A Lesson in Kickstarter Naivety

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#101 Posted by kkotd (294 posts) -

I like his idea of making people guess, but honestly he should have alteast given a bit of an idea out and then made backer goals like at $250 I reveal the title and at $500 I reveal my alpha build and at $1000 I invite all backers to help beta test... Market it! The real problem with this is that he admitted that he can make these games without kickstarter and now plans to ask for money AFTER they are done. Now while it costs money to publish titles, it sounds more like he's going to use Kickstarter to popularize and then monetize the property, using Kickstarter as the marketplace. That's not any better, infact that's probably worst than funding a 'mystery' game that may never come out. Kickstarter is not the poorman's Steam, nor should it be used just to make money off an already finished property nor use it just to make your game more popular.

#102 Posted by Assirra (95 posts) -
#103 Posted by TheHBK (5472 posts) -

Scam. Westwood college is just another diploma mill. He wouldn't actually know how to make a video game.

#104 Posted by TheHumanDove (2523 posts) -

The guy is essentially forming a scam. Look at his shitty 'martial arts' bonus. I don't know shit about martial arts, and I could make better, more fluid moves. Also, fuck pong.

#105 Posted by TheHumanDove (2523 posts) -

@clstirens said:

As someone who actually has a team built together, a team which has been working diligently to create a prototype build for our game, this sort of thing makes me incredibly sad.

Based on the details, it looks like he was just naive, but either way the increasing amount of distrust for Kickstarter projects has made our goal of posting our project on the site FAR more uncertain than it was before.

Makes you sad? Expect your possible customers to be more smart than 'spend money on unknown project from unknown person'. If that's your actual take on this, then you don't know much about business, or about common sense.

#106 Edited by umdesch4 (772 posts) -

@wmaustin55 said:

I also love how everyone here has expert life advice or is just belittling this dude. Come on now, your life isn't much better than this dude, if it even is at all. Such is the Internet and anonymous faces, I suppose

Nope, sorry. This doesn't fly. I don't care how great this guy's life is compared to mine, reading the comments on that kickstarter project and discovering that he was asking for $1500 in order to purchase a Unity engine license that wouldn't allow him to develop for the platforms he's claiming to deliver on...I thought maybe Unity licensing was deeply confusing or something. I spent less time at https://store.unity3d.com and http://unity3d.com/unity/licenses than I've spent writing this post, and my understanding of it is better than his was when he started asking for money. Does that mean I'd be more likely to deliver on a game than he would? I suspect so, and since I wouldn't bet money on myself to fully produce a game, I certainly wouldn't send him money.

Holy crap man, I spent more time researching how to cook the dinner I made this evening than I did figuring out these licenses. Frankly, I'm shocked that people are giving this guy a pass, and more to the point, talking out of their ass without even reading the details of this kickstarter project!

PS. Good on Mighty Rabbit Studios for spending a buck on the project so they could comment in an attempt to educate this guy. That's a classy move, IMHO.

#107 Edited by avantegardener (1117 posts) -

Well I'm glad that crappy projects are getting rooting out, as the kickstarter model has always presented a dangerous attitude of 'free moneyz' and burying more worthy prospects.

#108 Posted by BraveToaster (12590 posts) -

I'm still on the fence about people using Kickstarter to fund games. It all comes off as begging for money to me. I mean, I'm sure that awesome things will come out of this, but I don't see myself donating money to fund any of it.

#109 Posted by clstirens (847 posts) -

@TheHumanDove said:

@clstirens said:

As someone who actually has a team built together, a team which has been working diligently to create a prototype build for our game, this sort of thing makes me incredibly sad.

Based on the details, it looks like he was just naive, but either way the increasing amount of distrust for Kickstarter projects has made our goal of posting our project on the site FAR more uncertain than it was before.

Makes you sad? Expect your possible customers to be more smart than 'spend money on unknown project from unknown person'. If that's your actual take on this, then you don't know much about business, or about common sense.

Actually, it's because people may stop going to Kickstarter altogether thanks to an increasing rise in this, but thanks for insulting me.

#110 Posted by Johnny5 (1355 posts) -

Then there was Mythic that game whose page was covered in nothing but stolen art assets and lies that got around $15k before being exposed and cancelling funding.

