Dtoid's review by Jim Sterling was accidentally posted early

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JohnTunoku

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#51  Edited By JohnTunoku

Honestly one of the few reviewers I find my own weird ass opinion aligns with. Wasn't even considering this game based on what I've seen of the gameplay. Looks very flat and dull. To hear the fundamentals (AI for your squad based shooter) aren't up to snuff is even more damning.

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falserelic

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#52  Edited By falserelic
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maskedarcstrike

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Seems like the perfect time to beat up games at the end of a console generation for sensationalism until next gen consoles come out.

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maskedarcstrike

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#54  Edited By maskedarcstrike

@maskedarcstrike said:

Seems like the perfect time to beat up games at the end of a console generation for sensationalism until next gen consoles come out.

edit: Bad companion AI?? Mass Effect 2 and Bioshock Infinite had some of the best companion AI ever.... What would I do without all those ammo packs Elizabeth throws at me hidden in an invincible corner. What would I do without my comrades in the Mass Effect series that blindly run into fire and sometimes don't follow my cover orders....... Come on people.

sry accidental double post .......... swear i was editing

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DonMFJohnson

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GameSpot's Kevin VanOrd gave it 6.0, so a mediocre game? Too bad, I really don't want to waste my free time playing mediocre/bad games.

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BeachThunder

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#56  Edited By BeachThunder

@jakob187 said:

1. To everyone saying "it's Jim Sterling," you say that like it's some automatic form of discredit to the guy. Meanwhile, he's actually a damn good writer and just happens to not give a shit half the time because people are whiny entitled fuckholes and he likes to piss them off. Therefore, saying "it's Jim Sterling" means about as much as YOU think Jim Sterling means.

2. The game went through massive delays, revisions, and even a stint of "rumored as cancelled without confirmation from company of one nor the other." It's hard to expect it to come out unscathed from all of that. Shit, look at all of the circumstances around The Bureau:

  • XCOM gets announced as reboot with first-person shooter and strategy mixed together. Very little gameplay shown. People dig the aesthetics, but bemoan the shooter part of the game.
  • XCOM: Enemy Unknown gets announced. People get stoked about a Firaxis-developed strategy game in the vein of the original.
  • No one hears about XCOM for a little while, which leads to rumors starting that it has been put on hiatus, axed, cancelled, etc. 2K Marin does nothing to make comments on it in one way or the other.
  • XCOM: Enemy Unknown comes out, sells well, gets strong critical reception, and people fucking love it. 2K realizes that people want their strategy in some XCOM shit.
  • XCOM comes back as "The Bureau: XCOM Declassified," moving the XCOM moniker to the back of the title. This implies a link to the XCOM universe, but it is not an "official" XCOM game. Therefore, if it turns out bad or doesn't sell, it's just an "experimental spin-off." The game we see takes out the "-shock" game elements that we originally saw and replaces them with third-person shooter gameplay like Mass Effect, strategy gameplay kind of like XCOM: Enemy Unknown, and a load of other gameplay styles that shouts out "we're trying to appeal to everyone, identity crisis, identity crisis." People react in a very mixed manner.
  • The Bureau: XCOM Declassified shows up for pre-order for $5 off on digital PC retailer sites. Green Man Gaming runs a special where pre-ordering it will also get you Spec Ops: The Line and XCOM: Enemy Unknown as well as DLC for The Bureau. This is all but a sign that 2K doesn't plan on this game selling once it is out, as those prices are determined by the publishers, not the online stores. I know this because Amazon knows this, and Amazon is the one who directly informed me of such whenever I had bought Tomb Raider from them two days before they dropped the price down by $5.00 and I complained to customer service about it.
  • Jim Sterling's review "accidentally" leaks. The review generally sounds like what we would expect to hear: a troubled game that has no identity and tries to be everything (coincidentally, most troubled games try to appeal to many demographics of players with multiple types of genre mechanics in the hopes that one will click with someone). Score is 4.5 out of 10.

While people may not trust Sterling, the guy is someone who loves the shit out of the XCOM franchise. Honestly, in that review, it sounded like he really hated that he wasn't enjoying the game. It almost sounded painful, not from a "I played this game" standpoint, but from a "I really wanted this game to be fucking awesome" standpoint.

