So I was thinking that I've done a few additional play-throughs of ME2 above the 2 characters imported from ME1 and one of the things that irked me was that the last two played out similarly in sections because of the default choices given to you.
I'd quite like if it in ME3 you were given the option to pick some of the 'choices' 'your' character made if you started a character fresh in ME3, based on what your longest running character has done. For example:
John Shepard has played ME1. He was imported to ME2, survived, then was imported to ME3 to finish of his fate and completed his trilogy.
-A player who has done this, if they say wanted to create a new character fresh in ME3, they would be able to choose some of the major choices from ME1 and 2 that their brand new ME3 character starts off with.
Ellen Shepard has played ME2. She survived and was imported to ME3 and completed the two games.
-A player in this set-up who then created a fresh character for ME3 would be able to choose major choices from ME2 only based on their 2-game character.
Why do this then? You could argue that I should bite the bullet and play through all the games again and there is certainly a good argument for that, not to mention plenty of time for fun...but there are other considerations. The changing of game-play is quite fundamental, so even if you don't like all of the changes between ME1 and 2 (and then whatever is in store for us) I think you'd be hard pressed to say that on the whole, ME1 plays better than 2. There is also the time consideration, that I don't necessarily want to play through say, 50 hours of game play just to have one set-up before I start on the game I want to play.
Why let people who play ME3 only not have this option? Think of it as an award for playing through the previous games. I just want to experience a different reaction to something I didn't take previously, but I know exactly what would happen because I've played the game and know what would happen in that specific game. Someone who only plays ME3 will probably know about the Citadel Council survival (or not) and the Collector Base's condition, but they will likely care less about, say, the Rachni Queen or how many of your enemies you wish to push out windows etc.
So the exact way I propose this would be done is that major decisions, usually the ones at the end of missions including the two big end-game ones be selectable as to what happens and then for other minor decisions to either be defaulted to off or on or whatever, or all be placed on some sort of randomly placed switch so that out of say these 150 random decisions you could've made, 75 will randomly be 'positive' and 75 'negative' or whatever.
Okay, feel free to rip this to shreds.
Mass Effect 2
Game » consists of 21 releases. Released Jan 26, 2010
After a violent death by an unknown force and a timely reanimation by the human supremacist organization Cerberus, Commander Shepard must assemble a new squad in the seedier side of the galaxy for a suicide mission in the second installment of the "Mass Effect" trilogy.
By playing ME1 and 2, ME3 should let you...(spoilers)
I agree, I was gutted when I lost my saves for ME1 and started ME2 only to have Wrex dead and the Council :(. I really didn't want to go through ME1 again as I have too many games to go through as it is. It wil suck hard if you can't pick some decisions in ME1 and 2 if you start a new game in ME3, since there are way too many different paths you can take in the 2 previous games. I swear you would have to have like 4 characters min to see the effect of most decisions. (Council redemption, Rachni, Wrex ashely or Kaiden etc.)
" I'm pretty sure you can make some of the big decisions like that when you start a game. "From what I recall, the only decision you could influence at the start of ME2 on a new game was who the Earth ambassador was.
@fernog said:
" Hopefully something like this is incorporated in the ps3 version. "I hope they do get something, because it'd suck for them to be stuck with a certain story.
I agree that some choices should be able to change if you start fresh but i still think it is great to in rich the people who went and played every mass effect game.
Honestly, I would hate that. The whole notion of carrying a save forward is the fact that what's done is done and thus this is my Shepard and his story. If they opted to give me the freedom to alter the past, it would kill some of that even if I don't use it. Perhaps if it's opened up as a feature after a playthrough, ok, that I can live with.
Sure, they can do that, but it really takes away from the experience that the Mass Effect trilogy is trying to convey. The games are meant to be played as a saga and with the same characters that you had in ME1 and 2. I mean sure you can still play it starting out at ME3 or ME2, but you're not getting the full experience and it negates the whole point of the cross game character development feature.
" Honestly, I would hate that. The whole notion of carrying a save forward is the fact that what's done is done and thus this is my Shepard and his story. If they opted to give me the freedom to alter the past, it would kill some of that even if I don't use it. Perhaps if it's opened up as a feature after a playthrough, ok, that I can live with. "Having that as an extra feature once you beat the game sounds reasonable, but I agree that just having that as a flat out option seems to go against the spirit of the game.
