Killzone 3: Online Multiplayer at it's Worst

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#1 Posted by MetalMoog (907 posts) -

Man I don't think I've ever been more excited and disappointed by a game than Killzone 3. While playing the beta I was having a lot of fun with the game. Everyone was running around shooting each other, trying out different classes and guns and it was a fun chaotic mess. Now that the game's release has been in full swing for a couple of weeks I find every Warzone match is ruined by camping invisible Marksman with Assault Rifles. Due to the Medic's revive and cool down sucking and the Engineer having such crappy guns and weak turrets, Warzone is filled with Marksmen and Infiltrators. My whole problem with the game is the awesome tactical squad based play that Killzone 2 had are completely missing here. No spawning on squad leader anymore, no separate squad based systems (Alpha, Bravo, etc) from KZ2 and the game is reduced to lone wolf camping. Compared to a tactical team based shooter like Battlefield Bad Company 2, I'm not having any fun playing this online. It constantly leaves me filled with rage and frustrated about it's potential that was squandered to cater to the Call of Duty audience. I'm hoping that upcoming patches will fix the gameplay and push it more towards team based play like it's supposed to be, but I'm not holding my breath.

#2 Posted by mosespippy (4031 posts) -

A patch later this week is changing the cooldown on the medic tool from 25 seconds to 10 seconds. I'd say the game is more tactical than KZ2 because in KZ2 there would be 4 spawn grenades thrown down in a 15 meter radius and everyone would just throw a grenade and then die from someone else's grenade and they'd repeat. At least now map control is implemented with capturable spawns.

#3 Posted by benjaebe (2783 posts) -

While there are some things that I preferred from Killzone 2 multiplayer, K3 is not even close to online multiplayer at it's worst. It's actually pretty good.

#4 Edited by X19 (2304 posts) -

SOCOM 4 you're so close. Take me back to a time when ppl knew how to work as a team.

#5 Posted by JacDG (2113 posts) -
@benjaebe said:
" While there are some things that I preferred from Killzone 2 multiplayer, K3 is not even close to online multiplayer at it's worst. It's actually pretty good. "
I would have to agree, and while some things piss me off, mostly Infiltrators (to which there is a counter, but still) but also idiotic teammates, other than that it's pretty good.
#6 Posted by Bucketdeth (8004 posts) -

I am a huge fan of how Killzone 2 did things for multiplayer, it was fresh and innovative. I feel Killzone 3 is a great game and is still a blast to play online but is missing a lot of features the game should have had in the first place.
 
But I still think Killzone 3 is now where near close to multiplayer at it's worst.

#7 Posted by Punk1984 (549 posts) -

I've been playing a medic since day one (and in beta) I've only run into a horrible match one time. It had a variety of factors, camping marksman cloaked, idiot over headset and unbalanced teams. Once I found out where the marksman camped I lobbed a grenade up there and took him out. I muted the idiot over headset. The team imbalance persisted but was adjusted on the next map. KZ3 is very good multiplayer.

#8 Posted by SocialistNinja (33 posts) -

i wish it had the classes unlocked by level progression instead of having all classes by  level one.

#9 Posted by RobotHamster (4171 posts) -
@benjaebe said:
" While there are some things that I preferred from Killzone 2 multiplayer, K3 is not even close to online multiplayer at it's worst. It's actually pretty good. "
Yea I agree, even with its faults Killzone is really fun to play and no where near the worst.
#10 Posted by MetalMoog (907 posts) -

I find I'm always frustrated by the lack of Medics doing revives when I'm not playing one, and frustrated by the rampant X button mashing to respawn when I am playing one. Either side of the coin, I'm getting pissed off when I play. I think the reason I hate it so much is because it's not as team work oriented as I was expecting, far too many people worrying about their K/D and not working together going after objectives. It's good if you like lone wolf CoD style gameplay, it's bad if you were expecting it to be team based and innovative. I'm sure clan matches would be much better and more team focused, I haven't tried any of those yet. I'm just speaking about my experiences playing Warzone and Guerrilla Warfare in public matches. I do know the Killzone boards are flooded with complaints and frustration over the game, much of the same as I've been experiencing. Those that loved Killzone 2 for the vast majority view Killzone 3 as a step backward, as do I.

