Am I the Only One Who Isn't Feeling Street Fighter IV?

Mehdoken

   Those knee-jerk responses I can almost hear in the future say "That's just because you suck at it." And, yeah I know. For the most part, I do suck at it. I'm not the best fighting game champ ever, and lord knows I have things like other games, friends, a job, and showers to take... so I don't have the most time in the world to dedicate to the fourth Street Fighter, although I kinda wish I do. The game is fun. I enjoy the none-to-overly-complex combos (though, honestly, still prefer the Smash Bros. method of combat input), and let's all admit the game looks great.

   But why is the barrier for entry so fucking low?

   I suck, yeah, but I should be able to play through Arcade mode on Easiest a few times, do some training mode to help learn my moves, and then use Trial mode to build up some combo knowledge... except that even on Easiest, the game is way to brutal. Zangief just will NOT stop pile-driving me! As far as Trial mode goes, trying to pull off Abel's level 3, 3rd combo just isn't working. Nothing in that game is telling me how to do it, it just tells me what to do. There's no instruction on when to time my shots, or anything. So after 100 or so tries to throw a heavy punch and follow it up with his sweet punch-combo (that I have down solid), I still can't seem to link the two. Any advice out there?

   So, I'm not going to give a formal review. For one, nobody wants to hear from the guy who doesn't "know how to play," and I don't know near enough crazy shit about this game to give an in-depth opinion. All I can say is that I really, really wanted to get into this game, but it's refusal to stop destroying my face seems to be hindering that just a bit. Maybe I'll keep it around, play against people of my more relative skill level... Lord knows the online crowd is full of people who won't let off the "TIGER! TIGER! TIGER!" Also, why does every fucking person crouch? That's not how you fight. Stop crouching.

   /end rant

   Anyway, sorry I haven't posted any reviews lately (mostly sorry to myself), but I've been spreading myself thin between games lately, especially on DS. Without going into review depth, let me just make the following DS recomendations: Moon, Final Fantasy IV, Big Bang Mini, and Dementium: the Ward. All fantastic games. I'll talk more in upcoming reviews sometime in the hopeful future.

-Make it a Good One.
Randy "Dr. Randle" Marr

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Posted by DrRandle

Mehdoken

   Those knee-jerk responses I can almost hear in the future say "That's just because you suck at it." And, yeah I know. For the most part, I do suck at it. I'm not the best fighting game champ ever, and lord knows I have things like other games, friends, a job, and showers to take... so I don't have the most time in the world to dedicate to the fourth Street Fighter, although I kinda wish I do. The game is fun. I enjoy the none-to-overly-complex combos (though, honestly, still prefer the Smash Bros. method of combat input), and let's all admit the game looks great.

   But why is the barrier for entry so fucking low?

   I suck, yeah, but I should be able to play through Arcade mode on Easiest a few times, do some training mode to help learn my moves, and then use Trial mode to build up some combo knowledge... except that even on Easiest, the game is way to brutal. Zangief just will NOT stop pile-driving me! As far as Trial mode goes, trying to pull off Abel's level 3, 3rd combo just isn't working. Nothing in that game is telling me how to do it, it just tells me what to do. There's no instruction on when to time my shots, or anything. So after 100 or so tries to throw a heavy punch and follow it up with his sweet punch-combo (that I have down solid), I still can't seem to link the two. Any advice out there?

   So, I'm not going to give a formal review. For one, nobody wants to hear from the guy who doesn't "know how to play," and I don't know near enough crazy shit about this game to give an in-depth opinion. All I can say is that I really, really wanted to get into this game, but it's refusal to stop destroying my face seems to be hindering that just a bit. Maybe I'll keep it around, play against people of my more relative skill level... Lord knows the online crowd is full of people who won't let off the "TIGER! TIGER! TIGER!" Also, why does every fucking person crouch? That's not how you fight. Stop crouching.

