Bitterly Disappointd

#1 Posted by PeepingTommy (65 posts) -

I am a massive Burnout fan. I also loved Need For Speed Most Wanted. Sadly though, Hot Pursuit hasn't met my expectations. 
 
I can't quite put my finger on the complete reason but it does include the handling which to me feels like you're navigating a boat down a winding channel, whichever car you choose. Also the world is completely baron, with empty roads and shortcuts that seem more of a contrivance than part of the natural environment. And health bars? Very gamey.

#2 Posted by ethanraiden (2 posts) -

Unlucky, this game rocks.

#3 Posted by Grissefar (2842 posts) -

The demo could have told you that. Burnout had awesome sense of speed and tight controls. This, not so much.

#4 Edited by Seppli (10251 posts) -
@PeepingTommy: @Grissefar: 
 
You guys mad? The handling's 'effin perfect. Just get better at it. Go for gold on all events and beat your friends. If they're worth their salt, you'll eventually have to figure out how it's done. Perfect drifting, perfect sense of speed and a nice weighty handling giving all them impacts some force.
 
Don't forget. You'll go from around 200 km/h to up to 400 km/h. Add some Turbo to that and you'll brains will be scattered at the backwall of your room from the speed your going at.
 
That's not saying the lower tiers ain't fun. I'm regularly going back cleaning up my speedwall, when somebody actually beats one of my times.
#5 Posted by Three0neFive (2293 posts) -

Wait.  So you're complainging about a Need For Speed game being too "gamey"? LOL.
 
Oh wait, you're serious. Let me laugh even harder.

#6 Posted by salad10203 (654 posts) -

Based on the quick look, this game is EA trash.

#7 Posted by Mikewrestler5 (602 posts) -

It's an overrated game. Easily just as bad as NFS Undercover.

#8 Posted by Seppli (10251 posts) -

I'm frequently astonished by people asking for driving physics that don't require some mastering. Like completely flat and weightless. Still remember all the whiners who made DICE make the ATVs and Jeeps in BF:BC 2 less squirrely. They had an awesome sense of offroad powerdrifting to them, then the shallow ass gamers came around and were in the fucking majority obviously, asking for a dumbing down of the driving physics. I'll never get that.
 
GTA IV is the perfect example of how driving physics are weighty and fun. At least Rockstar has the balls to withstand the dumbassery of the shallow hordes asking for less simulated physical realism.

#9 Edited by Seppli (10251 posts) -
@salad10203: @Mikewrestler5: 
 
You guys are crazy...
 
Probably didn't even play the game yourselves. It's like the most PURE FUN AND JOY any game has been this year. Yeah, some I love more, but none of them is so free of frustration and conveyes such a pure sense of joy and fun.
 
Your ignorance drives me mad!
#10 Posted by salad10203 (654 posts) -
@Seppli:    Your ignorance drives me mad! 
 
Ditto
#11 Posted by PeepingTommy (65 posts) -

I love the physics in GTA. Weighty is very good. IMO Hot Pursuit isn't about weight, it feels like the car is stuck on a pole twisting left and right while the track rolls on.

#12 Edited by Seppli (10251 posts) -
@salad10203 said:

" @Seppli:    Your ignorance drives me mad!  Ditto "

One of us is wrong obviously.
 
Guess the guy who hates Mass Effect, Battlefield, all EA Sports Games, Deadspace, Dragon Age, Need for Speed and whatnot has to be right. All those games are total trash. *sarcasm*
 
I pity the fool who writes off Mass Effect 3, Dragon Age 2, Battlefield 3, Deadspace 2, Need for Speed : Shift 2 Unleashed, Crysis 2, Bulletstorm, Star Wars : The Old Republic as EA trash. Happy 2011!
#13 Posted by Seppli (10251 posts) -
@PeepingTommy said:
" I love the physics in GTA. Weighty is very good. IMO Hot Pursuit isn't about weight, it feels like the car is stuck on a pole twisting left and right while the track rolls on. "
Play Hood or Street Perspective. It's so much better played that way. Perfect, I say!
#14 Posted by Grissefar (2842 posts) -
@Seppli:  You really like this game. For me, I think I'll look around to see if there are other racing games being released right now.
#15 Edited by Seppli (10251 posts) -
@Grissefar said:

" @Seppli:  You really like this game. For me, I think I'll look around to see if there are other racing games being released right now. "

Every so often when drifting a crazy supercar around a big ass bend or passing through some shortcut or being in the middle of a pile of racers and cops, it's like a light goes on in my soul. A wave of biochemical joy floods my system and I'm fucking happy and content.
 
