Anti-dickwolves protesters threaten family of Penny Arcade writer

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Posted by Sweep (8843 posts) -

This was supposed to be a blog but I posted it in the forums by accident. Here is the actual blog:

 
Previous Threads.  

The Offending Strip: 

 
 

The second strip in response to the initial controversy: 

 
 

The Blog where Mike (Gabe) removes the dickwolves shirts from the Penny Arcade store: 

 

 "   It’s true that we have decided to remove the Dickwolves shirt from the store. Some people are happy about this but a lot more of you are upset. You think we’ve caved into to pressure from a vocal minority and you’re not entirely wrong. let me at least break down why we did it though.

First of all I would never remove the strip or even apologize for the joke. It’s funny and the fact that some people don’t get it, or are offended by it doesn’t change that. People complained about the strip and that’s fine with me, my response as always is “if you don’t like it don’t read it.” It is very easy not to log on to Penny Arcade and read our bullshit. We’ve always made offensive comics and that’s not going to change anytime soon. If jokes about violence,rape,aids,pedophilia,bestiality,drugs,cancer,homosexuality, and religion bother you then I recommend reading a different webcomic.

PAX is a different matter though. We want PAX to be a place were everyone feels welcome and we’ve worked really hard to make that happen. From not allowing booth babes to making sure we have panels that represent all our attendees. When I heard from a few people that the shirt would make them uncomfortable at PAX, that gave me pause. Now whether I think that’s a fair or warranted reaction doesn’t really matter. These were not rants on blogs but personal mails to me from people being very reasonable. It’s how they feel and according to them at least, removing the shirt would make them feel better about attending the show. For me that’s an easy fix to the problem. I really don’t want to have this fight and if not having it is as simple as not selling a shirt then I’ll do it. Contrary to what they might think I’m not a complete asshole.

Now for some people removing the shirt isn’t enough. They don’t want to come to PAX or support PA because of the strip or because they think Tycho and I are perpetuating some kind of rape culture and that’s a different matter. First off it assumes a lot about us that simply isn’t true but more importantly it’s not something I can fix. I’ve gotten a couple messages from people saying they are “conflicted” about coming to PAX. My response to them is: don’t come. Just don’t do it. In fact give me your name and I’ll refund your money if you already bought a ticket. I’ll even put you on a list so that if, in a moment of weakness you try to by a ticket we can cancel the order.

So there you go. It’s not a simple decision. No matter what we do we’ll have people mad at us. If you want to talk more about it we can chat at PAX."

 

The blog from yesterday about how someone threatened to kill Mike's family: 


" I think this has really gone too far. We have people on both sides of this ridiculous argument making death threats and worse. Kara was certainly upset to see someone mention on Twitter last night that it would be funny to come to my house and murder my wife and children. I know there are people who see themselves as being on our side that have made equally disgusting comments in the other direction. I want to make it very clear that I do not approve of this kind of bullshit.

I am certainly guilty of being snarky, sarcastic and rude. I apologize if that gave anyone the impression that I would ever condone this sort of behavior. If you are out there making these sorts of threats thinking that you are somehow doing our good work, please stop. I never should have engaged them at all much less the way I did. Obviously Courtney Stanton has been very vocal about her dislike of us and our behavior. But she is not censoring us, she has not stripped away our freedom of speech. She didn’t even have anything to do with our decision to remove the shirt. I’m sure she is just as upset with the threats being made by people who consider themselves her supporters. So I’m asking you to please leave her alone.

Personally I’m done with this argument and I’m asking you all to be done with it as well. Don’t go read the blogs, don’t respond to the Tweets, just let it go. Thank You. "


 Jerry (Tycho) reiterates in his slightly longer more convoluted blog from yesterday: 

 

"The other reason I didn’t speak about it is because I didn’t want to draw unwanted attention to the sources of complaint. Apparently, there are people who imagine they’re doing us some kind of a favor being jackasses and saying terrible things to critics of the site. Well, I’m a big boy, and I can handle my own shit. If you’re a reader, and not somebody just out for a scrap, if you love me at all you’ll put an end to that kind of bullshit. When someone believes something about you that isn’t true, the optimal strategy isn’t to prove to them time and time again that they were actually right all along - that you may be dismissed out of hand, that you have no merit. I assume that’s the opposite of what you want.

