Bioware Director responds to Critisism

#1 Edited by Delphic (62 posts) -

Over on IGN this morning an article was published where the director of Mass Effect 3, Casey Hudson, is defending the ending to Mass Effect 3. According to him the ending was designed to be left up to interpretation. He goes on to claim that the fan feedback is very important to Bioware and that future single player and multiplayer DLC will be designed around fan feedback. So we may get our new ending, but it sounds like it would not have been planned, as some Bioware faithfuls have hoped for. For me this puts a bit of a damper on the Indoctrination theory and makes it seems more unlikely. I would say that Bioware's biggest mistake is that is seems like the creative team was aiming for an ending that would make everyone happy, but instead that backfired and ended up enraging the entire fanbase. Here's the actual article

Casey Hudson defends "polarizing" ending, while promising single-player DLC.

Update: In a response to the huge fan feedback regarding Mass Effect 3's ending, Chris Priestly, Bioware's community coordinator, wrote on Bioware's official forums that they are waiting for the appropriate time to respond.
Priestly wrote: "we appreciate everyone's feedback about Mass Effect 3 and want you to know we are listening. Active discussions about the ending are more than welcome here, and the team will be reviewing it for feedback and responding when we can.
"Please note, we want to give people time to experience the game so while we can't get into specifics right now, we will be able to address some of your questions once more people have had time to complete the game. In the meantime, we'd like to ask that you keep the non-spoiler areas of our forums and our social media channels spoiler free.
"We understand there is a lot of debate on the Mass Effect 3 ending and we will be more than happy to engage in healthy discussions once more people get to experience the game. We are listening to all of your feedback."
Bioware Director Casey Hudson has responded to enraged fans that have criticised the game's endings and day-one DLC. In an interview with Digital Trends, Hudson said, "I didn't want the game to be forgettable, and even right down to the sort of polarizing reaction that the ends have had with people–debating what the endings mean and what's going to happen next, and what situation are the characters left in.
"That to me is part of what's exciting about this story. There has always been a little bit of mystery there and a little bit of interpretation, and it's a story that people can talk about after the fact."

Casey Hudson on Up at Noon
Particularly aggrieved fans have launched a campaign to get the Mass Effect 3 ending changed. There is even a Retake Mass Effect movement which is raising funds for the Child's Play Charity, in the hope of being taken seriously by Bioware. So far they have raised over $29,000. Their mission statement reads "We would like to dispel the perception that we are angry or entitled. We simply wish to express our hope that there could be a different direction for a series we have all grown to love."
When asked if Bioware listen to feedback, Hudson said, "We pay very close attention to it. It's very important to us and we will always listen to feedback, interpret it and try and do the right thing by our fans."
Hudson went on to promise fans single-player DLC, and that fan feedback will shape its content: "We have some really great multiplayer content and some really great single-player content coming over the air, (fan) feedback will become part of how we design that."
Regarding the From Ashes DLC, Hudson thinks fans are starting to see "common sense". "Initially, it was spun in a direction that suggested that we had taken the lore out of Mass Effect 3," he said. "Now the people who actually have played Mass Effect 3 and the DLC they know that that's not true."
Link to actual article: http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/122/1220712p1.html

So what do you guys think about this?

#2 Posted by Brodehouse (10107 posts) -

They didn't aim for something that would make them happy, they aimed for something that would make them obsess over it like Lost.

#3 Posted by mordukai (7184 posts) -

Hold the fuck on. Did Casey Hudson just basically said that Bioware trolled their entire fanbase so they could generate discussion?

#4 Posted by N7 (3658 posts) -

Just look at their twitters man, they've been hinting at shit for a while now.
 
WAKE UP AND SMELL THE OMNI-TOOL

#5 Posted by Delphic (62 posts) -

@Mordukai said:

Hold the fuck on. Did Casey Hudson just basically said that Bioware trolled their entire fanbase so they could generate discussion?

That's sort of how I read it.