Today I did some Rapid Deployment Preview Event with a Cop Bugatti Veyron. I ended up doing it like 10 times. All the while hollering 'Heehaw Heehaw Heehaw' like a police siren grinning like a madman. It's just maddeningly fun.
#16 Posted by TheKeyboardDemon (824 posts) -

 Sorry to hear you don't like it. That's sad, I can only encourage you to try it again, give it a bit more time and have a go online to see if you still feel the same after about 2 hours playing.

#17 Posted by reddin (418 posts) -

This game is a great NFS game, but a mediocre Burnout one.

#18 Posted by Mikewrestler5 (602 posts) -
@Seppli: 
 
I don't think we're crazy at all.
 I didn't enjoy the game. In fact, I prefer the old NFS games on the PS1. You know, the ones that didn't have boost. ;)
#19 Posted by ArchScabby (5809 posts) -

How long have you played it?  Because at first I might of agreed with you, but the more I played it the more I liked it, and now I'm almost obsessed with it.

#20 Edited by Chaser324 (6536 posts) -

Woah...a lot of hating going on in here. I don't really want to get involved in any sort of flame war, but I've definitely got to provide some backup to Seppli.
 
Everyone needs to realize that in terms of physics and car handling, this game is very different from Burnout, but that absolutely does not automatically make it bad. I feel like a lot of people are reacting to this game the same way they did to Blur. They're pulled in by the "arcadey" power-up laden appearance and end up being caught off guard by a fairly deep skill-based driving mechanic. All I can really tell those people is just to try to take a step back and view this game outside of all expectations of it as a Criterion game or a NFS game. Take some time to adjust to the physics and car mechanics, try out the multiplayer and social network features, and if after giving it a fair shot you still feel the same way, you're free to continue hating.

Moderator Online
#21 Posted by jkz (4025 posts) -
@Chaser324 said:
" Woah...a lot of hating going on in here. I don't really want to get involved in any sort of flame war, but I've definitely got to provide some backup to Seppli.  Everyone needs to realize that in terms of physics and car handling, this game is very different from Burnout, but that absolutely does not automatically make it bad. I feel like a lot of people are reacting to this game the same way they did to Blur. They are pulled in by the "arcadey" power-up laden appearance and end up being caught off guard by a fairly deep skill-based driving mechanic. All I can really tell those people is to just try to take a step back and view this game outside of all of expectations of it as a Criterion game or a NFS game. Take some time to adjust to the physics and car mechanics, try out the multiplayer and social network features, and if after giving it a fair shot you still feel the same way, feel free to continue hating. "
Echoes my opinion exactly.
#22 Edited by Seppli (10251 posts) -
@Chaser324: 
 
QFT!
 
For me, it was like all the little things, over time, they slowly add up to Hot Pursuit being outstandingly awesome. Most other games, the little things do the opposite. Little things I pick up that piss me off. Great games getting on my nerves over time. With Hot Pursuit it's the other way around. I was underwhelmed by the demo. Kinda 'meh'. I saw potential and said to me, if it gets great reviews, I'll get it day 1. It did and I did.
 
Hot Pursuit grew on me. More than I could ever have imagined. After a couple of hours, the game put me behind the wheel of the McLaren F1 for a preview event. While going for the gold medal, shaving off seconds of my runtime, it kinda all clicked and came together for the first time. Since then, it's only gotten better and better and better and a whole lot fucking faster!!!
 
And here I stand now, proclaiming it to be the Ultimate Arcade Racing game to date.
#23 Posted by Kelswitch (141 posts) -

Online is fantastic, this is easily the best NFS in a long loooong time.

