Nintendon't Anymore: & Why I'm Sad.

Posted by astrodoggy (145 posts) -

Recently I've put together a home arcade complete with a nice front loader and plenty of emulators. It's funny, with thousands and thousands of games to choose from over multiple platforms the only games I play for more than 5 minutes are the one's developed by Nintendo.

Sewww Geeeeewwdd...

 

See, I am an ex-Nintendo fan boy. I loved Nintendo for years, stuck with them through the Gamecube, but ultimately fell during the current generation. However, all this nostalgic revelry leads me to a terrible conclusion: Nintendo has fallen... hard, and I'm not sure if they'll ever be able to get up. There was a time that many of us can remember when Nintendo developed software set the standard for the rest of the videogame industry. Nintendo's current MO, however, seams content with pushing out rehashed titles onto their consumers, while spending the majority of their time developing hardware peripherals in lieu of actual creativity.

The root cause of this, in my opinion, is Nintendo’s inability to borrow ideas. I’ve been trying to pinpoint when Nintendo first took this unfortunate turn, and I think it began during the N64.

Nintendo refused to embrace CD tech and Sony successfully etched itself a corner of the market in part, by being able to include space hogging features such as full-motion video and large amounts of digital audio in their titles. This trend continued on in the next generation, when Nintendo failed to embrace DVD tech (it’s crazy that even in the current gen, you still can’t play DVDs on a Nintendo). The trend continues in the WII; Nintendo refuses to encourage any type of online community or deep online functionality on the system or in its software.  

Now, the truth is that along the way Nintendo has made some great games (Pikmin, Wind Waker, Super Mario Galaxy), but while these games are great, they are not setting any trends. Also, the limited selection of Nintendo developed games is not enough to carry the platform and refusal to embrace other ideas and technologies has significantly hurt their relationships with other developers.

I wish the Wii failed, because its success is really just enabling Nintendo to make the same mistakes all over again.

Is this thing going to put Nintendo back on track?? (hint: no)

 

Basically, I want to be won back, I want something more from Nintendo as a gamer… but let’s just accept this fact together: it will never happen. Goodnight Nintendo, and Good Luck.

#1 Posted by astrodoggy (145 posts) -

Recently I've put together a home arcade complete with a nice front loader and plenty of emulators. It's funny, with thousands and thousands of games to choose from over multiple platforms the only games I play for more than 5 minutes are the one's developed by Nintendo.

Sewww Geeeeewwdd...

 

See, I am an ex-Nintendo fan boy. I loved Nintendo for years, stuck with them through the Gamecube, but ultimately fell during the current generation. However, all this nostalgic revelry leads me to a terrible conclusion: Nintendo has fallen... hard, and I'm not sure if they'll ever be able to get up. There was a time that many of us can remember when Nintendo developed software set the standard for the rest of the videogame industry. Nintendo's current MO, however, seams content with pushing out rehashed titles onto their consumers, while spending the majority of their time developing hardware peripherals in lieu of actual creativity.

The root cause of this, in my opinion, is Nintendo’s inability to borrow ideas. I’ve been trying to pinpoint when Nintendo first took this unfortunate turn, and I think it began during the N64.

Nintendo refused to embrace CD tech and Sony successfully etched itself a corner of the market in part, by being able to include space hogging features such as full-motion video and large amounts of digital audio in their titles. This trend continued on in the next generation, when Nintendo failed to embrace DVD tech (it’s crazy that even in the current gen, you still can’t play DVDs on a Nintendo). The trend continues in the WII; Nintendo refuses to encourage any type of online community or deep online functionality on the system or in its software.  

Now, the truth is that along the way Nintendo has made some great games (Pikmin, Wind Waker, Super Mario Galaxy), but while these games are great, they are not setting any trends. Also, the limited selection of Nintendo developed games is not enough to carry the platform and refusal to embrace other ideas and technologies has significantly hurt their relationships with other developers.

I wish the Wii failed, because its success is really just enabling Nintendo to make the same mistakes all over again.

Is this thing going to put Nintendo back on track?? (hint: no)

 

Basically, I want to be won back, I want something more from Nintendo as a gamer… but let’s just accept this fact together: it will never happen. Goodnight Nintendo, and Good Luck.

#2 Posted by Kjellm87 (1728 posts) -

Sure, you're allowed to be disappointed about the WII, but I think you're a little extreme.

I mean, Nintendo are one of the most experienced developers and as you said makes games that are good enough for Brad to throw out 5 stars 12 years later. They are also responsible for many things that are standard today ( Joystick, rumble and I don't think motion can be considered a fad anymore.) So most of the time people take ideas FROM Nintendo.

