Very Disappointed With New Game+

#1 Edited by Seppli (10250 posts) -

After having an absolute blast with my first playthrough, I decided to go for a 'New Game+' (import ME2 character).
 
First shock - I can't switch to another class. Bummer. Okay - well, let's go with Insanity diffuclty. Oh, Bioware recommends to finish the game on hardcore first. Well - I'll do that then. I trust Bioware knows what they're doing... funny thing - my character hits 30 after the tutorial mission, which is the freaking levelcap. Why the hell should I do a playthrough+ on hardcore before going for Insanity? Anyways - I figure, I'm gonna give my assassin a go on hardcore anyways. The shootin' is fun enough in it's own right and the higher difficulty definitly shapes up my gameplay. More tactical decisions required and such.
 
Still - I believe Bioware has missed the mark with their interpretation of 'New Game+'. To me, a 'New Game+' is about payoff. Ultimate fanservice. Giving me everything I earned and the prospect to earn everything I want. Like not having to go mining again for upgrades, because you'd let me keep all my shit and all my upgrades from my first playthrough? No - even in 'New Game+' you ought to do that stuff again. It was okay to do the space exploration/strip mining thingy once. But not again in my 'New Game+'. Also - how about letting me change my class, just like with 'import ME1 character'. The main reason why I wanted to do a second or even more playthroughs is to play Insanity mode with different classes. Do you seriously expect me to max out ever class by hand - seriously?
 
I'm very disappointed with the 'New Game+'. Instead of rewarding me for my successful first playthrough, I feel hamstrung. Forced into doing the same shit twice. I would never have even considered doing a second playthrough with the same class, nor would I have played Hardcore instead of Insanty, if I had known that the levelcap was 30. Overall - the whole 'New Game+' is not what it should be. It's not liberating. It's confining. It's kinda pushing me to do a second playthrough with the same class. Why the hell do you want me to do that? Why the hell wouldn't Bioware give me free reign over my 'New Game+'? It should be the modus operandi for maxing out both Paragon and Renegade, for playing every class on the highest difficulty with all the advantages I've earned in my first playthrough. All weapons, all upgrades, no hazzle. Any class I want - maxed out.
 
Why in gods name, should I have to repeat the 'work' bits of the game in my 'New Game+'? Been there, done that. I want to ramp up difficulty and try out every class and every skill maxed out. That's what a 'New Game+' is for. Decadence! What you are giving me with your interpretation is a gimped standart 'New Game'! Stripped of class selection. Stripped of level ups. Stripped of good and fun things. Yet 'grindy' stuff like having to scan and probe planets for resources remains more or less mandatory for my 'New Game+'? Well - whoever was/is responsible for the design of Mass Effect 2's 'New Game+'...
 

 GO FUCK YOURSELF - INCOMPETENT DIPSHIT! CONGRATZ FOR TAKING A HUGE SHIT ON AN OTHERWISE ROYALLY AWESOME GAME! FUCK YOU!
#2 Posted by VWGTI (1919 posts) -

You can't pick a different class in a New Game +? That's kinda shitty.
#3 Posted by empfeix (774 posts) -

how did you hit the cap after the tutorial?

#4 Posted by ZackHoagie (23 posts) -

Why is this even an issue? It's the same exact thing as New Game+ in ME1.

#5 Edited by Seppli (10250 posts) -
@empfeix said:

" how did you hit the cap after the tutorial? "

 
New Game+ (My first playthrough was thorough)
 
After finishing a game - you can opt to replay the game with your endgame stats and weapons (as in getting the option to import your ME 2 charcter into a new game - aka 'New Game+').
#6 Edited by HatKing (6196 posts) -


 

 


If you start a new character you can choose a new class, get any ME1 import bonuses you get as well as getting a 25% exp bonus, a credit bonus and resource bonus for beating ME2.  Sorry for almost totally invalidating your argument. 
 
EDIT:  You also get one of the loyalty bonus powers you've unlocked.

#7 Posted by Napalm (9020 posts) -
@Seppli: 

GO FUCK YOURSELF - INCOMPETENT DIPSHIT! CONGRATZ FOR TAKING A HUGE SHIT ON AN OTHERWISE ROYALLY AWESOME GAME! FUCK YOU!

