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    The PC (Personal Computer) is a highly configurable and upgradable gaming platform that, among home systems, sports the widest variety of control methods, largest library of games, and cutting edge graphics and sound capabilities.

    Testing out the new rig

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    ttocs

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    #1  Edited By ttocs

    Tomorrow's the big day.  My Alienware Area 51 machine is being delivered and I can finally venture back into the world of PC Gaming that I have been forced to ignore due to my current rig being a bit on the shabby side.  Anyways, I'm looking for games out there that require a lot of machine in order to play on max settings.  I want to experience the PC gaming porn that I've been missing.  Any suggestions?  So far, I'm going to be playing Rift (preordered through Steam), and Dragon Age 2 (but not until March 8th).  Any suggestions though for games to pick up? 
     
    Thanks!

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    Tennmuerti

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    #2  Edited By Tennmuerti
    Metro 2033 if you want to truly tax your system.
    Beyond that almost any major game with DX11 graphical options will do.
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    ttocs

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    #3  Edited By ttocs

    Oh really?  I know that Metro 2033 is being offered free by preordering a game on Steam.  I might try that.    

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    sorawesome

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    #4  Edited By sorawesome

    crysis, bulletstorm actually stutters on my gtx 460 768mb :/

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    Mudrocket

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    #5  Edited By Mudrocket

    Minesweeper son!

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    HitmanAgent47

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    #6  Edited By HitmanAgent47

    Maybe crysis warhead, arma 2 games are taxing too even though they aren't that good of a game.

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    BeachThunder

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    #7  Edited By BeachThunder

    Cryostasis, not exactly great looking, just poorly optimised D:
     
    Anyway, it's a great game regardless.

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    ttocs

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    #8  Edited By ttocs
    @sorawesome said:
    " crysis, bulletstorm actually stutters on my gtx 460 768mb :/ "
    My machine is going to have dual GTX 460's so I could test that out as well.  Looks like a promising game but I've heard the PC version isn't as well made as the console versions.
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    TheKeyboardDemon

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    #9  Edited By TheKeyboardDemon

    Minecraft

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    Cirdain

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    #10  Edited By Cirdain
    @ttocs: 
    1. Rome total war
    2. Skirmish
    3. 8-player AI-only
    4. Max Army
    5. Full Graphics
    6. A small map with a dense town in the middle
    = CHAOS
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    ttocs

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    #11  Edited By ttocs
    @Cirdain said:
    " @ttocs: 
    1. Rome total war
    2. Skirmish
    3. 8-player AI-only
    4. Max Army
    5. Full Graphics
    6. A small map with a dense town in the middle
    = CHAOS "
    Thanks man.  That's exactly the kind of reply I was looking for.  I remember downloading the demo of rome total war on my old machine and it was like watching a realplayer movie.  
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    Cirdain

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    #12  Edited By Cirdain
    @ttocs: 
    The shogun total war 2 demo is on steam. I haven't played it yet but I need to check if it's got skirmish.
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    wolf_blitzer85

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    #13  Edited By wolf_blitzer85

    Dirt 2 looks awesome maxed out. Plus it's a solid racing game if you're looking for one.

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    Cirdain

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    #14  Edited By Cirdain
    @ttocs:  I've just checked and the demo got sp custom matches LOCKED so :(
    But rome or medieval though.... £4.99
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    #15  Edited By ttocs
    @wolf_blitzer85 said:
    " Dirt 2 looks awesome maxed out. Plus it's a solid racing game if you're looking for one. "
    I actually didn't play Dirt 2 yet.  My brother said it was good, but I never got into it.  I've never played a racing game on the PC before.  How are the controls?  Do you need a racing setup (wheel, etc.) to play it correctly?
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    Cirdain

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    #16  Edited By Cirdain
    @ttocs said:
    " @wolf_blitzer85 said:
    " Dirt 2 looks awesome maxed out. Plus it's a solid racing game if you're looking for one. "
    I actually didn't play Dirt 2 yet.  My brother said it was good, but I never got into it.  I've never played a racing game on the PC before.  How are the controls?  Do you need a racing setup (wheel, etc.) to play it correctly? "
    I recommend at least a wired xbox controller.
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    Halopower67

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    #17  Edited By Halopower67

    What are the specs of the new rig? and of the old one? Just for curiosity's sake and to see how hey will compare.