Nintendo was in the tech race up to the Wii where they wanted to try something else since the most powerful console don't always win proven by the PS2.

But enough about that, I think Nintendo did awesome work the Wii games, but porting to Wii was tricky for 3rd party of course, but overall it helped Nintendo become the second richest company in Japan and now Iwata has made statements on what the Wii was lacking.

Wii-U is gonna be somewhat of a beast apparently, I'm excited but kinda worried too. This gen has told me one thing: As games gets more expensive to make, developers becomes greedy.

Finally:

Nintendo make games, their consoles are focused on that. That means more it is more affordable for both costumer and Nintendo.

DVD is possible, but licensing it cost money. Right now it isn't worth it. Wii-U are gonna use their own format which apparently is pretty huge.

Nintendo did consider CD, Playstation was actually made for Nintendo, but one of the parts wanted unreasonable amount of the profit. ( I was told Sony, but don't quote me on that ) So Nintendo changed to Philips. ( Which resulted in classics like Hotel Mario)

People who have tried the table controller says it is comfortable and it makes a more traditional controller for devs who don't have a good use for the motion.

To early to speak about online on Wii-U.

#3 Posted by Enigma777 (6071 posts) -

I'm pretty much in the same boat. I used to be a huge Ninty fan and now I basically hate em. I think it happened halfway during the Gamecube's life cycle when I noticed that the only games they were releasing on a regular basis were the Mario Party crap.

However I think the main reason why Nintendo stuff doesn't appeal to me is that I'm no longer their target demographic. They don't want my money. They want my sister's and my nephew's money and frankly that's fine by me. I've moved on to bigger and better things.

#4 Posted by Claude (16255 posts) -

It seems like you want Nintendo to win you back, but alas, even the future seems unwanted. I loved my Wii way more than my Gamecube and the N64 was a fantastic ride. What happens next is all good for me.

#5 Posted by TooWalrus (13173 posts) -

I'm pretty much in the same boat... I'd be more bummed if there wasn't so much great gaming on the other platforms.

#6 Edited by Kjellm87 (1728 posts) -

Well it is not Nintendo had much choice with the Wii either, if the gaming industry is still young as some of you claim, well then you better wish the more-casual gamers welcome, alternative is slowing down the tech jumping.

#7 Posted by Enigma777 (6071 posts) -

@Claude said:

It seems like you want Nintendo to win you back, but alas, even the future seems unwanted. I loved my Wii way more than my Gamecube and the N64 was a fantastic ride. What happens next is all good for me.

You love your goddamn Wii? Shocker!

:P

#8 Posted by Claude (16255 posts) -

@Enigma777 said:

@Claude said:

It seems like you want Nintendo to win you back, but alas, even the future seems unwanted. I loved my Wii way more than my Gamecube and the N64 was a fantastic ride. What happens next is all good for me.

You loved your goddamn Wii? Shocker!

:P

Fixed

#9 Posted by Enigma777 (6071 posts) -

@Claude said:

@Enigma777 said:

@Claude said:

It seems like you want Nintendo to win you back, but alas, even the future seems unwanted. I loved my Wii way more than my Gamecube and the N64 was a fantastic ride. What happens next is all good for me.

You loved your goddamn Wii? Shocker!

:P

Fixed

What?! Fuck. Next you're gonna tell me that up is down, left is right, water is wine and the Jaguars are champions!

#10 Posted by Claude (16255 posts) -
#11 Posted by Hailinel (24421 posts) -

I've already got multiple devices that play DVDs. The Wii and Wii U don't need that functionality.

#12 Posted by Cold_Wolven (2216 posts) -

I absolutely loved Nintendo even through the Game Cube era and I'm probably in the minority that loved Super Mario Sunshine. However once 2006 hit and I was gaming on the Xbox 360 and a year later on the PS3 my thoughts changed, the Wii for me came 2 years too late and I outgrew Nintendo.

#13 Posted by CookieMonster (2416 posts) -

tits n ass.

#14 Posted by damnboyadvance (4060 posts) -

My problems with the Wii:

  • Too many peripherals that have horrible support
  • No online community
  • No quality downloadable games or channels
  • No HD
  • Bad graphics, compared to their competition
The system is fun, but not enough to satisfy me for more than 30 minutes.
#15 Posted by astrodoggy (145 posts) -
@Hailinel
right, nintendo's so late it doesnt matter anymore 
 
#16 Posted by astrodoggy (145 posts) -
@Kjellm87

You say that Nintendo is focused on making games, but ps3 and xbox software lineup is clearly more robust... Nintendo is confused... I don't think they're sure what they're focused on...
#17 Edited by Kjellm87 (1728 posts) -

@astrodoggy said:

@Kjellm87: You say that Nintendo is focused on making games, but ps3 and xbox software lineup is clearly more robust... Nintendo is confused... I don't think they're sure what they're focused on...