#11 Posted by Punk1984 (549 posts) -
@MetalMoog: I love Killzone 2 and don't view Killzone 3 as a step backward. I like the upgrade system and the new mode.
#12 Posted by MetalMoog (907 posts) -

I too enjoy the upgrade system, new controls, graphics, and single player campaign.

#13 Posted by Punk1984 (549 posts) -
@MetalMoog said:
" I too enjoy the upgrade system, new controls, graphics, and single player campaign. "
See it's ok. *Supportive pat on the back while sensitive music plays* Now let's play catch in the frontyard
#14 Posted by President_Barackbar (3432 posts) -
@SocialistNinja said:
" i wish it had the classes unlocked by level progression instead of having all classes by  level one. "
Really? I thought that was the worst part of KZ2. I played it quite a bit and never got to see 3 classes.
#15 Posted by lead_farmer (1040 posts) -
@X19 said:
" SOCOM 4 you're so close. Take me back to a time when ppl knew how to work as a team. "
I hear that. 
@MetalMoog:   I can understand the frustration.  There are a lot of marksman and while I don't mind too much because a lot of them are too dumb to change where they snipe from the biggest issue for me is when the snipers on your team stick to camping in a spot instead of helping out the team.  You should play with the Bx3 clan.  From what I can tell most people are Tacticians and Medics.
#16 Posted by MetalMoog (907 posts) -

That's a hell of an idea lead_farmer. Playing with people that actually work as a team would increase my enjoyment of the game a ton.

#17 Posted by McQuinn (651 posts) -
@X19 said:
" SOCOM 4 you're so close. Take me back to a time when ppl knew how to work as a team. "
ooooh yeeeaaahh 
  
I miss the squad tactics stuff too. Also those spawn grenades at the shear lols of a bloodbath they would create, even if they definitely needed to get rid of them.

Yeah, there have been games where I had to change out of marksmen even though I was the best one on the team. When I see four marksmen hanging out I know we are going to loose. A good marksman stays on the move. I use my pistol just as much as my rifle.
#18 Posted by Jamjones (21 posts) -

There two things that kinda bother me
 
Marksman is the all around deadly class 
Range they got the sniper rifle, machine pistol, and cloak suit is great  and For medium range they got the assault rifle and scrambler which negates tactician ability while engineer get nothing but repair and place turret that i swear are out to get me -_-

#19 Edited by handlas (2658 posts) -

Killzone 3's MP is basically a worse version of Killzone 2 but with better controls. 
 
It's not bad, just not as good.  I've actually went back and bought Killzone 2 just to play it again because I feel like I'm playing an inferior version of it with Killzone 3.  
 
The main detraction is the maps.  I just simply don't like them.  There is only 1 i like and a couple okay ones;  Bilgarsk Boulevard and a little bit of Pyrrhus Crater and Frozen Dam.   I played the Jetpack map a couple times and thought it was terrible.  You touched on the classes...I dislike some of the changes made.  I agree the sniper class shouldn't have a machine gun; dunno why they do.  I end up doing 2 primary weapon perk and holding a sniper rifle and a machine gun.   
 
And then I just nitpick other things like I thought KZ2 has some nice visual effects here and there that seem to be gone...for comparison sake, tho, this isn't major you can look at the default rifle.  In Killzone 2 the sights had a nice reflective effect going on that is almost completely gone in KZ3.  And I'm all for color but it almost bothers me in KZ3; I liked KZ2's darkness on everything....KZ3 feels like a completely different world.
 
SP side of things the I can't compare because I haven't beaten KZ3 but that may say something in itself....I beat KZ2 within the week it came out and haven't felt compelled to do so with KZ3.  KZ3, for me, is the perfect example of 1 step forward; 2 steps back.  Fix the controls majority of people complained about and then change a lot of good things about the game.

#20 Posted by shivermetimbers (763 posts) -
@MetalMoog:  I agree a million percent with you. Accept I would change marksman with assult riffle to marksman with sniper riffles. Lord knows how many times I've been spawn killed by marksman with his sniper rifle.
#21 Posted by Chojin (107 posts) -
@MetalMoog said:

" That's a hell of an idea lead_farmer. Playing with people that actually work as a team would increase my enjoyment of the game a ton. "

 

Yeah, come play with us:) We played yesterday and lost to an Italians clan obsessed with sentry bots and rocket launchers;p

I have to say that most of the times I play, there tend to be a group of people playing it as it`s supposed to be played, and I stick to them. Covering and reviving. I play only as a medic and couldn’t care less about K/D ratio. I absolutely hate games like COD and play this solely because of the team aspect. Probably half of my death`s is related to exposing myself to revive. Can`t wait for the revival distance to be increased.

