@ThePickle: Over here "Fanny" is not a word used in polite conversation, but Americans throw it around all the time. Should you stop using that word because we get offended by it? No, that would be crazy. However, if the site which you use said "You can't say this word" then you don't say that fucking word. That's not having double standards, that's common sense. If you don't like it: Find another website. Regardless of your opinions on these slurs, they have been deemed unacceptable. The word cunt has not.

I'm not usually one to post a gif and walk away but this sums my feelings up on the whole deal all too well:

Why cant people be more creative with their insults? At this point, Mega64 are the only people really innovating in that field.

"Downy Clown ass Fuck's", "Blue Cheese baby" and my personal favourite, the completely ridiculous "You suck a man dick"

Step it up, people.

@ThePickle said:

@Dagbiker said:

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep: So even though the word is as offensive to a larger group of people, just because the staff has not said it's an unacceptable word you are totally fine tossing it around like it's any other word?

Man, I love double standards.

How is that a double standerd, he probably thinks the same with every word. if they banned "bunny rabbit" tomorrow he would probably stop using it, until then, he will continue to use it.

It's a double standard because the offensive term for one group is unacceptable but the offensive term for another is perfectly fine. Words with the same impacts and offensiveness are being treated differently. When two things that are the same are being treated differently we call that a double standard.

As I mentioned in my last reply, this argument doesn't really work when you apply international subjectivity.

@Brodehouse said:

Straightforward, almost all the people here know Ryan isn't a bigot, and yet they're offended anyway.

From what I can tell, most of the people in this community have accepted Ryan's apology and certainly don't view him as a bigot. It seems to me that people are riled up about the group that is advocating the use of hate speech as an okay thing to do, as long as it's out of context.

I'm not usually one to post a gif and walk away but this sums my feelings up on the whole deal all too well:

Also I wish Hitman was still here.

Discriminatory language makes it easier to commit crimes against someone because we no long see them as human, we just see them as a slur. I completely and understand not wanting it used on the forums or comments.

I'm not convinced that shunning them as a society is the right answer. When we make a word taboo we are giving that word far more power than it deserves to have. Look at the word fuck. There was a time when it was taboo to use. Now everyone one uses it, from 11 year olds on PSN/XBL/PC to old catholic grandmothers on their death beds. Just ignoring the words takes away there power.

I want to go ahead and apologize for anything I might say that offends anyone in the future.

@N7 said:

@MikkaQ said:

I'm not usually one to post a gif and walk away but this sums my feelings up on the whole deal all too well:

Just sitting there, with an awkward look on your face?

Hahaha give me time, like I said, not usually one to post a gif. I had to dig out my HTML tag cheat sheet.

Although that that still is my reaction to most things that happen on these forums.

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

@Dagbiker said:

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep: So even though the word is as offensive to a larger group of people, just because the staff has not said it's an unacceptable word you are totally fine tossing it around like it's any other word?

Man, I love double standards.

How is that a double standerd, he probably thinks the same with every word. if they banned "bunny rabbit" tomorrow he would probably stop using it, until then, he will continue to use it.

It's a double standard because the offensive term for one group is unacceptable but the offensive term for another is perfectly fine. Words with the same impacts and offensiveness are being treated differently. When two things that are the same are being treated differently we call that a double standard.

As I mentioned in my last reply, this argument doesn't really work when you apply international subjectivity.

But doesn't f*g mean a cigarette over there? And international subjectivity shouldn't. It's a word that carries the same weight as the words that are now banned. It doesn't matter if it's not a global thing. Do people use fanny to demean or disrespect others the same way these words do? If so, then not banning it is a double standard.

@dr_mantas said:

@stryker1121 said:

@shivermetimbers: "Bitch" doesn't have the hateful baggage of "faggot." I don't get offended by much of anything, but to argue this point to the tune of 1K posts on the other thread, when the solution is something is simple as respect toward one another, is baffling to me.

Respecting one another is a wonderful solution. I do believe, however, a list of "forbidden words" is never a good solution.