 
The amount of irony you exude is quite staggering. Openly hurling swear words around like a retard won't grant you friends or supporters here.
 

#8 Posted by Seppli (10250 posts) -
@HatKing said:
"


 


If you start a new character you can choose a new class, get any ME1 import bonuses you get as well as getting a 25% exp bonus, a credit bonus and resource bonus for beating ME2.  Sorry for almost totally invalidating your argument. 
 
EDIT:  You also get one of the loyalty bonus powers you've unlocked.

"
 
Yeah - like I'm gonna go for Insanity difficulty with a level 3 charcter. Sure sounds like fun.
#9 Posted by Novyx (479 posts) -

I do think they missed the mark a bit, but letting you at least continue after the main quest is a step in the right direction. I'm hoping that as many of the big issues as got fixed from ME1 to ME2, ME3 should have this all bolted down and be pretty epic. Then the only reason to play 1 or 2 will be to make new, full-continuity Shepards.

#10 Posted by davidwitten22 (1708 posts) -
@HatKing said:
"


 


If you start a new character you can choose a new class, get any ME1 import bonuses you get as well as getting a 25% exp bonus, a credit bonus and resource bonus for beating ME2.  Sorry for almost totally invalidating your argument.

"
Yeah except for the whole "mining and getting upgrades" thing. 
 
The OP was good until the picture with the overzealous FUCK YOU shit that made your argument seem really childish.
#11 Edited by Seppli (10250 posts) -
@davidwitten22 said:

" @HatKing said:

"


 


If you start a new character you can choose a new class, get any ME1 import bonuses you get as well as getting a 25% exp bonus, a credit bonus and resource bonus for beating ME2.  Sorry for almost totally invalidating your argument.

"
Yeah except for the whole "mining and getting upgrades" thing.  The OP was good until the picture with the overzealous FUCK YOU shit that made your argument seem really childish. "
 
Anger is a childish emotion. ME 2's 'New Game+' made me angry. I'm doing myself proud with such a clear, comprehensive and honest message.
#12 Posted by Pinkshley1 (453 posts) -
@Seppli said: 
 GO FUCK YOURSELF - INCOMPETENT DIPSHIT! CONGRATZ FOR TAKING A HUGE SHIT ON AN OTHERWISE ROYALLY AWESOME GAME! FUCK YOU!
"
After reading the end caption, I came to the sudden realization that I have always, subconsciously, pictured you as somewhat of a child. Thank you sir, for the epiphany!
#13 Posted by HatKing (6196 posts) -

@davidwitten22:
Yes the resource thing is a pain, but you start off with a pretty sizable bonus to your resources and credits.  With those bonuses you can pretty much buy and upgrade an entire weapon.  Either way, if your character was capped and had all the upgrades what would be the point of playing again?  Other than seeing the story again, in which case you can easily do that with a new character.

 
@Seppli:

So you want to play on insanity, but you don't want it to be too hard?  Is that not the point?  Or are you just sore because you don't think you'll be able to net that achievement in a legitimate way?  If your problem is with the level cap think about it this way: Mass Effect 1 basically broke the 30 levels of Mass Effect 2 into 60 levels, by end game you are no less power than you were during the end game of ME1.  It makes each level more rewarding.

#14 Edited by Seppli (10250 posts) -
@HatKing said:
"

@davidwitten22:
Yes the resource thing is a pain, but you start off with a pretty sizable bonus to your resources and credits.  With those bonuses you can pretty much buy and upgrade an entire weapon.  Either way, if your character was capped and had all the upgrades what would be the point of playing again?  Other than seeing the story again, in which case you can easily do that with a new character.

 
@Seppli:

So you want to play on insanity, but you don't want it to be too hard?  Is that not the point?  Or are you just sore because you don't think you'll be able to net that achievement in a legitimate way?  If your problem is with the level cap think about it this way: Mass Effect 1 basically broke the 30 levels of Mass Effect 2 into 60 levels, by end game you are no less power than you were during the end game of ME1.  It makes each level more rewarding.