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    TheKeyboardDemon

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    #18  Edited By TheKeyboardDemon
    @Halopower67 said:
    " What are the specs of the new rig? and of the old one? Just for curiosity's sake and to see how hey will compare. "
    I'd like to know that too. You intrigue us by saying you've bought a massive powerhouse and then don't tell us what's under the hood. That's not very sporting now is it?
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    wolf_blitzer85

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    #19  Edited By wolf_blitzer85
    @Cirdain said:

    " @ttocs said:

    " @wolf_blitzer85 said:
    " Dirt 2 looks awesome maxed out. Plus it's a solid racing game if you're looking for one. "
    I actually didn't play Dirt 2 yet.  My brother said it was good, but I never got into it.  I've never played a racing game on the PC before.  How are the controls?  Do you need a racing setup (wheel, etc.) to play it correctly? "
    I recommend at least a wired xbox controller. "
    Yup, this would do just fine, and actually it wouldn't be a terrible idea to have a 360 controller on hand as it makes a really nice pc controller too especially with all these console ports out there. I find there is less headache when I just play the game with a gamepad as it was developed in mind for rather than wrestle with broken proper pc controls. Not all games are like this, but like I said, it's good to have that controller on hand when you run into problems like that.
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    Cirdain

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    #20  Edited By Cirdain
    @wolf_blitzer85 said:
    " @Cirdain said:

    " @ttocs said:

    " @wolf_blitzer85 said:
    " Dirt 2 looks awesome maxed out. Plus it's a solid racing game if you're looking for one. "
    I actually didn't play Dirt 2 yet.  My brother said it was good, but I never got into it.  I've never played a racing game on the PC before.  How are the controls?  Do you need a racing setup (wheel, etc.) to play it correctly? "
    I recommend at least a wired xbox controller. "
    Yup, this would do just fine, and actually it wouldn't be a terrible idea to have a 360 controller on hand as it makes a really nice pc controller too especially with all these console ports out there. I find there is less headache when I just play the game with a gamepad as it was developed in mind for rather than wrestle with broken proper pc controls. Not all games are like this, but like I said, it's good to have that controller on hand when you run into problems like that. "
    Yeah, I found that with that 2008 Prince Of Persia, and all the Assassin's Creed's mostly 3rd person adventure stuff.
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    ttocs

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    #21  Edited By ttocs
    @TheKeyboardDemon said:

    " @Halopower67 said:

    " What are the specs of the new rig? and of the old one? Just for curiosity's sake and to see how hey will compare. "
    I'd like to know that too. You intrigue us by saying you've bought a massive powerhouse and then don't tell us what's under the hood. That's not very sporting now is it? "
    It's an Alienware.  I know a lot of people say they are overpriced but I know nothing about building computers and they are the best gaming rigs I could think of.  So, I splurged and got a PC that would last me a while.  Here's the specs... 
     
    Processor: Intel Core i7-970 Six Core Processor, 3.23GHz, 12MB   
    Memory: 12GB Triple Channel 1333MHz DDR3      
    GPU: Dual Nvidia Geforce GTX460 
    HD: 1TB - SATA-II, 3Gb/s, 7,200RPM, 32MB Cache HDD     
    OS: Windows 7 Home Premium  
    Motherboard: Intel X58 ATX 
    Liquid Cooling     
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    Mirado

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    #22  Edited By Mirado
    @ttocs: Hate to say it but you kinda got screwed out of some cash; that 970 is totally unnecessary for gaming (unless you have some other use for a hexa-core processor? May I suggest the Tested Folding Team?), as by the time games use 6 cores (they barely use 4 now) you'll need to upgrade everything else. But hell, a new PC is a new PC. You'll enjoy yourself. Just take a trip over to Tested next time, we could have saved you some money.
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    TheKeyboardDemon

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    #23  Edited By TheKeyboardDemon
    @ttocs:  The specs look good, a little dated in terms of the graphics cards, and the CPU seems excessive for a gaming PC, like mirado said you will never see all 6 cores get used in gaming. 
     
    I tested this myself using a program called ProcessExplorer and found that out of 50+ games installed on PC only 1 game pushed all 4 cores to 100% and none pushed them all over 85%. The games that used more than 2 cores produced graphs that showed 2 cores peaking at around 70-80% while the others peaked at around 40-60% and I think that is more down the hardware spreading the load and not the software looking at using the available resources more fully.
     
    The most CPU intensive games I had in my collection were Battlefield Bad Company 2 which peaked with all 4 cores at 100% and Metro 2033 with 3 cores reaching 80% and 1 core hitting 100%. In most games the processes are split so that 1 core controls the game mechanics and AI while the other controls the graphics queues etc...
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    HitmanAgent47

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    #24  Edited By HitmanAgent47
    @TheKeyboardDemon: How is it outdated? It's faster than a gtx 580, the fastest card on the market right now, also it's very overclockable. Even though the frames are more inconsistent at X1600 rez, the power is there and it's cheap. You could go past the highest card of this gen by sli a gtx 570 or hd6950, but that's sort of expensive.
     
