Ermac Needs to be removed

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#1 Posted by Beaudacious (927 posts) -

Honestly am just tired of either having "pros" doing 60% combos with ermac if you even do anything other then block, or the scrub running and spamming grab. He ruins the pace of every fight, who's idea was it to have  a character that had control over the entire screen? Even if you don't make a mistake, his grab dominates every other animation, and boom there goes 60% of your life with a piss easy combo.  This game is starting to wear thin on me, either people just spam one special, or wait for one opening and spam one combo over and over.

#2 Posted by Lunar_Aura (2779 posts) -

People need to give this game time to simmer down and that includes Netherealm.

#3 Posted by TechHits (1377 posts) -

He doesn't need to be removed, however you do need to learn how to deal with him. 

#4 Posted by Beaudacious (927 posts) -
@TechHits: Oh tell me wise one, how do you counter animation priority?
#5 Posted by TechHits (1377 posts) -
@Beaudacious:  I donno, block then teleport? No need to be rude.
#6 Posted by LackLuster (713 posts) -

Oh rage threads... Coming from an ermac player there are ways to beat him you just need to sit down and figure it out maybe play as him your self to figure it out.

#7 Posted by Sauson (561 posts) -

Learn the match up with your character.

#8 Posted by NinjaHunter (972 posts) -

Which grab are you talking about? The lift or the push? Well I'm not sure it matters because he can be hit out of both. Just don't spam combos or random moves and you'll do better. If that's what you're doing cause I haven't played you.

#9 Posted by Rhaknar (5939 posts) -

from the little ive followed of MK tournamentes, its kung lao thats raping it up, not ermac so...

#10 Posted by thehexeditor (1404 posts) -

Game's terrible for vs. stranger online type shit  due to balance and all that
 
It's more of a play with friends thing. Accept it and move on

#11 Posted by Khadyn (228 posts) -
@Rhaknar said:
from the little ive followed of MK tournamentes, its kung lao thats raping it up, not ermac so...
Gonna be interesting how long he stays at the top since his damage is being lowered and some are jumping the Raiden bandwagon with his teleport ability or proving Shang Tsung is not the suck if you know how to play him correctly. Back to OP, I agree with the posts here and if there is a character I can't stand and (IMO) the most cheesy/turtling toon its Noob. Not a lie, I go get something to drink or eat when someone high level picks him during a tourney...
#12 Posted by dudeglove (7770 posts) -

So is Ermac the Ryu/Sagat of MK then?

#13 Posted by Bestostero (2758 posts) -
@Rhaknar said:
from the little ive followed of MK tournamentes, its kung lao thats raping it up, not ermac so...
Ermac is right up in there too, along with Raiden. Suprised Stryker isn't up in there as well, everyone keep saying the hat is what makes all the difference and he has a hat too lol
#14 Posted by Beaudacious (927 posts) -
@Khadyn: Shang Tsung is a really good character as long as you have 1 bar of ex and repeat the magic combo over and over. I think it hits for around 60% as well if all balls hit. 
@Rhaknar:  Its Kung Lao, Ermac, Cyrax

 
From reading this thread i don't think many people here have played against really good Ermacs, he takes advantage of the time it takes your punch/kick to travel(at sweep distance) to grab you instantaneously(especially with a stick). If the player can dodge 1 hit, you've just lost 60% life bar. And yes i can turtle like so many do, but i want to actually play this game and not hump the ground for 10mins.
#15 Posted by ryanwho (12082 posts) -

You should just mod the game to play "fair" like those weirdos who modded Super Smash Bros Melee rules into Brawl.

#16 Posted by Bestostero (2758 posts) -
@Beaudacious: Raiden too, he has a hat!
#17 Posted by TechHits (1377 posts) -
@Beaudacious:  sounds like maybe you shouldn't play online. 
#18 Posted by blueduck (964 posts) -

Use Breakers.

#19 Posted by Khadyn (228 posts) -

@blueduck said:

Use Breakers.

Agree..people think X-ray is important, while it can be somewhat useful if you want a fast ender for a round but majority of the time its blocked...Breakers is pretty much the must have for any match sets to prevent getting blown up and looking like a scrub.

#20 Posted by GoofyGoober (937 posts) -

Shit just remove all the characters from the game cause people have problems. It seems like no matter what the game, if there is an online portion, people will find the time to bitch and moan about a weapon, character, etc, etc. Do people take the time to learn and adapt anymore, or do we all just rage on the closest internet forum we can type into the address bar?

#21 Posted by NovaDTH (155 posts) -

If Ermac should be removed so should Kung, Raiden, Cage, Nightwolf, Kano, Sub. 
 