   /end rant

   Anyway, sorry I haven't posted any reviews lately (mostly sorry to myself), but I've been spreading myself thin between games lately, especially on DS. Without going into review depth, let me just make the following DS recomendations: Moon, Final Fantasy IV, Big Bang Mini, and Dementium: the Ward. All fantastic games. I'll talk more in upcoming reviews sometime in the hopeful future.

-Make it a Good One.
Randy "Dr. Randle" Marr

Posted by License_To_Bill

Dude, I'm totally there. I was actually losing on the easiest difficulty.  I'll give it a couple more weeks before I give up. It's been a long while since I've played a Street Fighter game.

Edited by wefwefasdf

I can't beat freakin Seth! And why were the computers easier on medium than easy? I don't understand...

Posted by LordXavierBritish

Is this like, a joke topic?

I just spammed heavy kick through all of easiest mode so I could unlock character.

The only opponents it never seems to work completely on is Seth and my Rival, and even then it does not take much more than putting in a few different moves.

Posted by License_To_Bill

That doesn't sound like it would be much fun to play.

Posted by LordXavierBritish

It isn't.

That is why I only played easiest to get characters.

Right now I'm playing somewhere in between Easy and  Medium.

All I'm saying is, from the way you describe it that does not sound like Easiest mode at all.

The CPU is just plain dumb on that level, it barely even blocks.

Posted by License_To_Bill

Yeah, I just played a bit by just high-kicking. Man that's easy. My problems with the easiest difficulty pop up when I'm actually trying to fight.

Posted by wefwefasdf

Wow. I am on a winning streak online. I have won 11 ranked matches in a row. :D :D :D

Posted by Dizzyhippos

they tweaked everything in the game, so everything isn't going to be exactly how it was in III. I myself am having issues with it, but that's more me needing to relearn using a fight stick then anything else

Posted by Cheapoz

You're pretty much repeating every post I've made in the last 24 hours about this game.


I'm getting to Seth on easiest, but can't beat him when he changes styles after you win a round. I'm getting better and able to fly through the arcade mode on easiest unless I meet Abel (throw move spammer), then Chun-Li in the rival match always takes me forever (uses Ultra every round and game gives no idea on how to prevent/counter it).
Edited by BoG

You crouch for a few reasons. First is because on moves where you must charge backwards and then thrust forward you can hold back-down to do it, and this way, you don't get out of range, so your spacing isn't off. Moves like this are many of Balrog's moves, and Chun-Li's spinning bird kick. Second is because you want to keep your opponent guessing. If the only time you ever crouch is when you are going to throw Chun-Li's fireball, they'll see it every time. If you crouch and bring it into a variety of moves, you can freely use those spcials without making it easy for your opponent to guess your tactics. Third, moves will go over your head and open the door for you to attack.

Moderator
Posted by BagManForHire

it takes time to get good at the game i remember hating SF:2 when it came out but i really got into SF:3TS and went back and learned how to play it just takes time you'll get there be patience.

Posted by RHCPfan24

I am not playing Street Fighter IV until I get my arcade stick in the mail, which should probably be by next week. I don't want to begin learning one way how to play it and then abandon it shortly after. For now, I have Dead Space to play. But to the TC, I suck at fighting games too, but as many people say, find a friend that is good at this stuff, or just practice. That is pretty much the only way to improve.

Edited by Kratos81

I was hated on yesterday for saying the exact thing, altho I can beat the game on medium with no problems {except for able and seth those cheap bastards} almost all the time. The only moves I have problems pulling off are the supers, dont know why they were the same for ken ryu in sf3 alpha, and I had no problems. I am enjoying the game, Im pretty good online its not near as laggy as I was expecting. I was a master at sf3 alpha so I  picked this up quickly except for the problems I mentioned.

Posted by Keeng

I haven't played the game yet but I totally understand your complaint. The barrier to entry is why fighting games are considered niche. My advice to you (if SFIV is anything like other fighters...which it is) is to keep banging your head up against that wall. Seriously. Getting pwned is just part of the growing process. You seem to have the inputs down already so it's basically just a matter of you getting into learning patterns, timing, and tactics (i.e. when to use these awesome combos the game teaches you and why you should use them at those times). I can't say if the game is at fault for not telling people that type of info, but if it is, most games that can be played competitvely are also at fault. They give you controls but not strategy. 


