Where is the skill in this game?

#1 Posted by Truant19 (197 posts) -

I will try not to come across as a troll, though I will admit right off the bat I do have some hatred for this game.
 
I bought this game day 1, and really enjoyed my self through the single player, and a few hours of the multiplayer. But it blows my mind that still half my friends list is full of people who continue to play this game. I tried to hop on again, after watching some black ops trailers and getting a bit hyped, but I find my self again getting more and more pissed off at the game.
 
Most of the friends, and the majority of people play team death match almost exclusively, so I hop into a game with some friends, and after a few matches quit. I cannot figure out what I am supposed to work on.
 
The "twitch" aspect of the game seems almost null to me, as almost every gun will kill someone from a mile away with 2 shots to any part of the body. Now, I guess that's realistic, but I am used to more combat type shooters where the player with faster reactions and better head shots would win a duel (tf2, cs, socom etc..). In MW2, it feels like if you see someone first, you will kill them, no matter the skill of the opponent (especially with the autoaim).
 
Which I guess I am ok with, instead of the skill being who has better aim or faster reactions, the skill must be in positioning and team work right? Well there is my second problem with the game. The spawning is horrendous! You can try to position your self correctly, but to what point, as the team can really just about spawn any where near you. If you clear out a few rooms of a building, in most games you get the sense of safety, as you know no one is behind you. Well not in MW as the enemy and your own team seems to spawn everywhere. I have watched kill cams of people spawning, run through a door and shoot me.
 
The teamwork in this game is zero aswell. I play on ps3, but atleast 95% of people dont have mics, and the part that do, spam nonsensical sentences covered up but static and being cutoff every 2 seconds.
 
So please explain to me, if you are still playing this game, what is the draw for you? Obvously I am TERRIBLE at the game, and getting frusterated with it, but I really want to like it because all my friends play it, and I want to like black ops.

#2 Edited by raiz265 (2242 posts) -

get a pc and play cod4 if you want cod. 
 
 
mw2 just seems way too dumb and spammy to me, with all this random killstreak crap dropping all over the map and shit like death streaks (lol)

#3 Posted by RsistncE (4496 posts) -

There's skill in everything. The thing is that the barrier to entry for MW2 is much lower than for other shooters such as TF2 or Counter Strike. That doesn't mean there isn't a super high level of play, there is, it's just that there are a lot more people playing at a lower tier because the game is so accessible.

#4 Edited by Lemoncookie01 (1642 posts) -

Heh,you sound like me a few months back when I started playing a lot BC2 and my friends always wanted to play MW2.

#5 Posted by blackbird415 (778 posts) -

Theres certain level memerization aspects to the game. Yes its pretty much garunteed you'll die at some point in the match. There is a twitch factor, but a timing factor too. The combining of different perks to weapons to match your chemistry of play also fits a style. I found I play best with the FAL assault rifle though, I hardly see anyone use it at all because its a semi automatic rifle. There is a certain bit of luck when it comes to respawing and I have personally turned off the game for having been hit with multiple missle and instantly killed multiple times. Ive gotten loads better at it since I started.  
 
For me what keeps me in is the leveling system and the run and gun play. After the whole stop and pop mechanic became popular I grew a distaste for it. I just wanted a good run and gun shooter and thats what it give me 
 
The mic. thing... I hate it too, theres hardly anyone with mics on and the few that do are assholes, but thats xbox live at times.

#6 Edited by Truant19 (197 posts) -

I don't know If I agree with that, I am pretty good at both cs and tf2, and some console shooters as well, but I am terrible at MW2. I just dont understand how I am suppoed to get better as there is no team work, the respawn is so random. It feels like I just need to get lucky and see people before they see me as I run around. Some games I go 25-5, and others 5-25.

#7 Posted by InfamousBIG (3227 posts) -
@Truant19:
 
HEY, THERE'S A LOT OF SKILL IN NOOB TUBING PEOPLE AND BOOSTING SO YOU CAN GET NUKES! 
 
In all seriousness, though, there are definitely problems with the game; but for the most part, it is a fairly well balanced game that does require a certain level of skill.  While by no means the best player, I am not bad at all (I have a 33 win streak in free for all).  I don't play anymore, and never got past first prestige.  But, I would say that the game is good. 
 