Everyone would be my guess, which would be the most logical unless you sell TVs on the side.

They could go pure casual this gen you know, but they still produced games like Mario Galaxy which is too difficult for casual games. They way I see it, Wii-U is a attempt to reach out to more people that might have not have been pleased with the Wii, which is about as good as it gets in this day and age.

Also I don't expect Wii-U to be as successful, but neither was PS3 to PS2 and they seem to do fine.

#18 Posted by Gamer_152 (14072 posts) -

I don't think Nintendo's recent actions are necessarily indicative of an inability to borrow ideas, it's just that there's no motive for them to do so. Why spend money trying to develop new, risky first-party titles when they can still push ridiculous numbers of units rehashing their old games? Why spend money trying to compete with PSN and Xbox LIVE when it's been proven that they can sell consoles in their millions without many online features? As for the whole disc format issue Nintendo did originally try to borrow the idea of CD technology for their consoles, but changed their mind at the last minute and have been sticking with their own storage formats since, because it gives them more control and because they don't have to pay third parties for their formats this way. I think there may be a lot to be said about how effective and willing Japanese developers in general are when it comes to borrowing ideas, but like it or not Nintendo's games have been able to carry the Wii more than well and even if they hadn't, they've still been turning a profit on the consoles themselves. Nintendo are a company, they're going to do what has the best chance of making them the most money, and right now that's not breaking away from their well-known first-party game formulas.

Moderator
#19 Posted by Hockeymask27 (3683 posts) -

The snes and n64 will always have a place in my heart. Even the gamecube manged to pull out some gems and then.............I don't want to talk about it.

#20 Posted by Tebbit (4461 posts) -

I dunno, man. Seems to me that the Wii has defined the way other companies make games for the last 5 years.

It may not be in the direction we wanted as gamers, but you can't deny that with the Wii they were trailblazing like never before.

And speaking of making hardware peripherals in lieu of actual creativity? Nintendo have always done that. Analogue sticks, rumble, terrible things like that stupid power-glove. The Wii was just another evolution of that.

Their games haven't set trends since Super Mario 64, but since when did setting trends matter? Like you said, Super Mario Galaxy was great, in fact I'd call it one of my favourite games of all time. Tried and trusted mechanics refined to perfection, with gorgeous graphics, beautiful music music. Nothing new, but then, what is?

#21 Posted by astrodoggy (145 posts) -
@Tebbit

Well, Ocarina of Time was after SM64, and Z targeting changed 3rd person action/rpg games forever... but I would say the GTA franchise was the next thing that set huge trends. I would also say that games like Heavy Rain & Littlebigplanet, are extremely unique and new concepts.... the latter setting trends in community connectivity amoung games. 
 
There is plenty of new, just not developed by Nintendo anymore.
#22 Posted by Aus_azn (2224 posts) -

Respect, TC. Nintendo is only a handheld maker in my eyes, and even that's a stretch.
 
I was a Nintendo fanboy from the start till the GCN. I had a PS2 in that time and resold it to get a GCN because I didn't like it. 7G, bought the Wii, played it for about 4 months, bought a 360, haven't touched it since except to play old GCN games on it.

#23 Posted by mariokart64fan (366 posts) -

yall can go cry me a ocean in the corner because you know what , you made every final decision when you bought the ps1 back then and didnt support the nintendo 64 ,

or the nintendo gamecube -if nintendo had the choice between 50 million or 90 million im sure they go with 90 million

yall seam to blame nintendo for everything ill start off with your graphics complaint

1- again ps1 era n64 had the most powerful graphics but guess what ,

the tribe spoke and said to nintendo graphics werent everything again they did so in the ps2 era

2 online- where you going with this wii sold 90 million without it and wii u will have it , more of it , and you still complain? go play a pc

3 -you want downloadable games now? i rather have my hard copies thank you go get a steam account there your problem is solved