"
According to the description of the difficulty settings - Insanity is for players who beat Hardcore. Harcore is for players doing a 'New Game+'. 'New Game+' is for everyone who beats the game. My first playthrough was on 'Veteran' with the Infiltrator class. Now I'm doing a 'New Game+' on Hardcore, just as the Bioware recommends me to do. It's the way it's meant to be played. Insanity is meant to make my 'New Game+' challenging and fresh, despite me knowing all the ins and outs of all the missions. It's not meant to be played with a 'Level 1' character. It certainly is beatable that way, but it certainly isn't the way it's meant to be played. Stop being an elitist jerk.
 
What's wrong with me wanting to play 'Insantiy' the way it's intended to be played (with a maxed out charcter) and not being restricted to play the same old class again? That's just restrictive bullshit which has no place in a modern day 'New Game+'. I don't have the time to do a thorough playthrough for every class just to get there. Heck - most people barely find the time for one thorough playthrough. 'New Game+' should enable me to play the game exactly how I want to play it and eliminate all tedium - such as buying upgrades again (with resources only available by menial labor scanning and mining planets).
#15 Edited by MushroomSamba (171 posts) -

I don't think the NG+ is all that hot either, but it's no biggie. I'm just glad the first run through was so enjoyable that it warrants a discussion for a second or third replay. I wish they gave more mining material bonuses though...the thought of having to go through all that again makes me grimace.

#16 Posted by The_Philosopher (570 posts) -
@Seppli:  I gotta say I totally agree. I was very disappointed that I couldn't pick a new class.
#17 Edited by RandomInternetUser (6789 posts) -

I just wish there was a NG+ in Dragon Age :(
 
Edit:  On topic, I was very dissapointed that NG+ didn't carry your Renegade/Paragon status over, and didn't carry your upgrades over.

#18 Posted by FalconCritical (224 posts) -

New Game+ gives you 200k credits, and 50k of each resource.  This is regardless of whether you bring your ME2 character into the new game+ or not.  You'll prob never have to mine Element Zero with that much from the start and the other three are easy to mine.  If you kept all your upgrades what is there to gain that you can't while getting the upgrades anyway?

#19 Posted by HatKing (6196 posts) -
@Seppli:
Okay I see.  Yeah I'll admit it is a little disappointing, I was pretty turned off by it too when I first played it but then somebody pointed me toward some Bioware statement(I wish I still had the link).  Basically they say the reason things are the way they are is so that they have a general idea of where everybody is at going into Mass Effect 3.  In Mass Effect 1 there was nothing stopping somebody from getting to level 60 in multiple play throughs and there were also those who beat the game at about level 40.  That is 20 levels of difference they would have had to compensate for in ME2, not to mention people just starting out.  So they came up with the plot device that would allow them to reset your stats, your class and your appearance in a somewhat logical way.  They didn't want the same problem with ME3 so they built it like this, they have control over exp by putting it towards missions and not kills and they know that everybody going to ME3 is either going to be level 30(or very close to it) or starting fresh at level 1.  It is a design choice that I'm sure we'll appreciate in the future.  Sad thing is it just makes me more excited for a game that is probably a good two years away.
#20 Posted by Whisperkill (2969 posts) -
@Seppli: Calm down, its a fucking video game... get over it.
#21 Edited by Seppli (10250 posts) -
@FalconCritical said:

" New Game+ gives you 200k credits, and 50k of each resource.  This is regardless of whether you bring your ME2 character into the new game+ or not.  You'll prob never have to mine Element Zero with that much from the start and the other three are easy to mine.  If you kept all your upgrades what is there to gain that you can't while getting the upgrades anyway? "

 
Well - I don't think there's many more than just a few serious playthroughs in a game with mechanics like Mass Effect 2 (paragon/renegade - male/female). The more often I repeat it, the more it's about combat. Not about leveling up, not about story or characters. It's about 'by the flesh of my teeth' encounters. This 3rd person shooter part of ME 2 is rocksolid and a lot of fun. I definitly want to play more than one class and take it into battle.
 
In short - it's about pitting every class against the impossible odds of the hardest difficulty setting. That's what my 'New Game+' should be about. Currently my 'New Game+' is about pitting the same tired old class against thougher enemies. The gameplay gets definitly more involved and fun. I like how hard settings make me shape up my game. 'Hardcore' is challenging, whereas 'Veteran' was barely challenging.
 