Some tips: for me, my biggest secret is that I go 99% by sound.  Once you start really getting into the game, and knowing all the sounds, you can judge where everybody is by sound.  You can always judge if someone is sneaking up behind you, if someone's upstairs from you, just by footsteps.  
 
The second thing is, as you pointed out, people spawn willy-nilly.  So, that makes it so that you always have to watch your back.  I  never run for more than about 3 or 4 seconds without looking all around me, to make sure that no one sees me/shoots me.   
 
Go ahead and pick whatever class works for you, but, since you say you are terrible at the game, and I'm giving out tips, I'll tell you what class I use.  Lightweight Pro, Commando Pro, and Marathon Pro (I think...I believe that is the third one but I forget).  Use a UMP45 for primary, Magnum + Tac Knife for secondary.  For UMP45 attachments, use rapid fire until you unlock FMJ.  Use the iron sight, it's the best. Killstreaks, I use Care Package, Harrier, and Pave Low. 
 
Well, there's my two bits.  Don't give up on the game, dude, give it a shot.  That class will be good and get you some kills, definitely.  Once you get to know the game like the back of your hand, it becomes beastly fun.
#8 Posted by audiosnag (1582 posts) -

There's definitely skill involved in the game but it's overshadowed by some poor design choices, bugs and ass-hat cheaters. I went from loving the hell out of that game to not wanting to play it anymore.

#9 Posted by Jadeskye (4368 posts) -
@Truant19: I played MW2 solidly for about 8 months. There is a sublime level of skill required for pro antics in that game. when you can go 52 and 0 you can't chalk that up to luck. 
 
Long and short of it: 
  • Posistioning, You want to know the maps and know where people go so you can cut them off or come in behind them.
  • Flanking, If you can come at a dude from the side or behind, he's dead. You don't have enough time to react in this game. 
  • Red dot, If you see a red dot on your map, thats a bad dude, don't charge him, instead go around behind or to the side of him. If he's close, wait until he expends his ammo. catch him reloading and he's dead.
  • ALWAYS BE MOVING! Don't ever stop moving. Theres very few places that you can truely sit and defend. if you're moving the chances of someone taking you unaware is much lower.
  • Know your weapon, Every gun in the game reacts differently, learn what you love and how to use it. tiny things like how the sights bounce after you fire and how much damage you can do to an arm before someone dies can all help in the long run.
  • Key perks, A lot of perks in this game can make your game easier. Try cold blooded to become invisible to enemy UAVs and a silencer on your weapon to not appear on a mini map when you fire. This can help you flank an entire team silently.
  • Sprinting, Sprinting can save your life or it can end it. When you sprint it takes longer to fire upon stopping. Don't sprint into a room full of guys, you'll be met with your own demise.
 
There much more to it but that should get you started.
#10 Edited by MonetaryDread (2177 posts) -

 I still enjoy the game. I admit though, I don't play much, not even an hour a week. I am casual with my multiplayer shooters, and I find that I can hop into Modern Warfare 2 for twenty minutes or an hour and have fun. I don't need to be in a clan, i don't need to practice heavily, I can just have fun. 
 
Edit: Helps that I am a fan of shooters back in the day and enjoyed the movement found in Unreal, Quake, and Modern Warfare.

#11 Posted by Tebbit (4486 posts) -

You have to not die and shot guy in face with guns what have the bullets. u pres e to nife hem coz u r ultimit soljer 
 
 
 
But seriously, there is no skill involved in actually playing the game, because it is really well designed, streamlined and user-friendly. The playing part is easy and fun.
To get lots of points during matches though, you need to be environmentally aware, cautious and calculating. There's some skill to that.

#12 Posted by punk_beatzUK (29 posts) -

This might sound obvious and very, very silly, but I look at the screen with an eagle eye. I'm not a great player by any means but I usually end up with fewer deaths than kills in every game I play. 
 
I look for the tiniest things such as the edge of someone's arm in a window, the top of someone's head as they're crouched behind something.  I agree hugely with @InfamousBIG too about sounds playing a big role. 
 