Can we all agree that threatening to kill someone’s wife and children, as happened yesterday, has no place in any fucking society? This is why I had to say something: because people who imagine themselves to be “agents” of each side have now graduated to threats of actual, physical violence."


WHAT SWEEP THINKS ABOUT ALL OF THIS: 

Now we get to the actual blog part.

 
 What the fuck, internet. I can understand a base level of intolerance for slightly edgy humour - for every victimising joke there is a victim, sure. That's the whole point. I don't understand how someone can be so overwhelmingly confused by the difference between ironic parody and malicious intent. There is a difference between making a joke about rape and actually wanting someone to be raped. I don't see how people can get so caught up about the content of a comic strip, something which is conceptually fucking obnoxious - let alone in the context of videogames. I don't understand why people feel the need to pounce on an issue which I thought was socially redundant by now. If you are personally offended by what you see in the world around you, tough shit. 
  
    

EDIT:  

A couple of people have got in touch with me since I posted this blog on the subject. I guess the reason that I feel the way that I do is because I can't relate to someone who is being fucked up by this issue. I can't relate to a rape victim who is suffering from repeat trauma, depression, panic attacks - I don't have the mental capacity to do so - but I can appreciate how horrifying it is and that's not something I would wish on anyone, ever. So whilst my opinion remains the same, I do appreciate that humour like this does contain the capacity to really fuck someone up. As a friend of mine just wrote to me on steam - both sides in this entire argument have been completely insensitive to the intentions of their dissenters.  
  

EDITEDIT: 

I urge all the people who are saying "It's just a fucking comic strip, people are too easily offended" I urge you to go read this article over on IGN which made me rethink my entire position on the subject. Cheers to Gaff for the link.

But that's not the point of this blog.

 The point of this blog was to address just how far some people are prepared to take this shit, and despite the fact that I can't relate to the sentiments of the people opposed to this, I can't see any way of justifying a threat on the oppositions family. Despite Tycho asking for this nonsense to end I think it's important to address what is obviously fucking bananas - I would hate to think that people think this is acceptable behaviour, online or otherwise.     
 
 
You just have to learn to deal with it just like everybody else - and as Jerry wrote in his blog: 

 "  people deal with horror of this kind in different ways, and one of them is with humor."

  

Seriously, internet. 

This 
is why we can't have nice things. 
   
  

Thanks For Reading 
Love Sweep    
Moderator
#1 Edited by Sweep (8843 posts) -

This was supposed to be a blog but I posted it in the forums by accident. Here is the actual blog:

 
Previous Threads.  

The Offending Strip: 

 
 

The second strip in response to the initial controversy: 

 
 

The Blog where Mike (Gabe) removes the dickwolves shirts from the Penny Arcade store: 

 

 "   It’s true that we have decided to remove the Dickwolves shirt from the store. Some people are happy about this but a lot more of you are upset. You think we’ve caved into to pressure from a vocal minority and you’re not entirely wrong. let me at least break down why we did it though.

First of all I would never remove the strip or even apologize for the joke. It’s funny and the fact that some people don’t get it, or are offended by it doesn’t change that. People complained about the strip and that’s fine with me, my response as always is “if you don’t like it don’t read it.” It is very easy not to log on to Penny Arcade and read our bullshit. We’ve always made offensive comics and that’s not going to change anytime soon. If jokes about violence,rape,aids,pedophilia,bestiality,drugs,cancer,homosexuality, and religion bother you then I recommend reading a different webcomic.

PAX is a different matter though. We want PAX to be a place were everyone feels welcome and we’ve worked really hard to make that happen. From not allowing booth babes to making sure we have panels that represent all our attendees. When I heard from a few people that the shirt would make them uncomfortable at PAX, that gave me pause. Now whether I think that’s a fair or warranted reaction doesn’t really matter. These were not rants on blogs but personal mails to me from people being very reasonable. It’s how they feel and according to them at least, removing the shirt would make them feel better about attending the show. For me that’s an easy fix to the problem. I really don’t want to have this fight and if not having it is as simple as not selling a shirt then I’ll do it. Contrary to what they might think I’m not a complete asshole.