" @Pezen said:" Honestly, I would hate that. The whole notion of carrying a save forward is the fact that what's done is done and thus this is my Shepard and his story. If they opted to give me the freedom to alter the past, it would kill some of that even if I don't use it. Perhaps if it's opened up as a feature after a playthrough, ok, that I can live with. "Having that as an extra feature once you beat the game sounds reasonable, but I agree that just having that as a flat out option seems to go against the spirit of the game. "
Indeed. As I hopefully made apparent in my OP (if not, apologies!) you'd only get this when starting a brand new character based on the performance of your longest running character. You couldn't, therefore, just load up ME3 and go "Hmmm, well, I'll have that, that, this and that" and then get under-way. The exception I would have for this would be for PS3 players getting ME2, because I think it's only fair that they do get to choose the major decisions considering they literally cannot play it through themselves.
@xyzygy said:
" Sure, they can do that, but it really takes away from the experience that the Mass Effect trilogy is trying to convey. The games are meant to be played as a saga and with the same characters that you had in ME1 and 2. I mean sure you can still play it starting out at ME3 or ME2, but you're not getting the full experience and it negates the whole point of the cross game character development feature. "Again, hopefully I anticipated this. I fully acknowledge(d) that Mass Effect is designed as a trilogy, but in actual game-play, that doesn't quite work out as consistent as say a trilogy of films. Now, I can't see game-play changing radically between ME2 and 3, but it is possible. I'm saying that for people, like my self, who have carried through at least one character (I've carried through 2 from ME1 to ME2, ready to go for ME3 and I'm sure there are people with more) it'd be nice if they had the opportunity to play through the entirety of the conclusion without the preceding 50-70ish hours for ME1/2 which (might) play differently anyhow. These aren't people who are brand new to the ME experience, these are people who have already put in a lot of time with however many characters they have and are loyal to the franchise and probably read around the game to find out more details anyhow. They know what the choices are, in that one is bad/less good/good etc., but it's totally different to experiencing it.
I don't think it does take away from the experience if you've already run through the trilogy at least once, in my case it'll be twice and for others, more.
It seems like a reasonable idea. There is so much stuff to do in those games, the chances of seeing every outcome is pretty small, unless you play it dozens of times, so having an option to see a wider range of plots would be interesting. Still, I'm not sure Bioware would really bother. I just have images of a large table full of a ridiculous amounts of questions and a "yes/no" box by the side of each one. I suppose you could just whittle it down to the bear essentials; Wrex's fate, did Ashley or Kaidan die, how many of the Normandy II's crew survived etc, but whether Bioware would even do that is debatable. It would be an interesting mod project if nothing else, and one that I would probably try out, but I think it would only really make sense for the PS3 version simply because of there not being any original Mass Effect file. But even then it would probably be easier just to have a set path, such as the default in ME2. The Bioware guys are pretty smart though, so I'm sure they've thought of something.
To condense what you want: basically you want to be able to have the option to choose what some of the big decisions in past games were.
@Alcamin: I can imagine it being a very long table, definitely! So, like I said, only really main decisions would be picked, like you said. So, nothing about say, Conrad Verner. At the same time, the kind of people who would want to do 'this' are likely the kind of people who wouldn't mind wanting to fill it out so they could tailor their experience. I think just being stuck with the default is a bit lame if you want to try out a new character for their class dynamics and go through the same story that you might have already done with one of your trilogy characters. I'm sure the story will be good, but there's something to be said for mixing it up a little bit. Hell, even a straight up Paragon/Renegade option would be better (not great, but better).
@LiquidPrince: Yes, so long as you've got say, at least one character that has played through all the games and completed ME3. (Or just ME2's if you've started then, as per my OP.) I'm not suggesting this should just be handed out to anyone.
That's actually a really awesome idea and would be very rewarding to those who have played through all the games. Although it would only be available for 360/PC owners.
@xyzygy: Exactly! You need to complete the trilogy before you could potentially have any say on how a new character was built. Until then, they are 'default'. Like I've said, I'd have the same option available for people who joined in at ME2 and completed ME3 with the same character, but they would only be able to change things about ME2 and not further back. Or who knows? LiquidPrince does raise a good idea in that there's nothing really stopping anyone from being able to use it. I'd say that PS3 users should be able to choose stuff for ME1 though regardless, considering they literally cannot play the game to make their own decisions.
