Edit: immediately moved this to the MGS2 section because I'm insecure about my choices. Derp.

In the 11/18/2014 episode of the Bombcast, Dan refers to watching certain anime as if one had played MGS2 before MGS1. I am that guy.

In early 2002, my best friend told me that I should play a game called Metal Gear Solid 2, and lent it to me. I had no idea what this was and the most cinematic game I had played by this point in my life was either Donkey Kong 64 or Perfect Dark. I was twelve. As I played through the game, I kept hearing reference to things like Shadow Moses, a dude who was apparently named after a state of matter and crazy non-sequiturs like "No wonder Naomi passed you over for the FoxDie program!" I probably understood 20% of that whole game and got the deeper, referential meaning of about 5%. This might be the worst (or at least, most risky) MGS to start someone on, a toss-up between this and 4.

However, a truly magical thing happened. It must have been the perfect storm of coincidences: I was a curious kid and interested in the mysterious; I was just opening my eyes to what video games could REALLY do as an art form, but wasn't quite aware of it; I had never seen anything even close to MGS2's cinematic delivery. I remember being specifically BAFFLED at my friend when he told me that after the Tanker chapter, the whole main game was spent on ONE level! This was absolutely mystifying to me, my most played game at the time being Super Mario World (I was one of those kids who got a SNES in like, 1996). I could have gotten to the introduction of the second - and admittedly less cool - protagonist and shunned him. I could have reached the meeting with Vamp and said "what the fuck is a vampire doing in a seemingly military based shooter?" I could have reached a mention of the Patriots and quietly, slowly turned my console off.

However - and I find it amazing how perfectly Dan nailed this analysis - instead, all of these confusing references and characters only deepened my interest. I would hear about how a legendary super-spy saved the world at a small island in the Fox archipelago and just like Dan said, think "I have no idea what happened at Shadow Moses, but I'm pretty sure it was fucking cool." Not to mention that all of the MGS2 specific content involving the Patriots (no spoilers, don't worry), Dead Cell and E.E. (who maybe I had a super-crush on at the time) was the most interesting material a game had ever delivered to me. To say, "I was hooked" would be a bigger understatement than "Dan Ryckert likes Hot Pockets".

MGS3 became the first game I ever got pre-hype for. I remember buying a copy of Playstation magazine while in Nanaimo (the NYC of Vancouver Island, Canada) on a family vacation, and inside were the early details of MGS3. I learned that I would not be playing as Solid Snake, but as a "different soldier during the time of the Cuban Missile Crisis", and that this would be Kojima's final entry in the series - for sure this time. *snicker* I asked for MGS3 for Christmas 2004, then secretly bought my own copy two weeks early because I couldn't wait.

All this time, MGS1 had been built up in my head as some sort of legend. I hadn't been able to locate a copy of the game in what would become six years. But when I did... well, that's probably a story for another day.

I think I should make my point. MGS2 changed my perspective entirely on what video games are, what they can do and what a good character is. It made me want a video game maybe more than any I've wanted in my life. So, I ask you dear Duders, is MGS2 really so bad? Yes, I know this game is respected for its impact and much of the reasons I've said, but I'm saying within the MGS context, should MGS2 really be branded as "the worst" of them? Like, for those Indiana Jones fans, would you say Temple of Doom is "the worst" of the trilogy (that's all there is, right? Three? Right), or that it's the "least fucking awesome" of the trilogy? Does MGS2 deserve that designation, or is it that people are still sore over the Snake switcharoo, or they can't be bothered to get interested in the story and write it off as "obtuse" and "pretentious"?

I'll grant you, the switcharoo was a dick move - particularly the pre-release footage of Snake fighting Fortune - but thirteen years later, really? As for the story, I'll admit I'm the last person to talk about the symbolic implications of art, but MGS2's plot has relevance to things we should be concerned about even today. MGS2 is literally the reason I find Net Neutrality logical and sound. Not to mention that MGS2 plays and has aged way, way better than its predecessor (I'm with Jeff, MGS2 plays the best out of all of them).