#24 Posted by KimChi4U (368 posts) -

I think the game is pretty good but one thing I am disappointed with is the AI rubber-banding. If you botch a turn during a race (meaning: not getting the right trajectory on a drift), usually 2 or 3 AI cars will zip past you and you'll have to work really hard to catch up. If an AI botches a turn, and you do happen to get into first place, they will be in your rear-view mirror 3 seconds later and looking to pass you. It's almost like you're driving a much slower car compared to the other racers.  It makes me feel like 95% of the race is executing close to perfect driving and the last mile is where something changes and the AI behaves differently
 
I really like the different kinds of races but I feel that the AI in the original Hot Pursuit game was better. There was rubber banding in that one as well, but I feel like you could do more to prevent the AI from overtaking you. The police would also focus more on the lead driver meaning that there was some strategy to your position throughout the race. You could hang back in second or third so that the police would harass the lead drivers, giving you a chance to catch up. If you were ahead of the pack, the police would try to slow you down making it more challenging. In the newest version, I was in a race where I was in last place due to a couple of crashes and the helicopter continued to hound me instead of slowing down the lead cars. There was no way I could catch any of the racers which meant I had to restart the race. 
 
I'm also a little disappointed in race lengths. Some of the cop missions are done in under a minute and many of the race missions are done in under 5 minutes? How can I get a feel for the cars if I'm not spending a lot of time driving? Would doing a race with a few laps mean that I could get used to the tracks and therefore race a little better? I had every track in the old Hot Pursuit games memorized which meant I could focus more on avoiding traffic. In the newest version, I am constantly taking my eyes on the road to see where the next turn is, looking back to discover that I'm about to collide with oncoming traffic. 
 
Weapons in the new game are mostly fun. I really like using the spike strip and the turbo when racing. The EMP seems to be useless in the single player unless used on a cop with one bar of health. I've used the EMP on other racers and have seen no effect their cars. I don't understand how using an EMP on a car while they are drifting around a turn doesn't make them crash into a wall and lose speed. They never help me overtake other racers and seem only to give me bounty points. Jammers are good for preventing you being totally derailed by an EMP but too bad cops have unlimited EMPs and you only have a few jammers. 
 
Personally, I love criterion's racing games but I think that Hot Pursuit wasn't earth-shattering. I love the friend integration stuff but I really think that they've taken a step back from both their previous games and previous Hot Pursuit games (notice that I say Hot Pursuit and not NFS games...some of the NFS games since Hot Pursuit have been garbage). I haven't played any online races yet so maybe that will change my mind. 

#25 Posted by Falconer (1686 posts) -
@PeepingTommy said:
" but it does include the handling which to me feels like you're navigating a boat down a winding channel "
Go get a Lambo with a fat ass, start going 200 down the freeway, and tell me that it doesn't handle similarly as it does in the game. No shit it's going to be hard to turn a car while traveling at high speeds. 
 
To all of you ass holes in general, get the the FUCK out of here. Don't talk shit about game that you've played for less than two hours.
#26 Posted by Falconer (1686 posts) -
@Seppli said:
" And here I stand now, proclaiming it to be the Ultimate Arcade Racing game to date. "
Same here. I'll have to spend a little more time with it (like a month, haha) to come to a final verdict. But, it's definitely up there with Burnout 3 and Paradise for me.
#27 Posted by Diamond (8634 posts) -

It's a very arcadey game in the style of Outrun or Crusin USA.  I don't see how you could call the environments barren, anyways.  There's no dragons or explosions going on but other than that they're beautiful and complex.

#28 Edited by xyzygy (9988 posts) -

 The world is very Baron, you say?

On topic, would you people say that this game is as good as the original Hot Pursuit? Or are they too different to compare?
#29 Posted by Ben99 (1135 posts) -
@Seppli said:
" I'm frequently astonished by people asking for driving physics that don't require some mastering. Like completely flat and weightless. Still remember all the whiners who made DICE make the ATVs and Jeeps in BF:BC 2 less squirrely. They had an awesome sense of offroad powerdrifting to them, then the shallow ass gamers came around and were in the fucking majority obviously, asking for a dumbing down of the driving physics. I'll never get that.  GTA IV is the perfect example of how driving physics are weighty and fun. At least Rockstar has the balls to withstand the dumbassery of the shallow hordes asking for less simulated physical realism. "
"shallow hordes" should always be the target for people who work their ass off to develop a game
#30 Posted by Sin4profit (2931 posts) -

yeah.. no...i think it's great.

