a few times now, I'm just glad that in 2013, good controllers are now standard. The Dualshock is bigger with better triggers; the Xbone has a solid d-pad. Finally, they both just got it right. Controllers aren't something we have to bitch about anymore.

I want a AA battery option for the PS4 pad. Goddamn internal battery nonsense. etc.

#62 Posted by Hunter5024 (5667 posts) -

@nezza: The controller is wider now, so that issue should no longer be a problem. Also I think its worth noting that in your dualshock photo, you'll notice that your thumbs are at a right angle, which is the advantage to that stick placement. It gives you a better idea of exactly which direction you're pushing at all times. When the analog stick is in the other spot, I've noticed I constantly drift to the right (or I over compensate and drift to the left).

#63 Edited by PillClinton (3291 posts) -

@pillclinton said:

Like Brad's said a few times now, I'm just glad that in 2013, good controllers are now standard. The Dualshock is bigger with better triggers; the Xbone has a solid d-pad. Finally, they both just got it right. Controllers aren't something we have to bitch about anymore.

I want a AA battery option for the PS4 pad. Goddamn internal battery nonsense. etc.

Yeah, true, and that's something we'll have to contend with from both controllers now. And unfortunately, battery technology seems to be the slowest moving tech around.

#64 Edited by LiquidPrince (15942 posts) -

@nezza: Who the hell holds the the PS3 controller in such a way that their thumbs overlap...? My thumbs are no where near each other when I'm holding the controller, let alone overlapping. And no, I don't have small hands. I just don't hold the controller the way your holding it in the picture...

#65 Posted by TheHT (11227 posts) -

That's cool n all, but I'm way more jazzed about those new thumbsticks.

#66 Edited by nosebleed (15 posts) -

I bought these. Never thought about it afterwards.

#67 Posted by Maajin (1063 posts) -

The Xbox 360 controller is more comfortable, but the Dualshock 3 is way more versatile. Also, I don't get the argument for bumping your thumbs, and I have huge hands.

#68 Edited by flakmunkey (75 posts) -

@nosebleed: I was just about to post this. Those trigger extenders are a goddamn requirement IMO. The stock L2/R2 are soooo bad. That's probably why FPS's on PS3 use L1/R1 for the most part when their 360 counterparts use the triggers.

I also have massive hands, and don't have the overlap issue, however I can totally see how that happens. I have yet to find a position for my hands on the DS1/2/3 that doesn't cramp up eventually (17 straight hours of Last of Us became pretty difficult), and no I'm not death gripping, the ergonomics just unfortunately seem to be incompatible with my massive mitts. That said, I'm really happy with the improvements in the DS4, especially the better angle on the grips. I think the grips actually seem like the best improvement here.

#69 Posted by StarvingGamer (8220 posts) -

Ok, so people who hold their analog sticks with the middle knuckle of their thumb prefer the 360 controller. I see that now.

#70 Edited by Tarsier (1061 posts) -

the xbox one controller looks infinitely better especially with the little tactile features here and there. im wondering if there are similar things with this one? i hope so. i have no interest in xbox one but the controller is amazing.

#71 Posted by flakmunkey (75 posts) -

@starvinggamer: I hold my sticks with the tip of my thumb, and prefer the 360

#72 Edited by StarvingGamer (8220 posts) -

@flakmunkey said:

@starvinggamer: I hold my sticks with the tip of my thumb, and prefer the 360

High five for making non-exclusive true statements!

#73 Posted by Angouri (231 posts) -

Man, who cares. Can they release a PS3 controller with the PS4 ergonomics? My DS3 could use a proper replacement while I finish out my PS3 games.

#74 Edited by PillClinton (3291 posts) -

@theht said:

That's cool n all, but I'm way more jazzed about those new thumbsticks.

Oh man, I wanna hold dat.

#75 Posted by GIyn (202 posts) -

Very excited, don't know what the fuck Sony was thinking when the made the "triggers" on the PS3 controller.

@mercutio123 said:

@mildmolasses said:

@mideonnviscera said:

@mercutio123 said:

@mideonnviscera said:

@zidd said:

@mideonnviscera: @chavtheworld: What are you guys talking about? The stick placement has been correct since 1997.

In 1997 they just crammed sticks onto the existing controller. Then they just never bothered to improve.

Why is having one in a different place an improvement?

It's way more comfortable.

What's wrong with your thumb that that inch causes you that much discomfort? The right stick is in the same spot on both Xbox and PS. Is that just as uncomfortable?

This is why I never understood that argument

Have you naysayers of different analog placement gamed much if at all on 360? I have, and believe me the precision and comfort there is unmatched by DS3.

It also might be because I have big hands, but I don't know.

I want my Dreamcast on-screen character controller.

#76 Posted by vinone (131 posts) -

@ares42 said:

@chavtheworld: @mideonnviscera: You mean like this ?

Seriously, the Wii U pro controller, is by far the best official controller currently on the market =)

B and A are kinda tough to hit, that's my only complaint, otherwise I like the placement.