Oh and "That's not how you fight. Stop crouching." made me laugh out loud. 

Good luck!
Posted by super_machine

kotaku posted a video that shows you can beat the entire game on easy by just repeating the high kick over and over.

Posted by Shadow

OH OH OH PICK ON ME TEACHER!  I keep tricking myself into getting excited for this game.  Every time I do, I go download that trial of Super Street Fighter 2 Turbo HD Remix thinking I'll suddenly realize the amazing nature of the game, but then I play it and realize "oh wait...that's right...this game sucks".  Everyone keeps ranting and raving about how awesome the new game is and I keep almost wanting to just go out and pick it up, but I have to keep reminding myself that I absolutely hate the game.

Posted by Keeng

@shadow


I know what you mean. You have to keep in mind that fighting games, even the mad sweet ones, are totally for fighting game fans. It's not the kind of thing where a person can say, "Oh this is awesome and everyone should pick it up." That's straight up not true about any fighting game. I bought SFIITHDR (wtF?) and liked it a bit, but it was still a fucking SNES game.
Posted by Cheapoz

I beat the game on Very Easy last night, I feel friggin accomplished.

Posted by BoG

I can understand you quitting if you can't beat easiest. To unlock Sakura, I just threw fireballs. That's it. I didn't go down once.

Moderator
Posted by PowerSerj

I'm having a bit of trouble too, this being my first SF. I've been using Sagat basically the whole time I've been playing (5+ hours), and even after spending a lot of time in practice mode and trials and player matches, I keep getting beaten by the 9 billion Ryu players in ranked matches. I'm gonna keep at it, though, because I'm really liking the game so far.

Posted by Alex_Murphy
Shadow said:
I keep tricking myself into getting excited for this game.  Every time I do, I go download that trial of Super Street Fighter 2 Turbo HD Remix thinking I'll suddenly realize the amazing nature of the game, but then I play it and realize "oh wait...that's right...this game sucks".
What? You're trying to tell if you will like a game by playing a demo for a DIFFERENT game? That's like playing Resident Evil 2 to see if your going to like RE5. I have HDremix and I'm never going to play it again because SF4 blows it so far out of the water that it's over the horizon and off my radar.
Posted by Systech

Crimson Viper is a bitch to fight with E. Honda. I naturally get frustrated, but I am really loving it.

Posted by TomA

Ya this is why i don't play Street Fighter,cause it's way too hard,and it's boring because of that.

Posted by HairyMike87

I'm sure you will get better with time. If you really are enjoying the game, stick with it. Don't get yourself down if there are people who can destroy you or else I would have quit a long time ago. Play with friends locally or online to practice the combos and in time, you'll be good and get addicted.

Posted by Diamond

I can see how new players might be turned off by the difficulty even if they're having fun otherwise.  I'm not a great SF player, I can beat SF4 on medium, but not without continuing, and depending on which player I pick, I can have real problems beating Seth on Easiest, and occasionally lose against other fighters.

Posted by StaticFalconar

Don't expect to super good at it when you begin; just about every fighting game i ever played was more fun the longer I played it due to learning the new system and how it all fits in.


If people do nothing but crouch all the time, then do an overhead move.

Whatever, I'm glad people are playing SF4 or fighting game general, but just like an FPS, it isn't for everybody so if you don't find enjoyment that's just you.

Posted by TeflonBilly

Man, I shudder at the thought of you people playing Garou or Third Strike and whatnot. :P

I love the game, but I can totally get where you're coming from. I remember when I imported the first Street Fighter 2 on the SNES from Japan.
In that game, your ending got longer and better the harder you played it and the better you did and I almost always got my ass whupped by Sagat.
It's the main reason my SNES controllers has teeth marks in them. I know it sounds like a pain in the ass, but usually a good fighter should just click with you at a certain moment. Hell, I still haven't gotten into Guilty Gear or King Of Fighters after trying for awhile.