So - everything that's between me and stringing one story mission to the next is inacceptable in a 'New Game+'. Very, very weak design for the NG+.
#22 Posted by dan168 (39 posts) -

can you New game+ if you sheppard dies? ahaha yeah i'm pretty dissapointed with how mostly everything resets and the level 30 cap

#23 Posted by Seppli (10250 posts) -
@HatKing said:
" @Seppli: Okay I see.  Yeah I'll admit it is a little disappointing, I was pretty turned off by it too when I first played it but then somebody pointed me toward some Bioware statement(I wish I still had the link).  Basically they say the reason things are the way they are is so that they have a general idea of where everybody is at going into Mass Effect 3.  In Mass Effect 1 there was nothing stopping somebody from getting to level 60 in multiple play throughs and there were also those who beat the game at about level 40.  That is 20 levels of difference they would have had to compensate for in ME2, not to mention people just starting out.  So they came up with the plot device that would allow them to reset your stats, your class and your appearance in a somewhat logical way.  They didn't want the same problem with ME3 so they built it like this, they have control over exp by putting it towards missions and not kills and they know that everybody going to ME3 is either going to be level 30(or very close to it) or starting fresh at level 1.  It is a design choice that I'm sure we'll appreciate in the future.  Sad thing is it just makes me more excited for a game that is probably a good two years away. "
 
It's not about the fucking levelcap. It's about the restricitons of 'New Game+'. NG+ should be liberating. But it isn't. It doesn't do, what I expect a good NG+ to do.
 
Otherwise I could just start a new game. I'd be better off.
 
How's that not to understand?
#24 Posted by HatKing (6196 posts) -

@Seppli:
Ah... well then there is nothing I can really say.  Sorry?  Is it just the upgrades not carrying over that is the problem... or the lack of some sort of unloackables?  I mean what specifically were you hoping for in a New Game+?

#25 Edited by Seppli (10250 posts) -
@Pinkshley1 said:

" @Seppli said: 

 GO FUCK YOURSELF - INCOMPETENT DIPSHIT! CONGRATZ FOR TAKING A HUGE SHIT ON AN OTHERWISE ROYALLY AWESOME GAME! FUCK YOU!
"
After reading the end caption, I came to the sudden realization that I have always, subconsciously, pictured you as somewhat of a child. Thank you sir, for the epiphany! "
 
He, who has lost the earnestness of his childhood, is not yet mature.
#26 Posted by FalconCritical (224 posts) -

He wants to start with all his guns and upgrades and levels, and just shoot his way through the story without the RPG elements (cept talking to people).  Not a bad idea but I personally prefer to do everything again myself, so I can start a new character and not instantly have the nuke gun or anything.  Perhaps loading a ME2 character should have different criteria for people like yourself, but generally speaking I prefer it the way it is.

#27 Edited by Luccaface (218 posts) -

The 25% bonus experience especially is a head scratcher.  I imported a level 60 ME1 file and hit the cap on my first playthrough in ME2.  Even if you didn't import, I can't imagine the bonus being relevant for more than a few missions during a second playthrough before you hit level 30.  Maybe they plan on increasing the cap in PRC or something. 
 
EDIT:  Oh wait, I forgot that bonus also applies even if you choose to import your ME1 file again.  So it does make your character progression a lot faster if you choose to go that route.
 
Not being able to change classes I can understand to an extent.  It's a game, you're supposed to play to earn things.  Realistically, though, as fantastic as this game is, I can almost guarantee I'll be sick of it before I try every class.  It's good, but not six-playthroughs good.  Making class changes an expensive research upgrade only available on subsequent playthroughs would've been a nice compromise.

#28 Posted by Vorbis (2752 posts) -

You weren't forced onto Hardcore, those descriptions are for casuals who thought the boxart looked pretty. The games actually easier if you just make a new character from level one, even on Insanity.
 
It gives you 50,000 of each resource, you never need to scan planets. It lets you pick a loyalty bonus from the last game, you get 25% more xp. Seriously what more do you want?

#29 Posted by Seppli (10250 posts) -
@HatKing said:
"

@Seppli:
Ah... well then there is nothing I can really say.  Sorry?  Is it just the upgrades not carrying over that is the problem... or the lack of some sort of unloackables?  I mean what specifically were you hoping for in a New Game+?

