#1 Edited by White (1320 posts) -

I just beat the game and a few things were bothering me, namely:

  1. Damien
    1. What was his motivations afterall? Is he just some power hungry and greedy nut?
    2. Why didn't he want Aiden to involve Ray Kenney in the decryption of Iraq's Data?
  2. Act 5
    1. Aiden wanted to go after Blume following the scene involving Clara's demise. But why? They didn't do anything to hurt his family.
    2. Aiden was driving to to Blume's HQ and then Damien cuts in saying he has full access to ctOS. Then Aiden switches gears to hunt Damien down? What the fuck?
    3. 1 Mission for Act 5? Sounds like someone ran outta time to make a game.
  3. Jordi
    1. =<

Also, did anyone find the pacing really off? They front load the game with a lot of slow meticulous introductions and after you meet Ray Kenney the game just accelerates with plot point after plot point after plot point.

#2 Edited by cb1115 (110 posts) -

kinda reminded me of AC3. a shitload of set-up that ultimately leads to a somewhat rushed ending.

and yeah, Jordi turning heel at the end for no apparent reason was kind of a bummer. probably the best character in the game.

#4 Posted by White (1320 posts) -

@cb1115 said:

and yeah, Jordi turning heel at the end for no apparent reason was kind of a bummer. probably the best character in the game.

Well, it's not so much him turning heel for no reason (afterall, I think he said he was in it for the money) but the way they handled it. He betrays you, falls and vanishes, and then calls you as if business as usual. Kinda like the same thing that happened to Bedbug.

#5 Posted by veryLogical (1 posts) -

Jordi does it for business. He is a fixer, a mercenary

He told Aiden in one of the missions that he seperates morals from moolahs(money)

During the latter half of the game, a huge bounty was place on Aiden's head. Jordi tells Aiden something along the lines of, "Wow, I have never seen this much zeros." This hints at his new contract and foreshadows his betrayal.

#6 Posted by Jedted (2322 posts) -

Damien was a power mad nutjob. That ending was all kinds of crazy, my main issue with it being once Damien takes control the city just goes dead. No cars or civilians on the streets which makes it frustrating when you restart at a checkpoint. I also don't see how you're meant to avoid the cops there without murdering them all(jumping in the river seems to be the best solution).

#7 Edited by White (1320 posts) -

@jedted said:

Damien was a power mad nutjob. That ending was all kinds of crazy, my main issue with it being once Damien takes control the city just goes dead. No cars or civilians on the streets which makes it frustrating when you restart at a checkpoint. I also don't see how you're meant to avoid the cops there without murdering them all(jumping in the river seems to be the best solution).

Must be your platform then. I was running on PC and there were still civilians on the streets.

And I managed to avoid shooting the cops by spamming Blackout, Jam Comms, disrupting helicopters and hiding behind indestructible cover while the cops slowly try to flank me.

#8 Edited by NTM (7263 posts) -

Eh, the story to me was adequate enough, but not enough to make me think a lot about it as far as this goes, same goes for the characters. The game was just fun to me. I just mean, the game had an alright story, but not really enough to warrant a huge conversation over. Jordi is just doing it for money, but I think if he's in a sequel, it'll reveal his good side and how he won't in the end do anything to take out Aiden, even when it comes to money (even though he was going to at the end). Just give him time :P.

Damien was just an ass that wanted control. Some of it was ambiguous, so it didn't really matter. I'm more curious about Dedsec's role in the future of Watch Dogs. It was really weird to get to the end, and Aiden turns them down, but then as you play the exclusive content, Aiden sounds like he's totally on their side. I understand they have mutual goals to an extent, but the tone was off.

#9 Posted by SgtSphynx (1264 posts) -

@ntm: Jordi doesn't die. After the initial set of credits you get a call from him and the game changes scene to a garage with Maurice in it and the choice to either kill him of walk away, then the rest of the credits roll.

#10 Edited by NTM (7263 posts) -

@sgtsphynx: Yep, I know, I thought the OP thought he did though, but then I had to edit because I re-read his post, and it was just saying "read number one". Oh, and you added a spoiler block, when this thread is about spoilers...