#31 Edited by Aus_azn (2224 posts) -
@Seppli said:

" @salad10203 said:

" @Seppli:    Your ignorance drives me mad!  Ditto "

One of us is wrong obviously.
 
Guess the guy who hates Mass Effect, Battlefield, all EA Sports Games, Deadspace, Dragon Age, Need for Speed and whatnot has to be right. All those games are total trash. *sarcasm*  I pity the fool who writes off Mass Effect 3, Dragon Age 2, Battlefield 3, Deadspace 2, Need for Speed : Shift 2 Unleashed, Crysis 2, Bulletstorm, Star Wars : The Old Republic as EA trash. Happy 2011! "
I thought your first list of games are excellent.
 
But credit where credit's due, NFS has not been excellent since Underground 2, and that can be argued to set the limit back to Hot Pursuit 2. I was not amused by the demo, but I may be biased due to its ridiculously limited scope of gameplay.
 
In your second list, NFS:S2 I don't expect to be good since the first was a very mediocre sim as far as I've played, and Star Wars:TOR is looking like a bog standard MMO, not worthy of the name and legacy it carries.  
 
EDIT: As one who loved Burnout, I can't say that I recommend Criterion's latest effort based on the demo. Much less to even buy the game since I'm currently transitioning between consoles.
#32 Posted by GlenTennis (3145 posts) -

I loved Burnout but I won't buy this because I know it won't be like Burnout. I think the Need for Speed games are good, just not my cup of tea.

#33 Posted by MikkaQ (10288 posts) -

I don't know why people complain about how the cars handle. They handle fine, they handle pretty much like how they did in Hot Pursuit 2, except a little more arcadey even, with the added burnout features like boosts and easy drifting.  
 
I think this game is pretty awesome.

#34 Posted by Chaser324 (6536 posts) -
@KimChi4U: 
If I hadn't played Split/Second earlier this year, I might agree with you about the rubber banding, but there is simply no other game I've played in recent memory that has rubber band AI that is anywhere near as bad as what I experienced in Split/Second.
Moderator Online
#35 Edited by Falconer (1686 posts) -
@Aus_azn:  @GlenTennis: Sorry, but you guys are being vague when you say Burnout. Do you mean Paradise? The series as a whole? As someone who played Burnout 3 for probably over 300 hours (suffice it to say, I knew that game like the back of my hand, including memorization of the traffic placement), this game plays VERY similarly. The main difference of course being that the cars have weight to them. Aside from that, this game evokes the same feeling.
#36 Posted by Chaser324 (6536 posts) -
@ShaggyChu: 
I agree. Everything from the map overview screen and event types to the career progression and feel of navigating through traffic is very evocative of Burnout 3.
Moderator Online
#37 Edited by Seppli (10251 posts) -
@Chaser324 said:

" @KimChi4U:  If I hadn't played Split/Second earlier this year, I might agree with you about the rubber banding, but there is simply no other game I've played in recent memory that has rubber band AI that is anywhere near as bad as what I experienced in Split/Second. "

I for one don't understand the complaint about rubberbanding AI. Racing games are most fun, when you're in the middle of it. In Hot Pursuit I'm almost always in the thick of it and that's not just fine, it's how it has to be.
 
Where's the fun in being miles ahead or back with no challenge or no way of ever catching up? Nah - everytime I hear rubberbanding AI as a negative point, I'm not buying it. There's a reason why most racing games do it and not having it is detrimental to the fun.
 