Posted by DrRandle

I... The internet... not.. .flaming me? What... what is this madness?

Any case, For some reason all of these comments have pushed me into wanting to play more and get better. That's. This is unwarranted. It's amazing. And I thank you.

Tomorrow I'll sit down and make myself get better with Abel.

Posted by wefwefasdf

Ryu for life!!!! 

Posted by Keeng
DrRandle said:
"I... The internet... not.. .flaming me? What... what is this madness?

Any case, For some reason all of these comments have pushed me into wanting to play more and get better. That's. This is unwarranted. It's amazing. And I thank you.

Tomorrow I'll sit down and make myself get better with Abel.
"
Street Fighter IV is bringing gamers together. You get a room full of people whose asses are sore from constant kicking and all of a sudden they're out of flame. It's kinda nice. 
Posted by BoG
DrRandle said:
"I... The internet... not.. .flaming me? What... what is this madness?

Any case, For some reason all of these comments have pushed me into wanting to play more and get better. That's. This is unwarranted. It's amazing. And I thank you.

Tomorrow I'll sit down and make myself get better with Abel.
"
Crap, you guys, as a moderator I can't allow this to happen! Oh wait, I'm supposed to encourage good behavior, aren't... oh well.
Giant Bomb is a new kind of internet forum. WE ROCK. Also, you should most assuredly try and get better, and join the tournaments that should be going on all the time for the next little while around the site. The more the merrier!
Moderator
Posted by Dauragon

Yeah pretty much, to get better at a fighting game (or an older school style fighting game I should say) you have to get your shit wrecked constantly. It may not seem like it at first, but with every loss you walk away with valuable knowledge.  If you walk right into a dragon punch to the jaw, I bet you would try to avoid that in the next match. Getting good at a fighting game, especially a street fighter game, doesn't happen over night. You just have to keep at it, and after a while you are doing crazy combos and supers out the ass. :D

Posted by gla55jAw

Listen, you CANNOT get any Street Fighter game down in your first day of playing. You really have to practice. Find 1 character that you like and just keep playing as them until you get better, start on easy and make your way through the difficulties. I'm pretty good with Ken and I still can't do his Hard Challenges. It takes time to learn the stragedy in this game. Sometimes I destroy people online and sometimes I get wrecked. You really have to be into Street Fighter to enjoy it. I love it tho.

Posted by RozzleDozzle
DrRandle said:
"I... The internet... not.. .flaming me? What... what is this madness?

Any case, For some reason all of these comments have pushed me into wanting to play more and get better. That's. This is unwarranted. It's amazing. And I thank you.

Tomorrow I'll sit down and make myself get better with Abel.
"
I have been seeing a lot of posts similar to yours in the SF4 forums, and all I can say is what I said to everyone else: practice. And just for future reference, Abel is a really hard character to play. If you are new to the series, you might want to learn some of the basics with Ryu. He is a very well-rounded character, and you will learn a lot from practicing with him.

SF is a great series in that you get what you put into it. The more you play it, the better you get. And it's fun! When you are challenged, and you finally beat it, you know that you are getting better! That is why the series is held on such a high pedestal. It is easy to jump in and have fun at any level, but hard to master.
Posted by sickVisionz
Keeng said:
"The barrier to entry is why fighting games are considered niche"
I'm not good at fighters, but SF4's barrier to entry is way harsher than the other games i've played like Marvel vs Capcom 2, X-Men vs Street Fighter, Street Fighter 2, Dead or Alive, Tekken 2, Tekken 3, Tekken Tag Tournament, Project Justice, etc.