"
 
1. Chose any class and begin with my endgame stats 
2. Any upgrade I earned in my first playthrough (trading away with the need for scanning/probing planets and scavenging every corner for 'loot')
3. Unlimited Respeccs for me and my Squad (stuff like this is classic 'NG+' material) 

Enabling me to go from story mission to story mission with having to deal with all the tedium of a first playthrough. Tedium gives a first playthrough weight. But a 'New Game+' gets weighed down by tedium.
#30 Posted by Seppli (10250 posts) -
@Vorbis said:
" You weren't forced onto Hardcore, those descriptions are for casuals who thought the boxart looked pretty. The games actually easier if you just make a new character from level one, even on Insanity.  It gives you 50,000 of each resource, you never need to scan planets. It lets you pick a loyalty bonus from the last game, you get 25% more xp. Seriously what more do you want? "
 
How about my life back?
 
I think it's a fair reward to give me access to all the game has to offer after a single thorough playthrough. That's what a 'New Game+' is for. It should liberate me from tedium (like maxing out every class) and unlock the whole depth of its mechanics. I've done the good work once - why should I be forced to do it again?
 
They shouldn't force me to. They should give it all up. Mass Effect 2 to my discretion. My reward for finishing the game. That's what a 'New Game+' should be about.
#31 Posted by Pinkshley1 (453 posts) -
@Seppli said:
" @Pinkshley1 said:

" @Seppli said: 

 GO FUCK YOURSELF - INCOMPETENT DIPSHIT! CONGRATZ FOR TAKING A HUGE SHIT ON AN OTHERWISE ROYALLY AWESOME GAME! FUCK YOU!
"
After reading the end caption, I came to the sudden realization that I have always, subconsciously, pictured you as somewhat of a child. Thank you sir, for the epiphany! "
 He, who has lost the earnestness of his childhood, is not yet mature. "
True, but a mature man would have been earnest and forgone the swearing altogether.
#32 Posted by Seppli (10250 posts) -
@Pinkshley1 said:
" @Seppli said:
" @Pinkshley1 said:

" @Seppli said: 

 GO FUCK YOURSELF - INCOMPETENT DIPSHIT! CONGRATZ FOR TAKING A HUGE SHIT ON AN OTHERWISE ROYALLY AWESOME GAME! FUCK YOU!
"
After reading the end caption, I came to the sudden realization that I have always, subconsciously, pictured you as somewhat of a child. Thank you sir, for the epiphany! "
 He, who has lost the earnestness of his childhood, is not yet mature. "
True, but a mature man would have been earnest and forgone the swearing altogether. "
 
Yeah - should I have transmitted my emotions telepathically? Over the internet? Right. I'll try... harder.
#33 Posted by frenchdork (90 posts) -

I agree with your points Seppli. It is the same reason why I always put in cheats for games (usually RPG's) that don't have New Game +.  I really don't want to waste my time with the more tedious game mechanics after I completed the game once. I just wanna play it again for the story and see the stuff that I missed with the choices that I made in my first play through.

#34 Posted by Vorbis (2752 posts) -
@Seppli: You're not forced to do anything, its a game, you play it for fun. The fact you call it "work" says alot.
#35 Posted by Maxszy (2071 posts) -

I agree, the NG+ is rather lackluster. Why make the level cap 30 when you practically get to that on the first play through? That's half of the first game. That being said, the way you go about your argument, especially all the swear word drops at the end...yeah that's rather ridiculous. Nullifies your argument in my opinion even though I do agree NG+ is not too great. Then again, I think playing with different ME1 imports is more fun anyway.

#36 Posted by Emandudeguyperson (2501 posts) -
@Napalm said:
" Aw, look. The baby got angry at something. How cute. "
#37 Posted by warxsnake (2650 posts) -

fuuuck... if you really care, use a trainer on a new game. if you're on xbox, whatever.

#38 Posted by rhodric (281 posts) -
@Napalm said:
" @Seppli: 

GO FUCK YOURSELF - INCOMPETENT DIPSHIT! CONGRATZ FOR TAKING A HUGE SHIT ON AN OTHERWISE ROYALLY AWESOME GAME! FUCK YOU!