Then what's the solution? Some words carry a long, painful and even murderous history among certain groups that have been shat upon for years. Bitch or cunt don't have same meaning as f*ggot or n*gger or kike for that matter. People around here can talk about censorship and their precious right to free speech, but they're right to free speech can take a flying fuck if it's hurting someone. IDK, it seems pretty obvious to me. Do unto others...etc.

Fuck yeah censorship

I just want to touch on the subject of context for a second. Yes, saying "Ryan said ****** on the Lantern Run" is very different to saying "You're a fucking ******", and we'll naturally deal with those offences in different ways. Initially I was firmly against imposing a straight up ban on that word. If people want to mention the word in an entirely non offensive context and do not promote the usage of that word, I was fine with it. For example, if someone were to say "****** is a horrible word. People shouldn't discriminate" - there is clearly no malice, discrimination or hate in that sentence. The person is denouncing the word and it is certainly not going to cause offence to anyone.

HOWEVER: It has become clear that the use of that word in such instances where offence is neither intended nor caused has lead to other people believing it is OK to use it in a context which does have the potential to offend. As such, we need to take a zero tolerance policy on it's usage. Obviously punishments will vary depending on context - if someone uses it with malicious intent they will most likely receive an instant suspension. If someone mentions the word in a context clearly unintended to cause offence they'll likely just receive a reminder of the rules. But the usage of that word in any context leads to issues with other people using it in other contexts, so we have had to take this stance. I hope you guys understand why we've had to take these steps.

@jyluth said:

@Brodehouse said:

Straightforward, almost all the people here know Ryan isn't a bigot, and yet they're offended anyway.

From what I can tell, most of the people in this community have accepted Ryan's apology and certainly don't view him as a bigot. It seems to me that people are riled up about the group that is advocating the use of hate speech as an okay thing to do, as long as it's out of context.

There seems to be three different people posting here, people who agree that the forums is no place for the hate speech. People that think that you should be able to say anything you want. And people that are angry about the ""double standard.""

Wow I had no idea the community would get so worked up about this issue. It's surprising since I generally don't see anyone speaking in a derogatory manner here. Sarcastic and passive aggressive, yes but hardly any outright use of insensitive words.

It actually surprised me that some people feel the use of certain words are okay as long you don't mean it or are using it jokingly. Coming from a bullied childhood I completely understand why such words would affect certain people. I find myself appalled now as to how would you go about explaining to someone who was the bully?

@MattyFTM said:

I just want to touch on the subject of context for a second. Yes, saying "Ryan said ****** on the Lantern Run" is very different to saying "You're a fucking ******", and we'll naturally deal with those offences in different ways. Initially I was firmly against imposing a straight up ban on that word. If people want to mention the word in an entirely non offensive context and do not promote the usage of that word, I was fine with it. For example, if someone were to say "****** is a horrible word. People shouldn't discriminate" - there is clearly no malice, discrimination or hate in that sentence. The person is denouncing the word and it is certainly not going to cause offence to anyone.

HOWEVER: It has become clear that the use of that word in such instances where offence is neither intended nor caused has lead to other people believing it is OK to use it in context which does have the potential to offend. As such, we need to take a zero tolerance policy on it's usage. Obviously punishments will vary depending on context - if someone uses it with malicious intent they will most likely receive an instant suspension. If someone mentions the word in a context clearly unintended to cause offence they'll likely just receive a reminder of the rules. But the usage of that word in any context leads to issues with other people using it in other contexts, so we have had to take this stance. I hope you guys understand why we've had to take these steps.

I understand and respect the decision. It's not my decision to make.

However, one note: zero tolerance policies rarely work out they way they are intended to. Good luck anyway.

@Animasta said:

@spartanlolz92 said:

@Animasta said:

@Brodehouse said:

@Hailinel

@Brodehouse said:

It's just empowering a word. Actually, it just appears to be an easy out for judgement calls. An adult can tell if someone is being hateful or not by the context of the situation. A censor script cannot. We've decided to stop being adults and just assume that a single word is more important than the dozen before or after it. That's Goddamn foolishness. Empowering words over meanings, what a bag of piss. The fact that this issue is so well-worn in western culture but this site pretends that it's a shocking new development baffles me.

