Dr. Ray addresses concerns on Mass Effect 3's ending

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#1 Edited by Matterless (330 posts) -

Whatever your feelings on this particular topic, you have to be impressed and heartened by the sheer humility shown by Bioware here: http://blog.bioware.com/2012/03/21/4108/

I don't know how in the hell they are going to address this with DLC, but it sounds like they'll try:

Exec Producer Casey Hudson and the team are hard at work on a number of game content initiatives that will help answer the questions, providing more clarity for those seeking further closure to their journey. You’ll hear more on this in April. We’re working hard to maintain the right balance between the artistic integrity of the original story while addressing the fan feedback we’ve received. This is in addition to our existing plan to continue providing new Mass Effect content and new full games, so rest assured that your journey in the Mass Effect universe can, and will, continue.

Thoughts?

#2 Posted by devilzrule27 (1239 posts) -

Thats cool or whatever.

#3 Posted by shway (176 posts) -

too little to late?

#4 Posted by TheHT (11513 posts) -

I hope it's just additional scenes and cutscenes that fill in the blanks and extend the whole ending instead of coming up with something new to replace the whole thing.

At this point though, some folks harbour such hatred for BioWare, I don't know how far this would go in helping that.

#5 Posted by Mr_Skeleton (5146 posts) -

My thoughts? People are stupid.

#6 Posted by wardcleaver (173 posts) -

I will lose respect for them if they change the ending due to a small, but vocal, minority who are complaining. If they want to add DLC to "clarify" the ending, I am fine with that, although I think it is unnecessary.

#7 Posted by N7 (3595 posts) -

"New, full games"?
 
I'm listening.

#8 Posted by Gizmo (5389 posts) -

Would be great if it was a 10gb download just to open a image of the entire Bioware team giving you the finger.

#9 Posted by Slaker117 (4843 posts) -

As I've said before, with so many actively demanding to be sold more Mass Effect, it would be foolish of Bioware to not take advantage of the opportunity and sell more Mass Effect.

#10 Posted by gsquirrelgo (48 posts) -

I wonder how much this revised conclusion will cost in earth bucks.

#11 Posted by TheCowman (60 posts) -

Heck, I'll eat up anything Mass Effect related. More content is fine with me.

I AM a little worried about how much "fan feeback" they'll try addressing. As I stated in one of the plethora of ME ending threads, it wasn't the ending I would have dreamed of, but I enjoyed it nonetheless. (Well, I enjoyed MY ending. I can't speak to other people's)

The whole "indoctronation theory" floating around is a bit too much of a downer for me, so I'd hope that wouldn't be the direction they'd go. At least not in the way it's been presented on the internet, anyway. The folks at Bioware haven't let me down yet (yes, I'm one of those weirdos who actually liked Dragon Age 2), so they still have my trust to put out some good stuff.

Though, just as a side-note, we DO all know that any change to the ending won't satisfy ANYBODY, right? No matter what they do, the complaining will continue. Any new ending will just divide the two factions into four. Those that liked the first endings and are fine with the changes; those that liked the first endings and feel the changes ruined it; those that didn't like the endings and DO like the changes; and those who didn't like the endings and also don't like the changes.

Not that it matters to me. I'm happy with the game I got and anything else is just frosting. I'm just checking to see if everyone else is acknowledging this.

#12 Posted by Marz (5658 posts) -

As a person who liked the game but didn't enjoy the ending.  I feel that they should have just put their foot down, stick with what they got or confirm any theories out there as truth (stares at all the indoctrination theorist).   Adding a DLC to tell a different ending is not what i would have liked from them and hopefully it's not the case.   

#13 Posted by Tennmuerti (8136 posts) -

Good on them for addresing the issue.
 
But like i keep saying, if this will be a free change i'd be allright with that.
If they decide to charge for a DLC that fixes that ending, i for one will not buy it and it will likely affect all my further purchasing decisions when it comes to Bioware from then onward, not in a positive way.
Charging for said changes will also cause yet another monumental internet outrage, probably even greater then the current one was.

#14 Edited by Sooty (8082 posts) -

People that pay for DLC to fix the ending are fucking idiotic. It will be opening the flood gates for publishers to release unfinished games.

I cannot see them charging for it because the backlash would probably be even bigger than the original ending. I hope it will be at least.