#77 Edited by BoOzak (917 posts) -

@nosebleed said:

I bought these. Never thought about it afterwards.

I bought this so I can use this! ;p (but it didnt cost me that much)

The DS3 is fine for most things but it does feel flimsy and cheap compared to the 360 controller.

#78 Posted by xSeanZx (190 posts) -

Guys fuck the Dualshock 3 it just doesnt work with how I like to hold my controllers.

#79 Posted by sdharrison (476 posts) -

@xseanzx said:

Guys fuck the Dualshock 3 it just doesnt work with how I like to hold my controllers.

This was solid comedy.

#80 Posted by ajamafalous (11988 posts) -
@xseanzx said:

Guys fuck the Dualshock 3 it just doesnt work with how I like to hold my controllers.

WHERE DID YOU GET AN INVERTED PS3 CONTROLLER

#81 Posted by xSeanZx (190 posts) -

@xseanzx said:

Guys fuck the Dualshock 3 it just doesnt work with how I like to hold my controllers.

WHERE DID YOU GET AN INVERTED PS3 CONTROLLER

Well I had to special order it because I like my controllers inverted but as you can see those pesky sticks still give me problems.

#82 Posted by Unavailable (56 posts) -

Both controllers look good, but the 360 constantly wins out in polls and generally seems more popular as a controller for PC gamers for a reason. It comes down to personal preference, but a lot of people like the the 360 trigger placement.

Now that the new DualShock fixed the convex triggers and analog sticks and the XBONE controller looks like it has a way better d-pad, we can finally all have pretty solid controllers.

Except that WiiU Pro controller really is the worst. I've used it. Never again.

#83 Posted by JNeam (77 posts) -

Both controllers look good, but the 360 constantly wins out in polls and generally seems more popular as a controller for PC gamers for a reason. It comes down to personal preference, but a lot of people like the the 360 trigger placement.

Now that the new DualShock fixed the convex triggers and analog sticks and the XBONE controller looks like it has a way better d-pad, we can finally all have pretty solid controllers.

Except that WiiU Pro controller really is the worst. I've used it. Never again.

Too be fair, for the PC part of the argument, getting a DualShock to work on the PC is a pain. Much easier with the plug n play 360 controller.

#84 Edited by myketuna (1692 posts) -

@jneam said:

@unavailable said:

Both controllers look good, but the 360 constantly wins out in polls and generally seems more popular as a controller for PC gamers for a reason. It comes down to personal preference, but a lot of people like the the 360 trigger placement.

Now that the new DualShock fixed the convex triggers and analog sticks and the XBONE controller looks like it has a way better d-pad, we can finally all have pretty solid controllers.

Except that WiiU Pro controller really is the worst. I've used it. Never again.

Too be fair, for the PC part of the argument, getting a DualShock to work on the PC is a pain. Much easier with the plug n play 360 controller.

I actually use a Logitech F310 to game on my PC. The "triggers" feel good to me (better shape than the DS3), the sticks feel tighter than the DS3, and it can serve as both a Direct Input pad (for emulators or indie games) and an official 360 pad (for console ports). I love it.

#85 Edited by Flacracker (1672 posts) -

@mercutio123 said:

@mideonnviscera said:

@zidd said:

@mideonnviscera: @chavtheworld: What are you guys talking about? The stick placement has been correct since 1997.

In 1997 they just crammed sticks onto the existing controller. Then they just never bothered to improve.

Why is having one in a different place an improvement?

It's way more comfortable.

Why not have both in that position? Like the Wii-U controller but better.

#86 Posted by Flacracker (1672 posts) -

@evo said:

@nezza: You're holding it wrong. It should be like this:

That is how I hold it but that is not correct either. You are not actually fully gripping the handles with your palms. You are letting the controller rest in your fingers to properly position the thumbs. Maybe people with small Japanese hands have a better time with it.

#87 Posted by Emoney244 (161 posts) -

I HATE the 360's triggers. Why didn't they just keep the PS3 design.

#88 Edited by SathingtonWaltz (2053 posts) -

@nezza: Oh wow you do have really large hands, I can kinda see how the Xbox controller is more accessible overall with the design.

#89 Posted by EVO (3901 posts) -

@flacracker said:

@evo said:

@nezza: You're holding it wrong. It should be like this:

That is how I hold it but that is not correct either. You are not actually fully gripping the handles with your palms. You are letting the controller rest in your fingers to properly position the thumbs. Maybe people with small Japanese hands have a better time with it.

For the record:

  1. That's not my hands. I stole that pic from NeoGAF.
  2. It might not be the "correct" grip, but at least your thumbs don't bash together.
  3. I actually have pretty big hands.
#90 Posted by Otacon (2209 posts) -

Can't wait to get my hands on a PS4 controller. The stick placement thing has never bothered me on either side, playing both consoles this generation I have to say that once I started playing the games I didn't notice what orientation the sticks were. My real gripes with the DS3 are the flimsy sticks and the spongey triggers, which seem to have been fixed for the DS4.