Now for some people removing the shirt isn’t enough. They don’t want to come to PAX or support PA because of the strip or because they think Tycho and I are perpetuating some kind of rape culture and that’s a different matter. First off it assumes a lot about us that simply isn’t true but more importantly it’s not something I can fix. I’ve gotten a couple messages from people saying they are “conflicted” about coming to PAX. My response to them is: don’t come. Just don’t do it. In fact give me your name and I’ll refund your money if you already bought a ticket. I’ll even put you on a list so that if, in a moment of weakness you try to by a ticket we can cancel the order.

So there you go. It’s not a simple decision. No matter what we do we’ll have people mad at us. If you want to talk more about it we can chat at PAX."

 

The blog from yesterday about how someone threatened to kill Mike's family: 


" I think this has really gone too far. We have people on both sides of this ridiculous argument making death threats and worse. Kara was certainly upset to see someone mention on Twitter last night that it would be funny to come to my house and murder my wife and children. I know there are people who see themselves as being on our side that have made equally disgusting comments in the other direction. I want to make it very clear that I do not approve of this kind of bullshit.

I am certainly guilty of being snarky, sarcastic and rude. I apologize if that gave anyone the impression that I would ever condone this sort of behavior. If you are out there making these sorts of threats thinking that you are somehow doing our good work, please stop. I never should have engaged them at all much less the way I did. Obviously Courtney Stanton has been very vocal about her dislike of us and our behavior. But she is not censoring us, she has not stripped away our freedom of speech. She didn’t even have anything to do with our decision to remove the shirt. I’m sure she is just as upset with the threats being made by people who consider themselves her supporters. So I’m asking you to please leave her alone.

Personally I’m done with this argument and I’m asking you all to be done with it as well. Don’t go read the blogs, don’t respond to the Tweets, just let it go. Thank You. "


 Jerry (Tycho) reiterates in his slightly longer more convoluted blog from yesterday: 

 

"The other reason I didn’t speak about it is because I didn’t want to draw unwanted attention to the sources of complaint. Apparently, there are people who imagine they’re doing us some kind of a favor being jackasses and saying terrible things to critics of the site. Well, I’m a big boy, and I can handle my own shit. If you’re a reader, and not somebody just out for a scrap, if you love me at all you’ll put an end to that kind of bullshit. When someone believes something about you that isn’t true, the optimal strategy isn’t to prove to them time and time again that they were actually right all along - that you may be dismissed out of hand, that you have no merit. I assume that’s the opposite of what you want.

Can we all agree that threatening to kill someone’s wife and children, as happened yesterday, has no place in any fucking society? This is why I had to say something: because people who imagine themselves to be “agents” of each side have now graduated to threats of actual, physical violence."


WHAT SWEEP THINKS ABOUT ALL OF THIS: 

Now we get to the actual blog part.

 
 What the fuck, internet. I can understand a base level of intolerance for slightly edgy humour - for every victimising joke there is a victim, sure. That's the whole point. I don't understand how someone can be so overwhelmingly confused by the difference between ironic parody and malicious intent. There is a difference between making a joke about rape and actually wanting someone to be raped. I don't see how people can get so caught up about the content of a comic strip, something which is conceptually fucking obnoxious - let alone in the context of videogames. I don't understand why people feel the need to pounce on an issue which I thought was socially redundant by now. If you are personally offended by what you see in the world around you, tough shit. 
  
    

EDIT:  

A couple of people have got in touch with me since I posted this blog on the subject. I guess the reason that I feel the way that I do is because I can't relate to someone who is being fucked up by this issue. I can't relate to a rape victim who is suffering from repeat trauma, depression, panic attacks - I don't have the mental capacity to do so - but I can appreciate how horrifying it is and that's not something I would wish on anyone, ever. So whilst my opinion remains the same, I do appreciate that humour like this does contain the capacity to really fuck someone up. As a friend of mine just wrote to me on steam - both sides in this entire argument have been completely insensitive to the intentions of their dissenters.  
  

EDITEDIT: 

I urge all the people who are saying "It's just a fucking comic strip, people are too easily offended" I urge you to go read this article over on IGN which made me rethink my entire position on the subject. Cheers to Gaff for the link.

But that's not the point of this blog.

 The point of this blog was to address just how far some people are prepared to take this shit, and despite the fact that I can't relate to the sentiments of the people opposed to this, I can't see any way of justifying a threat on the oppositions family. Despite Tycho asking for this nonsense to end I think it's important to address what is obviously fucking bananas - I would hate to think that people think this is acceptable behaviour, online or otherwise.     
 
