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    Mass Effect: Andromeda

    Game » consists of 20 releases. Released Mar 21, 2017

    Set in a galaxy far from the Milky Way, Mass Effect: Andromeda puts players in the role of a Pathfinder tasked with exploring new habitable worlds and investigating mysterious technology.

    Now you have a family!

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    BoOzak

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    To be more specific the male and female playable characters featured in the last two gameplay videos are brother and sister and you can choose to be either. (i'm not sure if you can change your choice halfway through, probably not)

    Your family will also be featured (the father was apparently in one of the videos) and your brother or sister will be part of the world.

    I'm not sure I like this. I like my playable characters to have a very vague back story so I can fill in the blanks.

    There are good and bad examples of family in RPG's, The Witcher did it pretty well. (granted they werent blood relatives) Fable did not.

    And lest we forget.

    No Caption Provided

    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-09-08-mass-effect-andromedas-male-and-female-hero-choices-are-brother-and-sister

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    ArtisanBreads

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    #2  Edited By ArtisanBreads

    Interesting. I find it to be a cool choice.

    I liked it in Dragon Age: Origins, depending on what origin you chose. The game had flaws but the family in Dragon Age 2 was not part of the flaws of the game. I think Fable is a bad example because it's not tied into the story whatsoever and the game is set up so you can have a family in every town and even kill your family off if you want, Ryan Davis style.

    Not a ton of RPGs have done it that I can think of, especially not with a focus, but that's a good reason to do so I think. I'm all for trying different things.

    I think the Witcher 3 did a lot of great stuff with being a dad so something about being a child of a Spectre sounds interesting coming off of that in a whole different way. In some games I can like things being vague but in general I would think having more motivations and backstory would almost always lead to better storytelling. It's not the case for every game but that's just my initial thought.

    In Bioware games I think they flesh out your party members so much that by comparison your character being so blank slate can be kind of lifeless and boring. I think the DA:O solution of letting you choose backstory is the coolest answer to this but it's really hard and time consuming to do that. It's really insane that game had all that content.

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    MooseyMcMan

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    Have they said for sure that you pick one of them and stick with that character through the whole game? I wouldn't be surprised if this was something like AC: Syndicate where it switches between them for story missions and the like.

    I also wonder if this means character creation is out the window. Like, editing faces and stuff. If the tradeoff is better facial animations, I know I wouldn't be that upset, but I know a lot of people probably would be.

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    Captain_Insano

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    #4  Edited By Captain_Insano

    I do prefer the 'blank slate' back story - I liked in ME1 that you could choose one of a few general backgrounds that impacted your character slightly (similar to how Dragon Age: Origins did it)

    I thought The Witcher 3 really pulled it off - Geralt's pursuit to get Ciri back was more than enough of a believable motivation - it just depends on how well it is used. If it is something as simple as "your brother/sister is missing, go get them!", then it's not great.

    Red Dead Redemption had an excellent use of family as motivation.

    Assassin's Creed Syndicate used the twins of Jacob and Evie Frye. I liked AC:S, but that aspect of the story never really drew me in. They had a bit of an attempt to make the sibling rivalry a large part of the plot but I never really felt it - I would've preferred AC:S to have solely been an Evie game I think.

    Still, Mass Effect is probably my favourite franchise from last gen, so I will have some faith in Bioware for this.

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    ArtisanBreads

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    #5  Edited By ArtisanBreads

    As far as character creation, I hope they just go off the basics of your character (skin tone, hair color) and then they can make them just look however they want. This game had really simple character creation, but it could be kind of like Deus Ex where they match Paul Denton to your choices for skin/hair color.

    I really doubt there is any sort of character switching and I'm sure they will bring back customization. Customization and owning a singular character has always been huge in Bioware games and it was always a big focus for ME, even if they had their standard models for Shepard.