Just get rid of all the high tier characters and the game will be balanced!

#22 Posted by damswedon (3185 posts) -

@NovaDTH said:

Just get rid of all the high tier characters and the game will be balanced!

You;re not going far enough. Get rid of all characters and the game will be balanced as hell.

#23 Posted by Gabriel (4061 posts) -

Play as Raiden.

#24 Posted by TheHT (11155 posts) -
@damswedon said:

@NovaDTH said:

Just get rid of all the high tier characters and the game will be balanced!

You;re not going far enough. Get rid of all characters and the game will be balanced as hell.

Now you're just being silly. Just have one character for everyone to play and master. That way anything your opponent can do, you can do! Uncomplainable!
#25 Edited by Slaker117 (4838 posts) -
@TheHT said:

@damswedon said:

@NovaDTH said:

Just get rid of all the high tier characters and the game will be balanced!

You;re not going far enough. Get rid of all characters and the game will be balanced as hell.

Now you're just being silly. Just have one character for everyone to play and master. That way anything your opponent can do, you can do! Uncomplainable!
Are you kidding?! The person on the left has such a huge advantage. They need to patch it so both players face the same direction.
#26 Posted by Rafaelfc (1333 posts) -

It's a sad reality that to become good at fighting games you have to sacrifice fun for winning...  
but hey, if you want fun just invite some scrub friends over and make your own tournaments, it's the best way, really

#27 Posted by Gabriel (4061 posts) -

@Slaker117 said:

@TheHT said:
@damswedon said:

@NovaDTH said:

Just get rid of all the high tier characters and the game will be balanced!

You;re not going far enough. Get rid of all characters and the game will be balanced as hell.

Now you're just being silly. Just have one character for everyone to play and master. That way anything your opponent can do, you can do! Uncomplainable!
Are you kidding?! The person of the left has such a huge advantage. They need to patch it so both players face the same direction.

Hell why have combos and special moves when you could just have QTE's, Kratos was a step in the right direction.

#28 Posted by imsh_pl (3295 posts) -
@Beaudacious

Honestly am just tired of either having "pros" doing 60% combos with ermac if you even do anything other then block, or the scrub running and spamming grab. 


 I'd like to actually see a 60% Ermac combo without the use of an X ray please.
Also: an attempted grab has a long animation and has to be close to your opponent to work. Furthermore you can get out of a grab by pressing triangle or X fast enough. It also doesn't work on crouching opponents who don't block and can be punished by fast attacks.
 
 

He ruins the pace of every fight, who's idea was it to have  a character that had control over the entire screen? Even if you don't make a mistake, his grab dominates every other animation, and boom there goes 60% of your life with a piss easy combo. 


 
His lift/grab doesn't have that much of a range, and he has very few possibilities of getting to you if you're on the other half of the screen - he can either spam projectiles, use an incredibly slow stomp or teleport, which is easily blockable and punishable.
 

 This game is starting to wear thin on me, either people just spam one special, or wait for one opening and spam one combo over and over.

NEWSFLASH
 
Taking advantage of a situation and waiting for your opponent's mistake so you can punish him with a combo are both crucial aspects of the fighting game genre.
 
 
To be frank it seems to me like you're just bitter, I play against a good Ermac player for an hour to a few a day (my brother and I play split screen a helluva lot) and he is in no way unbeatable.
#29 Posted by Slaker117 (4838 posts) -
@Gabriel: MK9 post-patch: Eveyone plays as Kratos, press X first to win.
#30 Posted by Origina1Penguin (3501 posts) -

@Slaker117 said:

Are you kidding?! The person on the left has such a huge advantage. They need to patch it so both players face the same direction.

Easy fix. Mirror player 2's screen and controls. Still boned if you're playing local though.

On topic, I also have trouble against Ermac. I'm not very good though so I can't say how far-reaching the problem is. I just play really aggressively and hope for the best.

#31 Posted by Beaudacious (927 posts) -
@Khadyn: Breaker is 2 ex, so good luck spamming that as easily as ermac's combo's when his grab nullifies your current move.
@GoofyGoober: Just because the developers made it doesn't make it fair, the point of balance is so that i won't have to fight 20 ermac's in a row. Sure the pro that's been balancing games at netherrealms can handle ermac, but not everyone plays in tourney's. Most bitching in online games is due to the fact that to adapt means to join the club and repeat the very behavior. It turns games into monotone spam fests. Whats the point of having a roster when everyone should jsut be ermac right? Honestly i don't understand what i expected after the crap that Street fighter has been online.

