Will they use the Max payne Shooting?

#1 Posted by JBird (489 posts) -

After watching he max payne videos the red text above the enemies heads reminded me of red dead, and then I suddenly thought. How cool would it be if they used the shooting controls from Max Payne in GTA V! I'm not talking about the slow mo dives, im talking about the literal third person shooting controls. The one thing that GTA IV lacked (in my opinion) was some real tight shooting controls, it became more of a lock on, tap up, headshot fest.

What do you think? Do you think the max payne shooting controls would add to the game's action? Or would the red dead aiming be suitable? Or just same as GTA IV!

#2 Posted by easthill (351 posts) -

I don't know, I haven't tried Max Payne 3 yet.

#3 Posted by Sooty (8082 posts) -

If they make it the same as GTA IV or RDR I won't buy it for sure, them games control hella clunky. RDR wasn't as bad at least.

#4 Posted by Fjordson (2448 posts) -

I thought RDR was an improvement over GTA IV and Max Payne 3 looks to be an even bigger improvement over RDR.

I think it's possible. The good thing is Max Payne 3 uses the RAGE engine, same as R*'s open world games, so theoretically pretty much anything they do with MP 3 could be in GTA V.

#5 Posted by AhmadMetallic (18955 posts) -
@Sooty said:
If they make it the same as GTA IV or RDR I won't buy it for sure, them games control hella clunky. RDR wasn't as bad at least.
I never understood this. GTA IV on the PC has the most satisfying shooting in a game ever. The guns felt heavy, cold and real in Niko's hands, they were loud and effectively damaging, and they sunk in enemies' bodies so well and popped their heads off.
#6 Posted by easthill (351 posts) -

@AhmadMetallic said:

@Sooty said:
If they make it the same as GTA IV or RDR I won't buy it for sure, them games control hella clunky. RDR wasn't as bad at least.
I never understood this. GTA IV on the PC has the most satisfying shooting in a game ever. The guns felt heavy, cold and real in Niko's hands, they were loud and effectively damaging, and they sunk in enemies' bodies so well and popped their heads off.

Because auto aim. You could turn it off, but then the controls weren't precise enough to feel satisfying. Naturally, this wasn't a problem on the PC.

#7 Posted by Enigma777 (6070 posts) -

@AhmadMetallic said:

@Sooty said:
If they make it the same as GTA IV or RDR I won't buy it for sure, them games control hella clunky. RDR wasn't as bad at least.
I never understood this. GTA IV on the PC has the most satisfying shooting in a game ever. The guns felt heavy, cold and real in Niko's hands, they were loud and effectively damaging, and they sunk in enemies' bodies so well and popped their heads off.

No, the shooting was pretty awful. The terrible cover system didn't help.

#8 Posted by jillsandwich (762 posts) -

Max Payne 3 controls are pretty out of character for a GTA game, in my opinion.

I think it's safe to say that targeting has been reworked, though. Let's hope they can finally make that work well.

#9 Posted by Yummylee (21477 posts) -

I'd be perfectly OK if GTAV still played a lot like RDR. I loved RDR's shooting; got me soopa addicted to the MP.

#10 Posted by TentPole (1858 posts) -

I don't think it is so easy to take the gameplay mechanics created for one engine and successfully fit them into another.

#11 Posted by CL60 (16906 posts) -

@AhmadMetallic said:

@Sooty said:
If they make it the same as GTA IV or RDR I won't buy it for sure, them games control hella clunky. RDR wasn't as bad at least.
I never understood this. GTA IV on the PC has the most satisfying shooting in a game ever. The guns felt heavy, cold and real in Niko's hands, they were loud and effectively damaging, and they sunk in enemies' bodies so well and popped their heads off.

I agree. I never understand why people say the shooting in GTAIV is incredibly bad. I think it's fantastic. Same with the driving. I thought they handled the driving really well too.

#12 Edited by MooseyMcMan (10868 posts) -

It would probably be amazing if they did, but I bet there are a whole bunch of (technical) reasons why they can't.

Edit: I'm more concerned about the literal controls. I like playing these games on PS3 (because that's what I do (I don't pay for Xbox Live Gold)), but I don't like how it's always L2 to aim and R2 to fire. They patched in a thing for RDR to let you switch that, but it'd be nice to have that from the start (for both GTAV and Max Payne 3, actually).

Moderator
#13 Posted by ShaggE (6403 posts) -

I just hope enemies go the hell down when I dump on them. I love GTA4, but it really set my gaming OCD on edge when I'd put eight headshots into a guy just to have him writhe around on the ground afterwards. I know the human body is much more resilient than fiction makes it out to be, and most shootings are non-fatal, but eight bullets to the face is pretty goddamn fatal.