 
You just have to learn to deal with it just like everybody else - and as Jerry wrote in his blog: 

 "  people deal with horror of this kind in different ways, and one of them is with humor."

  

Seriously, internet. 

This 
is why we can't have nice things. 
   
  

Thanks For Reading 
Love Sweep    
Moderator
#2 Posted by Skald (4367 posts) -

It's a jpg and a nerdy shirt. Why does the internet have to get so bothered by this?

#3 Posted by Slaker117 (4837 posts) -

I never really cared for PA's humor, but people acting outraged over dickwolves are ridiculous.

#4 Posted by eroticfishcake (7783 posts) -

The fact that these people are threatening them with this kind of stuff just shows how much worse they are. I don't consider myself a big PA guy but I definitely agree with Jerry and Mike on this. Seriously, this has been going on since last Summer. Some people need to learn to drop this. 

#5 Posted by SomeJerk (3215 posts) -

Wonder if those people got offended by any other mention of what terrible experiences rape victims go through in other sources of fiction. I bet not.
 
Wonder if they give a rats ass about how women and children are left alive when African villages are wiped out by genocide only to serve as rape recipients. I bet not.
 
Wonder if their world circles around them. I bet it does.

#6 Edited by BeachThunder (11830 posts) -

I haven't been following this, but, really, I am confoosed :(
 
My guess is that some community is behind this, because I doubt people would usually be this up in arms about something like this.
 
EDIT: btw, that video is great =D

#7 Posted by Hailinel (24395 posts) -

And this is what happens when people keep trying to stoke a controversy that really shouldn't have been all that controversial in the first place.  Thanks, you anonymous internet fuckwads.  Thank you so much for threatening the lives of people over a fucking comic strip.  What the hell is wrong with you?

#8 Edited by JCTango (1360 posts) -

This might make me sound a little prud, but to me, a lot of the "mature" humour in today's society seem a little childish and insensitive.
 
I prefer jokes that people make about themselves - by targetting their own mistakes and such, they encourage their audience to realize that they too, are imperfect.
 
That said though, I wouldn't threaten people like that if they enjoyed that sorta humour... that's a little crazy.

#9 Posted by Make_Me_Mad (3066 posts) -

Whole thing is dumb.  No point to getting offended by a joke on the Internet.

#10 Posted by Dudacles (1448 posts) -

I find it to be a bit of a paradox that you are drawing attention to this matter by making this blog post despite the Penny Arcade staff specifically going out of their way to stop people from bringing this up again. I'm not saying you're not correct in your assessment of the problem--the people who started this are obviously idiots. I just can't help but feel that when someone who is a pretty note-worthy blog writer starts talking about this, it can only add fuel to the fire, even if it is on another site.
 
I just hope this is allowed to die now. It's ridiculous.

#11 Posted by Andorski (5268 posts) -

So rape is bad, but threatening violence is okay? 
 
Humanity, I'm disappointed in you.

#12 Edited by Toms115 (2316 posts) -

if they care so much about rape why not go help out some victims instead of bitching about a joke that clearly does not condone rape. 
 
oh, wait - that would actually require action, not just a keyboard and a broadband connection. silly me.

#13 Edited by Underachiever007 (2468 posts) -

 How these people fail to realize the irony of what they are doing is beyond me.    

#14 Posted by Gamer_152 (14070 posts) -

I've said it before and I'll say it again, this is about more than just the anti-PA people getting offended, even if (like me) you don't agree with them, it must be observed that most of the people on the other side of this argument aren't calling for censorship because they were offended, they have genuine moral objections to the work of PA and if you're going to talk trash about them and brand them as idiots without actually looking at what they're saying then you're displaying the exact same kind of ignorant mentality which has been fundamental to the opposition of video games themselves. Dumb things have been said on both sides of this argument though, but people posting genuine death threats? That's idiotic, disgusting, and only sets back your own cause.