    My cores are different or hyperthreads, games like mafia 2, assassin's creed 2 utilize every core or hyperthread dispite how ppl likes to rationalize how it shouldn't. I mean it utilizes it even if it's not designed for it, I thought you should know. You can see what is being used, by alt and tab, then turn on the processes through ctrl alt and delete going into the process. Play the game for a minute or two then alt tab out and see what is being used for a few minutes consistently because the bar meter thing should be high. I never seen a game use less than 4 cores on my i7, it might use like 5-8 hyperthreads depending on the games, which shows up more for open world games. Like I said, it's not designed for it, but it gets utilized dispite what ppl says from my experience anyways. I guess amd cpus does things differently then and uses less.
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    TheKeyboardDemon

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    #25  Edited By TheKeyboardDemon
    @HitmanAgent47:  Outdated in the sense of GTX4xx previous gen cards and GTX5xx current gen cards.
     
    It would be interesting in seeing how a selection of the games you play show processor utilization on ProcessExplorer as I have only been able to test my own AMD rig. 
     
    I do know that software that has not been threaded such as iTunes shows no performance gain from using extra cores and that an i7-980x (6c/12t) was 0.01s slower than an i7-975 (4c/8t) in transcoding the same track. And I have been led to believe that most games are not created as Hyperthreading enabled applications.
     
    This is what Tom's Hardware had to say about the performance gains of a six core CPU over a 4 core: 

    Intel is wise to keep Hyper-Threading an integral part of its high-end processors. Our analysis shows that many applications can benefit significantly from the extra logical cores. The feature is naturally most effective in threaded apps. Software developers know where parallelism stands to benefit the performance of their titles most profoundly, and over the years, a majority have optimized their products to utilize the almost-ubiquitous ecosystem of dual-, triple-, and quad-core CPUs. Fritz, 3ds Max, Cinebench, MainConcept, and 7-Zip are but a few of the apps able to capitalize on the feature and demonstrate improved performance. Even clock speed increases can't yield these performance boosts, unless you really crank up the overclocking. In this regard, Hyper-Threading does a great job by further improving performance via augmented utilization in the workloads that need it most.
     
    Unfortunately, these types of applications aren't necessarily universal on mainstream desktop PCs, and therein lies the rub. Many of the titles used in this article can't take advantage of additional parallelism. Gulftown’s six cores already provide plenty of performance, and whether Hyper-Threading is switched on or off doesn't make a ton of difference (until you start looking at power consumption, that is). Enabling Hyper-Threading clearly increases peak power. Conversely, disabling the feature helps to lower peak power.  

    In the end, efficiency increases with Hyper-Threading on Intel’s quad-core Core i7-975 Extreme Edition because many applications scale well at up to eight cores (or threads). The new Core i7-980X shows little benefit from Hyper-Threading, though, and even takes a slight efficiency hit. The conclusions we drew in our initial review hold up here. This isn't a gaming processor, and it's not particularly well-suited to the desktop at all. Rather, it's a workstation processor best suited to content creation, rendering, and other parallelized workloads. If you're not doing that sort of heavy lifting, a quad-core CPU like the Core i5-750/Phenom II X4 965 or even a Hyper-Threading-enabled quad-core chip like the Core i7-930 makes for a smarter buy. 


    What I understood from this article is that in the case of the Alienware PC that the OP bought his gaming performance would increase if he had opted for an i7-975 (4c/8t) instead of the i7-970 (6c/12t).

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    #26  Edited By ttocs
    @TheKeyboardDemon said:
    " @HitmanAgent47:  Outdated in the sense of GTX4xx previous gen cards and GTX5xx current gen cards.
     
    It would be interesting in seeing how a selection of the games you play show processor utilization on ProcessExplorer as I have only been able to test my own AMD rig. 
     
    I do know that software that has not been threaded such as iTunes shows no performance gain from using extra cores and that an i7-980x (6c/12t) was 0.01s slower than an i7-975 (4c/8t) in transcoding the same track. And I have been led to believe that most games are not created as Hyperthreading enabled applications.
     
    This is what Tom's Hardware had to say about the performance gains of a six core CPU over a 4 core: 

    Intel is wise to keep Hyper-Threading an integral part of its high-end processors. Our analysis shows that many applications can benefit significantly from the extra logical cores. The feature is naturally most effective in threaded apps. Software developers know where parallelism stands to benefit the performance of their titles most profoundly, and over the years, a majority have optimized their products to utilize the almost-ubiquitous ecosystem of dual-, triple-, and quad-core CPUs. Fritz, 3ds Max, Cinebench, MainConcept, and 7-Zip are but a few of the apps able to capitalize on the feature and demonstrate improved performance. Even clock speed increases can't yield these performance boosts, unless you really crank up the overclocking. In this regard, Hyper-Threading does a great job by further improving performance via augmented utilization in the workloads that need it most.
     
    Unfortunately, these types of applications aren't necessarily universal on mainstream desktop PCs, and therein lies the rub. Many of the titles used in this article can't take advantage of additional parallelism. Gulftown’s six cores already provide plenty of performance, and whether Hyper-Threading is switched on or off doesn't make a ton of difference (until you start looking at power consumption, that is). Enabling Hyper-Threading clearly increases peak power. Conversely, disabling the feature helps to lower peak power.  