    @captain_insano: You do say slightly, but IMO the Origins in DA:O are way more involved than the very simple, slight choices for background in ME. With Origins, depending on what you go with you can have wildly different relationships with major plot characters and your origin can figure back into the story in a lot of different ways. Playing a the dwarf noble for example completely changed your relationship to a major area of the game in Orzammar and it was very cool to see it all weave into the story way beyond just even that area. To me it was not an example of a blank slate game as a result. You just had a lot of choice choosing backstory, but the backstory was there.

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    BoOzak

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    @artisanbreads: The first two Fables revolved around avenging/finding your sister and your brother is one of the main antagonists of 3.

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    ArtisanBreads

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    #7  Edited By ArtisanBreads

    @boozak: fair enough. The main plot threads have totally slipped my mind of those games I suppose, which speaks to how I think about the main plot threads of those games. To me Fable is a sandbox game and II is the only one I think is good (it's very good though).

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    Pezen

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    That actually sound pretty interesting and I am curious where they take that as I am sure they wouldn't go through all of that trouble if it didn't have some tangible reason. As others have noted there are games with good use of family as a catalyst. If customization is in there they could just do a Fallout 4-esque solution of having you customize all of the playable/related characters. Otherwise there's a lot of things that needs to line up (assuming they're family in a biological sense), and I would hate to create my character and have the game assume an appearance for father/sibling based on my character because that can go all sideways.

    I really hope this game turns out well.

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    The_Ruiner

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    The family stuff wasn't the problem with DA 2. In fact it was the only thing i was even remotely invested in in that story. Rebuilding your family's estate was actually a nice touch. I even felt for my piece of shit Uncle by the end of it.

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    TheUnsavedHero

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    Ehhh... Wait and see on this I suppose.

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    TheHT

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    Cool! I enjoyed that stuff in Dragon Age 2, as well as most of Dragon Age 2. Yeah, that's right.

    Also a neat way to have both protagonists feature into everyone's game, rather than having your choice of sex lock you out of the other performance (at least for that playthrough, if replaying these games is your thing).

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    kblosnack

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    Space incest maybe?

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    Teddie

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    Ehhh... as long as they don't force my character into liking them because they're my sibling. Unless they forced a personality on them in every other aspect.

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    MezZa

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    It seems like a nice way to solve the "this is the true Shephard!" problem. Might also be a good opportunity to add some emotional brother and sister moments in the game if done well.

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    hassun

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    I'm not particularly interested in the siblings/siblings and parent relationship in Mass Effect (or in video games in general really) but on the other hand it's not something that really bothers me either. Bioware has made dreadful characters but also some absolutely terrific ones in the past and I hope they will outdo themselves with Andromeda.

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    csl316

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    By gawd, I do?

    Interesting choice, it'll certainly allow a new type of story to be told.

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    GhostPantsu

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    I just want a Mass Effect that let's you choose what race you play as. Just imagine the wacky scenarios a family of Volus, Elcor, or Hanar would get into.

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    Fredchuckdave

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    Blank slate is always trash in terms of the storyline, works for first person immersive games though. Not having a protagonist is not a very good baseline for creating an interesting plot I'm afraid, of course Mass Effect has never been in the Blank Slate mold, it's just "Asshole Shepard" or "Slightly Bigger Asshole Shepard."

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    Xeiphyer

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    100% chance the other sibling dies lol.

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    Justin258

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    I'm actually way more interested in a character that's not a total blank slate. It's become a very common trope and I think it's certainly a useful one, but I think there's definitely a place for RPG's that don't try to make your character as generic as possible. You can definitely do that and still have tons of player choice, The Witcher is ample proof of that.

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    BoOzak

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    #21  Edited By BoOzak

    @justin258: Except for the part where Geralt has amnesia for two games because that's not a well worn trope or anything.

    The problem with your characters family playing a prominant role is i'm supposed to know these people and care about them but I cant because I dont. At least that was the case with Dragon Age 2, Fallout 4 and Fable. The Witcher is an outlier. But Bioware could pull it off and if they dont there's still aliens to shoot and seduce.