#6 Posted by adoggz (2070 posts) -
@Brodehouse
They didn't aim for something that would make them happy, they aimed for something that would make them obsess over it like Lost.
Seems like they succeeded too.
#7 Posted by Veektarius (4984 posts) -

They had to know a lot of people would want a happy ending, maybe they just underestimated the number of those who did. I think that when he says the ending is meant to be ambiguous, it doesn't put a damper on any theory - that's the thing about ambiguous endings. It's the ultimate mystery, where there are a million conflicting clues to the real answer, and no way of identifying which clues are correct. (My personal take is that the last scene took place in Shepard's head but was by and large literal in meaning).

I don't feel that there was anything wrong with going for an ambiguous ending, though the Normandy part goes beyond pure ambiguity into 'plot hole' territory. At the same time, i don't think there's anything wrong with augmenting the ending with fan-preferred options. It's not as if giving some players the closure they wanted will be detrimental to the ME3 "artistic vision", since each instance of Mass Effect is a very personal experience. While in the short term I'm sure some people would say that it's kind of 'gross' (that's what I'd predict Jeff would say) that they changed the game to something other than what the devs wanted because some nerds overreacted, if this ending is truly more satisfying, it will improve people's memories of ME3 in the long run. Sort of like how some people retroactively upgraded their opinion of KOTOR 2 after they modded their game with the cut endings to that.

The thing I worry about with a different ending is... how good can the ending that people want be without bringing in the VAs for your squadmates? It's not beyond the realm of possibility that they could come back in, but your main companions were silent for all of ME2's DLC.

#8 Posted by Marokai (3115 posts) -

Click on the link, people.

#9 Posted by TentPole (1858 posts) -

@Marokai said:

Click on the link, people.

Never

#10 Posted by Phatmac (5726 posts) -

Would have rather liked a definitive ending. Don't care if Shepard dies to save Earth or some bullcrap, at least it ends his storyline. The ending just came out of no where and left me unsatisfied. That's not how you end a trilogy.

#11 Posted by mikey87144 (1811 posts) -

The interpretation thing in complete bullshit. Not one second of Mass Effect was open to any interpretation. Everything was explained, characters motives were eventually laid out and, like all well told stories, the twists occurred while the story was still going on so that that you, your Sheppard, and the other characters had time to react to the situation. The ending went against everything the story did previously. I knew the guys at Bioware would say something like this to try and defend the ending. He also said he wanted people to remember the series so that's why the ending is the way it is. I have no idea why he would do that considering that the journey is what people tend to remember most from well told stories. The eventual destination need not be mind blowing if the journey to get their was great.

#12 Posted by Hailinel (25203 posts) -
@Mordukai

Hold the fuck on. Did Casey Hudson just basically said that Bioware trolled their entire fanbase so they could generate discussion?

Pretty much.
#13 Edited by Grixxel (769 posts) -

:|

#14 Posted by Hailinel (25203 posts) -
@Marokai
Click on the link, people.
It takes me to an article on the Last Airbender spin-off. Wrong link, or are you trollling?
#15 Posted by Delphic (62 posts) -

@TentPole said:

@Marokai said:

Click on the link, people.

Never

Editied the OP to show the article text.

#16 Posted by Gearhead (2251 posts) -

@TentPole said:

@Marokai said:

Click on the link, people.

Never

Never?

#17 Posted by Delphic (62 posts) -

@Hailinel said:

@Marokai
Click on the link, people.
It takes me to an article on the Last Airbender spin-off. Wrong link, or are you trollling?

Oops! Edited ^_^

#18 Posted by Animasta (14718 posts) -

@N7 said:

Just look at their twitters man, they've been hinting at shit for a while now. WAKE UP AND SMELL THE OMNI-TOOL

don't you mean eezo

#19 Posted by rmanthorp (4047 posts) -

I wish I cared anymore. I really do, reading this however. I just don't give a fuck anymore. It was an unfinished ending that was lacklustre at best and that's what it will remain to me. Beyond caring and that SUCKS...