 I like how everyone says, just block, use a breaker, adapt like stating simple answers makes them correct. All while taking about animation mechanics prioritizing ermac's moves to which all those suggestion are quite silly. 
 
@xhavoc86:  I bet its the hat that lets him torpedo spam like that, its the only explanation!
#32 Posted by imsh_pl (3295 posts) -
@Gabriel said:

@Slaker117 said:

@TheHT said:
@damswedon said:

@NovaDTH said:

Just get rid of all the high tier characters and the game will be balanced!

You;re not going far enough. Get rid of all characters and the game will be balanced as hell.

Now you're just being silly. Just have one character for everyone to play and master. That way anything your opponent can do, you can do! Uncomplainable!
Are you kidding?! The person of the left has such a huge advantage. They need to patch it so both players face the same direction.

Hell why have combos and special moves when you could just have QTE's, Kratos was a step in the right direction.

But QTEs are so difficult... they should just determine the winner based on the amount the players paid for a special subscription service. That way we can ensure that everyone is getting their money's worth.
#33 Posted by NinjaHunter (972 posts) -

@Beaudacious: I'm an Ermac player and he can be hit out of the lift. Maybe I'm just bad at timing wake up specials but he can't really do anything once you knock him down. It sounds like you don't actually want to play the game but want to just mash buttons. Don't just mash random combos you WILL get lifted. There's enough time in between combos to lift you if you try to follow up. If he blocks you're first couple of attacks just end the combo prematurely and/or block. You should have enough time to punish him if he attempts a lift. Unless there's lag but that usually messes everybody up. And of course whiffing moves in front of him is a bad idea.

#34 Posted by JazGalaxy (1576 posts) -

I agree with you 100 percent  rafaelfc, and I've been thinking about that a lot recently. 
 
I have a roomate who plays SCII all the time and is really good at it. To the point of making money. But the way he talks about the game, it sounds absolutely no fun to me. But then, he would say that winnign is fun. How you get there is irrelevant. 
 
To me, I care more about the spirit of the game than I do the meta-tactics it takes to get tehre. 
 
That's why I'll never be truly great at anything...
#35 Posted by MetalMoog (908 posts) -

@TechHits said:

He doesn't need to be removed, however you do need to learn how to deal with him.

LOL. This is mean and funny at the same time.

#36 Posted by dbz1995 (4790 posts) -

I play a guy called xStingy who plays the best Ermac I've seen on MK online. Rushes down, with some good combos and mix-ups. From what I've played against him, you're an idiot if you jump around all over the place, since those gravity grabs hurt. Blockdash, rush him down before he gets the opportunity. And watch that wake-up. Ermac is very good at being aggressive from pretty much any place on the stage-he isn't anywhere near as good at taking it.
 You're blocking way too much if he's grabbing you-what character(s) are you playing anyway? Just get close by blockdashing (once you block enough of the invisible grabs he'll stop) and get your hits in. Teleport in if you can, but there's no rush. Get in, no matter how long it takes, and then don't stop smashing him round the face.
 Also, without Enhanced, I don't think Ermac can do more than 50% damage.
 
RushRushRush!

#37 Posted by imsh_pl (3295 posts) -
@Origina1Penguin said:

@Slaker117 said:

Are you kidding?! The person on the left has such a huge advantage. They need to patch it so both players face the same direction.

Easy fix. Mirror player 2's screen and controls. Still boned if you're playing local though.

Easy fix as well. Just make player 2's controls reversed so that he and his opponent have to input the same directional command even when on the opposite sides of the screen.
#38 Posted by Origina1Penguin (3501 posts) -

@imsh_pl: I think that would hurt my brain somehow.

#39 Posted by Khadyn (228 posts) -

@GoofyGoober said:

Shit just remove all the characters from the game cause people have problems. It seems like no matter what the game, if there is an online portion, people will find the time to bitch and moan about a weapon, character, etc, etc. Do people take the time to learn and adapt anymore, or do we all just rage on the closest internet forum we can type into the address bar?

Meh..this is nothing..wait til SSFIV AE is released..THEN you will see the bitchfest with the Yun/Yang domination (supposedly overpowered / broken characters so far)...

#40 Posted by Buttenator (188 posts) -

@Beaudacious said:

Honestly am just tired of either having "pros" doing 60% combos with ermac if you even do anything other then block, or the scrub running and spamming grab. He ruins the pace of every fight, who's idea was it to have a character that had control over the entire screen? Even if you don't make a mistake, his grab dominates every other animation, and boom there goes 60% of your life with a piss easy combo. This game is starting to wear thin on me, either people just spam one special, or wait for one opening and spam one combo over and over.