Moderator
#15 Edited by Sweep (8843 posts) -
@Gamer_152:  
@dudacles said:

" I find it to be a bit of a paradox that you are drawing attention to this matter by making this blog post despite the Penny Arcade staff specifically going out of their way to stop people from bringing this up again. I'm not saying you're not correct in your assessment of the problem--the people who started this are obviously idiots. I just can't help but feel that when someone who is a pretty note-worthy blog writer starts talking about this, it can only add fuel to the fire, even if it is on another site.  I just hope this is allowed to die now. It's ridiculous. "

Yeah, I kinda get the irony but this blog was more incredulous that someone took this issue to the level of death threats - as oppose to the actual issue itself. I think it's important to address what is obviously fucking bananas - I would hate to think that people think this shit is acceptable behaviour, online or otherwise.
Moderator
#16 Posted by Ventilaator (1501 posts) -

I'm done with humans. Whichever otherwordly race accidentally left me here, I'll forgive you if you get me out now.
 
That's the third most up-my-own-ass thing I've said all day.

#17 Posted by Kieran_ES (258 posts) -

I'll say what I said in the other thread; it is not the joke, comic or t-shirt that is annoying but the reaction from a large number of the PA community, often-times PA included, towards those who objected to the joke. There has been a widespread and disgusting belittlement of these people who have legitimate reasons to be a bit on edge about stuff like this, going so far as to actively call rape survivors liars because they have no proof. Numerous twitter accounts have been made specifically to attack these people, and PA's treatment of the issue in the way they have has encouraged it. The joke is fine, but if you put something out like that and receive complaints, don't be a giant dick about it.  
 
At the same time, there are people (as this thread title immediately indicates) that have taken it too far on the other side as well.  

#18 Posted by Nomin (970 posts) -

I recall sometime ago in some game convention somewhere someone poked somebody's eye out with something.  
There are some deranged people out there whose bubble of association is either so small or warped that they cannot help but be embroiled in this brouhaha and get amped up about anything so trivial.  
Oh Internet. They will not simmer down just because of this concession, they will soon find other things to carp on, thus abetting this cycle of fake internet outrage safely at a distance of anonymity. 

#19 Edited by HarlequinRiot (1098 posts) -

Anyone with an opinion about anything is dumb. And that's a fact.  
  
Also, the "critics" really need to let this dickwolves things go. Like, of all the things to complain about how can a PA comic rile you up that much? It is good to see Mike and Jerry, who may not have handled this with complete tact, speak out against their more vulgar supporters. 

#20 Posted by bonbolapti (1611 posts) -

Much like in the vain of activism or protests, all it can do is escalate.
It's a shame yeah. : /

#21 Posted by The_Laughing_Man (13629 posts) -

People need to relax. It was a comic calm the fuck down. 

#22 Posted by TaliciaDragonsong (8698 posts) -

Kill the ones threatening to kill.
 
That'll shut em up.

#23 Posted by raiz265 (2237 posts) -

I had to laugh reading "dickwolves" in the thread title alone... :D

#24 Posted by MegaGoat (219 posts) -

Sometimes it is right to murder
It's always right not to read Penny Arcade

#25 Posted by Sweep (8843 posts) -
@EndSarcasm said:
" I'll say what I said in the other thread; it is not the joke, comic or t-shirt that is annoying but the reaction from a large number of the PA community, often-times PA included, towards those who objected to the joke. There has been a widespread and disgusting belittlement of these people who have legitimate reasons to be a bit on edge about stuff like this, going so far as to actively call rape survivors liars because they have no proof. Numerous twitter accounts have been made specifically to attack these people, and PA's treatment of the issue in the way they have has encouraged it. The joke is fine, but if you put something out like that and receive complaints, don't be a giant dick about it.   At the same time, there are people (as this thread title immediately indicates) that have taken it too far on the other side as well.   "
I can understand that completely - with any edgy humour there is the risk of offending someone and you have to deal with the consequent knee-jerk reaction - and that reaction is completely justified a lot of the time. This whole dickwolves thing was a complete cluster-fuck from start to finish, but I just thought it worth noting the rate at which it had escalated to forum-based controversy to full-scale threats on peoples lives. How do you deal with that? Do you say "Maybe I really did go too far, someone is obviously really fucked up about this topic to the extent that they feel desperate enough to threaten my family?" or do you say "You are a fucking crazy person stay away from me I am calling the police". People find it offensive - ok, fine. I don't have a problem with people having different opinions to my own. I'm just fucking amazed at the extent which people are prepared to go to. That was more the point of this blog, the actual comic strip and penny arcade stuff is just for context. Where does it end?
Moderator
#26 Edited by Jeust (10548 posts) -

I think dicks everywhere are feeling their ego threatened by the might of the dickwolves. And so comes forth the need to protest. Protest all you want dicks!