Moderator
#20 Posted by N7 (3658 posts) -
@Animasta said:

@N7 said:

Just look at their twitters man, they've been hinting at shit for a while now. WAKE UP AND SMELL THE OMNI-TOOL

don't you mean eezo

Are you flirting with me?
#21 Posted by AdmiralStupid (78 posts) -

@Mordukai: The saddest part is that I (and I'm sure thousands of others) WANT them to have done so, rather than accept the ending(s) at face value. How Machiavellian genius this may have been on their part.

#22 Posted by laserbolts (5352 posts) -

I think the last thing Bioware should do is make another ending. As much as it sucked they are the creators of mass effect so they should end it the way they wanted to not just give in to a bunch of whiny self entitled fans.

#23 Posted by Delphic (62 posts) -

@laserbolts said:

I think the last thing Bioware should do is make another ending. As much as it sucked they are the creators of mass effect so they should end it the way they wanted to not just give in to a bunch of whiny self entitled fans.

Though I agree with any creator ending a story how they want to end it, I also believe as a writer myself that the creation of an ending designed to make everyone happy is ultimately flawed. This is what I think bioware has done, and it backfired on them.

I personally would be okay if all of a sudden BioWare popped up and went "haha! Made ya look!" and gave us a true ending that they have designed from the start, but it appears that's not the case.

#24 Posted by laserbolts (5352 posts) -

@Delphic said:

@laserbolts said:

I think the last thing Bioware should do is make another ending. As much as it sucked they are the creators of mass effect so they should end it the way they wanted to not just give in to a bunch of whiny self entitled fans.

Though I agree with any creator ending a story how they want to end it, I also believe as a writer myself that the creation of an ending designed to make everyone happy is ultimately flawed. This is what I think bioware has done, and it backfired on them.

I personally would be okay if all of a sudden BioWare popped up and went "haha! Made ya look!" and gave us a true ending that they have designed from the start, but it appears that's not the case.

Even if they do that you know they would charge more for it which is kinda rotten if you ask me.

#25 Posted by ApertureSilence (1156 posts) -

It's not BioWare backtracking. This was the plan all along. I'm just going to leave this right here, without further comment.

#26 Posted by drag (1223 posts) -

@Delphic said:

the creation of an ending designed to make everyone happy is ultimately flawed. This is what I think bioware has done, and it backfired on them.

@Brodehouse said:

They didn't aim for something that would make them happy

:}

#27 Posted by Napalm (9020 posts) -

Give it a month, guys. They've pretty much guaranteed to address the endings specifically, whether that's, "we're sticking to our guns. The endings are the endings," or, "we've been planning a continuation of the ending, but we wanted to get it right, (therefore had to mislead the fans for a short time), " or, "we give in! New ending!" 
 
All I want is love interest-focused single player content, and you know... a continued ending that has true multiple endings in it and wraps up everything up nicely. I'm still a believer in the hallucination theory.

#28 Posted by Delphic (62 posts) -

@laserbolts said:

@Delphic said:

@laserbolts said:

I think the last thing Bioware should do is make another ending. As much as it sucked they are the creators of mass effect so they should end it the way they wanted to not just give in to a bunch of whiny self entitled fans.

Though I agree with any creator ending a story how they want to end it, I also believe as a writer myself that the creation of an ending designed to make everyone happy is ultimately flawed. This is what I think bioware has done, and it backfired on them.

I personally would be okay if all of a sudden BioWare popped up and went "haha! Made ya look!" and gave us a true ending that they have designed from the start, but it appears that's not the case.

Even if they do that you know they would charge more for it which is kinda rotten if you ask me.

I agree 100%. It is rotten, unless they decide to make the DLC free which is highly unlikely. Then there are those people who don't have access to Xbox live. What would they do there, mail them a disk? The whole concept really seems rotten if you ask me. I just think their plan for an ambiguous ending turned into one big flop and there really is nothing that can be done about it really.

#29 Posted by Sackmanjones (4784 posts) -
@N7
Just look at their twitters man, they've been hinting at shit for a while now.
 