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    ShadyPingu

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    #22  Edited By ShadyPingu

    I'll be curious to see to what degree Ryder's family ties informs his/her character. Bioware MCs have over time taken on some "blank slate" qualities that have done the games no favors imo -- Shepard is so bland that I'm left wondering why all these cool aliens want to be his/her friend so badly. It's a bummer because Bioware clearly has skill writing investable characters, just rarely the one you're playing as. It's not as if it's an unavoidable consequence of having plot branches either. There are games, the Witcher 3 for instance, that follow a roughly similar design model but are noticeably better at writing compelling MCs, so it is at the very least possible to do better.

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    ivdamke

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    @boozak: A character suffering from Amnesia doesn't make them a blank slate character.

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    dagas

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    I just hope it doesn't mean there won't be any character creation this time. I prefer to make my own rather than using the default.

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    gkhan

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    @theht said:

    Cool! I enjoyed that stuff in Dragon Age 2, as well as most of Dragon Age 2. Yeah, that's right.

    Fuck yeah, homie!

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    BoOzak

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    @ivdamke: It is a tired trope that makes the character seem more generic though.

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    TobbRobb

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    Eh, ok. I guess I wasn't gonna play it so it doesn't really matter. But I am a little bummed that they are moving the games in this direction. I prefer blank slate characters in rpgs, it's an easy fix for my problem of immersing in a role. And I'm especially wary when iffy character writing decides who I control, Witcher ended up being fine because I found Geralt relatable, likable and consistent. But in most games I don't trust the stars to align like that. This could go either way, but I tend to consider Bioware closer to Bethesda rather than CDPR when it comes to characterization and quality of writing. So not exactly holding my breath on this one.

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    papercut

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    I remember that in the first Mass Effect if you picked the background where you were from a military family, there was a mission where you find a veteran on The Citadel who is down on his luck and asking for money or something like that. You could then actually call you mom who was on another Alliance ship in space and get some information on the guy and briefly just chat with her.

    The one minute of dialogue that you have with Shepard's mom was one of my favorite little moments in the game.

    I understand why people might be against having predetermined character backstories in the game. Part of the appeal of Mass Effect was that you can make your Shephard be whatever kind of character you wanted him/her to be. You could make him/her a do good space marine, a scoundrel, something in between. Giving the player character a defined character history, even if it is just a brother or sister, may not fit some people's vision of what they want their Ryder to be.

    But I think that family in character driven games can really invest you in the world and you choices that traditional backstory options just don't convey. When I talked to Sheps mom in Mass Effect, there's was an exciting moment of "what is she going to be like?", "what does she think of me?", "Are we on good terms?" I wouldn't get that way if it was just some dude that I knew from the military before that I got to do a random mission around.

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    deactivated-5e60e701b849a

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    I'm all for this. I like having a more fleshed out character background. And if I had to guess, I would say you can customize both of the siblings and the dad, to resemble both of them, is a mix of the siblings' features.

    @kblosnack said:

    Space incest maybe?

    What happens in Andromeda, stays in Andromeda.

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    BojackHorseman

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    What was wrong with the family stuff in DA2? I liked it.

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    OMGFather

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    @xeiphyer said:

    100% chance the other sibling dies lol.

    And the father.

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    Fezrock

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    Its a neat idea, assuming the NPC sibling is fairly visible in the story, maybe even a party member. If its just a few throwaway lines and a character you meet once, that'd be disappointing. I like RPGs where the main character already has some defined traits and a personality; being able to adjust it over the course of the game is great, but having a complete blank slate is just too boring for me. Its why I dislike silent main characters too. So having the character starting out with a family and some defined relationships sounds good to me.

    In addition to knowing the size of their role, I'm also interested to find out how much the NPC sibling's personality is set in stone versus changing in reaction what the player character does. Also, just how far is Blizzard taking this concept? Can you play the exact same game with either sibling, or will there be differences no matter what and you need to play through the game twice to see the full story? (e.g. at one point Ryder always goes to planet A, while Guyder always goes to planet B).