Did you understand a even single thing Gamer_152 said? A single goddamn thing?

Yes, I did. The rule was always "don't be a dick". That's a rule that makes sense. But separating words outside of meaning is something a script would do. "Don't be a dick". You can be a complete racist without uttering any slurs, you can be perfectly neutral while doing the opposite. Saying that "in these cases, context doesn't matter" is wrong, I'm sorry, but it's wrong. Context is all that matters, otherwise Kanye West is Grand Wizard of the KKK.

it's still not your right to tell people to stop being offended, it's not your word to reclaim, and it doesn't impact you so you have no idea how hateful it can be; even a completely innocuous use.

also context is not magic

im pretty sure all of as human being have been offended in some way or have been hated at somepoint in our life. i may not be of the same sexual orientation or race as somebody else but have they ever had a disability and been called any of the derogatory terms that come with it. the point that he is trying to make is that words mean nothing the sooner you accept that the better off you are and the happier you will be.

ablest speech is terrible too, but to tell others to not be offended is unrealistic. humans are emotional creatures, we aren't robots. sometimes someone can say something that just hurts. It'd be nice for people to be able to say whatever they want and not have it taken as a slur against anyone, but to put that on the people who are slurred against and not the people who slur against them is victim blaming bullshit.

@Brodehouse: what's wrong with salem? it's a pretty cool place

I believe he's talking about the salem witch trials.

@supamon said:

It's surprising since I generally don't see anyone speaking in a derogatory manner here.

Stay here long enough and you'll see a lot of it.

@Hailinel said:

In a way, I'm glad that this happened, because this has forced Giant Bomb and the community to take a good, hard look at the language that's been spouted off here. This is a website that should be welcoming to all; not stuck in the mindset of a preadolescent shithead that has no idea how society at large functions. Unfortunately, this incident has brought out the latter in a lot of people.

Well said.

People defending the use of the word by saying context is everything also forget one very important detail. Giant Bomb is an international community. Just because Americans represent the majority of the audience doesn't mean there aren't people from all of the world visiting. I heard there's Canadians around these parts or worst yet Brits like Sweep!

Cultural differences can make a whole lot of differences to one's understanding of the context. I'm not a native english speaker and i don't always understand the context in certain discussions. I'm not stupid, i'm not purposefully trying to be offended, it's just not my native language, like many others around here. Even if you're a native english speaker, this is the internet we're talking about. People do not have high standards when it comes to grammar...

And while context is important, dropping the N-bomb of F-bomb would never be an issue in the first place if homophobia or racism didn't exist at all. There are probably some very progressive country in the world where being a member of the LGBT community is no bigger a deal than breathing oxygen to stay alive. You grow up in a place like this and might not be aware of the damage the F-bomb can do when said in places where being a member of the LGBT community is not exactly unicorns and rainbows all the time.

whatever, it's not like many people use that word here anyway :\ 
 
this whole thing is dumb and we should probably get past it already

While I can't identify with zero tolerance, I think it would be easier to get on board with a script that changes all instances of banned language to mundane household objects.

While I don't really have a dog in this fight, I can see both sides of the argument, I can't help be reminded of the Cartoon Wars episode of South Park, censorship of any kind is definitely a slippery slope. We are seeing it already, with people bringing up other words and questioning why they are allowed. Ultimately, the rules of the forum are what they are, they are set by the mods and the staff. If people don't like them or find them unfair they are free to leave.

Man, these last few days have really exposed the Giant Bomb community for what it is: hypocritical, insensitive, and juvenile.

@Sweep: I would just like to say that Americans do not use the word "fanny" all the time. :P

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

@Dagbiker said:

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep: So even though the word is as offensive to a larger group of people, just because the staff has not said it's an unacceptable word you are totally fine tossing it around like it's any other word?