WAKE UP AND SMELL THE OMNI-TOOL
I believe you mean medi gel. Foul smellin stuff…
Online
#30 Posted by Delphic (62 posts) -

@Napalm said:

Give it a month, guys. They've pretty much guaranteed to address the endings specifically, whether that's, "we're sticking to our guns. The endings are the endings," or, "we've been planning a continuation of the ending, but we wanted to get it right, (therefore had to mislead the fans for a short time), " or, "we give in! New ending!" All I want is love interest-focused single player content, and you know... a continued ending that has true multiple endings in it and wraps up everything up nicely. I'm still a believer in the hallucination theory.

I like to believe it myself, but what about those people who don't have access to Xbox live and can't download DLC?

I say if Bioware wants me to interpret my own ending then in my mind the indoctrination theory is what happened, the truth appears to be that BioWare made a bad creative decision.

#31 Posted by Dtat (1627 posts) -

The fact that people are talking about it isn't necessarily a good thing, Mr. Hudson.

#32 Posted by Napalm (9020 posts) -
@Sackmanjones said:
@N7
Just look at their twitters man, they've been hinting at shit for a while now.
 
WAKE UP AND SMELL THE OMNI-TOOL
I believe you mean medi gel. Foul smellin stuff…
You don't smell medi-gel, you idiot!
#33 Posted by Korwin (2984 posts) -

@Napalm said:

@Sackmanjones said:
@N7
Just look at their twitters man, they've been hinting at shit for a while now.

WAKE UP AND SMELL THE OMNI-TOOL
I believe you mean medi gel. Foul smellin stuff…
You don't smell medi-gel, you idiot!

Hey man that shit is pharmaceutical grade, it's perfectly safe. Not like that back yard shed made medi-gel, you shouldn't mess with that shit.

Online
#34 Posted by ShaneDev (1696 posts) -

Making a DLC that "fixes" the ending is a terrible idea and if they do it then it would be one of the dumbest things in the history of games.

#35 Posted by Sackmanjones (4784 posts) -
@Korwin

@Napalm said:

@Sackmanjones said:
@N7
Just look at their twitters man, they've been hinting at shit for a while now.

WAKE UP AND SMELL THE OMNI-TOOL
I believe you mean medi gel. Foul smellin stuff…
You don't smell medi-gel, you idiot!

Hey man that shit is pharmaceutical grade, it's perfectly safe. Not like that back yard shed made medi-gel, you shouldn't mess with that shit.

Ya I have a problem! Get off my back! I'm gonna get clean I'm gonna. Just one more hit… one mor……hit……
Online
#36 Posted by Death_Burnout (3800 posts) -

I love the ending, there, I said it.

#37 Posted by Gatehouse (689 posts) -

Damn, I respect their wanting of an ambiguous ending, but the one given was just not good enough. They say there's no such thing as bad publicity, but, 'they' have been wrong before.

#38 Posted by believer258 (12103 posts) -

Ambiguous endings are good when you see people talk about their own interpretations of it. This is how you know that the ending was created to be interpreted.

Ambiguous endings are not meant to make people exclaim "WHAT THE FUCK!?" and then go make a petition to have it changed. This is how you know that the writer (s) said "We have no clue how to end this, so let's use the "ambiguous" excuse and go get lunch".

Granted, the very notion of petitioning and raising money to have it changed is absolutely ludicrous, but it does illustrate how bad the ending was.

Me? Personally? Yeah, I'll discuss it, but I'm not busting my nuts over it. I'd rather find some friends, get a pizza, and play Halo.

#39 Posted by adoggz (2070 posts) -
@Korwin

@Napalm said:

@Sackmanjones said:
@N7
Just look at their twitters man, they've been hinting at shit for a while now.

WAKE UP AND SMELL THE OMNI-TOOL
I believe you mean medi gel. Foul smellin stuff…
You don't smell medi-gel, you idiot!

Hey man that shit is pharmaceutical grade, it's perfectly safe. Not like that back yard shed made medi-gel, you shouldn't mess with that shit.

Yeah man don't fuck with that backyard medigel stuff. Omni gel its called on the street and its made from some bad shit and then steped on. Only the truely desperate dare use it
#40 Posted by Fawkes (253 posts) -

@Brodehouse said:

They didn't aim for something that would make them happy, they aimed for something that would make them obsess over it like Lost.