Everyone likes a challenge, but this game borders on being like Ninja Gaiden where its so difficult that its unfun.  But honestly, Ninja Gaiden isn't even this tough.  Playing SF4 on medium is like playing Gaiden on the second hardest difficulty setting.  I keep reading people saying that SF4 was like the game that was gonna return fighters to the masses and bring them back in popularity somewhat.  I can't see that happening.  I think it's gonna be the nail in the coffin for most non-fighter fans.  They'll put it on very easy, get beat mercilessly and realize that the genre isn't for them.
Edited by TeflonBilly

Dude, I love the VS games and was a huge fan of Tekken 3, but those game scrape the bottom of the barrel in depth compared to stuff like Third Strike, Virtua Fighter or Garou. I really don't mean that in an elitist way even if it sounds snobbish.

The game isn't perfect, but I wouldn't compare it to the masochism that was hard Ninja Gaiden.
You won't master it in two days. Hell, I've played these games for close to two decade and am still at 0.33 in win ratio online. I still get utterly destroyed a few times by Zangief or Seth in the second round on Medium in the arcade mode. It sounds like a chore, but it's very rewarding when you finally get it.
This may sound harsh, but all the people who give up after two days can just leave if they don't have the stomach to try bettering themselves in the game for a bit. As I said earlier in this thread, some games just take awhile to click with you. I remember hating Street Fighter 3 and not getting the hang of the parrying system on a regular basis and having to choose my Super before the match. But as soon as I got the hang of it, it was awesome.

Posted by TheWiFiJedi

Dude I totally feel ya,  Im not doing to well at it either its a good game but damn its hard!

Posted by Kratos81
sickVisionz said:
"Keeng said:
"The barrier to entry is why fighting games are considered niche"
I'm not good at fighters, but SF4's barrier to entry is way harsher than the other games i've played like Marvel vs Capcom 2, X-Men vs Street Fighter, Street Fighter 2, Dead or Alive, Tekken 2, Tekken 3, Tekken Tag Tournament, Project Justice, etc.

Everyone likes a challenge, but this game borders on being like Ninja Gaiden where its so difficult that its unfun.  But honestly, Ninja Gaiden isn't even this tough.  Playing SF4 on medium is like playing Gaiden on the second hardest difficulty setting.  I keep reading people saying that SF4 was like the game that was gonna return fighters to the masses and bring them back in popularity somewhat.  I can't see that happening.  I think it's gonna be the nail in the coffin for most non-fighter fans.  They'll put it on very easy, get beat mercilessly and realize that the genre isn't for them.
"
I agree, I have been playing sf since sf2 was new in arcades. I had to take all the skills I aquired over the years and add to them to be good at this game, and the only character i seem to be good with is akuma online. If I had never played a sf game before the difficulty would have turned me off. This is a tuff game it is not a button masher, I have practiced my ass off and either I easily win online or just plain get my ass kicked. only a very few times have I played games where the skill is equal. Tuff game, but I love it.
Posted by Jolly_Lolly

Dude, no, you don't even know how badly I want this game. I came this fucking close to buying SF2HDROMGWTF but I made myself get over it.

Now this, this behemoth is out on every game shelf, just mocking me with its awesomeness. I just hate it because I don't want to devote my entire life in order to be good at this game (also why I don't really like RPG's).

Now if there were 30 hours in one day, maybe....

Posted by Arkthemaniac

Don't worry, I don't feel Street Fighter 4 either.


Though, aren't you supposed to play it?
Posted by LiquidPrince

The game is sold out everywhere on the PS3...

Posted by Keeng

Am I the only one who didn't find Ninja Gaiden hard (or good)? 


Anyway, yeah, fighting games are bitch hard. It just goes with the territory and it's worse with SFIV because this is a hard fighting game that mimics another decade old game. It's like your only way to practice is by playing other people but most of the other people who give a damn have been playing since the 90s. 

sickVisionz said:
"Keeng said:
"The barrier to entry is why fighting games are considered niche"
I'm not good at fighters, but SF4's barrier to entry is way harsher than the other games i've played like Marvel vs Capcom 2, X-Men vs Street Fighter, Street Fighter 2, Dead or Alive, Tekken 2, Tekken 3, Tekken Tag Tournament, Project Justice, etc.