#111 Posted by TheHumanDove (2523 posts) -

@clstirens: Meh, you had it coming. lawl

#112 Posted by Fleafa (51 posts) -

Wow, he is not good at Capoeira.

#113 Posted by predator (350 posts) -

Video game Kickstarters make my blood boil, especially Double Fine getting $3,336,371 of donations for proprietary software, then contributing to an free software platform with a permissive licence, stating that "open source is very much in the spirit of Kickstarter", which is an ultimate kick in the nuts.

#114 Posted by WindFall259 (364 posts) -

@TheHumanDove: He had it coming only because idiots like you exist.

#115 Posted by AriesDog (36 posts) -

The man doesn't even position his Kinect sensor properly. (Off to the left?) How could you trust him to make a game.

#116 Posted by ma_rc_01 (363 posts) -

I thought his kickstarter was supposed to be a meta commentary on kickstarter, but no it was just his PR campaign.

#117 Posted by LegendaryChopChop (1198 posts) -

@ma_rc_01 said:

I thought his kickstarter was supposed to be a meta commentary on kickstarter, but no it was just his PR campaign.

Same here, when I saw it, I thought it was being aware to the fact that Kickstarter is being abused.

This guy was honest and seems like a nice guy, though. Plus, he stayed true to his backer's deal. Quite a dude to do that.

#118 Posted by dropabombonit (1490 posts) -

People have turned sour on kickstarter so fast, good that you let people know what the real deal with this guy was

#119 Posted by Norusdog (344 posts) -

this is stupid. kickstarter can blow me.

yah let me "donate" money to help a company (small or not) make a game so that I can fucking pay again and they can make money.

you get double fucked.

anyone supporting this shit is a fucking retard

#120 Posted by Cheesebob (1235 posts) -

@Norusdog: You...you do realize that you usually get the game for 'free' if you donate a certain amount? Like for the double fine one, if you donate $15 you get the game DRM free.

#121 Posted by Nights (611 posts) -

@Cheesebob said:

@Norusdog: You...you do realize that you usually get the game for 'free' if you donate a certain amount? Like for the double fine one, if you donate $15 you get the game DRM free.

Of course he doesn't. A lot of people tend to talk shit without getting their facts straight.

#122 Posted by WMWA (1160 posts) -
@umdesch4 That's fair. I was speaking more to people just trolling and talking about him as a person. Not even talking about the actual business aspects. You're right, he does need to and should know this
#123 Edited by Bread_Harrity (108 posts) -

As an artist, I've seen people like this guy. I don't think he was being naive, I think he is PLAYING the naive card (after he got called out). There are "artists" that do the same thing, particularly in the freelance field and it damages the integrity of the industry and makes it harder for real artists.

Sorry but there is nothing innocent going on here.

#124 Posted by J913B (1 posts) -

They need to step up their filtering.

#125 Posted by EuanDewar (4890 posts) -

Capoeira? FUCKING LOL

#126 Posted by Scodiac (470 posts) -

@Norusdog: I've contributed to two projects and part of the deal with both of them is a copy of the game and a video doc of the development as it happens. You've got a lot to say about something you seem to know little to nothing about.

#127 Posted by LordAndrew (14426 posts) -

@Norusdog said:

this is stupid. kickstarter can blow me.

yah let me "donate" money to help a company (small or not) make a game so that I can fucking pay again and they can make money.

you get double fucked.

anyone supporting this shit is a fucking retard

If you don't want to pay twice, give enough that you can reach the "get the game" prize tier. Most of the time it's also cheaper than if you bought it at release.

#128 Posted by blacklab (1542 posts) -

My guess is that he probably just wanted attention.

#129 Edited by Bread_Harrity (108 posts) -

@blacklab: This. Unfortunately, I think he just ruined his reputation and probably made a lot more people wary about Kick Starter stuff.

This article was way too nice to the guy.

Edit: The fact that he ruined his reputation is fortunate, since no one will make the mistake of trusting him.

#130 Posted by probablytuna (3611 posts) -

So far I've only backed three projects, all of them by known developers in the industry. I'm not sure if I can trust people that haven't got some good games under their belt.

#131 Posted by mrfluke (5130 posts) -
#132 Posted by forestofdeath (252 posts) -

@Norusdog: Classy shit, guy.