Up until the ending of Lost I though "I love this series, when this is over I need to buy a DVD box set". And then the ending was shitty and I hated it and never really had any desire to watch anything Lost related ever again.

Same for Mass Effect 3, except I already own it all. I don't really see myself buying any DLC or future Mass Effect games. (I don't even see how they make that a thing without a retcon)

#41 Posted by Jaytow (703 posts) -

If they don't do post endgame DLC (as they've said they probably wouldn't set anything past ME3) then I'd expect them to put more signs of indoctrination in the pre endgame DLC which would be kinda cool.

#42 Posted by CaptainCharisma (339 posts) -

@Fawkes said:

I don't really see myself buying any DLC or future Mass Effect games. (I don't even see how they make that a thing without a retcon)

Most likely, there will just be DLC for stuff like going to Omega with Aria since the save file they leave you at is right before the Cerberus base. Either way, if it has nothing to do with the ending, then I don't plan on getting DLC. Which is something I never thought I'd say since Mass Effect is my personal Star Wars of my generation but that ending left such a bad taste in my mouth.

#43 Posted by Brodehouse (10107 posts) -
@CaptainCharisma

@Fawkes said:

I don't really see myself buying any DLC or future Mass Effect games. (I don't even see how they make that a thing without a retcon)

Most likely, there will just be DLC for stuff like going to Omega with Aria since the save file they leave you at is right before the Cerberus base. Either way, if it has nothing to do with the ending, then I don't plan on getting DLC. Which is something I never thought I'd say since Mass Effect is my personal Star Wars of my generation but that ending left such a bad taste in my mouth.

Likewise.

I was considering hanging a giant fucking framed picture of the Normandy in the living room. Because that describes to anyone who visits what I'm into. Now I don't know if I'll read another book.

(probably will still play any games, because games are fun)
#44 Posted by PolygonSlayer (432 posts) -

"That to me is part of what's exciting about this story. There has always been a little bit of mystery there and a little bit of interpretation, and it's a story that people can talk about after the fact."

This is basically exactly what I said in the other forum threads about this.

However, if they actually change it because of a group of cry-babies on the internet I will loose respect for Bioware for not sticking to their guns and what in my opinion was a rather good ending.

#45 Posted by Irvandus (2886 posts) -

@N7 said:

Just look at their twitters man, they've been hinting at shit for a while now. WAKE UP AND SMELL THE OMNI-TOOL

Yeah must of the stuff they have been saying on the twitter is "How would you change the ending?" "What did you like about the ending" "What do you think happened at the end?"

#46 Edited by Liquidus (946 posts) -

I've pretty much stopped caring at this point. Bioware took a huge shit on the series as a whole with that god awful ending and I have no intention of buying a single one of their games or even replaying any of the Mass Effect games at this point. They've soiled their brand.

#47 Edited by Napalm (9020 posts) -
@rebgav said:

I really don't think that they "get" that people are annoyed about the endings being nonsensical in themselves and half-assed in execution.

I truly think they understand it now. It's not a vocal minority, it's almost every fan who has cared about the fiction in some capacity speaking up. They're not calling for the burning of BioWare employees, they are just vocalizing their discontent with the ending, which is completely valid.  Even the official charity is being respectful about it, and they nicely wrap up everybody's feelings. I just have a nagging feeling that something else is going to happen in terms of the fiction. There's been very small, but very poignant signs over the past week or so.
 
At this point, I've gotten over how awful the end is, and now I am just waiting on pins and needles for something official from BioWare in the next month or so. Until then we should all just relax and get some air. But if this is true that they are sticking to their guns, then I can say this ending is by far the most disappointing for a trilogy of this generation. 
 
I don't know if I mentioned this in my OP, but Casey isn't about to, after the game has been out for two weeks, say, "oh yeah, we have another true ending lined up in a month or so." Most companies are on a very specific reveal schedule, so Casey isn't about to undermine two years of work.

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