Man, I love double standards.

How is that a double standerd, he probably thinks the same with every word. if they banned "bunny rabbit" tomorrow he would probably stop using it, until then, he will continue to use it.

It's a double standard because the offensive term for one group is unacceptable but the offensive term for another is perfectly fine. Words with the same impacts and offensiveness are being treated differently. When two things that are the same are being treated differently we call that a double standard.

As I mentioned in my last reply, this argument doesn't really work when you apply international subjectivity.

But doesn't f*g mean a cigarette over there? And international subjectivity shouldn't. It's a word that carries the same weight as the words that are now banned. It doesn't matter if it's not a global thing. Do people use fanny to demean or disrespect others the same way these words do? If so, then not banning it is a double standard.

Yeah, and we also have these. And yes, fanny is considered offensive, though only mildly. So you think whiskey media should try to be politically correct for the entire world, their entire international audience? That's fucking insane.

What they have done is adopt a set of rules that apply to everyone. To try and impose any other ruleset is impossible, unreasonable, and niave.

Reminds me of that whole Luis Suárez thing, the footballer who was charged by the FA for "abusive and/or insulting words and/or behaviour contrary to FA rules", including "a reference to the ethnic origin and/or colour and/or race of Patrice Evra." - Same deal here. Even though the word was fine in his own language, and the league is full of international players, the FA made the call. That's not double standards, either.

As I stated in Ryan's blog, I can understand being offended by something if he used the word to say some hateful message about the homosexual community, but I can't really understand why the word by itself would be considered offensive. This site uses the word "bitch" constantly, couldn't that offend women that use the site?

@SpikeSpiegel said:

@Sweep: I would just like to say that Americans do not use the word "fanny" all the time. :P

Well you should probably start. That shit is hilarious.

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

Can any mods make sense of why cunt is a perfectly fine thing to say but these words aren't?

Cunt is offensive, sure, but it doesn't have the same connotations that make racial or homophobic slurs unacceptable. It's not a word designed to offend based on prejudice. It's just really fucking rude.

It attacks a specific group of people. How is it any different than these other words? And "really fucking rude" might just be the understatement of the century.

Does it? Which group? In England it means fuck all. It's the same as calling someone a dick.

In the US it is the worst thing you can call a woman.

Haha I don't think I have ever actually said it directly to a woman. That would be a cunt thing to do!

It's fun seeing a mod toss around a word like cunt, which is easily as offensive as the words in question, and laugh about it.

I don't have to justify my behaviour to you or to anyone else - I have been moderating this site a long time and posting here even longer, so I don't think anyone would be suprised by the way I conduct myself. If I was told by the staff that saying "cunt" was unacceptable then I would stop saying it when I use the site out of respect for them, even if I didn't agree with the decision. That hasn't happened yet, fortunately, so I don't need to worry about it.

Feel free to bring it up with Snide if you want. Send him a PM.

I think if you want to draw a line and say "here is what can be said on Giant Bomb" that is fine as you have to draw the line somewhere and there is always going to be someone who thinks it should be stricter. But in the context of this thread it is kinda lame, especially for a mod, to make a cheeky cavalier joke about a word that a lot of people find offense and derogatory even if it is on the other side of the line that Giant Bomb has decided to draw.

@BraveToaster said:

@supamon said:

It's surprising since I generally don't see anyone speaking in a derogatory manner here.

Stay here long enough and you'll see a lot of it.

Well not outright hostile and not to anyone who didn't ask for it.

@Brodehouse said:

@Hailinel

@Brodehouse said:

@BrockNRolla

I am completely appalled at the defense force that seems to come out every time someone uses homophobic or racial slurs. "They're just words," "You have to look at the context," "He didn't mean anything hateful."

Bullshit. It largely doesn't matter how the words are used. It doesn't matter if you find them offensive. You do not live in a vacuum where the world reflects your thoughts and opinions. Using words like "Faggot" or any other slur are inappropriate. There are a whole lot of people out there who would be offended. There isn't a constructive way to use those words. They aren't empowering anyone. The words are meant to convey hatred. If you are using them to do that, then you've used the word appropriately. Otherwise you're just being an ignorant asshole with no care at all for those around you.