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    BojackHorseman

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    @xeiphyer said:

    100% chance the other sibling dies lol.

    And the father.

    There has actually been a rumor for quite a while that Andromeda would be about the Ryder family, and that Ryder Sr. will be the villain of the game.

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    clagnaught

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    I kind of like that idea, at least in the sense that the male and female protagonist options are separate characters.

    But then, are both going to be referred to as Ryder? If you pick the brother, will the sister get a default first name? Will both just say Ryder to each other over and over?

    Still think it could be interesting. I'm just curious to see it in action.

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    BoOzak

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    What was wrong with the family stuff in DA2? I liked it.

    It's been a long time since i've played Dragon Age 2. I just remember hating everything about it. But I know i'm in the minority in this thread so i'll just leave it at that.

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    ll_Exile_ll

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    What was wrong with the family stuff in DA2? I liked it.

    There's certainly plenty to dislike about Dragon Age II, but I quite liked the family and the protagonist. Hawke is my favorite protagonist in the Dragon Age series, pretty much entirely because the character is far less of a blank slate than the other player characters in the series. Hawke is a much more tangible character, and the presence of their family contributes to that.

    Like a lot of people in this thread, I'm not really much of a fan blank slate characters, so this news about the protagonist's family in Mass Effect Andromeda is good news as far as I'm concerned. I've never really understood the need some people have to 100% identify with the main character in a role playing game.

    Role playing for me isn't ideal when the character becomes me , but when I put myself into the mind of the character. I find it much more interesting to put myself in the shoes of a well defined character and try to see things through their eyes and experience their world they way they would. Controlling some unfeeling automaton with the idea that I'm supposed to project my qualities onto them is entirely unappealing. I've been me for my whole life, I'm boring. I don't want video game characters to be me too.

    I'd much rather play as someone that isn't anything like me. The core idea of role playing is that you play a role, putting yourself into the mind of someone else, not making the character as much like you as possible.

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    BoOzak

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    @ll_exile_ll: Blank slate characters dont have to represent you, they can represent whoever you want to be, it just requires some imagination.

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    wolf_blitzer85

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    Which one's the space racist?

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    ll_Exile_ll

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    @boozak said:

    @ll_exile_ll: Blank slate characters dont have to represent you, they can represent whoever you want to be, it just requires some imagination.

    True, but whenever I see someone advocate blank slate characters it's almost always based on the idea that they want the character to represent themselves.

    Regardless, I think an emotionless, passionless main character with little or no tangible ties to the world in which in the game is set is much more detrimental to good storytelling that any potential disconnect that could arise between the player and a well defined main character.

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    BoOzak

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    @ll_exile_ll: Storytelling sure, Roleplaying? Not really. I'll take a good RPG over a glorified Telltale game any day.

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    Redhotchilimist

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    #41  Edited By Redhotchilimist

    Considering Bethany was the hottest character in DA2, I can't say I was hoping for them to repeat this.

    Still, good if it works. I'd just like it to be more Dojima and Nanako and less "daddy's the villain", if that's the rumor. Or that they die immediately.

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    Toug

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    StarvingGamer

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    #43  Edited By StarvingGamer

    I love it although I do wish you could play as both in a single playthrough and have TWO ROMANCES

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    monkeyking1969

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    Teddie

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    @ll_exile_ll said:

    Regardless, I think an emotionless, passionless main character with little or no tangible ties to the world in which in the game is set is much more detrimental to good storytelling that any potential disconnect that could arise between the player and a well defined main character.

    Except the player characters in Mass Effect/Dragon Age were never that because all their dialogue was written with that stuff in mind? Just because they're blank slates doesn't mean they stay that way, it's just on the player to decide which elements they want to reflect onto their character. That's fun in my mind, but it's obviously not going to be everyone's cup of tea.