At any rate, I'd see the idea implemented similarly to how you pick your facial features. You'd have sliders for all the choices split up into ME1 and then 2.
I want to point out I don't believe for a second this idea is full proof and Bioware's best and legitimately water-tight argument is "You should have a character experience everything, not just be able to change everything on a whim". Regardless, I still think this a good and fun idea.
I'm remembering it 2nd or 3rd hand, but one of the things that was tested for ME:2 was similar to what you're describing. They had some option for new characters where you could choose "default" or "custom" for the story, similar to the face reconstruction thing; choosing custom gave a list of all the things in ME:2 that could be effected by ME:1 choices.
The one way that I suppose a feature like this could work is if it was unlockable after completing your first run through, At least then any new players would have a better idea of the story and be able to make a more informed judgement about the elements that they wish to change, while the the veteran players, who carried their Shepard all the way from ME1, can do some "what if" scenarios after seeing the final outcome. It's a complicated topic, but in a way I think it's a testament to how great Mass Effect is that we are talking about it at all. :) There's certainly a lot of possibilities.
@Alcamin: ...because I imagine it fits into what you said, namely that Bioware might not think it's worth it. And yeah, like I've said, major choices only. I've played both games thoroughly and to be honest, Conrad Verner didn't do much for me, so I can hardly see a newbie to the series caring that much. Granted, I'm not everyone though!
So, off the top of my head, things would be:
ME1: Rachni Queen, Feros survivors (any?), Wrex, Kaiden/Ashley, Council, Human Ambassador
ME2: Collector's Base, who survived (so a choice for everyone with crew as a general tab), loyalty out-comes (eg, Garrus being more paragon or renegade, Samara/Morinth, Legion's virus etc.). I know ME1 looks like having more, but there's a good few groupings for ME2.
Misc: How many times you punched the news reporter...okay, this one's just a joke.
It was over the course of two or three posts on Penny Arcade. Tycho/Jerry posted that he, for whatever reason, didn't have his ME1 save, and was wondering how he'd be able to get the choices he had made count in ME2. He related that he'd talked to someone who had played/tested what they thought was a final or close to final build of the game, where that feature was available. Fast forward to the game being out, and of course there was no such feature. Jerry made a specific point in a post after the game came out that he was so certain his friend was right, that he at first assumed he had missed a setting somewhere. I don't recall that there was a reason found or given; his friend wasn't high enough up the food chain to know exactly why.
It may seem obvious, but I think that Bioware didn't or couldn't find a way that they were happy with to implement more than a few choices. Or, it could be that they narrowed down what they thought were the most important changes that would carry over into ME3. I really hope it's the former, not the latter, since I'd like to see something come of letting the Rachni queen and Wrex both live in the first game.
Personally I've invested too much time on my saves to be comfortable having them on the HDD only. Makes me care more about how I've played the game knowing that if I lose it, my chances of affecting the next game is gone.
I guess a feature spoken of would be appreciated to the ones that had their save lost, but it also takes away a bit of the feeling that if I screw up, I'll have to restart because it will eff up things in the sequel.
Also, having to get to choose who survived the Collector base is just wrong because that took a lot of work. Taking the edge of it by being able to say "well I screwed up royally in the finish of the game but meh I'll just start a new Shepard in ME3 so I can choose who survived." The stakes of what to expect in terms of carrying over to the next game has been set and I can really only see this thing being very much viable between ME1 and ME2 (more from the fact as to how polished and smoother ME2 is compared to ME1). Getting to choose whether you purged or blew up the station perhaps but not who survived and did not, if you're that invested in the characters then you would play ME2 to get to that.
Besides, if you do have the inclination to restart because you screwed something up, then I'd say you're missing the point of the game. If you have choices, you're supposed to accept the results for whatever you choose. I do acknowledge though that for people whose saves went kablooey, this would be a good edition, but like I said this further re-affirms my idea that it should perhaps only be available post game completion so that you see one experience first (either your own imported or the default).
The who survives was just a random idea to the kind of depth we could go to. Major decisions, like the Collector's Base would be a shoe-in. Who survives, well perhaps Bioware would come up with their own idea, or maybe 'survival of the fittest'? I would however say that deciding how much of your crew survives is a pretty major decision as you are, quite literally, dealing out life or death, as opposed to my go-to example of Conrad Verner where he's just a bit la-la in the head.
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