#15 Posted by Brodehouse (10072 posts) -
@Marz After a few weeks to reflect, I don't need a different ending. But explaining what the setting looks like after the ending would be nice. They could wait until the next game to show the post-Shepard galaxy, but maybe it would be better if they showed their cards a little earlier. From the moment you made your last gameplay/choice, the game ends in about 3 minutes. Stretch that out, show us what happens in more detail.
#16 Posted by Funkydupe (3321 posts) -

@N7: Full games as opposed to ... games that aren't full games, but can become full once we buy and activate the DLC already on our disk? :) Sorry N7. I had to. (I enjoyed that specific DLC!)

#17 Posted by Napalm (9020 posts) -

I am extremely fucking excited about this, honestly. Downloadable content for Mass Effect 3 was a given at this point, and I truly feel like additional clarity needs to be addressed towards the end. This isn't a vocal minority complaining because they can, these are people, like me, who are legitimately disappointed and upset at how the trilogy concluded, and it doesn't feel like this was intended. It feels very goofy and shoved-in. I won't speculate on the hows and whys of it happening, but the script changing creative hands and possible time crunch may have had an impact on this. I don't know. I can respect the team truly feeling like this is the ending they wanted to go out on, but for everybody else, it doesn't feel conclusive in the least.

#18 Posted by GrandHarrier (180 posts) -

About the best we could have hoped for. I am optimistic that they are serious. We may not see Vent God disappear into the plot hole he came out of, but fixing the obvious and glaring mistakes of the ending would help.

#19 Posted by Breadfan (6590 posts) -
@Marz
As a person who liked the game but didn't enjoy the ending.  I feel that they should have just put their foot down, stick with what they got or confirm any theories out there as truth (stares at all the indoctrination theorist).   Adding a DLC to tell a different ending is not what i would have liked from them and hopefully it's not the case.   
I agree. The game has only been out for what, two or three weeks, and I'm already sick of hearing anything related to the ending.

I hope BioWare doesn't change anything and just moves on. That's what most people complaining need to do anyway.
#20 Posted by Funkydupe (3321 posts) -

@Napalm: I really liked the characters and the universe. I support more games. There's no rush. I'd rather they take their time and make quality experiences that'll be remembered and replayed 10 years from now.

#21 Posted by onan (1286 posts) -

@wardcleaver said:

I will lose respect for them if they change the ending due to a small, but vocal, minority who are complaining. If they want to add DLC to "clarify" the ending, I am fine with that, although I think it is unnecessary.

I already lost respect for them with the existing ending. It was short, introduced new concepts at the very last minute with no ability to question them, and I think worst of all inexplicably had the Normandy fleeing the battle to save Earth *WITH THE PARTY MEMBERS I HAD WITH ME.*

Still, reading between the lines of what Dr. Ray said, even if he's claiming they're going to maintain artistic integrity but also somehow address the concerns about closure, he said this:

"The journey you undertake in Mass Effect provokes an intense range of highly personal emotions in the player; even so, the passionate reaction of some of our most loyal players to the current endings in Mass Effect 3 is something that has genuinely surprised us. This is an issue we care about deeply, and we will respond to it in a fair and timely way. We’re already working hard to do that."

Maybe someone missed that when editing it, but it looks like they're going to change the ending anyway, or more likely than anything expand on it. Too many things make it seem like a dream sequence after all, things that I'd never expect a detail-oriented developer like Bioware to drop the ball on. If anything, all of the complaining probably just stepped up the timetables on them. Like Jeff said in the Podcast yesterday, the ending they have now gave me zero desire to look at any DLC or additional content for this game, or desire to continue playing the multiplayer because it all feels completely meaningless.

Oh well, here's hoping for the best.

#22 Posted by spazmaster666 (1972 posts) -

I would actually be very interested in DLC that would clarify whether or not the ending is symbolic in nature or if its actually what happens the galaxy. Also clarification on some smaller details would be nice as well (i.e. the actual power of the Mass Relay explosions).

#23 Posted by Zereta (1368 posts) -

I've finally come to terms with the ending as something that makes complete sense and they're gonna change it? Ah well, more Mass Effect 3 is good news I suppose :)

Now, what really interests me is that Bioware themselves are not done with making Mass Effect games. Good good :D

#24 Posted by JasonR86 (9742 posts) -

It's shitty they have to do this. Regardless of what people think about the ending, it was the ending they decided to create for their franchise. As someone who wants as much artistic and creative freedom as possible, I'm all for them making the ending to their creative work however they want. But they have been strong-armed by fans to change their creation and I find that to be as bad as if they had to change something due to censorship concerns.