#133 Posted by Saganomics (191 posts) -

@Smokey_Earhole said:

@Saganomics said:

Word. I liked playing as Eddy Gordo, too.

And you can totally learn to do that shit, for reals! (But probably not from this guy, judging by the video demonstration...)

Come on, dude. He took his glasses off and everything. This is clearly a guy who knows what he's doing.

#134 Posted by yoshisaur (2701 posts) -

@Pixel_Kaiser said:

I kind of get the feeling, though, that Patrick is leaning a bit too heavily into the Kickstarter skepticism lately.

The sad thing is that skepticism and negativity always make better articles. I, myself, do not agree with this sentiment, but it rings too true.

#135 Posted by Anupsis (291 posts) -

Isn't doing a Kickstarter after the game is done defeat the purpose?

This dude worries me.

#136 Posted by BamBamBradley (24 posts) -

Why would people throw money at a guy who just says I'm going to make a game but I don't know what is it yet?

#137 Posted by Binman88 (3685 posts) -

@BamBamBradley said:

Why would people throw money at a guy who just says I'm going to make a game but I don't know what is it yet?

Indeed. Also I don't like it when it seems that people are using Kickstarter as an easy way to offload risk to a bunch of strangers, when the sum is such that it could be attained rather easily by other means. 1500 dollars is not a huge sum, and I'd be more willing to donate to someone's project if they first showed me that they did all they could to get that money together themselves (eg. selling their shit, going to a bank or credit union to get a loan). If you're confident in your project, to the point where you're happy to beg strangers to part with their hard earned cash, I think you should be confident enough to place that risk on yourself first and foremost. If you've done that (sold all you could sell, borrowed all you can borrow), prove it.

#138 Posted by InternetDetective (351 posts) -

I hope his grandma kicks him out.

#139 Edited by Nintendude (283 posts) -

@Anupsis: @Anupsis said:

Isn't doing a Kickstarter after the game is done defeat the purpose?

This dude worries me.

Yeah kind of. A project course could need money if they want to push out any physical product but falsely claiming that money is needed to make some idea come true or to continue development would be a damn disappointing scam.

#140 Posted by Boopie (191 posts) -

when I asked for 250 hundred million to make my Minecraft meets Bayonetta by way of Starflight masterwork KIckstarter denied me the right to post it so I am now forced to crowd source this game through the interwebs themselves what they used to call "coding to the metal" in the Sega Saturn days

#141 Posted by sublime90 (531 posts) -

Capoeira!? ba na na wayyyy ba na na way nana naaaa ba na na wayyyyyyy ba na na way na na na

#142 Posted by 1337W422102 (1009 posts) -

Fuck year, 1337 funding.

#143 Posted by sthusby (382 posts) -

Eddy Gordo made a Kickstarter. Cool.

#144 Posted by Suits (245 posts) -

Yes, let's be as vague as possible to get money from complete strangers that don't know what it's for.

#145 Posted by Enigma_2099 (146 posts) -

“I decided to go the route I did because I thought people might enjoy trying to figure out some early details about my game while waiting for the game to be finally revealed at a later time,”

What in the hell made you think THAT was a good idea!?!?!? You people are asking for REAL money! No one's gonna give up cash for what looks like an empty promise!

Even if your intentions were honorable, it doesn't work that way, and it WON'T work that way. The only people that can get away with that are people like Tim Schaffer, and it's not because of who he is.... it's because of what he's done. People see him, and they KNOW he's really making a game, because he already has... several in fact. It's not about becoming a household name, it's about backing up your requests with proof that you're not scamming anyone, and you're actually making a GAME. Even if you don't offer up anything but a 5 minute demo as proof, that's infinitely better than not offering up anything at all, and then asking for cash...

#146 Posted by jasondesante (603 posts) -

that guy is a total noob

#147 Posted by Arkasai (701 posts) -

Oh god, please someone find me a gif that meme's the shit out of that capoeira video.

#148 Posted by aksanakmal (3 posts) -

Kickstarter makes that guidelines to filter which project is promising and which is not, that is so the backers can determine to pledge or not. The project sounds cool, but by not explaining it when he is convincing his backer's candidate is a big mistake. His fail isn't a reason to trigger anti-kickstarters. But I agree if he makes another one (with a clear explanation of what is the project) , he'll make the pledges for sure.

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