    In the end, efficiency increases with Hyper-Threading on Intel’s quad-core Core i7-975 Extreme Edition because many applications scale well at up to eight cores (or threads). The new Core i7-980X shows little benefit from Hyper-Threading, though, and even takes a slight efficiency hit. The conclusions we drew in our initial review hold up here. This isn't a gaming processor, and it's not particularly well-suited to the desktop at all. Rather, it's a workstation processor best suited to content creation, rendering, and other parallelized workloads. If you're not doing that sort of heavy lifting, a quad-core CPU like the Core i5-750/Phenom II X4 965 or even a Hyper-Threading-enabled quad-core chip like the Core i7-930 makes for a smarter buy. 


    What I understood from this article is that in the case of the Alienware PC that the OP bought his gaming performance would increase if he had opted for an i7-975 (4c/8t) instead of the i7-970 (6c/12t).

    "
    Eh, I got a bonus from work and I always wanted an Alienware machine.  So, I figured I'd treat myself.  I know nothing about PC's, only what I read that is in basic english so I am going to try and learn a lot with this.  I know the 400 series is "outdated" but that's why I got two of them working together.  I figured two of them would be better than one 500.  At least that's what I read.
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    TheKeyboardDemon

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    #27  Edited By TheKeyboardDemon
    @ttocs:  Yes, you're right, 2 GTX460s would outperform a single GTX580 without a doubt. Also I just had a quick look at the Alienware website and from what I can see you have made the best choices from the options available and also the i7-975 wassn't given as an option.
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    s7evn

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    #28  Edited By s7evn
    @Mudrocket said:
    " Minesweeper son! "
    Oh hell yeah!
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    Franstone

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    #29  Edited By Franstone
    @ttocs: 
     
    I use the PC Xbox 360 controller for Dirt2, works like a charm.... 
     
    I'd look into trying these games out (most have been mentioned): 
    -Metro 2033 
    -Crysis Maximum Edition (Crysis 1 and Crysis Warhead) 
    -Pre order Crysis 2 (End of March release)  
    -Battlefield Bad Company 2 (Just damn fun and cheap on Steam, nice looking too)
     
    Metro is the only one that is real heavy on Directx 11 though. 
    I'd definately try that to see what your system can do until the machine killer known as Crysis 2 comes out...   : ) 
     
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    MrOldboy

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    #30  Edited By MrOldboy

    I usually test out my new system by running Half-Life at 800x600.

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    TheKeyboardDemon

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    #31  Edited By TheKeyboardDemon
    @MrOldboy said:
    " I usually test out my new system by running Half-Life at 800x600. "
    That's extreme gaming for you. What sort of frame rates are you getting? ;)
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    Azteck

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    #32  Edited By Azteck
    @ttocs said:
    " Oh really?  I know that Metro 2033 is being offered free by preordering a game on Steam.  I might try that.     "
    Thing is that Metro 2033 isn't an accurate display of what your computer can handle as it's veeery poorly optimized.
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    ttocs

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    #33  Edited By ttocs
    @Azteck said:
    " @ttocs said:
    " Oh really?  I know that Metro 2033 is being offered free by preordering a game on Steam.  I might try that.     "
    Thing is that Metro 2033 isn't an accurate display of what your computer can handle as it's veeery poorly optimized. "
    I see.  Regardless, I picked it up because it was free with a homefront pre-purchase off of steam.  I've been wanting to play the game anyways so it's a win win.
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    MrOldboy

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    #34  Edited By MrOldboy
    @TheKeyboardDemon said:

    " @MrOldboy said:

    " I usually test out my new system by running Half-Life at 800x600. "
    That's extreme gaming for you. What sort of frame rates are you getting? ;) "
    It depends on how hot my room is and if I open my case and put a fan on it. 
     
    Seriously though. Look at the games you have. Look at a review for your graphics card and test the game you own with Fraps on. Usually they test the graphics cards on pretty good rigs so i like to compare to those numbers since the video card is a big piece of what makes your games go. If I can come close to the reviews benchmark I feel good about my rig. Or run a benchmarking part of a game, like Metro 2033, Just Cause 2, or something and compare with others.
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    TheKeyboardDemon

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    #35  Edited By TheKeyboardDemon
    @MrOldboy:  lol. Until quite recently I used to use the benchmarks in Counter Strike: Source and Half Life 2: Lost Coast as a measure to see how well my rig was performing. It is only when I realised that no matter what I do to the hardware I'm not going to get over a certain framerate that I started looking at what other games I had on my system, and then when I realised my system could do so much more I spent so much more money on games! (Well that and the Steam Christmas sale). ;)

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