#25 Posted by Napalm (9020 posts) -

Also, "can, and will, continue," and, "new full games," almost makes it sound like BioWare might double-down and do a Mass Effect 4.

#26 Posted by GlenTennis (3145 posts) -

FUUUUUUUUUCK THAAAAAAAAAAAT

#27 Posted by Sackmanjones (4739 posts) -

They really do care about Dan feedback and that's awesome. Key words are clarifying the ending. Clarify not change the ending. That's all I want an I'm excited for it

#28 Posted by SeriouslyNow (8534 posts) -
@Napalm said:
Also, "can, and will, continue," and, "new full games," almost makes it sound like BioWare might double-down and do a Mass Effect 4.
new full games implies another trilogy
#29 Posted by Winternet (8025 posts) -

I'm just going to quote Ryan's tweet: "BOO BIOWARE. FUCKING BOOOOOOOOOO".

#30 Posted by hangedtoaster (156 posts) -

@Gizmo said:

Would be great if it was a 10gb download just to open a image of the entire Bioware team giving you the finger.

That would be oddly fantastic in a sense, "The entirety of the Bioware team has come together to say screw off!!"

#31 Posted by Brodehouse (10072 posts) -
@Funkydupe The idea of 'full' is really the problem. I go by 'worth 60 bucks'... Or 40, or 30 if I've waited for a price drop.

The ending definitely makes that game worse, but it's still worth 60 bucks.

I disagree with Patrick about Javik. I used Liara and Garrus because they're Better. I got Javik with the CE and I didn't even use him. He seemed weird. They're putting 6 characters into the main game, I'm glad Javik was the one left out. I wouldn't give up anyone for him. ... Maybe James.
#32 Edited by DeathbyYeti (749 posts) -

terrible that they are going to change it

now consumers think they are entitled to everything

Edit: MY uncensored opinion is "Fuck that! Do you know what you have done?"

#33 Posted by Dany (7887 posts) -
@Sackmanjones
They really do care about Dan feedback and that's awesome. Key words are clarifying the ending. Clarify not change the ending. That's all I want an I'm excited for it
Yeah, I feel they intended for something in the ending, but it didn't come across clearly
#34 Posted by Zaph (274 posts) -

I have to echo Jeff's sentiments - this will not end well.

I too was very disappointed by the end of ME3, but this will not appease anyone and will probably just make things worse. Whether it's just an extended epilogue or a full-on retcon, fans will take issue with it.

And if we have to pay for it? Well EA will discover fans are willing to pay extra for a game ending...

#35 Posted by LordXavierBritish (6320 posts) -

Mass Effect 3 came out like two years ago who even cares.

#36 Posted by Napalm (9020 posts) -

Also, I'm kind of sick of the press shitting on the fans about this. Yes, some are taking it too far, but it's still a legitimate complaint to those who have a hefty investment in the series and want to see it end on a less-than-shitty note.

#37 Edited by Matterless (330 posts) -

@JasonR86 said:

It's shitty they have to do this. Regardless of what people think about the ending, it was the ending they decided to create for their franchise. As someone who wants as much artistic and creative freedom as possible, I'm all for them making the ending to their creative work however they want. But they have been strong-armed by fans to change their creation and I find that to be as bad as if they had to change something due to censorship concerns.

The video I'm going to post is nearly all spoilers, so don't click it if you haven't finished the game.

I agree with you in principle, Jason. And I find a lot of complainers (and complainers about complainers for that matter) obnoxious and far too rabid. While a lot of this video is rife with this kind of bitching, it's a good crystallization of the complaints about inconsistencies and plotholes left in the ending, as well as guarantees made by the creators of what the audience could expect: http://tinyurl.com/6w2o8gq

I was disappointed. I'm not a freak about it. But I see the point here.

#38 Posted by chilibean_3 (1657 posts) -

@Gizmo said:

Would be great if it was a 10gb download just to open a image of the entire Bioware team giving you the finger.

I want this to happen so hard.

#39 Posted by Sooty (8082 posts) -

@Napalm said:

Also, I'm kind of sick of the press shitting on the fans about this. Yes, some are taking it too far, but it's still a legitimate complaint to those who have a hefty investment in the series and want to see it end on a less-than-shitty note.

If the fans pay money to fix the ending then I fully endorse the press shitting on 'us' more.

Let's show EA we're willing to pay for endings to our games!