So overall...is anyone surprised by the review?

I think if you look back, you'll see that the main criticism when it was first announced was that it was called XCOM, even though it didn't have any relation to past X-Com games.

About Green Man Gaming, they had an offer for preordering BioShock Infinite that came bundled with The Darkness 2, BioShock 1, and XCOM: Enemy Unknown. So, I don't think the quality of the game has anything to do with it, Green Man/2K have a precedent of doing these kind of bundles.

Also, tactics is not just a synonym of strategy.

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JouselDelka

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Wow, what a bummer. Swedish Gamereactor gave it 6/10 and took the review down. I've got it pre-loaded, would be a shame if the game was that bad...

Then why the fuck did you buy it before it released? o.O

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BurningStickMan

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#58  Edited By BurningStickMan
@jakob187 said:

So overall...is anyone surprised by the review?

Any game that embargoes its reviews has something to hide.

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bybeach

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#59  Edited By bybeach

Now I went and bought the game pre-order, with the usual lecture I was blowing it not waiting for reviews. I don't hang my hat on this Sterling guy, I've heard about him in action before. But, wait for some other pro reaction and player reaction before considering this game. Right away the ideas seem good, but something about the graphics and gameplay .. jank in movement and such. I have a few dollars, I can make a mistake. I'm also going to push on a little further and see what pops.

I also have truly good games that look much better for the first ten minutes that I should give another try .... I'm thinking of you Dishonered, once I got used to the art style.

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Hailinel

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@maskedarcstrike said:

Seems like the perfect time to beat up games at the end of a console generation for sensationalism until next gen consoles come out.

edit: Bad companion AI?? Mass Effect 2 and Bioshock Infinite had some of the best companion AI ever.... What would I do without all those ammo packs Elizabeth throws at me hidden in an invincible corner. What would I do without my comrades in the Mass Effect series that blindly run into fire and sometimes don't follow my cover orders....... Come on people.

sry accidental double post .......... swear i was editing

The Bureau isn't either Mass Effect 2 or Bioshock Infinite.

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D43M0N

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#61  Edited By D43M0N

I'm glad that I ended up pre-ordering for console, so I can abuse EB Games' 7 day return policy and finally put some money down for GTAV.

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2HeadedNinja

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#62  Edited By 2HeadedNinja

@fruitcocoa said:

Wow, what a bummer. Swedish Gamereactor gave it 6/10 and took the review down. I've got it pre-loaded, would be a shame if the game was that bad...

Then why the fuck did you buy it before it released? o.O

So did I ... I am old enough to know what I like and what not and no review will ever change that. I also know what kind of Information I need to decide if I want to play a game or not. So reviews are kinda pointless to me as a consumer and I imagine there is a fair share of people who are in the same situation.

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MachoFantastico

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Whilst I don't rate Jim Sterling as a reviewer, it sounds like he speaks the truth regarding this game. Hearing a few poor things related to it.

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maskedarcstrike

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@hailinel: ya but still, it's all a game. I remember watching some gamespot interview with Levine and how he was boasting that Elizabeth was like the shark from Jaws that never worked and all of a sudden she worked. Without saying that all they did was make her an invincible NPC that throws ammo from a corner.

Anyways I still think this game is getting shat on cause it's the end of the console generation and there's nothing big in the news right now.

Killer Is Dead is gonna have a big giant dump taken on it as well for site traffic.

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Seppli

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#65  Edited By Seppli

I've read one too many Jim Sterling reviews that don't even remotely align with my own opinions. I love XCOM, so I'll keep an open mind. The gameplay videos I've seen look quite fun, and appropriately tactical. Only thing missing seems to be destructible environments (which really would have put it on my radar).

Alas, unless it's critical reception is strong, and I like what I'm hearing, I'm going to pass on it.

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Hailinel

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@hailinel: ya but still, it's all a game. I remember watching some gamespot interview with Levine and how he was boasting that Elizabeth was like the shark from Jaws that never worked and all of a sudden she worked. Without saying that all they did was make her an invincible NPC that throws ammo from a corner.