Being in the thick of it, the AI handles itself very well. They behave naturally and believable. They react to what I'm doing and try stuff themselves.They aren't just 'emotionless' zombies driving passively on the ideal racing line.
#38 Posted by Falconer (1686 posts) -
@Seppli said:
" @Chaser324 said:

" @KimChi4U:  If I hadn't played Split/Second earlier this year, I might agree with you about the rubber banding, but there is simply no other game I've played in recent memory that has rubber band AI that is anywhere near as bad as what I experienced in Split/Second. "

I for one don't understand the complaint about rubberbanding AI. Racing games are most fun, when you're in the middle of it. In Hot Pursuit I'm almost always in the thick of it and that's not just fine, it's how it has to be.  Where's the fun in being miles ahead or back with no challenge or no way of ever catching up? Nah - everytime I hear rubberbanding AI as a negative point, I'm not buying it. There's a reason why most racing games do it and not having it is detrimental to the fun. Being in the thick of it, the AI handles itself very well. They behave naturally and believable. They react to what I'm doing and try stuff themselves.They aren't just 'emotionless' zombies driving passively on the ideal racing line. "
 
Agreed. NFS has very reasonable rubber banding. If it didn't have it, it would be like playing Forza against medium difficulty AI. Not that I find that boring, but it definitely would be in this game.
#39 Posted by black_sheep121 (5 posts) -

This is not a burnout game so stop expecting burnout driving mechanics.....

#40 Edited by Chaser324 (6536 posts) -
@Seppli: 
In general, I agree with you...but have you played Split/Second? That is some of the most unfair shit I've ever seen in a racing game.
 
Part of the issue is just the fact that the powerups only benefit you when you're behind. If you're in the lead, your power-ups are useless, and when you inevitably get passed one turn before the finish line, you won't have enough time to try using them to regain the lead. I also have to say that I personally think that the drifting in that game is pretty screwed up too. The AI seems to be able to pull off drifts without losing much or any speed, but it seems damn near impossible for the player to do the same. As a result, you are constantly getting passed in the sharper turns with little recourse for maintaining your lead.
 
I'm all for reasonable rubber banding like what you see in Hot Pursuit. It keeps you in the thick of things and can help keep the excitement level up, but Split/Second...fuck that game.
Moderator Online
#41 Posted by Seppli (10251 posts) -
@Chaser324 said:
" @Seppli:  In general, I agree with you...but have you played Split/Second? That is some of the most unfair shit I've ever seen in a racing game.  Part of the issue is just the fact that the powerups only benefit you when you're behind. If you're in the lead, your power-ups are useless, and when you inevitably get passed one turn before the finish line, you won't have enough time to try using them to regain the lead. I also have to say that I personally think that the drifting in that game is pretty screwed up too. The AI seems to be able to pull off drifts without losing much or any speed, but it seems damn near impossible for the player to do the same. As a result, you are constantly getting passed in the sharper turns with little recourse for maintaining your lead.  I'm all for reasonable rubber banding like what you see in Hot Pursuit. It keeps you in the thick of things and can help keep the excitement level up, but Split/Second...fuck that game. "
Certainly, rubberbanding can be done wrong, but as for the concept itself, I find it to be sound.
#42 Posted by SuperSambo (2865 posts) -

This video game is too video gamey.

#43 Posted by KimChi4U (368 posts) -
@Seppli:   Sorry bud. I think you should reread what I wrote.I never said that the idea of rubber banding was bad. I said that the rubber banding in this game wasn't as good as either the previous burnout games or the previous Hot Pursuit games. I felt in those games that if you raced really well, you could stay ahead of the pack with the AI always close behind you. In this game, every time I take a corner, even if I take the corner well, the AI zooms at least a second and a half out in front of me. Quite often when they get nailed by a spike strip, they stay within rear-view mirror sight of me. When you reverse this situation, I drop to 4th or 5th place. 
 
When you are out-running the police in the old hot pursuit games, the police would focus on the lead cars and give some slack to the cars at the back of the pack. This meant that if you hit a spike strip, you at least had a chance to catch up and get back in the action. In this new hot-pursuit, I got nailed twice in a row by simple bad luck and the police AI wouldn't let up a little some that I could at least try to overtake the cars in the back of the pack. 
 