#40 Posted by N7 (3595 posts) -

No matter who sided with what, I think we can all agree this is the make or break point for Bioware.
 
Too many expectations are riding on this.

#41 Edited by SlightConfuse (3963 posts) -

having not played this gmae yeet thi sis a terrible move by bioware. Stick to your guns and shut down the fan entitlement , this back peddling ruins waht ever vision they had. og well as long as its optinal then i guess i wont buy it until i beat the game.

Justin McElroyJustinMcElroy

Following

For SHAME, BioWare: Caving to the internet is like negotiating with terrorists. It just makes it harder for the next guy.

#42 Posted by Coolarman (786 posts) -

@Breadfan said:

@Marz
As a person who liked the game but didn't enjoy the ending. I feel that they should have just put their foot down, stick with what they got or confirm any theories out there as truth (stares at all the indoctrination theorist). Adding a DLC to tell a different ending is not what i would have liked from them and hopefully it's not the case.
I agree. The game has only been out for what, two or three weeks, and I'm already sick of hearing anything related to the ending. I hope BioWare doesn't change anything and just moves on. That's what most people complaining need to do anyway.

I agree with both of you. I was not a fan of the ending but giving in to public pressure from fans (a very small subset of fans) isn't what I want Bioware to do. It will be interesting to see what they do with the ending. Do they write a completely new ending or take the existing ending and just bolt on something extra to the end.

#43 Posted by Dany (7887 posts) -
@N7
No matter who sided with what, I think we can all agree this is the make or break point for Bioware.
 
Too many expectations are riding on this.
Whatever they do, they CAN NOT charge monies for this
#44 Posted by Slaker117 (4843 posts) -
@JasonR86 said:

It's shitty they have to do this. Regardless of what people think about the ending, it was the ending they decided to create for their franchise. As someone who wants as much artistic and creative freedom as possible, I'm all for them making the ending to their creative work however they want. But they have been strong-armed by fans to change their creation and I find that to be as bad as if they had to change something due to censorship concerns.

I agree, but I have to wonder if the current ending is what they really wanted, or if they had to make significant compromises due to time/budget pressure, or something else in that vein.
 
Granted, given unlimited time, no creator will ever be fully satisfied with their work, but I get a strong impression that something went wrong in ME3's development that forced Bioware to diverge greatly from the ending they wanted to make.
#45 Posted by Kevin_Cogneto (1094 posts) -

I played every bit of DLC for Mass Effect 2 and I was planning to do the same for ME3. But if their DLC changes the ending in any way, I'm out. Come on Bioware, have some integrity for Pete's sake...

#46 Edited by Sooty (8082 posts) -

@SlightConfuse said:

having not played this gmae yeet thi sis a terrible move by bioware. Stick to your guns and shut down the fan entitlement , this back peddling ruins waht ever vision they had. og well as long as its optinal then i guess i wont buy it until i beat the game.

I don't agree with the people demanding another ending is released, but a lot of the backlash is purely because of how bad the ending is. There's nothing wrong with saying that.

If this costs money and people buy it, then I hope you people know that publishers will take advantage of this and gouge you for more money than they already do now.

#47 Posted by ArbitraryWater (11909 posts) -

@GlenTennis said:

FUUUUUUUUUCK THAAAAAAAAAAAT

At some point, I am going to have to take this stance. Stand by your (admittedly terrible) ending Bioware.

#48 Posted by kishinfoulux (2394 posts) -

Man fuck all the internet whiners. And Bioware has let me down caving into the fans like that. It's their god damn story and they can end it however the fuck they please. This sets an awful precedent for the future. I hope the new ending is just a giant troll face or a middle finger or some shit.

#49 Posted by Napalm (9020 posts) -
@Sooty said:

@Napalm said:

Also, I'm kind of sick of the press shitting on the fans about this. Yes, some are taking it too far, but it's still a legitimate complaint to those who have a hefty investment in the series and want to see it end on a less-than-shitty note.

If the fans pay money to fix the ending then I fully endorse the press shitting on 'us' more.

Let's show EA we're willing to pay for endings to our games!

It's a shit ending and not the actual ending that was envisioned, so you're whole sentiment of "fixing" an already broken ending doesn't have a leg to stand on.
#50 Posted by Draugen (664 posts) -

Fair play, I say.

I really hated the ending, but I was never in favour of them backtracking on it. No do-overs. But if they manage to put some of my concerns to rest with this, whatever it is, I'll give them a polite golf clap, and be on my way.

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