Apart from that it's just as the other guys say - looking at the mini-map and getting to know the maps, weapons and perks.

#13 Posted by AhmadMetallic (18954 posts) -

skill is looked down upon in today's AUTO AIM SEXBAWX SHOOTING

#14 Posted by yakov456 (1923 posts) -

I find myself playing WAW more than MW2. at least when I play WAW I get some WW2 personality as I'm getting my ass kicked.

#15 Posted by Grissefar (2830 posts) -

It sounds like you're dying a lot. I liked Domination because it's easiest to predict where the enemies are. TDM is a bit random. Positioning, map awareness, general patience are key aspects. You need to master those. Aiming is secondary and teamwork is non existant.

#16 Posted by commandercup (497 posts) -

Sounds like a post made out of frustration. There is skill in all games and MW2 is no exception. It may not be the same as CS, but you still have to aim faster than the other players and work on positioning and the like.

#17 Posted by natetodamax (19220 posts) -
@InfamousBIG said:
 it is a fairly well balanced game that does require a certain level of skill
Modern Warfare 2 is the farthest thing from balanced.
#18 Posted by SethPhotopoulos (5403 posts) -

There is skill in this game. It's supposed to be how you place yourself in the level and how well you use the environment.

#19 Posted by FirePrince (1767 posts) -

MW2 is very,very fun,but the balance. 
Jesus christ.See,that's why people play it.Every 3-4 matches,the horrible matchmaking system and the terrible balance of everything tips in their scale. 
Kill-streaks after kill-streaks,massive kill-counts,higher-than-average K/D ratios.
The problem is,that in this game,when you are having fun,everybody else is not.
#20 Posted by T00MuchSteeze (157 posts) -
@FirePrince said:
" The problem is,that in this game,when you are having fun,everybody else is not. "
This.  
 
As for me, I completely quit playing it at the end of last semester. Just got too old too fast. Must have been in my second prestige I think.  
Still can't view my online friends without seeing at least 9 -10 people still playing this. 
#21 Posted by Potter9156 (944 posts) -
@jadeskye said:
" Long and short of it: 
  • Posistioning, You want to know the maps and know where people go so you can cut them off or come in behind them.
  • Flanking, If you can come at a dude from the side or behind, he's dead. You don't have enough time to react in this game. 
  • Red dot, If you see a red dot on your map, thats a bad dude, don't charge him, instead go around behind or to the side of him. If he's close, wait until he expends his ammo. catch him reloading and he's dead.
  • ALWAYS BE MOVING! Don't ever stop moving. Theres very few places that you can truely sit and defend. if you're moving the chances of someone taking you unaware is much lower.
  • Know your weapon, Every gun in the game reacts differently, learn what you love and how to use it. tiny things like how the sights bounce after you fire and how much damage you can do to an arm before someone dies can all help in the long run.
  • Key perks, A lot of perks in this game can make your game easier. Try cold blooded to become invisible to enemy UAVs and a silencer on your weapon to not appear on a mini map when you fire. This can help you flank an entire team silently.
  • Sprinting, Sprinting can save your life or it can end it. When you sprint it takes longer to fire upon stopping. Don't sprint into a room full of guys, you'll be met with your own demise.
 
There much more to it but that should get you started.
"
 
This. 
 
To add upon that, I would suggest turning up the volume up on your TV as sound is everything in MW2. Try changing your button layout to tactical. Moves the crouch/prone button from B or O(?) to the right stick. Being able to aim while going to prone is a huge advantage. A good, easy class setup? SCAR with red-dot, some type of missile launcher for taking down killstreaks, Scavenger, Cold-Blooded, Ninja. I use that class when I'm doing bad or want to wreak havoc. Also, try to stay away from Marathon/Lightweight until you're REALLY good. Hard setup to master.
#22 Posted by Krummey (198 posts) -

I disagree that teamwork is non-existent. I've spent the vast majority of my time in this game playing with one friend, and we've learned each other's tendencies and skills and can play off of one another. But that doesn't matter when the other four dudes as fucking clown shoes. Recently however, I met a guy that plays with several other people, and we usually have a six man team. We won 25 straight Sabotage matches the other day, most of the time in fewer than three minutes, because we were coordinated. THAT'S what makes this game unplayable, when you actually come up against a team that DOES play well together.