#14 Posted by mosespippy (4106 posts) -

@TentPole said:

I don't think it is so easy to take the gameplay mechanics created for one engine and successfully fit them into another.

Both games are made using the Rockstar Advanced Game Engine (aka the RAGE engine), so it likely won't be too hard for them to copy a system from one game and put it in another, especially when they are also the company that makes the game engine.

#15 Posted by BBQBram (2212 posts) -

I'd hope so but if it's on the level of Red Dead that would be fine.

#16 Posted by artgarcrunkle (970 posts) -

It probably won't be much of an improvement over Red Dead (which had horrible controls) because it doesn't have to be great to make a ton of money.

#17 Posted by mikeeegeee (1553 posts) -

@CL60 said:

@AhmadMetallic said:

@Sooty said:
If they make it the same as GTA IV or RDR I won't buy it for sure, them games control hella clunky. RDR wasn't as bad at least.
I never understood this. GTA IV on the PC has the most satisfying shooting in a game ever. The guns felt heavy, cold and real in Niko's hands, they were loud and effectively damaging, and they sunk in enemies' bodies so well and popped their heads off.

I agree. I never understand why people say the shooting in GTAIV is incredibly bad. I think it's fantastic. Same with the driving. I thought they handled the driving really well too.

I don't think most people played through the game without auto-aim. It's a much better experience without it.

#18 Posted by Sooty (8082 posts) -
@mikeeegeee said:

@CL60 said:

@AhmadMetallic said:

@Sooty said:
If they make it the same as GTA IV or RDR I won't buy it for sure, them games control hella clunky. RDR wasn't as bad at least.
I never understood this. GTA IV on the PC has the most satisfying shooting in a game ever. The guns felt heavy, cold and real in Niko's hands, they were loud and effectively damaging, and they sunk in enemies' bodies so well and popped their heads off.

I agree. I never understand why people say the shooting in GTAIV is incredibly bad. I think it's fantastic. Same with the driving. I thought they handled the driving really well too.

I don't think most people played through the game without auto-aim. It's a much better experience without it.

I did, still think it's horrible. RDR was considerably better, I think it's more a case of the guns lacking feedback than anything else.
#19 Posted by AhmadMetallic (18955 posts) -
@mikeeegeee said:

@CL60 said:

@AhmadMetallic said:

@Sooty said:
If they make it the same as GTA IV or RDR I won't buy it for sure, them games control hella clunky. RDR wasn't as bad at least.
I never understood this. GTA IV on the PC has the most satisfying shooting in a game ever. The guns felt heavy, cold and real in Niko's hands, they were loud and effectively damaging, and they sunk in enemies' bodies so well and popped their heads off.

I agree. I never understand why people say the shooting in GTAIV is incredibly bad. I think it's fantastic. Same with the driving. I thought they handled the driving really well too.

I don't think most people played through the game without auto-aim. It's a much better experience without it.

/thread
#20 Posted by mikeeegeee (1553 posts) -

@Sooty: What do you mean lack of feedback? In my mind, feedback is the sound of the gun coupled with the reaction of the enemy being shot. Maybe the gun sounds weren't great, but the impact of bullets was practically palpable, wasn't it? Shoot a guy in the knee, he crumples over, clutching his knee. He'll probably then shoot at you from the ground, but if he manages to get up, he hobbles off, limping where you shot him. Isn't that pretty sweet? I'm not saying you're incorrect, I just wonder where you're coming from.

#21 Posted by Funkydupe (3311 posts) -

Max Payne Shooting = Normal Shooting but in slow motion?

#22 Posted by Daiphyer (1333 posts) -

I don't care what anyone says, the shooting in GTA IV was terrible. It was clunky and sluggish. They improved it in RDR, but the cover mechanics still sucked. I really hope they use a toned-down less arcadey version of the shooting mechanics in MP3.

#23 Posted by Gildo (8 posts) -

No. Vice City on the pc had something similar to the MP3 gameplay that I have seen and I didn't seem to enjoy it as much as the PS2 version plus it seems to me that your problem isn't with the shooting controls/mechanics of GTAIV but more so on the lock-on/auto-aim mechanics. I think all of us here knows how you can easily solve that...

#24 Edited by Andorski (5249 posts) -

GTA IV had your basic third person shooter controls. The problem was that it felt sluggish and unresponsive. They can keep going that route and have a tighter third person shooting mechanic, but I would prefer they go with what they did with RDR. The pseudo-lock on mechanic had you popping off enemies with ease, and its control scheme made shooting while driving (or in RDR's case, horseback riding) feel unencumbered. You can argue that it took away the necessity of skill while in combat, but no one plays free-roaming Rockstar games to challenge their shooting reflexes.