    I'd much rather play as someone that isn't anything like me. The core idea of role playing is that you play a role, putting yourself into the mind of someone else, not making the character as much like you as possible.

    That's exactly what I do too, as a fellow boring person, only I don't need the predefined character there to come up with a role to play. The last Shepard I played was a crotchety old man that I had nothing in common with, and by the end of the series I hated his guts. It's never been a self-insert thing for me, so it's a shame you seem so convinced that's all anybody wants to do with blank-slate characters.

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    redyoshi

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    I generally like family stuff in RPGs, so I've got no problem with this. Then again, I'm also the type to look up "canon names" for protagonists if they exist. I appreciate the fact that there are people that don't like any sort of pre-existing backstory for their characters, but I've always thought that if it's done well, it adds a lot to the experience for me.

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    Fredchuckdave

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    @starvinggamer said:

    I love it although I do wish you could play as both in a single playthrough and have TWO ROMANCES

    WITH EACH OTHER! Next time you get to play as Joffrey. I was hoping for a GTA 5 esque system where you have 2 separate parties on different sides of the same enormous battlefield or something.

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    ll_Exile_ll

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    @teddie said:

    @ll_exile_ll said:

    Regardless, I think an emotionless, passionless main character with little or no tangible ties to the world in which in the game is set is much more detrimental to good storytelling that any potential disconnect that could arise between the player and a well defined main character.

    Except the player characters in Mass Effect/Dragon Age were never that because all their dialogue was written with that stuff in mind? Just because they're blank slates doesn't mean they stay that way, it's just on the player to decide which elements they want to reflect onto their character. That's fun in my mind, but it's obviously not going to be everyone's cup of tea.

    I didn't mean to imply previous Mass Effect/Dragon Age games were guilty of what I was talking about. The issue I have with the idea of blank slate protagonists is that the balance between the player's freedom to personalize the character is inherently at odds with the game's ability to recognize it.

    The Mass Effect series specifically does a pretty good job of acknowledging the way you've chosen to portray your character, with the trade-off being the very limited number of in game options you're given to do so. There's really only a handful of different ways you can choose to play your version of Shepard within the game.

    Games that give a wider array of options in how you want to portray your character suffer the opposite, they aren't able to meaningfully acknowledge the way you're playing your character.

    @teddie said:

    I'd much rather play as someone that isn't anything like me. The core idea of role playing is that you play a role, putting yourself into the mind of someone else, not making the character as much like you as possible.

    That's exactly what I do too, as a fellow boring person, only I don't need the predefined character there to come up with a role to play. The last Shepard I played was a crotchety old man that I had nothing in common with, and by the end of the series I hated his guts. It's never been a self-insert thing for me, so it's a shame you seem so convinced that's all anybody wants to do with blank-slate characters.

    It's not that I need a predefined character to role play, it's that I prefer games where the character has a more meaningful involvement with the story. The more defined a character is, the more personal the story can be. Blank slate characters give more ability to shape their backstory and personality, but there is a fundamental disconnect with the core narrative in these instances. Often these characters come across as passive participants in these major events despite their actions seemingly driving things forward.

    Finally, as I said to someone else in the thread, I know not everyone wants to project themselves onto blank slate characters, but it is the common reason given by both players and developers. The explanation for the presence of silent protagonists by developers, for example, is almost always to allow the character to be a cipher for the player to project themselves upon.

    I understand the appeal of fully customizing every aspect of your character and fully immersing yourself in the role, and there are specific types of games where I think that's the best route. However, the more story driven a game is the more I feel like a fairly defined main character is better suited. Other types of RPGs where interpersonal relationships aren't the focus (such as Bethesda games) are much better suited to blank slates.

    Bioware games are so story driven and so dependent on character interactions to the extent where having a main character with more personality and personal stakes serves them better in my opinion. Of course, they've never had entirely blank slates, but moving even further towards predefined characters is a good direction for these types of games as far as I'm concerned.

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