#23 Posted by Sander (413 posts) -
@Truant19 said:
" Some games I go 25-5, and others 5-25. "
There's your problem right there. For someone who feels he's not good at the game and he goes 25-5, that was mostly luck because going 5-25 demonstrates poor intelligence and inferior experience because many of those deaths will be in the exact same spot repeatedly, taking way too many risks and walking in the killzone. I'm certain that of those 25 deaths, only perhaps 1 or 2 where somebody spawned behind you and killed you. 
If you're running towards where you think the enemy is and find yourself head on in a 1vs1 situation, your best odds are only 50-50 and if you don't have the reflexes, it will be much less than that. 
Even basic sense will tell you that a defensive position is a far more superior tactic. Once you have mastered defensive gameplay, then you can think about playing a more offensive game. 
 
Going 1-4 is much better than going 5-25. Can you control your emotions to not go run out into the open and get killed? If you can't control your emotions, then you need to feel the shame in making your team lose by getting killed so many times. I think that will make you a better player.
#24 Posted by DystopiaX (5361 posts) -

I think that it's there, it's just not as apparent and the skill level needed isn't as high in CoD than in other games.

#25 Posted by InfamousBIG (3227 posts) -
@natetodamax said:
" @InfamousBIG said:
 it is a fairly well balanced game that does require a certain level of skill
Modern Warfare 2 is the farthest thing from balanced. "
I acknowledged in my post that it has problems (believe me, I've played enough MW2 to know that), and I said it is fairly balanced.  Yeah, you can complain about noob tubing and other bullshit stuff, like I did in the joke opening of my post, (and believe me, I've done plenty of complaining about that), but for the most part, it is fairly well balanced.  To be able to have such a variety of play-styles and "classes" be viable--that requires balance.  And you can certainly play MW2 a whole mess of ways.
#26 Posted by Meteora (5787 posts) -

Call of Duty has a very accessible gameplay that many people can just pick up and have fun; that is if they can ignore having negative ratio in the beginning. All you really need to do is run around, find people, aim down the sights and shoot them. And as you keep killing, you rack up perks and other unlockables, which makes it feel as if the newbie was making some actual progress than having to pretty much die endlessly in say Counterstrike. 
 
High tier play is still there; just not nearly as frequent as you'd see. There's plenty of really high tier players. Go and search up Tebjz on YouTube; that guy kicks some serious ass in MW2.

#27 Posted by OneManX (1693 posts) -

There was a time where games were just fucking madness 
 
And I love fucking madness 
 
I love MW2.

#28 Posted by Djeffers03 (2545 posts) -

There is a HUGE amount of skill required in sitting still at the end of a hallway with a SCAR and a noobtube! 
 
But yeah, posted this before and i'll post it again: 

#29 Posted by OmegaPirate (5522 posts) -

whoever can push left on their d-pad first 
or 
whoever can click in the right stick fastest 
 
Pretty much the game

#30 Edited by Potter9156 (944 posts) -
@Djeffers03 said:

" There is a HUGE amount of skill required in sitting still at the end of a hallway with a SCAR and a noobtube! 
 
But yeah, posted this before and i'll post it again: 

"
 
 
I can understand why people wouldn't like COD, but to go as far as to break the disc? Asinine, pathetic, sad, senseless and just naive. There just aren't enough words to describe your stupidity. An intelligent person would trade the game for a game they like, or give it to friend. But you, a moronic, puerile mook breaks it. Would you kindly go fuck yourself.
#31 Posted by Djeffers03 (2545 posts) -
@Potter9156 said:
" @Djeffers03 said:

" There is a HUGE amount of skill required in sitting still at the end of a hallway with a SCAR and a noobtube! 
 