You'd know exactly what I mean if you played Hot Pursuit 2 on the PS2. That game was well made. I put it into my PS2 after writing my previous post and it immediately felt better than the new installment of Hot Pursuit. The getting through road blocks was more skill than luck and spike strips could be better anticipated. The music fit better with the game (maybe that's a personal taste) and the cars had a real sense of difference in speed. Even the tracks felt interesting enough that I knew which turns were coming up by visual cues in the environment (a Fire truck on the side of the track putting out a fire just as you're heading into the wooded area of the race is an example from HP2 that comes to mind). Maybe these track would feel more comfortable to me if I raced more than one lap at a time on them or spend more than 5 minutes on them.
 
Again, not saying that Criterion's Hot Pursuit is bad, but I feel like the AI could be improved so that the races didn't always feel like I have to play keep up until the last half mile of the race where I then turn on my boost to overtake the leader on the last stretch of the race.
#44 Edited by Seppli (10251 posts) -
@KimChi4U said:

" @Seppli:   Sorry bud. I think you should reread what I wrote.I never said that the idea of rubber banding was bad. I said that the rubber banding in this game wasn't as good as either the previous burnout games or the previous Hot Pursuit games. I felt in those games that if you raced really well, you could stay ahead of the pack with the AI always close behind you. In this game, every time I take a corner, even if I take the corner well, the AI zooms at least a second and a half out in front of me. Quite often when they get nailed by a spike strip, they stay within rear-view mirror sight of me. When you reverse this situation, I drop to 4th or 5th place.  When you are out-running the police in the old hot pursuit games, the police would focus on the lead cars and give some slack to the cars at the back of the pack. This meant that if you hit a spike strip, you at least had a chance to catch up and get back in the action. In this new hot-pursuit, I got nailed twice in a row by simple bad luck and the police AI wouldn't let up a little some that I could at least try to overtake the cars in the back of the pack.  You'd know exactly what I mean if you played Hot Pursuit 2 on the PS2. That game was well made. I put it into my PS2 after writing my previous post and it immediately felt better than the new installment of Hot Pursuit. The getting through road blocks was more skill than luck and spike strips could be better anticipated. The music fit better with the game (maybe that's a personal taste) and the cars had a real sense of difference in speed. Even the tracks felt interesting enough that I knew which turns were coming up by visual cues in the environment (a Fire truck on the side of the track putting out a fire just as you're heading into the wooded area of the race is an example from HP2 that comes to mind). Maybe these track would feel more comfortable to me if I raced more than one lap at a time on them or spend more than 5 minutes on them. Again, not saying that Criterion's Hot Pursuit is bad, but I feel like the AI could be improved so that the races didn't always feel like I have to play keep up until the last half mile of the race where I then turn on my boost to overtake the leader on the last stretch of the race. "

You're just not doing it right. You underestimate how good one can become at this game.
 
Especially when I'm going to take back a best time from a good Autolog competitor and I get to know the track well and how to manage my nitrous the most effciently, I end up well ahead the pack early in the race and stay there all the way through.
 
It's a deep arcade racing game and you just put it off as something lesser than that - your bad!
#45 Posted by KimChi4U (368 posts) -
@Seppli: Maybe I'll have to give it some more time. However, if you get a chance to go back and play some hot pursuit 2 on the PS2 (on the hard difficultly), you'll know what I mean.
#46 Posted by rbanke (191 posts) -

I picked this up solely due to how much its been talked up on the bombcast. I have to say, its fun but only in short doses. I'm finding it to be extremely repetitive. I'm typically into racers but after playing a few events I get the feeling of tedium and turn it off. Playing online with my buddy isnt really that great either as there is no party system so finding a game is a hassle, then once your in a game you get thrown on opposite teams..dunno, its not great. Luckily, I picked it up on the cheap so I suppose its worth what I paid.

This edit will also create new pages on Giant Bomb for:

Beware, you are proposing to add brand new pages to the wiki along with your edits. Make sure this is what you intended. This will likely increase the time it takes for your changes to go live.

Comment and Save

Until you earn 1000 points all your submissions need to be vetted by other Giant Bomb users. This process takes no more than a few hours and we'll send you an email once approved.