We need not use such words. We just don't need to. It isn't a matter of censorship, its a matter of decency. Take two-seconds to just think about how your words might effect someone. Try to caring about someone other than yourself. And if you say something hurtful, apologize. Simple as that.

Context ALWAYS MATTERS. It's the only thing that takes language from noises to communication. Words are worthless without context. You can get mad, offended, whatever, but when you say that context is worthless you are leaving the realm of rationality. Straight up. Context is EVERYTHING.

So if I called you a racial or homophobic slur, it's all right for me to do so as long as I can claim you didn't understand the context behind my usage of the word?

Because that's fucking stupid.

Yeah, your situation you've invented and then blamed me for would be ridiculous, I think that's why you invented it. There's no easier way to make me unreasonable than invent unreasonable situations and accuse me of approving of them. If you called me a slur, I'd have to look at the context. My friends call each other slurs all the time, I know they're not racists (except for Adam). That would depend on how it was used, and what I know about you. Others would do the same thing. Maybe you're a bigot, probably you're not and just being offensive to be offensive. That social intelligence is all we have, if we start saying that ANY use of X word makes you a bigot/racist/whathaveyou, we're ignoring the thing that made us even capable of language. Straightforward, almost all the people here know Ryan isn't a bigot, and yet they're offended anyway. That doesn't make sense. If they think Ryan is a bigot, absolutely be offended, but that's not what's happening here. They're empowering a word more than the actual meaning. Among strangers, yeah they probably won't understand that you're not a bigot, you should wait until you have a rapport/persona that they can draw context from. But that's not what's happened here. I don't feel I'm being unreasonable.

News flash: You don't personally get to dictate the power words hold over others. If I call a woman (or a man) a cunt, even in a joking manner, I shouldn't be shocked if I receive an overtly hostile response of any sort. But by your logic, I should be just fine because, oh hey, I was joking when I said that. Sorry, but reality doesn't play that way.

People on GB have become desensitized to the word because lol Vinny, but it's still a highly offensive term.

@AhmadMetallic said:

@SpikeSpiegel said:

Man, these last few days have really exposed the Giant Bomb community for what it is: hypocritical, insensitive, and juvenile.

I never understand these posts. Someone walks in, calls the community out for being so and so, drops a fullstop at the end and leaves the thread. What the hell are you talking about? Who is being " hypocritical, insensitive, and juvenile" and how? Or do you just enjoy lining up a mouthful of adjectives?

I hope you know, your part of the community too.

Context ALWAYS MATTERS. It's the only thing that takes language from noises to communication. Words are worthless without context. You can get mad, offended, whatever, but when you say that context is worthless you are leaving the realm of rationality. Straight up. Context is EVERYTHING.

@AhmadMetallic said:

@SpikeSpiegel said:

Man, these last few days have really exposed the Giant Bomb community for what it is: hypocritical, insensitive, and juvenile.

I never understand these posts. Someone walks in, calls the community out for being so and so, drops a fullstop at the end and leaves the thread. What the hell are you talking about? Who is being " hypocritical, insensitive, and juvenile" and how? Or do you just enjoy lining up a mouthful of adjectives?

I thought my point was fairly obvious, but maybe I should have been more clear. I did not mean that the entire community is those things, but the last couple days have definitely brought out those users.

We have the users who are obsessed with the context of the word (I don't know if we are even allowed to type it now).

We have the users who really don't care about how words harm others and only care about shouting "No censorship!"

I also find it amusing that this is the first word that has been given a this sort of ban considering the common use of other offensive words on these forums.

Like I said, hypocritical, insensitive, and juvenile.

Why are you trying to start shit with me, Ahmad?

@TentPole said:

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

Can any mods make sense of why cunt is a perfectly fine thing to say but these words aren't?