Everyone likes a challenge, but this game borders on being like Ninja Gaiden where its so difficult that its unfun.  But honestly, Ninja Gaiden isn't even this tough.  Playing SF4 on medium is like playing Gaiden on the second hardest difficulty setting.  I keep reading people saying that SF4 was like the game that was gonna return fighters to the masses and bring them back in popularity somewhat.  I can't see that happening.  I think it's gonna be the nail in the coffin for most non-fighter fans.  They'll put it on very easy, get beat mercilessly and realize that the genre isn't for them.
"
You make a good point. I know a lotta people have been buying this game but the difficulty will inevitably put them off. I heard the same complaints about SCIV (online) but there's still a thriving population of hardcore players and noobs still trying to improve. The genre won't ever be what it was in the days of arcades in the US, but the online scene is alive and kicking--no pun intended. 
Posted by sickVisionz

I still enjoy the game.  After practicing for like 3-5 hours a day since tuesday and reading online, I played the arcade mode on easy and feel like i'm ready to step up to the normal setting now.  The only match I had a really hard time with was my rival fight, and even then I only had to do it like 4 times before I won (compared to like 25 times yesterday and still not doing good at all).  I think I lucked out by not having to fight Zangief, Abel or Rufus though, but still I feel like i've gotten alot better.


However, I don't think the non-fighting game fan who picks this up is gonna be willing to invest 3-5 hours a day for weeks on end and spend most of that time staring at that damn training stage trying to do one move on a regular basis for hours on end.

They missed a real opportunity, imo, by not letting you actually see a training move combo pulled off successfully.  If you could do that, it'd be alot easier to see what you're doing wrong.  It'd be even better if your inputs showed up while you're in that mode... and super better if the cpu's input's showed up when they showed you the example.
Posted by SathingtonWaltz

Why spend 3-4 hours a week training in a fighting game, when you could spend that time training in real martial arts instead! :D

Posted by TeflonBilly
Keeng said:
"Street Fighter IV is bringing gamers together. You get a room full of people whose asses are sore from constant kicking and all of a sudden they're out of flame. It's kinda nice. "
Haw haw, nice. It is true though. I don't think I've ever chatted with or exchanged messages with so many nice people on XBLA than I have with SFIV.
It's like everybody's been humbled so much that they've lost their braggadocio and just wanna shoot the shit or say a quick thanks for a cool match.
Posted by TeflonBilly
SathingtonWaltz said:
"Why spend 3-4 hours a week training in a fighting game, when you could spend that time training in real martial arts instead! :D"
Hurr durr, why don't you learn to play drums and guitar instead of playing Rock Band.
Why don't you join the army instead of playing Call Of Duty 4.
Why don't you stick your head in the toilet instead of playing Super Mario Bros?
Posted by Jolly_Lolly
TeflonBilly said:
"SathingtonWaltz said:
"Why spend 3-4 hours a week training in a fighting game, when you could spend that time training in real martial arts instead! :D"
Hurr durr, why don't you learn to play drums and guitar instead of playing Rock Band.
Why don't you join the army instead of playing Call Of Duty 4.
Why don't you stick your head in the toilet instead of playing Super Mario Bros?
"
Unsuccessful troll is unsuccessful.

*hits troll with stick*
Posted by TeflonBilly

What the hell? Troll?
I'm just pointing out the fallacies in his stupid ass comment.

Let's break it down to another medium then.
Why watch Heat when you can just go rob a bank?
Why watch Titanic when you can just sink a ship?
Why watch Evil Dead 2 when you can just chop your hand off and replace it with a chainsaw?

Posted by Keeng
TeflonBilly said:
"What the hell? Troll?
I'm just pointing out the fallacies in his stupid ass comment.

Let's break it down to another medium then.
Why watch Heat when you can just go rob a bank?
Why watch Titanic when you can just sink a ship?
Why watch Evil Dead 2 when you can just chop your hand off and replace it with a chainsaw?
"
I hope/think the guy that started this whole line of thought was being sarcastic.
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