#22 Posted by RsistncE (4496 posts) -

All I know is that half the games I play are complete clusterfucks.

#23 Posted by Vinny_Says (5685 posts) -

you've obviously never played the online in GTA4

Online
#24 Posted by Interfect (978 posts) -
@MetalMoog said:
" That's a hell of an idea lead_farmer. Playing with people that actually work as a team would increase my enjoyment of the game a ton. "
Yeah I play as a medic always, and when I'm playing with the clan I always stick my neck out to go rescue Enigma or someone else who is dead.
#25 Posted by Spoonman671 (4554 posts) -

I have to call bullshit on this one.  Killzone 3 has some problems, but there is almost always a nice diversity of classes in Warzone.  It's a very rare occasion when I can't find a usable ammo crate and I find myself getting revived often enough (sometimes by myself) for my tastes.  There are too many marksman, but that can be said of any game with a sniper class.

#26 Posted by AuthenticM (3698 posts) -

I would say that KZ3 is a much better game than its predecessor.

#27 Edited by captain_clayman (3318 posts) -

killzone 3 is the most fun i've had with multiplayer on PS3.  second is uncharted 2, mostly because of the co-op horde mode stuff. 
my only beef with it is it's not QUITE as customizable as it should be (like you cant do all kinds of specific stuff with the way the matches go, like the sequence in warzone) 
 
and i kinda wish the engie and marksman should swap their middle class guns, like the marksman gets the SMG, and the engie gets the assault rifle.

#28 Posted by TravisT (160 posts) -

The only thing I've been unhappy with so far are Infiltrators on Frozen Dam. 

#29 Posted by Afroman269 (7387 posts) -

People tend to work together more in operations, unfortunately there are only 3 fucking scenarios in that gametype. I like that one the most. I don't agree about with KZ 3 being called the worst but I do agree about the rampant camping by bitch ass marksman. Also grenade spamming is still a problem.

#30 Posted by Redbullet685 (6024 posts) -
@President_Barackbar said:
" @SocialistNinja said:
" i wish it had the classes unlocked by level progression instead of having all classes by  level one. "
Really? I thought that was the worst part of KZ2. I played it quite a bit and never got to see 3 classes. "
Yeah, I think that KZ3 ranking system is way better.
#31 Posted by the_OFFICIAL_jAPanese_teaBAG (4307 posts) -

ive had fun with the engineering class.  in my experience ive had more people using the Helghan smg which pissed the shit out of me cause they were using it so effectively

#32 Posted by TwoOneFive (9459 posts) -
@X19 said:
" SOCOM 4 you're so close. Take me back to a time when ppl knew how to work as a team. "
cannot wait dude. 
#33 Posted by Enigma777 (6057 posts) -
@mosespippy said:
" A patch later this week is changing the cooldown on the medic tool from 25 seconds to 10 seconds. I'd say the game is more tactical than KZ2 because in KZ2 there would be 4 spawn grenades thrown down in a 15 meter radius and everyone would just throw a grenade and then die from someone else's grenade and they'd repeat. At least now map control is implemented with capturable spawns. "
No, it just encourages more camping. The first team who gains most or all of the spawn points wins. In some maps (like Turbine or Corinth) it's almost impossible to capture a spawn point back if the other team knows what it's doing because there's only 1-2 small entrances.  
 
Also the Maksman should NOT have an AR and the ability to become invisible and never show up on the map or the Tactician's scans. 
#34 Posted by BigBoss1911 (2413 posts) -
@TwoOneFive said:
" @X19 said:
" SOCOM 4 you're so close. Take me back to a time when ppl knew how to work as a team. "
cannot wait dude.  "
Be prepared to be disappointed........
#35 Posted by Skald (4367 posts) -

The classes aren't balanced properly. Think of what Team Fortress 2 did to constrain class behaviour. That's what Killzone 3 is missing.