Oh no, your opponents aren't playing the way you want them to. You complain about something being overpowered when really you're just upset that no one will go easy on a weak player. Think about it, assuming the one combo people are spamming against you is Ermac's most damaging combo, then they would be stupid NOT to do it.

Anyways, both of his telekinetic grab attacks are punishable on block and can be interrupted by pokes. You can go through them with any armored move. If you get grabbed you can breaker out. If he's grabbing you out of attacks then maybe you should try something that comes out faster or try being less predictable.

Oh, and Dhalsim has been controlling the entire screen since 1991.

#41 Posted by Ares42 (2625 posts) -

Hmm, I'm probably wrong, but I'm curious to see this 60% combo that Ermac can pull out over and over easily. Seem to remember some pretty well-known fighting guy playing Ermac at UFGT and his go-to combo was like 41%, but dropped down really low if he missed a hit or two in the beginning of it. A quick search on youtube and the only non-X-ray combo that goes that high is a corner combo that uses 2 bars.

#42 Posted by ThePhenomenal1 (467 posts) -

rub a dub dub... scrubs in a tub

how bout we make it a rule that we all play sheeva? that should be fair, right?

#43 Posted by Nurve (122 posts) -

Lol at this thread.

#44 Posted by ElBarto (272 posts) -

If you don't know how to punish Ermac, stop playing.

#45 Posted by Xolare (1280 posts) -

If this is the mindset your bring into online gaming then I have some bad news for you.

#46 Posted by Demoskinos (14778 posts) -

Being an Ermac player myself I gotta say the best thing to do against Ermac is  get in his face and DON'T LET UP.   If you give Ermac any breathing room he can setup a nice defensive barrier with his  force grab and chip away at you. 
 
Also, once you get close use cross ups constantly.  Using cross ups makes Ermac's lift at close range effing useless.   And ALWAY ALWAYS  expect a force grab on wakeup.     And never jump in on a Ermac player either. 
 
There are ways around Ermac  but he is a defensive character by nature so you should expect most Ermac players to try to combat you at mid to full screen because that is obviously where he has the most advantage. 
 
So either... get good or bitch your choice.  There are ways around him.    

#47 Posted by SethPhotopoulos (5230 posts) -

Insert picture of baby crying here and then say that this thread appears for every fighting game and that the real problem is the player losing because they haven't learned to deal with the opponent and not the actual character being fought against.  So use more skill.

#48 Edited by TaccyP (307 posts) -

A good Ermac will always want to keep you out, that's just the nature of the character. Calling Ermac cheap is like calling Sagat or Ryu cheap. Those characters aren't cheap, but they certainly can seem grossly overpowered to bad players who mindlessly rush in. To get close to Ermac, cancel your dashes with blocks to close the gap while avoiding the force push and space your jumps out so that he can't anti air you. Try to keep your jumps to a minimum, however. Once you're in close, Ermac is trash. Most of his blocks strings are slow and he doesnt have a string that starts with a low that leads into big damage. You just have to patiently navigate through Ermac's obstacle course and then once you get in on him, stay in on him. Also, don't be a scrub and get hit with wakeup tele-slams, bait that shit out and punish it.
 
It's always depressing when newcomers to fighting games dub things as "cheap". It's been happening since Street fighter 2 when idiots couldn't figure out how to get past Ryu's fireball/uppercut game. The worst are the players who think the only "fair" type of game is a game where you're both in each other's faces mashing buttons.

#49 Posted by JammyJesus (770 posts) -

Hew man like totaly like man divvnt like worry like man.

#50 Posted by StarvingGamer (8156 posts) -
@Beaudacious Your complaint about his zoning game having higher priority makes no sense to me. In any fighting game there will always be a character with the "best" projectiles. Even in this regard, Ermac is hardly the be-all-end-all. It's true that both his lift and push come out very quickly, but they only reach about half-screen. At full screen he loses hands down to Kabal, Stryker, Kano, Noob, and probably Kung Lao, Kitana and Shang as well. Beyond that numerous characters have teleports and a significantly stronger up-close game that they can play such as Scorpion, Raiden and Cyrax.

What makes Ermac so powerful is the fact that he is the best at controlling the pace of the game at mid-screen. This means that characters with limited movement options like Sonya and Liu Kang have to be extremely patient if they want to find a way inside to mount their offense. Careful dash blocking and resisting the urge to jump-in will go a long way towards exposing an Ermac player.

I'm not suggesting that Ermac is a weak character, he definitely is near the top of the heap, but he is far from imbalanced. In any fighting game there is always going to be the character that is best at X. I'd suggest that rather than sit and complain about how much Ermac dominates the mid-screen, figure out a way to force him to fight on your terms.

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