Despite my earlier comment about Raiden being less cool... well, it's hard to beat Solid Snake. I think of Raiden as trying desperately to be Snake but never quite reaching his level. He even seems to suggest this about himself at a point in the game. He's like the accidental mentee, or a friendly foil, to Solid Snake. Similar in description, but couldn't be more different in execution; but he's trying and trying hard. Viewed from there, I think Raiden is a real cool guy. Again, no Snake, but a worthy partner. As for Rose... let's say I tried real hard to like her, particluarly during my recent playthrough. I like how she's used a lot more in MGS4: sparsely and for emotional effect.

I guess the reason I thought of all this is Metal Gear Scanlon 1 showed me that for all of MGS' aging problems, a person blind to all of MGS can still enjoy the story and get excited for the future. Metal Gear Scanlon 2 is showing me that Strut F can suck my -- sorry, I mean that it's showing me that a lot of people hold little reverance for MGS2. Furthermore, more than a few people have said that it's okay if Drew hates this game, as he wouldn't be alone in that. I think that's unfair, partially because he's upset over the gameplay, not the story/characters as most people were; partially because as I've said, MGS2 deserves a decent chance. I've always thought that it isn't fair to sit back during a story and say, "okay, wow me." You have to be willing to meet the story halfway so to speak sometimes, because some stories require a little effort and consideration on the player's part. You have to get out there and love the story. You can't just wait for the story to love you (God, I hope someone gets this). I know Drew is his own thinking, intelligent person, but I'd hate for him to finish the game and say, "well, that was hard to understand, and Raiden's kind of a weiner, but no-one else likes it, so I guess that's no surprise. Oh, well".

So, I hope this has made some people a little more sympathetic to MGS2 and to consider its value before lambasting it. Furthermore, if some newcomers to MGS read this in conjunction with watching Metal Gear Scanlon and earn an appreciation for any of the MGS games - including 2, of course - nothing could make me happier.

Great blog

MGS4 was the first one of the series I played. I had no idea whatsoever what was happening but I appreciated it for its crazy-ass cutscenes. I specifically remember Liquid Ocelot pointing finger guns at patrol boats and making them explode haha

MGS2 was one of the last MGS games I've played so it was weird going in having known pretty much everything about it: all the major twists, story points, characters, you name it. This is probably why I was never too bothered by the fact that I was playing Raiden and not Snake.

I definitely wouldn't call MGS2 the best playing of the series, that belonged to MGS4 and now with Ground Zeroes, I would say it plays better than MGS3 simply because of Snake Eater's added mechanics (Stamina meter, sneaking with D-Pad, having to constantly switch camouflage, Rations no longer recover health instead relying on Stamina regen and Life Medicine) that hampered my enjoyment of the game. I still think MGS2 is probably the "worst" of the series overall, but even then it's still pretty great.

As a person who has lived on Vancouver Island for the entirety of my life, I have no idea what this means.

If Drew can handle MGS 1's gameplay and not hate that game, he can most certainly handle MGS 2's much improved gameplay.

I don't get where all the hate for MGS 2 comes from these days. Yeah, the Raiden thing was a dick move, but the gameplay and attention to detail was top-freaking notch back in the day. And the entire game is super ballsy for a triple-a title.

Yeah great blog. Something different happened to me though.

I was a guy like you. But in 2001 when MGS2 came out, I had not heard of MGS beyond having seen stuff in magazines for VR Missions. I didnt know what the game was about. I had just gotten a PS2 and decided I needed the best looking game for the system and remember people were hyped for it. So I got it, it played like no other game ever and it looked gorgeous. This Solid Snake guy was so fucking cool. And then... oh man, why is my voice different. Snake has blonde hair? Wait, who the fuck is this guy. Then I kept playing it and it was cool. I liked sneaking around in an enemy uniform and the deep story kept me interested.