#36 Edited by handlas (2658 posts) -
@BigBoss1911 said:

" @TwoOneFive said:

" @X19 said:
" SOCOM 4 you're so close. Take me back to a time when ppl knew how to work as a team. "
cannot wait dude.  "
Be prepared to be disappointed........ "
I never played the SOCOM series.  I don't really get the hype either...nostalgia?  I'll play the beta and see for myself.  I did buy Confrontation, tho, I know that isn't a good representation of the SOCOM franchise since it was Slant 6.  I didn't think it was half bad if you look past the horrible launch with bugs and lag. 
 
I've ordered Killzone 2 again ;p.  Gonna head back to that game cuz I can't get into Killzone 3's MP.  I think I actually prefer some of the abilities they removed/changed.  Remember one class had a sprint ability; that helped greatly when doing search and retrieve.  I also liked it better when the Marksman class had the spot and mark ability.  And, I'll be damned cuz I hated it before, but I think I prefer the Tactician's ability to throw down spawn points where ever he wanted. 
#37 Posted by EVO (3863 posts) -
@handlas said:
" I've ordered Killzone 2 again ;p.  Gonna head back to that game cuz I can't get into Killzone 3's MP.  I think I actually prefer some of the abilities they removed/changed.  Remember one class had a sprint ability; that helped greatly when doing search and retrieve."
They didn't remove the sprint ability, it's one of the Saboteurs secondary abilities.
#38 Posted by Gabriel (4055 posts) -

Snipers ruin games, and life in general. 
 
I'm a Sniper racist, killing should be up close and personal.  
 
SWORDS.

#39 Posted by Mystyr_E (1189 posts) -

While I'm glad they got rid of the spot and mark ability on snipers which REALLY promoted camping, giving them an assault rifle is just BS and having that scramble ability which basically says "I'm nearby, be on your guard" is useless. Some maps like Snowdrift, Boulevard and the jetpack map flat out suck, Crater is decent, Graveyard's cool but they pick horrible maps for KZ3. 
 
I mean, mechs AND missile launchers on Salumun? This game reminds me of Battlefield: it's doable solo but it's also more frustrating while I'm sure it's a blast in a team because holy shit, randoms suck in this game

#40 Posted by Example1013 (4834 posts) -
@X19 said: 

" SOCOM 4 you're so close. Take me back to a time when ppl knew how to work as a team. "

That will never happen again. SOCOM 3 is gone, and I think we'll all have to face this fact.    
#41 Posted by Mikewrestler5 (602 posts) -

 Killzone 3: Online Multiplayer at its Worst 
 
You're welcome.

#42 Edited by handlas (2658 posts) -
@EVO said:

" @handlas said:

" I've ordered Killzone 2 again ;p.  Gonna head back to that game cuz I can't get into Killzone 3's MP.  I think I actually prefer some of the abilities they removed/changed.  Remember one class had a sprint ability; that helped greatly when doing search and retrieve."
They didn't remove the sprint ability, it's one of the Saboteurs secondary abilities. "
wow really?  I've played a very good bit and haven't seen anyone use it.  Unless it just isn't as fast as it was in Killzone 2 and thus I don't notice it.  Suppose I could hop into a bot match and check it out.
 
I've only been playing Marksman and Medic and dropping unlock points into those.
#43 Edited by handlas (2658 posts) -
@Mystyr_E said:

" While I'm glad they got rid of the spot and mark ability on snipers which REALLY promoted camping, giving them an assault rifle is just BS and having that scramble ability which basically says "I'm nearby, be on your guard" is useless. Some maps like Snowdrift, Boulevard and the jetpack map flat out suck, Crater is decent, Graveyard's cool but they pick horrible maps for KZ3.  I mean, mechs AND missile launchers on Salumun? This game reminds me of Battlefield: it's doable solo but it's also more frustrating while I'm sure it's a blast in a team because holy shit, randoms suck in this game "

What?  Boulevard is like the ONLY good map in the game.  The only map that feels like it could be in Killzone 2 imo.     Maybe you are thinking of that huge square map with the mech suits?  That one is complete garbage. There is a video of one of the DLC maps on Killzone's website and it looks like garbage too....the layout looks so random and cluttered.   
 