Cunt is offensive, sure, but it doesn't have the same connotations that make racial or homophobic slurs unacceptable. It's not a word designed to offend based on prejudice. It's just really fucking rude.

It attacks a specific group of people. How is it any different than these other words? And "really fucking rude" might just be the understatement of the century.

Does it? Which group? In England it means fuck all. It's the same as calling someone a dick.

In the US it is the worst thing you can call a woman.

Haha I don't think I have ever actually said it directly to a woman. That would be a cunt thing to do!

It's fun seeing a mod toss around a word like cunt, which is easily as offensive as the words in question, and laugh about it.

I don't have to justify my behaviour to you or to anyone else - I have been moderating this site a long time and posting here even longer, so I don't think anyone would be suprised by the way I conduct myself. If I was told by the staff that saying "cunt" was unacceptable then I would stop saying it when I use the site out of respect for them, even if I didn't agree with the decision. That hasn't happened yet, fortunately, so I don't need to worry about it.

Feel free to bring it up with Snide if you want. Send him a PM.

I think if you want to draw a line and say "here is what can be said on Giant Bomb" that is fine as you have to draw the line somewhere and there is always going to be someone who thinks it should be stricter. But in the context of this thread it is kinda lame, especially for a mod, to make a cheeky cavalier joke about a word that a lot of people find offense and derogatory even if it is on the other side of the line that Giant Bomb has decided to draw.

I agree with this, it kinda pisses on the entire op.

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

@Dagbiker said:

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep: So even though the word is as offensive to a larger group of people, just because the staff has not said it's an unacceptable word you are totally fine tossing it around like it's any other word?

Man, I love double standards.

How is that a double standerd, he probably thinks the same with every word. if they banned "bunny rabbit" tomorrow he would probably stop using it, until then, he will continue to use it.

It's a double standard because the offensive term for one group is unacceptable but the offensive term for another is perfectly fine. Words with the same impacts and offensiveness are being treated differently. When two things that are the same are being treated differently we call that a double standard.

As I mentioned in my last reply, this argument doesn't really work when you apply international subjectivity.

But doesn't f*g mean a cigarette over there? And international subjectivity shouldn't. It's a word that carries the same weight as the words that are now banned. It doesn't matter if it's not a global thing. Do people use fanny to demean or disrespect others the same way these words do? If so, then not banning it is a double standard.

Yeah, and we also have these. And yes, fanny is considered offensive, though only mildly. So you think whiskey media should try to be politically correct for the entire world, their entire international audience? That's fucking insane.

What they have done is adopt a set of rules that apply to everyone. To try and impose any other ruleset is impossible, unreasonable, and niave.

Reminds me of that whole Luis Suárez thing, the footballer who was charged by the FA for "abusive and/or insulting words and/or behaviour contrary to FA rules", including "a reference to the ethnic origin and/or colour and/or race of Patrice Evra." - Same deal here. Even though the word was fine in his own language, and the league is full of international players, the FA made the call. That's not double standards, either.

If it's only a mild curse then it shouldn't be banned. And sorry, I have no idea what a Luis Suarez is.

You have still not answered my original question: why is cunt acceptable but f****t and n****r aren't? Why draw the line there? Doing so is a textbook example of a double standard, quit trying to make it an international thing. You've just showed me the word does not have the same power over there as it does here. Just because British women won't be offended doesn't mean American women won't either and the word over here has the same power as the words in question here. It shouldn't matter if it only applies to those in a certain region.

And what about Ryan's constant use of "Jesus Christ" and "goddamnit"? What about the Christian GBers?

@TentPole said:

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

Can any mods make sense of why cunt is a perfectly fine thing to say but these words aren't?

Cunt is offensive, sure, but it doesn't have the same connotations that make racial or homophobic slurs unacceptable. It's not a word designed to offend based on prejudice. It's just really fucking rude.

It attacks a specific group of people. How is it any different than these other words? And "really fucking rude" might just be the understatement of the century.

Does it? Which group? In England it means fuck all. It's the same as calling someone a dick.

In the US it is the worst thing you can call a woman.