#27 Posted by ProfessorEss (7318 posts) -
@Sweep:  What I find the most fucked up about it is that they're not even pushing any boundaries with the joke, but you know what, I'm not even gonna get into it. That Steve Hughes video you inserted sums up my feelings pretty solidly.
#28 Edited by Kieran_ES (258 posts) -
@Sweep said:

" @EndSarcasm said:

" I'll say what I said in the other thread; it is not the joke, comic or t-shirt that is annoying but the reaction from a large number of the PA community, often-times PA included, towards those who objected to the joke. There has been a widespread and disgusting belittlement of these people who have legitimate reasons to be a bit on edge about stuff like this, going so far as to actively call rape survivors liars because they have no proof. Numerous twitter accounts have been made specifically to attack these people, and PA's treatment of the issue in the way they have has encouraged it. The joke is fine, but if you put something out like that and receive complaints, don't be a giant dick about it.   At the same time, there are people (as this thread title immediately indicates) that have taken it too far on the other side as well.   "
I can understand that completely - with any edgy humour there is the risk of offending someone and you have to deal with the consequent knee-jerk reaction - and that reaction is completely justified a lot of the time. This whole dickwolves thing was a complete cluster-fuck from start to finish, but I just thought it worth noting the rate at which it had escalated to forum-based controversy to full-scale threats on peoples lives. How do you deal with that? Do you say "Maybe I really did go too far, someone is obviously really fucked up about this topic to the extent that they feel desperate enough to threaten my family?" or do you say "You are a fucking crazy person stay away from me I am calling the police". People find it offensive - ok, fine. I don't have a problem with people having different opinions to my own. I'm just fucking amazed at the extent which people are prepared to go to. That was more the point of this blog, the actual comic strip and penny arcade stuff is just for context. Where does it end? "
Yes some people have definitely taken it beyond any rational point, and it's ridiculous to see this so often. Mike and Jerry's family seeing threats on their life is way too far, but you have to look at that and then attempt to engage with the rational ones that began the discussion in the first place.  
 
As a side note, nobody seems to actually understand what it is when people refer to 'rape culture'. It keeps being used incorrectly by the PA side. 
#29 Posted by fwylo (3556 posts) -


Seriously, internet. 

This is why we can't have nice things.     
#30 Posted by IBurningStar (2162 posts) -

...This is fucking stupid. We are threatening people's lives over this now? Really? Really? Really?!
 
I have a solution. Everyone just admit that we are just a bunch of assholes and move on with our lives.

#31 Posted by BeachThunder (11830 posts) -
@TaliciaDragonsong said:
" Kill the ones threatening to kill.  That'll shut em up. "
I'll kill you if you kill the ones threatening to kill!
#32 Posted by LackingSaint (1787 posts) -

This is all so stupid. Being offended by the idea of being raped by the dickwolves makes about as much sense as being offended by the idea of being savagely beaten by the handspiders. Both the dickwolves and handspiders have been well known for their disregard for common law, instead living out their anarchic lives in the abandoned sewers, and we've been FINE with that until now. Why there's a big fuss about it now is beyond me.

#33 Posted by bybeach (4789 posts) -
@ProfessorEss said:
" @Sweep:  What I find the most fucked up about it is that they're not even pushing any boundaries with the joke, but you know what, I'm not even gonna get into it. That Steve Hughes video you inserted sums up my feelings pretty solidly. "

I agree with this. It sounds more like somebody with an agenda, I call them the Simplifiers, have seen a ball and decided to run with it. Threaten somebodies family over this? If it is really true, and this is the Internet after all, it speaks of somebody drawing a target symbol, and less of whether the whole thing really fits. 
 
The cartoon was dark humor, not at all advocation, and now dark humor is suspect...wow.
#34 Posted by TaliciaDragonsong (8698 posts) -
@BeachThunder said:
" @TaliciaDragonsong said:
" Kill the ones threatening to kill.  That'll shut em up. "
I'll kill you if you kill the ones threatening to kill! "
I'd like to see you try!
#35 Posted by EvilTwin (3324 posts) -

To be fair, people have regularly threatened to kill other people on the internet for less than this.
 