 
The amount of irony you exude is quite staggering. Openly hurling swear words around like a retard won't grant you friends or supporters here.
 

"
Nah you just made yourself look like a dickwad for contributing absolutely nothing to this thread. lol@your fresh "Yo where can I find more shops?!?!" thread. How about you finish the game first before criticizing people who obviously know more than you do?
#39 Posted by Adamantium (885 posts) -

I was disappointed with New Game+ as well, but dude, calm down. No need to get angry about it.

#40 Posted by SuperSecretAgenda (696 posts) -

...The bashing on the OP is pathetic.

#41 Posted by Capum15 (5024 posts) -

...I agree completely.
 
It sucks that you have to upgrade every damn thing again. The hell's up with that? And no, the 50k Resources don't make it so you don't have to mine again. Even going into a new game (Import ME1 bonus + Long Service Record bonus (ie, 50k)) I'm ending up spending a long ass time mining for resources. It's fine the first play through (tolerable for new games), but annoying and tedious when you do New Game +. 
 
I'm glad that everything requiring Element Zero is so cheap though.
 
Oh, something else that sucks... You can't use the Cain Heavy Weapon at the beginning when you New Game + because you need the damn ammo upgrades (again!). Everything except, obviously, the story, should carry over for a NG+
 
Pretty much boils down to "Give me everything I had and let me destroy things". I'd totally cheat the hell out of the resources if I could (360). 
 
It'd be nice if you could change classes, but I'm fine with starting new games for that.

#42 Posted by Demyx (3237 posts) -
@Seppli said:
" @HatKing said:
"


 


If you start a new character you can choose a new class, get any ME1 import bonuses you get as well as getting a 25% exp bonus, a credit bonus and resource bonus for beating ME2.  Sorry for almost totally invalidating your argument. 
 
EDIT:  You also get one of the loyalty bonus powers you've unlocked.

"
 Yeah - like I'm gonna go for Insanity difficulty with a level 3 charcter. Sure sounds like fun. "
Everything should be scaled enough so its pretty much the same to be honest.
#43 Posted by Delta_Ass (3286 posts) -

I do think the New Game+ is kinda messed up. Just ran into another issue with it:
 

#44 Posted by rhodric (281 posts) -
@Delta_Ass: Same, I wanted to get the upgraded shotgun as vanguard. didn't work.
#45 Edited by Seppli (10250 posts) -
@Vorbis said:

" @Seppli: You're not forced to do anything, its a game, you play it for fun. The fact you call it "work" says alot. "

 
Every decent roleplaying game has tedium built into it. Tedium serves to give the player's progression weight. It's the equivalent of what work is to money in real life. But seriously, for my 'New Game+' I'd rather just get all the money without the work. The work has been done obviously.
#46 Edited by Seppli (10250 posts) -
@Delta_Ass said:

" I do think the New Game+ is kinda messed up. Just ran into another issue with it:
 

"
Jup - was pretty bummed out about that too... looking forward to reap those rewards a second time too. Being such tightasses about 'New Game+'. Not being cool about it at all - just sucks. Why even have an option for 'New Game+' at all then...
 
About the swearing - the exploitative use of foul language to express my anger at the 'New Game+' has proven to be very effective to convey the my exact emotion in this matter - anger. It just seems some of you guys are ridiculously Zen, never get mad and can't relate or are just so polite, that being honest about my emotion towards NG+ is unacceptable. In any case - you guys got a stick up your bums or just like to pick on the angry guy to get 'em worked up some more. Bah!
#47 Posted by chimpchamp (46 posts) -

I think the OP is right.  MGS had a basic but enjoyable NG+ (bandanna or stealth suit), which took out one of the "grindy" elements to the gameplay.  And there were extra things to get/do.  That was 13 years ago.  The NG+ in ME1 even sounds better than in ME2.  ME2 is a big missed opportunity, and a massive let down and no way near as good as too many people are making out.  Can't believe you hit the level cap after the tutorial on the second playthrough, would have thought they playtested that... guess again eh?

#48 Posted by applet0n (654 posts) -
@Seppli: Troll pwnage WIN 
 
With regards to the topic, I'm still annoyed that I have to mine for upgrades, specifically since it is really the worst part of the game...

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