But you are correct, this is pretty much the reason why I'm not enjoying KZ3 MP as much as I could be.  The maps just don't seem as fun.  Salumon Market as well...it feels not as fun either for some reason.  Partly because of what you mentioned, the mechs and missle launchers.  Partly because of the Tactician spawn points as well, imo, because you get a cluster of enemies in specific places on the map now.  And another partly because I actually don't like the daylight look of the map as much as I did the dark setting.
#44 Posted by Mystyr_E (1189 posts) -
@handlas: Personally, out of the new maps, I think Mawlr Graveyard and Corinth Passing are the best. There's a lack of...."flow" with Boulevard
#45 Posted by TwoOneFive (9459 posts) -
@BigBoss1911 said:
" @TwoOneFive said:
" @X19 said:
" SOCOM 4 you're so close. Take me back to a time when ppl knew how to work as a team. "
cannot wait dude.  "
Be prepared to be disappointed........ "
uh... MAG hasn't dissapointed whatsoever and that was a massive undertaking. im am 100% certain Zipper will deliver the goods.  
The core gameplay in Socom, even when done shoddy (slant six cough cough) is still excellent. Confrontation, after months of patching, ended up being a ton of fun. 
#46 Posted by Boiglenoight (529 posts) -
@SocialistNinja said:
" i wish it had the classes unlocked by level progression instead of having all classes by  level one. "
This was something that, while interesting, I ended up disliking about 2.
#47 Edited by handlas (2658 posts) -

I just got Killzone 2 in the mail...wooo! lol... 
 
I forgot you start out in MP only playing against other noobs that dont have classes unlocked...I'm surprised I was able to find games playing.  God, this game is so much better than Killzone 3 it makes me depressed to think what GG did to Killzone to appease to the masses....Killzone 3 feels so much more Call of Duty-esque than I realized.  I played Salumn Market first and didn't realize how much they changed it in Killzone 3 (for the worst).  Still stand by, graphically, Killzone 2 even looks better in the MP at least. There is more effects going on in the maps...wind, things blowing around, smoke popping up from your footsteps, shadows, reflective effects on your weapons, and more objects in the environment that are destructible.

#48 Posted by Bouke (1401 posts) -

Infiltrators and cloaked snipers are probably the reason i get killed the most; with infiltrators i'll just shoot at anyone just to make sure, but some of those snipers really frustrate the hell out of me! If i'm running along and get sniped or standing somewhere for a little to long, good job, no problem with that. But the times i've been killed by some asshole sitting in a corner cloaked...  
 
I agree with the OP in that the engineers weapons are shit; he could really use a assualt rifle, even if its the burst medic rifle. At short range the LMG and SMG are fine but at medium to long range you'll probably die trying to get that kill. The turrets are to easy to take out and are "looking" the other way most of the time. And i hate the fact that you get damage when you run into a friendly turret, especially when someone put up a turret behind you... 
 
I still haven't seen the patch that fixes the cooldown time on the medics heal, so i'm not using him as often because the medic class as it is; is also underpowered.  
 
So for now i'm sticking with my tactician while i'm upgrading my infiltrator.

#49 Posted by Jamjones (21 posts) -
@Bouke said:
" Infiltrators and cloaked snipers are probably the reason i get killed the most; with infiltrators i'll just shoot at anyone just to make sure, but some of those snipers really frustrate the hell out of me! If i'm running along and get sniped or standing somewhere for a little to long, good job, no problem with that. But the times i've been killed by some asshole sitting in a corner cloaked...   I agree with the OP in that the engineers weapons are shit; he could really use a assualt rifle, even if its the burst medic rifle. At short range the LMG and SMG are fine but at medium to long range you'll probably die trying to get that kill. The turrets are to easy to take out and are "looking" the other way most of the time. And i hate the fact that you get damage when you run into a friendly turret, especially when someone put up a turret behind you...  I still haven't seen the patch that fixes the cooldown time on the medics heal, so i'm not using him as often because the medic class as it is; is also underpowered.   So for now i'm sticking with my tactician while i'm upgrading my infiltrator. "
Speaking of the engineer turret, why is so stupid?
The base turret are deadly as sin lock on to anything that moves near it they got and they got armor plates?
If rank 3 turret had better detection or armor like the base turret i would be happy, but the latter would probably make the turret OP..
#50 Posted by H_U_R_D (45 posts) -

operations 
 
and as long as u play with friends, it cant be bad

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