Anyways I still think this game is getting shat on cause it's the end of the console generation and there's nothing big in the news right now.

Killer Is Dead is gonna have a big giant dump taken on it as well for site traffic.

Why would they shit on the game simply because it's the end of the console generation? That's not being honest. It's far more believable that the critics that are panning it don't like it because, as they tell it, The Bureau doesn't do any of the things that it wants to do with any skill. Just because Mass Effect 2 and Bioshock have competent AI companions doesn't mean that every game that features them will do them well. According to reviews, The Bureau's AI companions aren't particularly smart, require micromanagement, and are about as sturdy as wet paper at low levels. Combine that with the permanent death mechanic, and I could see this becoming frustrating.

Maybe you personally will enjoy the game, but that doesn't invalidate criticisms others level at it.

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BestUsernameEver

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#67  Edited By BestUsernameEver

@krullban said:

It's Jim Sterling.

So? His review scores are well placed around the 10 point scale, if he has a differing opinion, that's one thing, and it's also a thing that isn't needed to be pointed out.

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Cirdain

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Aww... :(

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Humanity

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I don't know what my 'agree to disagree ratio' is but the review seems pretty damning on every level.

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XenoNick

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#70  Edited By XenoNick

This seems like the sort of game I'll pick up cheap in a few months.

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jsnyder82

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@rowr said:

I think we sit and wait for the real reviewers.

Yeah, and they're all going to say it sucks too. Honestly people, I can count on my hand the number of times Sterling's opinion of a game has varied wildly from the general consensus. This is getting ridiculous.

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maskedarcstrike

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@hailinel: So an invincible companion that throws ammo in a corner and follows scripted sequences is smart? You still have to micro the shit out of Mass Effect companions in any difficulty above normal to have them survive more than 10 seconds. This is nothing new and pointing it out in the Bureau seems too fucking opportune when shit AI companions have been around for quite some time.

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Nekroskop

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#74  Edited By Nekroskop

@devitiffany That settles it then. Jim doesn't appreciate good games. His reviews are invalid.

Personally I'm grateful that the European launch date is on Friday(for once). Gives me time to see forum reactions and other reviews.

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deactivated-630b11c195a3b

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I'll wait for a more credible review.

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LackingSaint

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For the record to the people saying "I'll wait for a REAL reviewer", just google The Bureau: XCOM Declassified and you'll be met with a host of 6/10 reviews. Which really sucks to say, I had a lot of hope for this game, but it seems consensus is very much on it being an average experience.

I'll still probably check it out at some point.

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Ramone

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I've agreed with Jim in the past so that's a disappointing score.

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devitiffany

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#79  Edited By devitiffany

So the reviews seem to be saying that it's a decent game, but fuck it because it's not actual "XCOM"? I don't give a shit about XCOM as a brand, so I'll probably end up liking it a lot more than these reviews.

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Wampa1

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The Polygon review is really odd, he states one of the major negatives is the ability to reload checkpoints to undo permadeaths but.. hasn't that been the case in every X-Com? You don't like it you can load a save, it's your choice to fully engage with it's systems and stick with deaths. Hopefully there's an Ironman mode in this just to force me to deal with it.

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cloudnineboya

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#81  Edited By cloudnineboya

Bummer, don't read his stuff so will reserve judgment till :brad or :jeff or :vinny do a ql. Was looking more for this than ''saints'' row, you know for some intelligent gaming.

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winsord

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#82  Edited By winsord

@dungbootle said:

There are a fair number more reviews for the 360 version than the PC version, just for a better sense.

Jim Sterling reviews aren't much more than joke reviews to me, so I don't care what he scored it, but the general reception is still kind of middling (Jim holds the lowest score, there's a surprise!). So far things are going kind of as I expected, a few 60s and a few 80s, in the texts it seems like some people are simply connecting more with the core mechanics than others.