They should also take out the cover mechanic all together. It works in games like Gears of War because the entire level design is rooted in that feature. They can't build an entire city with the cover mechanic in mind, unless they are willing to have the entire neighborhood with waist-high walls. Here's an idea: have the player be able to crouch, so they can literally put themselves behind cover. With the Euphoria engine, they could (maybe) have the player's character "react" to cover (e.g. put their back to the wall) when taking cover, so that there is the sensation of "taking cover" without the frustration of getting sucked onto the side of something.

Online
#25 Posted by Vinny_Says (5700 posts) -

RDR was smooth as butter in comparison to GTA4, make it just a bit better than that in GTA5 and you're good.

#26 Posted by CaptainTightPants (2834 posts) -
@Andorski: I have no idea how you think that removing the cover system will at all help the shooting. Not that it matters since the cover system in both GTA IV and RDR works just fine. You could hide behind dumpsters, cars, and hot dog vendor stands, in addition to walls in GTA IV so building an entire city with a cover mechanic in mind isn't really necessary.
#27 Posted by Andorski (5249 posts) -

@Resident4t said:

@Andorski: I have no idea how you think that removing the cover system will at all help the shooting. Not that it matters since the cover system in both GTA IV and RDR works just fine. You could hide behind dumpsters, cars, and hot dog vendor stands, in addition to walls in GTA IV so building an entire city with a cover mechanic in mind isn't really necessary.

The cover mechanic in GTA IV and RDR can work, but it's not consistent. From a technical aspect, there are multiple occasions when the game's engine can't decide whether an object is something that can used to take cover. It mostly happens with "detailed" objects. Taking cover behind a flat wall works out well, but it gets finicky when you try to take cover behind a cabinet because its door is ajar and the game doesn't know how to account for the character's back being planted against and irregularly shaped object. Then there are times when the player can take cover behind an object that is just a hair too short, which actually left them open to enemy fire. I specifically remember this being a problem with RDR and taking cover behind rocks in the canyons and deserts.

Not to mention that the cover mechanic is at odds with sandbox games. Open world environments allows for combat scenarios where enemies can spawn from every direction. The cover mechanic is effective only when enemies pop up from the other side of cover. Stop-and-pop shooters like Gears of War of course have combat scenarios where enemies spawn from the player's flank as well, but these situations always happen in levels specifically designed with additional cover on the player's sides to keep them covered. Uncharted 3's ship graveyard is a great example of how bad of an issue this can be when the level design does not compensate for enemies spawning from all sides.

Online
#28 Posted by phrali (646 posts) -

i don't care about the shooting mechanics I JUST DONT WANT TO HAVE TO BUTTON MASH TO SPRINT JUST LET ME HOLD DOWN THE FUCKING BUTTON

#29 Posted by Donkeycow (556 posts) -

I'm happy if the shooting is the same as RDR. Im not really sure why people are so negative about RDR's controls, in my opinion they are tight and the guns feel hefty and powerful.

#30 Posted by MikkaQ (10281 posts) -

@mikeeegeee said:

@CL60 said:

@AhmadMetallic said:

@Sooty said:
If they make it the same as GTA IV or RDR I won't buy it for sure, them games control hella clunky. RDR wasn't as bad at least.
I never understood this. GTA IV on the PC has the most satisfying shooting in a game ever. The guns felt heavy, cold and real in Niko's hands, they were loud and effectively damaging, and they sunk in enemies' bodies so well and popped their heads off.

I agree. I never understand why people say the shooting in GTAIV is incredibly bad. I think it's fantastic. Same with the driving. I thought they handled the driving really well too.

I don't think most people played through the game without auto-aim. It's a much better experience without it.

I used the auto-aim and still thought it had great shooting controls.

#31 Posted by Arker101 (1474 posts) -

@Yummylee said:

I'd be perfectly OK if GTAV still played a lot like RDR. I loved RDR's shooting; got me soopa addicted to the MP.

I don't know what it was but shooting stuff in RDR felt good. I haven't played MP3 yet, so it might be as good.

#32 Posted by RedRoach (1190 posts) -

RDR and MP3 have much, MUCH better sooting controls then GTA4 did so I'm cool with that.

#33 Posted by TEHMAXXORZ (1199 posts) -

It will still blow Saints Row clean out of the water.

#34 Posted by Muttinus_Rump (814 posts) -

Haven't played Max Payne, but the RDR controls with the advanced aiming on were incredible. Having that'd be nice.

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