But whatever, I haven't touched any of this with a ten foot pole.  I wash my hands of it. 

#36 Posted by Gaff (1711 posts) -
@Sweep: You mean the extent people will go to for things they have, at the most, a tangential relation to?  
 
Whether it be celebrities, Gods, or politics, people tend to define themselves by the things they associate with, therefore, any attack on said thing is an attack on the person.   
 
God dammit, I'm sounding like a complete miser.
#37 Posted by SoylentGreen (254 posts) -
@Ventilaator said:
" I'm done with humans. Whichever otherwordly race accidentally left me here, I'll forgive you if you get me out now."
I'm sorry, we can't. You've been with them for too long.
 
Seriously, though, this is nuts. PA have made a successful business out of dark humor about violence, penises, foul language, and other not-nice things for over a decade. There are routine strips about Tycho's fetish for bestiality. There's that Apple guy who is the butt of implied gay jokes all the time. People are getting upset now?
#38 Posted by Sweep (8843 posts) -

A couple of people have got in touch with me since I posted this blog on the subject. I guess the reason that I feel the way that I do is because I can't relate to someone who is being fucked up by this issue. I can't relate to a rape victim who is suffering from repeat trauma, depression, panic attacks - I don't have the mental capacity to do so - but I can appreciate how horrifying it is and that's not something I would wish on anyone, ever. So whilst my opinion remains the same, I do appreciate that humour like this does contain the capacity to really fuck someone up. As a friend of mine just wrote to me on steam - both sides in this entire argument have been completely insensitive to the intentions of their dissenters.  
 
But that's not the point of this blog. The point of this blog was to address just how far some people are prepared to take this shit, and despite the fact that I can't relate to the sentiments of the people opposed to this, I can't see any way of justifying a threat on the oppositions family. Despite Tycho asking for this shit to end  I think it's important to address what is obviously fucking bananas - I would hate to think that people think this shit is acceptable behaviour, online or otherwise.

Moderator
#39 Edited by Kieran_ES (258 posts) -
@bybeach said:

" @ProfessorEss said:

" @Sweep:  What I find the most fucked up about it is that they're not even pushing any boundaries with the joke, but you know what, I'm not even gonna get into it. That Steve Hughes video you inserted sums up my feelings pretty solidly. "

I agree with this. It sounds more like somebody with an agenda, I call them the Simplifiers, have seen a ball and decided to run with it. Threaten somebodies family over this? If it is really true, and this is the Internet after all, it speaks of somebody drawing a target symbol, and less of whether the whole thing really fits.  The cartoon was dark humor, not at all advocation, and now dark humor is suspect...wow. "
The people who have spoken out against the joke have absolutely legitimate reasons to have done so. It's not an issue of  'well it doesn't actively say to go out and rape so what's wrong with it?' as so many people think (not saying you do). Most of those offended did actually get the joke, but were not happy with the way PA were essentially contributing to a very real, worrying trend in our culture. Rape culture is not one where people are encouraged to rape, but instead a society where 'misogynistic' comments, and jokes such as this, are so common place and normal that rape becomes marginalized. For those who have experience with rape, this is disturbing and to them helps foster a society where maybe a few people do see it as OK to commit this because it's just another part of our lexicon.  Trigger responses are also a worry. Much like triggering a flash back to combat in a soldier, things like this can trigger memories of the incident. Something PA decided to mock after the whole thing kicked off. 
 
Personally, I wasn't at all offended, but at least think before you make assumptions. I know I sound preachy, but I keep seeing so many misguided and inconsiderate opinions on this issue. 
#41 Posted by BabyChooChoo (4391 posts) -

That is disgusting. Not the dickwolves comic, I thought that was funny. It's the whole killing Mike's family thing that's disgusting. How completely fucked up in the head do you have to be to want to be kill the family of a guy who just made a comic strip, that wasn't even offensive in the first place, and later decided to apologize because he felt it was the right thing to do even though he didn't have to. This whole thing has gotten out of hand and I genuinely feel sorry for Gabe and Mike for having to put up with all this.
 
This sorta reminds me of the whole Anthony Gallegos(?) thing on GameSpy, though that wasn't nearly as 'big.' Someone thought he should be raped and murdered because of his Uncharted 2 review. A human being thought another human being should be fucking raped and murdered over a video game review.
 