So then my friend told me, nah, MGS1 was a better game. So I had to try it out. It looked way worse. I never had a PS1 and always thought the games looked like shit. And you couldn't do the first person aiming. Or the peaking around corners to shoot guys. But man it was a much more grounded experience. It had the right mix of weird sci fi shit with crazy military conspiracy stuff. Playing it, I started to think back... why didn't I get to play as Snake in MGS2? Why are the bosses in MGS2 so fucking lame. A fat guy on roller skates? A whiny chick who wants to die? A vampire? Sure MGS1 had a psychic but it didn't seem lame he could read minds, as a character he was neat. Sniper Wolf was probably my favorite. And Snake most of all, dude was badass. That Tanker mission was perfect and just pissed me off that we missed out on a great Solid Snake experience. I started to hate what MGS became later. Just trying to be crazier and crazier and making no sense. MGS3 and 4 just made it worse. Guy made of bees, fighting a ghost, a retarded plot about the Boss defecting that makes no sense from a just get it done perspective. Playing as an old Solid Snake who is not as cool as an old Clint Eastwood. And the twist in the story about the Patriots. Dumb. And now MGS5 with robot arms and disappearing chicks who dont talk. It just pushed me away. I think MGS1 is something special. It had the right mix of crazy and espionage story telling. Military sprinkled with some fantastical elements and great characters. Kojima sucks at telling stories and I think he just got lucky with MGS1.

I never would have gotten into MGS if it wasn't for the introduction of 3rd person camera. MGS3: Subsistence was my first MGS game as it had 3rd person gameplay first in the series. Later, after finishing MGS4, I played 1, 2 and Peace Walker. 2 is the only one I've finished out of those, the mess it was. I enjoy Peace Walker's story but it just too goddamn long and repetitive.

Have you played MGR?

Also, quality post A++ would read again.

2 Is definitely not the worst of them. Even if I really dislike large sections of actually playing it, what it tried to achieve is too impressive not to acknowledge.

Besides, it would take a lot to bring 2 down to the level of 4, PW or Portable Ops. 4 is probably the worst of the bunch just in general. I had fun with it and all the absurdity, but holy shit that game is a mess.

I had a lot of the same reactions but with MGS 1 actually I was introduced to Metal Gear Solid and Tony Hawk Pro Skater at about the same time and my goddamn head nearly exploded.

MGS2 is easily the best in series. The way the themes of the story are told, and tie into the gameplay, mark it above the rest. That said, I think it's only as good as it is for me with the knowledge of MGS1.

One of the coolest small details in the game, on the tanker if you go to the bar and shoot one of the big mugs with ice in them, the ice falls out and actually melts.

I started playing through the series recently knowing nothing about Metal Gear at all. I'm about 5ish hours into MGS 3 and right now I feel like anyone who says 3 is better than 2 is a crazy person. The hunger mechanic sucks, healing sucks, no radar sucks, camouflage sucks, the jungle sucks and so far the story isn't as interesting.

Maybe I'll come around on it as i keep grinding through it but right now i feel like 2 is way superior.

MGS2 is great and it is the first I played, but the worst just because the actual objectives/levels are pretty bad and basically designed around backtracking. Great core gameplay and its partnership with MGS1 is brilliant.

This is a good read! I finished MGS2 a couple of years after it came out, since I didn't really grasp all the gameplay changes right away and gave up on it for a bit. But when I finally got into the meat of the game, it definitely blew my mind. Not only do I agree that it plays the best out of any of the MGS games (except maybe Ground Zeroes), but the story and the way it's told were insane for the time. Kind of still are - how many games work their narrative themes in so completely? I get that people don't like Raiden and I don't really blame them, but there is so much more going on in MGS2 than just a whiny protagonist.

@theveteran13 I am with you 100%, I really feel like you can completely skip 3 and not miss anything (except for some insight into Ocelot, but he's basically played off as comic relief in 3 anyway). It has a lot of interesting ideas, but I'd rather play any other (numbered) game in the series over 3.

I played MGS2 before MGS as well. Loved it.

I just finished MGS2 for the first time last night. I wasn't really deep into games until I was 14 back in 04, so I didn't know anything about Metal Gear until playing the MGS3 demo and learning things about the series as the years went by and as more games came along. So when I learned about playing 90% of MGS2 as Raiden, I was probably indifferent towards it since I didn't have the reverence for Metal Gear as other people did. If anything as an outsider looking in at the time, I thought that Raiden was cooler than Snake, because Raiden used a sword, and I like swords, so I in turn would have been in the minority of people waiting for Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance when it was just an idea.