#11 Posted by Zella (701 posts) -

Damien didn't want Ray Kenney involved because he was worried Kenney would leak all the blackmail Iraq had. Damien was trying to make a deal with Blume surrounding the blackmail data. It is the reason he has Aiden running around trying to obtain it.

Aiden's turn against Blume is probably just a way of helping to frame Blume as the big bad guys and set them up for a larger role next game. He is also pretty pissed off with the whole blackmail conspiracy by the end of the game, especially as it leads to Clara's death, and Blume is at the center of it.

In the final mission I think the first objective marker is just an arbitrary point as your objective is to locate Damien, it then switches to the ctOS building after you talk to T-Bone so that you can shut Damien out of the system.

Yeah the pacing was off for sure but that is an issue with pretty much every AC game as well so I've come to expect it from Ubisoft.

#12 Edited by SgtSphynx (1264 posts) -
#13 Posted by apexgus (7 posts) -

Having just finished the game, I'd like to point out 2 things...

1. The motivation of the main antagonist of this game (Damien) was to... cripple the infrastructure of big cities around the world as revenge for being crippled!

2. The protagonist is unable to figure out who took out a hit on him after he steals from people staying at a mob operated Hotel owned by a notorious gangster crime lord...

#14 Posted by Sinusoidal (1285 posts) -

"Damien" has to be the most cliché bad guy name ever...

#15 Posted by MiniPato (2719 posts) -

"Damien" has to be the most cliché bad guy name ever...

He also has the most punchable face I've seen in a videogame in a long time. He's like an annoying looking version of Willem Dafoe from Life Aquatic. And that goddamn voice makes it worse. His motivation for revenge is also incredibly weak. Guy has to wear a leg brace, big deal. He's lucky he survived a mob hit alive.

The whole game feels like a set up story for the game they actually wanted to make. The ending just felt like "alright, now we can make our open world faux-batman game with Dedsec and Blume as center villains." And really, Dedsec and Blume should have been central villains in all this. It shouldn't have been a revenge story and ransom story. I think they came up with the E3 demo first, and then wrote a lackluster story around that. And they weren't sure whether Blume would be bad guys or not because CTos is what lets Aiden do his magic. "CTos could be bad because 1984, but also Person of Interest vigilantism is cool right?" It's like they didn't know what stance to take on the matter and because of that, they didn't want to make Blume central villains.

#16 Posted by ThePhantomnaut (6185 posts) -

Jordi is a douche but I wonder if he will maintain his position as a fixer for Aiden or has fully turned over for the $$$ in the next one...

#17 Posted by SgtSphynx (1264 posts) -

So, who is everyone's favorite npc?

Personally, I like Clara the best followed closely by Jordi and T-Bone

#18 Posted by TheHT (10871 posts) -

So, who is everyone's favorite npc?

Personally, I like Clara the best followed closely by Jordi and T-Bone

Clara dying seemed completely unnecessary. I get the why, but it just sort of happens in that mission and then you walk away and that's that. Came across like they forgot to put a "someone you know dies and then you feel sad and kill stuff" part and just snuck it in there before the final missions. In this fuckin ctOS hacker paradise of information and connectivity, Clara really didn't know that you just fuckin rescued your sister?

Then you just assume she's dead and walk away leaving her body (at least it's a cemetary). That whole scene came across as just plain silly.

#19 Posted by SgtSphynx (1264 posts) -

@theht: Yeah, I didn't care for them killing her off that way. But, I will say that before that scene I was trying to not kill anyone that the game didn't force me to kill, and after that scene I wasn't. Though whether you can count them as forced kills or not is another mater.

#20 Posted by MiniPato (2719 posts) -

I feel like if Aiden was so hell bent on killing everyone involved in Lena's death, he really shouldn't have cared that much about Clara, even if she did help him after she had sold him out to Quinn. If Aiden were a more developed character I'd have bought him as caring for her. But throughout the game, they portray him as a 2 dimensional character who cares about his family and wants to kill anyone involved with hurting his family while occasionally throwing in a "how many people have I killed to come this far?" in a lazy attempt to make it seem like his character has depth. So him caring about Clara who played a pretty major part in killing his niece, just felt like writers being unable to have Aiden be a coldblooded killer to a lady. Yeah, she helped Aiden quite a bit, but she had just as much to gain for herself and Dedsec by going into that bunker and having access to all kinds of information.