4 its either you want graphics or you dont want graphics it seams to me , that you just dont know what you want , im stickin to nintendo whether you like the decisions they make or not , maybe its time for you to look at the previous gens before this one - and look exactly what happened and why nintendo choose the low end graphics route ----- its because the majority did not want it , and its still true to this day -- - wii has sold 90 million ds has sold 150 million vs ps3 360 50 million you as gamers tell the companies what you want and dont by supporting a nother product that is inferier that would be your fault not nintendos

its time you wake up and smell the coffee

you slammed your money on a ps1 back in the day along with 100 million other people who are probably the same people also bashing the wii

so you know what you dont want graphics you dont want online you just want it your way,

im sorry but until you make your own company , -- your not going to have it your way

nintendo is going to succeed , and when it does , ill see ya in 5 yrs when ps4 720 have finally hit there marks cause thats how long itl take from those 600 dollar machines -dont say i didnt warn ya about that either

#24 Posted by SoldierG654342 (1763 posts) -

@astrodoggy said:

The root cause of this, in my opinion, is Nintendo’s inability to borrow ideas.

I would argue a better way to phrase that is "Nintendo's continued reliance on proprietary hardware."

#25 Edited by TheGreatGuero (9130 posts) -

@astrodoggy said:

Nintendo's current MO, however, seams content with pushing out rehashed titles onto their consumers, while spending the majority of their time developing hardware peripherals in lieu of actual creativity.

I think you totally hit the nail on the head right there. That's my biggest problem with the Wii. While Nintendo hurt itself by losing third party support last generation with the Gamecube, and by failing to take advantage of online gameplay, at least the console had great games. Nintendo took daring risks with their biggest franchises. Their fans were outraged when they first revealed the cel-shaded graphical style of Wind Waker, though despite the outcry, it ended up being one of Link's greatest adventures yet. Mario took a break from Mushroom Kingdom and went on vacation with a water gun device. Again, their fans initially whined, but it ended up being a great change of pace for the plumber and a genuinely fun gameplay experience. No 3D Mario game controls better than Sunshine, and if you ask me, the game is far better than the insanely overrated Super Mario Galaxy. There were many doubts when Nintendo decided to make Metroid in 3D. People thought they wouldn't be unable to create an authentic Metroid experience in three dimensions. Turns out they could, and not only that, Metroid Prime ended up being possibly the #1 greatest game of last generation. Nintendo took risks, and it paid off.

We were introduced to unusual looking games like Animal Crossing and Pikmin, and they ended up being great new franchises. Mario Kart: Double Dash turned into a co-op affair, which really added a whole other dimension of stategy to the series. You had great mature games such as Resident Evil 4 and Eternal Darkness. Smash Bros Melee improved upon the original in every conceivable way. F-Zero GX ended up being easily the best game in franchise history, and it's whole interactivity with the arcade version F-Zero AX was pretty freaking rad. Paper Mario 2 was wonderful sequel, and while some sequels failed to live up to expectations (like 1080 Avalanche), for the most part the Gamecube really ruled when it came to games, and that's what it's all about anyway, right?

With the Wii, on the other hand, because of the innovative controller, Nintendo played it safe with all of their games. They started listening to their fanboys that they should have never listened to in the first place. The Wii's games for the most part are largely just more of the same. They stuck to the game's basic formulas that Nintendo already knew worked. It's as if they felt the controls alone were enough creativity that they wouldn't have to be creative with their biggest franchises. Mario Kart Wii took a step backwards towards classic Mario Kart, Twilight Princess was limited by adhering so closely to Zelda traditions (Well, that was originally a GC title, so maybe I shouldn't mention it), Smash Bros Brawl was more of the same but bigger, etc. The console thrived on rehashing older games, or even rereleasing many Gamecube games with motion control support. The problem being that the motion controls were never very accurate or immersive to begin with. It's really unfortunate, I think. Few Nintendo games on the Wii are actually even innovative. Within the first two years or so, Nintendo lost the loyalty of so many of their fans and early Wii adopters. I had gone a stretch of about a year and a half without even playing my Wii, though I'd make no hesitation to use it to replay favorite Gamecube games. While I'm a big Nintendo fan myself, I probably only play my Wii about twice a year at this point and am always reminded why I don't really like it at all. I have my fingers crossed for Skyward Sword. I even finally bought a Motion Plus attachment online about a week ago in preparation for it's release. From what I've been reading, it's not sticking too closely to the Zelda formula, and being my first experience with Motion Plus, I'm really looking forward to it. Finally, a game that will showcase what the Wii was meant to be all along. It's almost tragic then that it's going to be the last game on the Wii. I really hope it delivers, and perhaps that it proves to me that with this motion control concept Nintendo sought after with the Wii really was worth pursuing. This is their chance at redemption. I hope they don't let me down.

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