For me, MGS2 is a fun game. I got through it just fine despite being spoiled by Subsistence's alternate camera and MGS4's updated controls, and actually playing through the story was much more interesting than just learning the story bits though various wiki pages, let's plays, speed runs and MGS4 calling back to those events. So I got a really big sense of accomplishment from finally finishing the game since I never got past the tanker when I first played the original version sometime in the late 2000s.

Since Metal Gear is my favorite gaming franchise of all time, I can't make a judgement call on what I think are the best and worst games of the series since I accept and appreciate the differences between each game and the themes they go for. But I'm willing to say that I like 3 the most because it's the game the got me aware of the series. Still, 2 is pretty awesome, despite Rose being annoying.

@theveteran13: I'm super surprised how many people I'm finding mirroring your thoughts on 3. Maybe I was being self-centric, but I always thought of MGS1 as the one that's my favorite, 2 is the one that plays like silk and 3 was the one with the tight script, and just selfishly figured everyone else felt that way until I started hearing other gamer responses.

If you don't like the story, then I don't know what to tell you, other than it pretty much stays at that level of hype for the entirety, excluding the MGS-typical finale where all the plot twists happen. The feeding, healing and camo systems were so gosh dang cool at the time, that I never even thought about how annoying it would be to constantly pause and menu surf. Just childish wonderment, I guess. But now, I can't see them as anything but cool because of that, I can't see them objectively. Anyway the point is, if the story doesn't grab you and the mechanics are frustrating, neither really get "better", per se. I don't think the story is boring, but it is rather steady in pacing through and through. And well, you'll be opening that heal menu PLENTY come the fight with Fury. Honestly, I'm just dissapointed you're not enjoying yourself, because MGS is that one game series for me - that I think everyone has - that I want as many people to play as possible.

My sympathies.

@poobumbutt: I don't think the story is boring but I rolled straight into 3 after finishing 2 so I felt an extreme drop off in my Metal Gear hype levels. The camo would maybe be better if the enemies didn't see you from a mile away whenever you're not prone, healing is just a hassle i don't want to deal with I want to eat a ration and have everything be better. As for having to eat that's just a game mechanic I don't like at all in general and the environment so far is just a green/brown mish mash with some buildings thrown in there. Like I said before maybe I'll come around on it because I still plan to finish the game but right now it's just not grabbing me like 1&2.

One thing I will note about the MGS series is that MGS fans are pretty varying when it comes to which game they would say is their favourite. A pretty equal amount say their favourite is either 1, 2, or 3. A little less for 4 and PW. What makes Metal Gear great is that none of the games a really like the others in the series. Yet there is a fair amount of style continuity between all of them, so you to sort of know what to expect to some degree with each new entry; but MGS never reasonably gets that one opt-out criticism that annual or even bi-annually released games get when people say "this game is too similar to the last one, so I'm not playing it". Hey Far Cry 4. So there is a lot of MGS fans out there that love MGS3, but dislike MGS2. Or you get people like Jeff who like MGS2 and 4, but dislike 1 and 3.

So, I hope Drew is able to make his own opinions on these games, without other people's strong comments affecting him too much, or at all.

Also anyone who has played Portable Ops knows immediately that MGS2 is not the worst games in the series, at least mechanically.

I absolutely love MGS2, its such a mindfuck. It's great watching Drew play through it and picking up on stuff that foreshadows those later twists. Also, the mechanics and attention to detail were pretty mindblowing at the time and I'd say impressive even to this day.

100% this. I imagine Drew will have a harder time with MGS 3, if anything. Similar controls but additional systems to get used to as well.

This just makes me feel that MGS1 is just a crazy lightning-in-a-bottle synthesis between 1980s American action films and quintessential anime self-serious flamboyance. Does that make any sense to anybody else?

Does he mean New York City of Vancouver Island? I'm from Vancouver and went to the Island a lot to visit my girlfriend at UVIC, and I'm pretty sure Nanaimo is the "Whatever the worst city in New Jersey is" of Vancouver Island.

That makes sense, because that's exactly what it is.