Haven't had a chance yet to play it myself, so I still don't know how much I'm going to like it, but I remain optimistic. There's always reason for concern when a game goes under so many drastic revisions, but what I saw in the Quick Look EX looked pretty fun, so if it's just rough around the edges I can handle that. I imagine my views will be more in line with Justin McElroy's, but he does bring up one thing in the review I kind of forgot about. It worries me that the protagonist is a character that can't ever be killed, so if he dies you just load up the last checkpoint. A lot of the fun I had with Enemy Unknown was in the tension created by being able to lose all of your units on field at any time. Hopefully the AI companions carry enough weight to them that you won't be able to beat most of the game using only the main character, and that that's able to create the same stress as in Enemy Unknown without being frustrating. Justin didn't seem to think the companions were critical, but he probably also played on normal for the review, which seems like the 'wrong' way to play this kind of game.

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Hailinel

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#83  Edited By Hailinel

@hailinel: So an invincible companion that throws ammo in a corner and follows scripted sequences is smart? You still have to micro the shit out of Mass Effect companions in any difficulty above normal to have them survive more than 10 seconds. This is nothing new and pointing it out in the Bureau seems too fucking opportune when shit AI companions have been around for quite some time.

Your companions in Mass Effect can be revived. Your companions in The Bureau die permanently.

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OurSin_360

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I think I'll wait for more than 1 review before making a purchasing decision on this one.

wow, general consensus is this new xcom game is bad, but that has to be the most ludicrous thing i've read right there. I mean i'm not even going to comment on him not liking the side missions or giving it a 4.5, but saying 2 looked worse than 1 is just an all out lie.

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deactivated-6050ef4074a17

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So, I shouldn't trust Jim's opinion on anything because of one (dumb) review he did four years ago?

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Arabes

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@marokai: Two dumb reviews - he gave the Witcher 2 a 6 the fucker!

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tearhead

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#87  Edited By tearhead

@arabes said:

@marokai: Two dumb reviews - he gave the Witcher 2 a 6 the fucker!

My God! He's a monster!

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jakob187

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Forget the AC2 review, there is no way I'm trusting the opinions of a guy who thinks a Dynasty Warriors game deserves a 9/10 in this day and age.

You're saying that a Dynasty Warriors game DOESN'T deserve that kind of score? Madness.

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Hailinel

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@jakob187 said:

@neocalypso said:

Forget the AC2 review, there is no way I'm trusting the opinions of a guy who thinks a Dynasty Warriors game deserves a 9/10 in this day and age.

You're saying that a Dynasty Warriors game DOESN'T deserve that kind of score? Madness.

If he gives a Dynasty Warriors game a 9/10, he's my kind of guy.

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avantegardener

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#90  Edited By avantegardener

So with european realease date at the end of next week, is it worth cancelling my Amazon preorder for the PC version?

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Fredchuckdave

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Sterl Jimling > Jim Sterling

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ArbitraryWater

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#92  Edited By ArbitraryWater

@avantegardener: given the universally middling reviews, probably? It seems like the kind of game that will be $30 in 3 months.

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avantegardener

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@avantegardener: given the universally middling reviews, probably? It seems like the kind of game that will be $30 in 3 months.

Yeah, can't help but feel your right. It's about 43 dollars (28 sterling, and about 32 euro) on Amazon now. I think its the large lull in triple A games, that has me so feverishly wanton from something substantial, mind you, I have played a shit tonne of indies in the mean time. Alas, perhaps this is not the droids I was looking for, but it may fill the void.

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SecondPersonShooter

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I love Jim Sterling and this thread is why.

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TheManWithNoPlan

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I think this would be much more suited to being a downloadable game. If I'm not mistaken I believe there was some whispers of it being just such a while back when some really rough gameplay footage was shown off.

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Yummylee

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@fredchuckdave said:

Sterl Jimling > Jim Sterling

I don't know why, but I can't but find 'Sterl Jimling' to be hilarious.

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Sterling

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His review is actually pretty spot on.

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jerseyscum

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Jim's good people. He's a hell of a writer, he's consistently gone to bat for LGBT issues in gaming....and Podtoid is frequently goddamn hilarious. Really homoerotic, but still funny as all hell.

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Giantstalker

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Jim Sterling's a sensationalist... a well-spoken one, but still, it is what it is.

I'm not really in love with this game's take on XCOM but Sterling's opinions are - while funny - essentially worthless in my eyes.

This leak's content doesn't surprise me in the least; just look at the man's Witcher 2 review, for example.