I try to believe in humanity, but people like that make it extremely difficult....

Online
#42 Posted by AlexW00d (6235 posts) -

So there are people that are against rape but are pro-murder? And people wonder why I hate humanity.

#43 Posted by animateria (3252 posts) -

Now I gotta KILL some... 
 
time reading some PA comics. 
 
I don't get the controversy surrounding the comic, those people need to look at the context in which it was used.  
 
Might as well go after everyone who even mentions the word rape. Looks like they have some time to kill, and some people to threaten. 

#44 Posted by Gaff (1711 posts) -
@Sweep said:
" But that's not the point of this blog. The point of this blog was to address just how far some people are prepared to take this shit, and despite the fact that I can't relate to the sentiments of the people opposed to this, I can't see any way of justifying a threat on the oppositions family. Despite Tycho asking for this shit to end  I think it's important to address what is obviously fucking bananas - I would hate to think that people think this shit is acceptable behaviour, online or otherwise. "
I think this didn't really come through in the initial post. Which you have since edited. Argh, I'm slow. Must be my age. 
 
Anyway, I came across Arthur Gies' blog about this over at IGN. What do you think about his thoughts about this?
#45 Posted by EpicSteve (6479 posts) -

People are offended too easily. 

#46 Posted by Sweep (8843 posts) -
@Gaff said:

" @Sweep said:

" But that's not the point of this blog. The point of this blog was to address just how far some people are prepared to take this shit, and despite the fact that I can't relate to the sentiments of the people opposed to this, I can't see any way of justifying a threat on the oppositions family. Despite Tycho asking for this shit to end  I think it's important to address what is obviously fucking bananas - I would hate to think that people think this shit is acceptable behaviour, online or otherwise. "
I think this didn't really come through in the initial post. Which you have since edited. Argh, I'm slow. Must be my age. 
 
Anyway, I came across Arthur Gies' blog about this over at IGN. What do you think about his thoughts about this? "
Yeah, that's why I edited it, I was trying to refocus attention. 
 
That's a really great article! I think it's a little harsh at times. To say:

"  I’m a straight white male, and let’s be honest, rape is not a likely immediate threat to me.

Being male, I have the luxury of sexual safety by virtue of thousands of years of western conditioning and culture. I don’t walk down the street at night worrying about it, or what I’ll do if it happens; whether I can bear to report it because to admit I was sexually violated invites questions of whether I “had it coming” because of whatever I chose to wear that day, or whether my sexual activity would be used as justification or to minimize my assault. I’m aware of those factors, but I’m not conscious of them in the way women have to be. So when shit like this happens, it’s easy for me to move on without thinking about it. "


 And then to criticize Mike and Jerry who are in exactly the same situation is pretty hypocritcal. There are also times when he suggests that Mike and Jerry are deliberately not trying to resolve this entire thing and are being childish, which I disagree with as well. But the general sentiment is pretty spot on: 

" Both of them say it’s time to “let it go,” but that ignores that rape survivors don’t get to let it go, and that this incident has revealed a lot of ignorance and ugliness in our subculture.  " 

Moderator
#47 Posted by kratier (223 posts) -

this stupid drama story has been posted and reposted everyday, god just let it die  , PA fans are the friggin worst

#48 Posted by PixelPrinny (1030 posts) -

Wouldn't it be great if we could just derail all threads and blogs and tweet-wars about this subject into talks about cakes vs pies? Of course, cheesecake would reign supreme, but we could let pies and cakes duke it out for second place.

#49 Posted by Sweep (8843 posts) -
@PixelPrinny said:
" Wouldn't it be great if we could just derail all threads and blogs and tweet-wars about this subject into talks about cakes vs pies? Of course, cheesecake would reign supreme, but we could let pies and cakes duke it out for second place. "
Surely cheesecake is a cake. It's says "cake" right there in the damn name.
Moderator
#50 Posted by PixelPrinny (1030 posts) -
@Sweep said:
" @PixelPrinny said:
" Wouldn't it be great if we could just derail all threads and blogs and tweet-wars about this subject into talks about cakes vs pies? Of course, cheesecake would reign supreme, but we could let pies and cakes duke it out for second place. "
Surely cheesecake is a cake. It's says "cake" right there in the damn name. "
But the properties of it are more that of a pie! It's the best of both worlds, really, and thus why it is the clear winner.

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