EXTomar's forum posts

#1 Edited by EXTomar (4445 posts) -


Keep in mind that a lot of that the details have passed into history and legend so who knows what happened. I personally missed out on the blow up and don't care beyond the interesting history. (Lets get Ken Burns to make a documentary about it!) And that generation that loathes Riot Games are really old where new players these days have no clue about that legacy stuff and is more passed around as a meme.

Speaking of meme, the whole "mystery of Icefrog" is a long running thing because he wields so much power and yet seems to operate from the background. So someone like Cyborgmatt, who is very knowledgeable and seems to have inside insight into a lot of thing game's workings gets accused of being Icefrog which of course Cyborgmatt would say "I am not Icefrog" which people would say "Of course that is exactly what Icefrog would say! So when is Techies coming?" Hell I think people have accused Brad of being Icefrog. :)

If people have been tracking this phase of The International, the interesting thing to note here is that all teams are embracing radically different meta. All of the teams have been holding in their "pockets" ways to use rarely picked professional heroes (at pro levels) to try to get some advantage which has caused some unusual matchups. If you would have told me a couple of weeks ago that Faceless Void and Skyrath Mage would be picked (and banned) so much while powerhouses of TI3 like OD and Viper would be ignored or have a bad record I would have been wondering what you were seeing because previous tournaments really didn't show it.

#3 Posted by EXTomar (4445 posts) -

Isn't the joke about Metal Gear Solid series is that it has nothing to do with Metal Gear tech itself?

#4 Edited by EXTomar (4445 posts) -

@l44 said:

As a neutral who plays both depending on which friend plays what, the Dota 2 community is much more actively hostile towards League than the other way round but both are as equally aggressive within themselves. Comparing the games themselves is apples and oranges, both play very differently and have emphasis in different things. Your thoughts are great keep it up.

There is deep and bad history behind that where much of it has now passed onto "legend". A lot of this is speculative but the story goes....

The core of it is that "back in ye olden days", DOTA was being built and maintained by multiple people where, like many other free projects, it was just simply passed around when someone got tired of it or couldn't keep up with it or just wanted to add one thing or whatever. As time went on, the engine that ran the game (Warcraft 3: The Frozen Throne) was really showing its age and limitations (running out of ways to add heroes, running out of ways to code abilities and skill shots, etc). Should DOTA stay with the limitations or go "next gen"? There were good arguments for both but the guys who ran the original "DOTA All-Stars" web site which was the primary source for DOTA for years thought they should go with the "next gen" solution. These (2?) guys started Riot Games and promised to keep the spirit of DOTA with a new game called League of Legends.

People were excited and Riot seemed to take suggestions and feedback from "DOTA All-Stars" site and community as League continued to fill out. What happened next and why is still kind of a mystery: There are accusations that there was some controversy in the design and technical decisions made in early League of Legends and wanted to squash any descent. There are some accusations that it was purely a financial move because the biggest competitor to League of Legend was DOTA. There are even some accusations that they simply forgot about it and some coder just did it on his own. One day the "DOTA All-stars" site disappeared and redirected visitors to League of Legends site instead. On the one hand, they were technically owners of the site and could do what they wanted with it but on the other hand, if you loved DOTA now you could not get access to information and notes that have been built up for years about DOTA. After a bit it was restored but a bunch of things where missing: Posts around League of Legend feedback was the most obvious. Notes and suggestions about new heroes were missing as well which really irritated some when these later showed up in LoL. There are rumors other things created by the community but are missing and subsequently used by Riot.

Riot Games with LoL was really hitting the big time. Meanwhile a plucky little company called Valve was interested in doing something MOBA so they went straight to "the source" invited Icefrog to Valve HQ. At the same time another plucky little company called Blizzard was also thinking about doing something with MOBAs and "remembered" the progenitor of all of this stuff was actually running on their own game. And again it is kind of a mystery what was going where it appeared like Riot Games was also making moves to secure the rights to anything and everything called "DOTA" while Blizzard pointed out that by their EULA any mods run on Warcraft 3/War3:TFT was actually theirs while Valve was basically saying "Icefrog is the author and maintainer of DOTA, neither of you guys have rights too it".

A few legal moves later, Blizzard and Valve come to an agreement that is roughly: Valve can call their game Dota 2 but they must remove all references to Blizzard IP and Valve will not interfere with Blizzard working on its own MOBA (Heroes of the Storm). We can see this in Dota 2 today with complete model and effects reworks for Skeleton King Wraith King and name changes like Windrunner Windranger. It should not be lost on people how Riot Games is basically left out in the cold.

So yeah, there is a bit of animosity that seems to go one way between Dota 2 towards LoL. There is an entire "generation" of Dota 2 players who consider themselves wronged or refugees by Riot Games. At this point I don't know or really care who is "right" where instead I think this could be a fascinating book if someone jumped in and did deep research into what happened.

#5 Posted by EXTomar (4445 posts) -

I don't see the this story (or non-story as some complain) as much of "is this or that true" but that again Microsoft doesn't seem to understand that their representatives should deliver a consistent message especially on future features. A sales guy I know who does network hardware sales has advice on this guys at Samsung and Google also live by: As bad as it is you have to announce that they have to cancel a feature in a product that exists today, it is actually worse to announce you are canceling a feature that never existed. Another who has recently retired gives corollary advice: Whatever it is, never appear in public like you don't know. Ending up in a situation where people are giving differing or contrary statements indicates someone does not really know what is going on. If you know it is being canceled or don't know then they should simply say "We are looking into it and will announce our plans for it in the future".

As for GB and Patrick, I do not come to Giantbomb.com for news. Hell I don't go any of the normal sites for news where instead I rely on aggregation and message boards. In fact I would rather see Patrick make an article on how messed this situation is instead of whether or not Microsoft did or did not cancel a promised feature that may or may not exist.

#6 Edited by EXTomar (4445 posts) -

@def said:

@extomar: This is not how they make games over there. So yes, I am very sure.

Hence why I said "like" multiple times. And I'm sure you are correct that on Nintendo's moon base where they sequester their teams of developers that they will never get a chance to look at or know what the hot games people are playing or get inspiration from other places.

#7 Edited by EXTomar (4445 posts) -

@bisonhero said:

@bigjeffrey said:

who to believe?

Though would not be surprised if it is scrapped.

If they blindsided Charla with this news, that would be hilarious, in an incredibly sad sort of way.

But yeah, could just be that this whole thing isn't true.

That has been a theme throughout the xbox one as well: Two people who are supposed to be able to speak on authority saying two different things. It leaves people confused which is what we have now where no one is sure who is correct.

#8 Posted by EXTomar (4445 posts) -

This is a big bummer but also not surprising. Something that will help Microsoft level or recoup costs are licensing fees and rental/sale of development hardware. If they went forward with this plan then that cuts another revenue stream off or makes it a much smaller one.

This isn't a major problem where other platforms have this restriction but it does make indie development have another hurdle to jump over.

#9 Edited by EXTomar (4445 posts) -

Are you sure it isn't the other way around? It feels like Skyward Sword was built by a team that looked at games like Skyrim and tried to add that those elements to Zelda. Quests with a ridge log structure that were meaningless. Trying to do an open world that wasn't really an open. Crafting that was worthless. Zelda doesn't necessarily need these things and yet they were in the game and didn't really work out.

#10 Posted by EXTomar (4445 posts) -

Mustard is my "go to" condiment. Its fat free and works on anything that ketchup works with.