#91 Edited by Asurastrike (2166 posts) -

@nezza: Filthy, filthy fingernails.

#92 Posted by VoidProd (95 posts) -

I prefer the DS3 to the 360 Controller. I can use both just fine, but for longer sessions the DS3 is much better for me personally. That said the L2 and R2 are not great.

The DS4 (or whatever it's called) looks like an engineering marvel from a user experiense perspective. Probably the thing I'm looking forward to the most about next gen, keeping in mind that better graphics are a given.

#93 Posted by Cirdain (3088 posts) -

@myketuna said:

@jneam said:

@unavailable said:

Both controllers look good, but the 360 constantly wins out in polls and generally seems more popular as a controller for PC gamers for a reason. It comes down to personal preference, but a lot of people like the the 360 trigger placement.

Now that the new DualShock fixed the convex triggers and analog sticks and the XBONE controller looks like it has a way better d-pad, we can finally all have pretty solid controllers.

Except that WiiU Pro controller really is the worst. I've used it. Never again.

Too be fair, for the PC part of the argument, getting a DualShock to work on the PC is a pain. Much easier with the plug n play 360 controller.

I actually use a Logitech F310 to game on my PC. The "triggers" feel good to me (better shape than the DS3), the sticks feel tighter than the DS3, and it can serve as both a Direct Input pad (for emulators or indie games) and an official 360 pad (for console ports). I love it.

Because of some similarities between PC's and the PS4 the new controller could potential be plug'n'play.

#94 Edited by Silver-Streak (1357 posts) -

For people wanting a wider controller: The DS4 is wider in all of the images I've seen of it. I think it's wider due to the touch pad.

For people with issues on the PS3 triggers: http://www.gamestop.com/ps3/accessories/ps3-real-triggers/90442 I bought them for a friend who had issues with the PS3 triggers, and he loved them enough to the point where I bought them for myself as well, and I didn't even mind the triggers on the DS3. It is a noticeable improvement, and they just snap on/off.

Also, while you definitely can hold the dual shock multiple different ways, there used to be images released around the PSX/PS2 era by Sony showing how to hold them.

@nezza : You've gripped the controller far too high up and forward. The tips of your index fingers should be resting flat on the L1/R1 or in the space between the L1/R1 and L2/R2. If you're high enough on the controller that you can use your knuckles to press the buttons, you are both reducing your reaction times (human finger tip is more responsive than the space between finger tip and 2nd knuckle) as well as potentially causing RSI issues with those fingers. In addition, the hand grips are meant to rest with the tips of them in either your palms, or on the top ball of your hands (the flat part right before your fingers but after your palms). This allows for you to have a full grip rather than a partial grip on the controller grips, and can prevent the controller from shaking if you're jamming on the buttons. It will also make it so your thumbs aren't straight out when using the sticks, but angled forward, meaning that you will need much less motion to go from sticks to buttons. In your current positioning, you would have to move your thumbs a whole 90 degrees, with the positioning I mentioned above, you have to angle your thumbs /maybe/ 30 degrees.

That being said, hold the controller however you like, but coming from someone with ultra long fingers and thumbs, holding it this way will make your life easier.

Edit: also, I posted this before seeing your comments about angling. My above may not be 100% accurate, but you are still gripping the controller pretty far forward (as in your hands are forward) based off where the end of the controller grip is in relation to your pinky. Try moving the controller up a bit till your finger tips are resting on l1/r1 instead of your middle knuckles. That should angle your thumbs forward. See how that feels after an hour or so of playing something.

#95 Posted by announakis (114 posts) -

@seppli said:

I absolutely don't understand people unwilling or even unable to adapt to a controller. I've adapted perfectly to both the PS3 and 360 gamepads. I initially preferred the 360's formfactor, but once I adopted the 4-Finger-Stance in regards to shoulder buttons (because Vanquish plays much more awesomely this way), the Dual Shock 3 became my favorite. *Polygripping* (trademark pending) just works better with the DS3's formfactor. I guess if you've got T-Bone-Steak sized hands, its diminutive size could become a legitimate problem.

FYI - the DS3 is a way higher quality product in terms build quality. The analog sticks alone are already worlds beyond the 360's, which seems to have a much larger deadzones to provide a sufficient fault tolerance for out of kilter analog sticks.

YES, I do agree!

I initially bought an XBox360 because of the feel of the controller that is heavier...got used to the left stick up there fine...

recently purchased a PS3 to play all these wonderful games I missed all these years and had a short moment of painful adaptation with the DS3 but then realized that my fingers found naturally their place so that I used 4 fingers for shoulders buttons instead of only my index fingers....this is ssssooooooooo much better!

Add the triggers to that, and bye bye Xbox controller preference....I am all in for DS4!

#96 Posted by BestUsernameEver (4825 posts) -