@lukeweizer: Nanaimo isn't that bad. If Victoria is the NYC of the Island, Nanaimo would be like Boston. And Port Alberni (my home town) would be the shitty NJ town. Avoid at all costs.

Totally. I think that Dan has made me realize that since this Metal Gear Scanlon. From Snake in the first Metal Gear just being Kyle Reese from Terminator and the bad ass way he talks about being a soldier but then the over the top characters like Vulcan Raven or Ocelot. Now it feels like its an Anime purely and dropped the influence of those 80s action movies.

Not to mention that the first half of the game is quite literally navigating a jungle maze with hard to remember names.

@slab64: Yeah, I have played it and I hated it. Then I played it again and I loved it and now it's my favorite character action game. Long story. Or maybe it isn't...

Anyway, my wording was crap for what I was trying to convey, but I meant that the paths both characters took to reach their respective destinations were very different, as were the destinations themselves. Sure, by MGR's end, Raiden is "as badass" as Snake. But Snake has a composed, almost calm, emotional-wall personality to deliver his badassery and seems despondent at the idea of killing, despite his battle-filled life; meanwhile we have Raiden who is practically licking his lips at the prospect of murder by MGR's halfway point, his emotions are BOILING to the surface. So, although you could describe both characters as "people who fight and even murder to achieve their goals", the execution between them couldn't be more different. Of course, Snake is a well written character, so one could probably provide evidence that he likes the feel of battle and violence as much as Raiden (does he really "enjoy all the killing" as Liquid claims?). These are just my interpretations.

Oh, and thanks a lot!

I was one of the people that played MGS4 before the rest of the series. In fact, it was the process of watching the ending of MGS4 that got me interested in MGS4. So I initially came to the series will all sorts of questions. I enjoyed MGS4 for the effort it put into being a movie, but many of the questions I had still weren't answered. I eventually played through the whole series, which made playing through MGS4 again like a sequence of "Oh, that's what it meant!" moments.

@sunbrozak: That sounds like a fascinating way to get exposed to MGS. I'd like to see an in-depth write-up of your experiences!

MGS2 was the only game I owned in the 8th grade. I beat it about fifteen times in that schoolyear and maybe more than thirty times by now. I had only played Twin Snakes before. Obviously, MGS2 was a very formative game for me. I've definitely spent a large part of my life thinking about that game. I have one of the tie-in comic books, given to me by a close highschopl friend a year or two before he passed away from cancer. I got a premium account just for Metal Gear Scanlon.

I think MGS3 will be easier, especially if they play the Subsistence edition. I think it fits Drews playstyle more and the binoculars trivialize most of that game.

I think I'm in the weirdest camp of the Metal Gear(?!) fandom, in that 3 and 4 are my favourites. I played a bit of 1 when it first came out, and appreciated it, but never owned it, and never finished it. I thought there was a lot of neat stuff going on, but it never grabbed me. Then I never had a PS2, so I didn't get around to playing 2 until the XBOX version came out, and I bought a cheap copy years after the fact. I never even finished the Tanker level.

In 2012, I got a PS3, and decided I was going to play some classic games that I had missed during my time with MS' boxes. I don't know why MGS3 was one of the first games I got for the console, but it was, and I very much enjoyed it. It is still my favourite in the series, moreso than Ground Zeroes. All the crazy stuff you could do, the open ended way to treat enemies, the ability to kill off a boss long before you ever fight him (still never actually fought The End, though I hear it's probably the best boss fight in the game. My loss I guess) all added up to one of the most unique gaming experiences I've ever played. Plus it was like playing an anime version of a 60's Bond movie, which was so nuts and fun.

I followed up 3 by playing 4 very shortly afterwards, and I really appreciated how cinematic the game was, and just how damn epically everything wrapped up. It could have been better, and there were absolutely frustrating parts, but it still has some of my favourite moments in gaming history, namely the awesome fight against Ocelot.. One of the best trips through videogame history.

I loved watching Drew go through MGS2, but god damn, I never want to play that game. And also, every time I watch gameplay footage of The Phantom Pain, I get so damn excited to play that game. Though I will definitely be putting it on a low difficulty, because GOD DAMN I am bad at these games.