Jordi is a douche but I wonder if he will maintain his position as a fixer for Aiden or has fully turned over for the $$$ in the next one...

The ending credits of Watch Dogs was pretty much them setting up The Dark Knight version of Watch Dogs. They even gave Aiden's vigilante persona a name "The Fox." So I wouldn't be surprised if Jordi became his Joker. He has that kind of unhinged insanity to him that would make him an entertaining villain.

#21 Edited by meaninoflife42 (497 posts) -

Maybe it's just me, but I felt like the Defalt section of the game was pointless. It didn't really contribute anything to the overall story and acted as an unnecessary set-up for a character that they could have easily introduced as the antagonist in Watch Dogs 2.

#22 Posted by MiniPato (2719 posts) -

@meaninoflife42 said:

Maybe it's just me, but I felt like the Defalt section of the game was pointless. It didn't really contribute anything to the overall story and acted as an unnecessary set-up for a character that they could have easily introduced as the antagonist in Watch Dogs 2.

I was convinced that the Defalt mission was a preorder bonus mission or something. But then I realized it was a semi-recreation of the first E3 demo cause you go into the Ambrose Theater. I'm kinda glad he wasn't a more central villain though. I hate smug villains, but smug villains who taunt you with tired memes (U mad Aiden?) are the worst. Not to mention the part where you escort T-Bone out of Defalt's apartment was in the E3 demo too. Really felt like forgot about those demos and either had to crowbar them in or try to build a game around those demos.

I hated the screen static effect during Defalt's mission and during the Damien blackout part in Act V. It's really annoying, which is the point, but it doesn't make sense in the context of the game story. It's not like you're Adam Jensen with cyber implant eyes or some super soldier in an advanced nanosuit. You're just a regular dude who hacks stuff with his phone.

#23 Posted by SethPhotopoulos (5095 posts) -

So, who is everyone's favorite npc?

Personally, I like Clara the best followed closely by Jordi and T-Bone

I thought Jordi was the only worthwhile character in that game. He knew who he was and he fun doing it.

#24 Edited by White (1320 posts) -

@minipato said:

I feel like if Aiden was so hell bent on killing everyone involved in Lena's death, he really shouldn't have cared that much about Clara, even if she did help him after she had sold him out to Quinn. If Aiden were a more developed character I'd have bought him as caring for her. But throughout the game, they portray him as a 2 dimensional character who cares about his family and wants to kill anyone involved with hurting his family while occasionally throwing in a "how many people have I killed to come this far?" in a lazy attempt to make it seem like his character has depth. So him caring about Clara who played a pretty major part in killing his niece, just felt like writers being unable to have Aiden be a coldblooded killer to a lady. Yeah, she helped Aiden quite a bit, but she had just as much to gain for herself and Dedsec by going into that bunker and having access to all kinds of information.

I don't know about that. I think Aiden was more of "conflicted" with his revenge quest as he progressed. He clearly isn't some stone cold murderer that just shoots people for kicks.

The reason why he cared about Clara is because she's the closest thing he has to a friend. It's probably the reason why he didn't blast her face there and then. Also, she's only hired to get names. I bet after the incident at Merlaut Aiden isolated himself from everyone he cared about to protect them while he goes on hunting for the guys who hired Maurice. They could've handled the last few acts better though. All I took away from that scene with Clara is that they clearly had plot points they want to hit, so they made a fast one.

That game also has a lot of throwaway characters. They could've done a better job fleshing out Iraq, Bedbug and Ray, but I guess that's probably due to budget and time constraints.

#25 Posted by TheBrokenPinion (35 posts) -

I kinda wish Default had a bigger role he just seamed cool, I enjoyed the game but the last few missions seamed like I was just rushing to finish it.

#26 Posted by Sla5hNeck (3 posts) -

@thebrokenpinion:

Yeah, but Defalt's car is top notch. Good skid. control, power stability. Embarrassingly, you can only get it if you let Defalt go after hack'n drive.

That reminds me, motorcycle super sucks, I'm used to good prim physics, but this, motorcycle is nailed to the street.