But yeah, posted this before and i'll post it again: 

"
  I can understand why people wouldn't like COD, but to go as far as to break the disc? Asinine, pathetic, sad, senseless and just naive. There just aren't enough words to describe your stupidity. An intelligent person would trade the game for a game they like, or give it to friend. But you, a moronic, puerile mook breaks it. Would you kindly go fuck yourself. "
I may be asinine, pathetic, senseless, naive, stupid, moronic, puerile and able to insert a penis into my own rectum but Im certainly not sad, in fact after freeing myself from that shit I feel the complete opposite. If I didn't snap it I wouldn't have been able to bring myself to trade it in and I never would have stopped playing it. With around 12 days played I was pretty addicted to it even though, and this is no exaggeration, I hated it for about 10 of those if I added up the total amount of time I was in a rage. This may sound over dramatic but I seriously think I was getting a high blood pressure because of that game. 
 
Cheerey-oh now.
#32 Posted by kenya24 (235 posts) -

 I've played (and continue to play) a lot of MW2 on Xbox live. There's plenty of skill to be had in the game. PC guys (I play plenty of PC games too, for the record) like to sh!t on console shooters and talk about mouse accuracy being skill. That is one skill, one of many. It's the same skill used to click icons on the desktop etc. It's not all that different. Some people are better at it than others.

But as some other have said, the skill in playing MW2 online (when nearly everyone can get some kills with "blah blah blah autoaiming" and "blah blah blah weapons") is in thinking tactically. True, team play is limited in MW2, but that doesn't mean you can't be tactical and be strategic. Sound in MW2 is huge, so huge. Play in 5.1 and try playing quiet so you learn how to use sound. When you do, it'll be way more fun and you'll do better.

Someone else said knowing environment etc... Absolutely correct. The non-teamwork tactical aspect is knowing maps, knowing how people are playing, knowing where you team is, getting a feel for how the teams are playing in general, and playing a style that will be successful given the game you're in. Adaptability in MW2 is paramount. Most people who struggle play one way and one way only. If run and gun isn't working, play stealthy. If that doesn't work, try sniping. Play with different weapons. If you're having a bad day, load up an RPD with grip and FMJ and you have an all purpose weapon.

Other games modes are good to try also. I find when TDM is no good (bad games, people, luck, whatever), I like to go play a free for all and change my style completely. Know that the spawn system is different in free for all (they'll spawn right around a corner once you kill them). You'll soon learn there's plenty of strategy involved.  
 
Learn what people do, know that they're trying to do the same, stay unpredictable.     

#33 Edited by 234r2we232 (3181 posts) -
@Djeffers03 said:

" @Potter9156 said:

" @Djeffers03 said:

" There is a HUGE amount of skill required in sitting still at the end of a hallway with a SCAR and a noobtube! 
 
But yeah, posted this before and i'll post it again: 

"
  I can understand why people wouldn't like COD, but to go as far as to break the disc? Asinine, pathetic, sad, senseless and just naive. There just aren't enough words to describe your stupidity. An intelligent person would trade the game for a game they like, or give it to friend. But you, a moronic, puerile mook breaks it. Would you kindly go fuck yourself. "
I may be asinine, pathetic, senseless, naive, stupid, moronic, puerile and able to insert a penis into my own rectum but Im certainly not sad, in fact after freeing myself from that shit I feel the complete opposite. If I didn't snap it I wouldn't have been able to bring myself to trade it in and I never would have stopped playing it. With around 12 days played I was pretty addicted to it even though, and this is no exaggeration, I hated it for about 10 of those if I added up the total amount of time I was in a rage. This may sound over dramatic but I seriously think I was getting a high blood pressure because of that game.  Cheerey-oh now. "
Coming from a guy who broke a $60 game just so he could post pictures of it to troll with on the Interwebs... No? Really?
#34 Posted by Djeffers03 (2545 posts) -
@sofacitysweetheart: Rephrase please, I do not understand.
#35 Edited by 234r2we232 (3181 posts) -
@Djeffers03: I bold'd your text and replied specifically to that.
#36 Posted by ShockD (2421 posts) -

No skill really. I played it yesterday for first time (God ask me why). Full of noobtube campers, who if, occasionally, get out of their foxholes, get owned. Then to be more unfair, the game rewards me with AGM missiles to own them even more and make them camp more. Seriously, if you have a PC, get CS Source. This is an Xbox360 game.

#37 Posted by valrog (3648 posts) -
@Truant19 said:
" So please explain to me, if you are still playing this game, what is the draw for you? "
The campaign.

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