One other side note, Deadmau5 - Defalt - rat boy...... smh......So much creativity castrated to that. Pity.

Still love Watch Dog anyway, been looking for Creed life in modern days ..... and they serve this on a silver plate. RAD!!!...

#27 Edited by TheBrokenPinion (35 posts) -

@sla5hneck: Did not even know you could get his car

#28 Edited by Sla5hNeck (3 posts) -

easy come easy go, only lasted till the next campaign, and not automatically added to the car dealer list. In game the LCD look nice, even side window shade and glare look ultra realistic, the rolling mouse head matrix is a piece of work lol. Sorry, didn't mean to go off topic.

#29 Edited by CorruptedEvil (1696 posts) -

@sla5hneck: It is added to the car dealer list. I think it's under muscle or sport cars. That's the special reward for beating the mission as detailed in the progression menu.

Online
#30 Posted by Sla5hNeck (3 posts) -

@sla5hneck: It is added to the car dealer list. I think it's under muscle or sport cars.

COOL!...thanks!!.

#31 Posted by Whitestripes09 (399 posts) -

The ending was pretty crazy and it definitely seems like the sequel is going to continue that, which is a shame because I feel like the last few minutes of this game are actually good story wise with Aiden not being a total prick and being a somewhat original character after realizing the trail of bodies he left behind and becoming more than just a hired gun with a taste for revenge. Jordi was probably my favorite character and it was sort of upsetting to see him betray Aiden, but the action did fit his character.

#32 Posted by lead_dispencer (34 posts) -

I just finished this game not more than 15 minutes ago and had to hop on here for everyone's thoughts. i mostly agree with everyone overall. I really wished Clara did not die because she was my favorite character. But her dying made me like the story a lot better for me personally. I enjoyed the back and forth between Clara and Aiden, I kept wondering if they would hook up or become intimate because there were a few times they were flirting in their own weird stubborn hacker ways.

Ultimately, I feel like all the characters are underdeveloped and that the plot was rushed towards act 3-4. I enjoyed the secondary characters more than the primary ones but I this whole game is basically a giant set up for sequel. Despite these flaws I still enjoyed this game very much and I loved the gunplay and blowing shit up. Lets hope the next game (Due out probably 2016 I assume) pulls everything together and avoids the hype train that this one created.

#33 Posted by AlecOfTheWest (275 posts) -
#34 Posted by KalleNoble (1 posts) -

I agree with all this, but that ending I thought may have been the most annoying thing I have ever experienced in a game with all the random glitches in your hud. I feel like they were just trying to figure out to piss people off as much as possible.

#35 Edited by handlas (2658 posts) -

I just beat it and think this is probably my favorite GTA type game now. I don't know what is hard to follow about the story. I think that is one of its strengths. It wasn't overly complicated and all over the place like GTA 5 was I thought. I lost the motives of all the characters in GTA 5 and the ending was completely flat. All the characters in this game are just pieces of shit it seems. I liked that. Aiden seems like a scumbag.

I wish people hadn't been so lukewarm on this game. I really enjoyed every bit of it. A lot of the missions being able to be completed with simply hacking and not running in and shooting everyone was great.

Plus, without a doubt, this is the best shooting, stealth and driving in an open world game to date. No question. You could drop any parts of that stuff into another game of another genre and it would be good. GTA always had that problem... 5 especially has terrrrible stealth and the shooting has always been bad.

oh and bonus...ONE...ONLY ONE tailing mission. Shocking. However, I wasn't thrilled about the missions where you had to lead another character to a location using cameras.

I very much look forward to a sequel. I liked Jordi a lot so I hope he is a bigger role in the next game.

#36 Posted by GunstarRed (5022 posts) -

I thought it wrapped up OK. Although it really does feel like it's all setup for Ubisoft to just go full Batman with the next game. Really not sure how I feel about the name "The Fox." I liked the game a bunch, I wasn't all that fond of how aggressive the police get when CtOS goes crazy, but I had a good time with it and enjoyed the story for the most part. It definitely feels like the stakes are a lot higher than in something like GTAV and hopefully they can Assassins Creed 2 the hell out of the next game.

I also quite liked that Jordi turns on you for money. That's the character they set up throughout the rest of the game. The bounty on your head is massive, why wouldn't he go for it. I thought it was amusing how he just calls you up at the end like nothing had happened.

@handlas said:

oh and bonus...ONE...ONLY ONE tailing mission. Shocking. However, I wasn't thrilled about the missions where you had to lead another character to a location using cameras.

The only one that requires you to lead a character is the Bedbug one. The one with Aidens sister and T-Bone you can go in guns blazing. The Bedbug mission was a personal lowpoint of the game.

#37 Edited by DoctorTran (1544 posts) -

I agree with all this, but that ending I thought may have been the most annoying thing I have ever experienced in a game with all the random glitches in your hud. I feel like they were just trying to figure out to piss people off as much as possible.

That was pretty much how I felt about it. It made no logical sense to do that. I kind of understand with all of the waypoint markers but having the screen freak out was just a huge pain in the ass. That and the endless stream of police was just... uggghhh. Fucking cops.

#38 Posted by Humanity (8801 posts) -

That lighthouse scene was pretty fucking awesome though.

#39 Edited by Tomorrowman (147 posts) -

Overall I really enjoyed the game, I feel like there was a bunch of cynicism in the community around it that weighed down a perfectly fun thriller. The after the credits scene was the only thing that bugged me about the entire game.

After murdering like a billion innocent security guards all of the sudden I'm having a karmic crisis over a dude who killed a tiny child???

#40 Posted by handlas (2658 posts) -

Overall I really enjoyed the game, I feel like there was a bunch of cynicism in the community around it that weighed down a perfectly fun thriller. The after the credits scene was the only thing that bugged me about the entire game.

After murdering like a billion innocent security guards all of the sudden I'm having a karmic crisis over a dude who killed a tiny child???

True. Which is why I had no hesitation in shooting him right between the eyes. Why would Aiden walk away?

#41 Posted by Tomorrowman (147 posts) -

@handlas: I walked away cause I'm a goodie fuckin two shoes, but it felt completely out of character. Unlike something like fable or infamous where the 'bad' choices always feel shoehorned in.

#42 Posted by notnert427 (221 posts) -

@minipato said:

@meaninoflife42 said:

Maybe it's just me, but I felt like the Defalt section of the game was pointless. It didn't really contribute anything to the overall story and acted as an unnecessary set-up for a character that they could have easily introduced as the antagonist in Watch Dogs 2.

I was convinced that the Defalt mission was a preorder bonus mission or something. But then I realized it was a semi-recreation of the first E3 demo cause you go into the Ambrose Theater. I'm kinda glad he wasn't a more central villain though. I hate smug villains, but smug villains who taunt you with tired memes (U mad Aiden?) are the worst.

The Defalt portion of the game was terrible. They either needed to flesh out that character more or not include him at all. (I would have much preferred the latter.) Those memes were truly painful. I wanted to brutally murder his character, and it was satisfying when I did, but for the wrong reasons. It should have been about resolution, but instead I was just so glad not to have to deal with that annoying fucker ever again in the game.

Clara's death fell flat for me as well. I liked her character fine, but it felt like they thought about killing off Aiden's sister, decided that would be too much, and killed Clara instead. What was particularly jarring on my playthrough is that this sad piano music kicked in after she gets killed, but I stole a car to get from point a to point b, and some citizen called the cops on me, which ended up being a 10 minute cop chase that switched to the fast-paced "you're getting chased by the cops" music, and then when I finally evaded them, it reverted back to sad piano time. Uh, yeah.

The Damien blackout mission was annoying as well (most of the last Ubi missions are among the worst in their games, for some reason). I didn't mind the waypoint distractions and screen freakouts because that sort-of fit the game, but the police being literally inescapable was infuriating. I pulled off a brilliant sequence to evade the cops, only to find out that there would be a ctOS scan of 95 bubbles around wherever I went to put the cops right back on me. Bullshit.

I didn't mind Jordi turning on you. He was always in it for the money. I did mind when they had him call you like it was business as usual without even really addressing the fact that he just tried to fucking kill you. That seemed like a missed opportunity for some good banter. I hope they don't make him the villain in the next one. I'd like to see him be a central figure in the next game, but I think it would be much better if you ran across him throughout the game, sometimes being on your side, other times being against you based on who was paying him.

On the plus side, I did enjoy that Aiden took out Lucky Quinn via hacking the pacemaker when he thought he was safe in his panic room. That was a good moment. However, as usual, the game spoiled it a bit later, as playing through the side missions and other stuff after completing the story makes multiple fails by consistently having NPC chatter refer to Lucky as if he's alive. "Lucky said take you out!" No, I'm pretty sure he didn't. Also, throwing in a new label on Aiden as "the fox" at the end was weak. Not only is that a cheesy name, it's incredibly forced.

That's Watch_Dogs in a nutshell, though. It's a bunch of close, but no cigar. I liked the game overall, and I think it got a bunch of internet hate it didn't really deserve from people who never played it, dismissed it entirely for simply being an open-world game, acted like the game looks like complete shit because the final product wasn't as good as the tech demo, etc. Still, every time the game almost approached greatness for me, it would have some WTF moment.

I'm still playing some side mission stuff in Watch_Dogs, and I'm plenty excited for Watch_Dogs 2.0. It seems like they've set it up with Blume/ctOS 2.0 as the antagonist and more of anti-establishment narrative with the next go-round. Which, frankly, is probably what Watch_Dogs should have been, as Aiden's "revenge" story was ill-fitting and pretty fucking lame. If they do it right, the next game should have Aiden as an insane anarchist with nothing to lose who has completely lost his moral compass. That would make a hell of a lot more sense than having heroic Aiden steal money from people's bank accounts right after he beat down a dastardly criminal for stealing a purse.

If Ubi had some real balls, they'd make you the villain in the next game. Not at first, though. I'd like Aiden to do increasingly horrible shit throughout the story, under the notion that the ends would justify the means once he gets to the top of Blume to expose their evil and shut down intrusive ctOS for good. Except when he gets there, he discovers that Blume and ctOS serve zero nefarious purpose, that he's just terrorized the city for nothing, and that ctOS is designed to protect innocents from people like him. That would be a good story, but it will never make it in a AAA title because a bunch of pantywaists would go apeshit. Still, one can hope.

#43 Posted by overnow (120 posts) -

Did people really have to kill a ton of cops in the last mission? I had to do it twice on normal difficulty. My first run I basically crashed into a corner and killed 2 cops trying to get away but got taken out. My second run I didn't kill a single cop and didn't use boats until the final getaway after the virus uploads. My car got close to taken out multiple times and I just got a bit of space, hopped out and immediately hopped into a new one.

#44 Edited by DanielBar (1 posts) -

For me, the game was great, the story was.... "drinkable", but the worst, it the left open mysteries and the lack of choices.

I just finished the game, didnt play any special missions yet.

In Defalt, they talked about "precious prototypes" and thats it... wtf are they? Why does he has them...

And also Dedsec, to less développement! They could have been a key coponent of the game! And why couldnt i chose at the end if i wanted to help or not? Personnaly, i would have let them anyday!

And what happens to his family after?

Damien just didnt have any motive really....

I really think Ubisoft has a serious problem with endings... in the Far Crys, in the Assassin's Creeds....

For me, the name of a game means a lot and need to be justified, at the end, Dedsec said "We'll be the Watchdogs", for me at that point, Aiden was gonna agree, if not, then the title doesnt mean anything. ... is it just because the sequel is about Dedsec?

You can find a justification like " Aiden and T-Bone are the watchdogs of Chicago, butththey wanted to connect the title with Dedsec, so why the helk did he refuse?...

Btw, im posting this from my phone so sorry for any errors ( and it bugs a lot)

#45 Posted by VoshiNova (1638 posts) -

The game felt like it was made by ALOT of people in medium sized chunks.

The side activities really helped me pad out the hard turns in the story beats, but overall I thought it was just really fun gameplay.

#46 Posted by Glottery (1104 posts) -

@minipato said:

I hated the screen static effect during Defalt's mission and during the Damien blackout part in Act V. It's really annoying, which is the point, but it doesn't make sense in the context of the game story. It's not like you're Adam Jensen with cyber implant eyes or some super soldier in an advanced nanosuit. You're just a regular dude who hacks stuff with his phone.

I had the exact same thought about cyber eyes and laughed at how silly it was.