Haha I don't think I have ever actually said it directly to a woman. That would be a cunt thing to do!

It's fun seeing a mod toss around a word like cunt, which is easily as offensive as the words in question, and laugh about it.

I don't have to justify my behaviour to you or to anyone else - I have been moderating this site a long time and posting here even longer, so I don't think anyone would be suprised by the way I conduct myself. If I was told by the staff that saying "cunt" was unacceptable then I would stop saying it when I use the site out of respect for them, even if I didn't agree with the decision. That hasn't happened yet, fortunately, so I don't need to worry about it.

Feel free to bring it up with Snide if you want. Send him a PM.

I think if you want to draw a line and say "here is what can be said on Giant Bomb" that is fine as you have to draw the line somewhere and there is always going to be someone who thinks it should be stricter. But in the context of this thread it is kinda lame, especially for a mod, to make a cheeky cavalier joke about a word that a lot of people find offense and derogatory even if it is on the other side of the line that Giant Bomb has decided to draw.

Yeah, well, I'm a bit of a twat. Welcome to Giant Bomb.

You can't just pick and choose what flies and what doesn't. Hate speech is hate speech. This entire "f****t-gate" situation has become a joke to me because it has shown me how one-sided the community, and apparently some mods, are about it all. Go all the way or don't even bother. Defend and protect against all bigoted comments or enjoy being a hypocrite. The fact that you can be so up in arms about this and let so much else slide makes this whole argument fall flat on its face.

If f****t goes, then so does c**t. I don't care that you are from a different country, it is still hugely offensive to a massive population. And don't even get me started on all of the nasty things that are said in any thread that brings up religion. Once all of these things are treated fairly and equally I'll take you seriously, but until then just don't even try. It's disgusting.

@Brodehouse: newsflash; no one hates vinny or ryan for their language choices

@ZombiePie said:

@LordAndrew said:

I think people might have had an easier time understanding if it wasn't considered A-OK to casually utter the word "cunt", one of the most shocking and offensive words available today. Where is the line drawn?

The line gets drawn when the staff say that they don't want users posting that word on the forums. That's happened with the homophobic slur that Ryan said, but it has not happened to the C-word.

In that case the argument being made amounts to no more than "follow the rules", which is fine, but a completely different issue as to the right or wrong behind it. You could say "don't use nouns" and it would have as much legitimacy as the argument you just made for 'f*****' being one side of the line and 'cunt' being the other.

@Subjugation said:

You can't just pick and choose what flies and what doesn't. Hate speech is hate speech. This entire "f****t-gate" situation has become a joke to me because it has shown me how one-sided the community, and apparently some mods, are about it all. Go all the way or don't even bother. Defend and protect against all bigoted comments or enjoy being a hypocrite. The fact that you can be so up in arms about this and let so much else slide makes this whole argument fall flat on its face.

If f****t goes, then so does c**t. I don't care that you are from a different country, it is still hugely offensive to a massive population. And don't even get me started on all of the nasty things that are said in any thread that brings up religion. Once all of these things are treated fairly and equally I'll take you seriously, but until then just don't even try. It's disgusting.

To be fair, they pick and choose according to their audience and people that surround them. And on a video game site, let's face the facts here, you are much more likely to encounter a gay man, rather than a woman.

@Brodehouse said:

@Hailinel

@Brodehouse said:

@Hailinel

@Brodehouse said:

@BrockNRolla

I am completely appalled at the defense force that seems to come out every time someone uses homophobic or racial slurs. "They're just words," "You have to look at the context," "He didn't mean anything hateful."

Bullshit. It largely doesn't matter how the words are used. It doesn't matter if you find them offensive. You do not live in a vacuum where the world reflects your thoughts and opinions. Using words like "Faggot" or any other slur are inappropriate. There are a whole lot of people out there who would be offended. There isn't a constructive way to use those words. They aren't empowering anyone. The words are meant to convey hatred. If you are using them to do that, then you've used the word appropriately. Otherwise you're just being an ignorant asshole with no care at all for those around you.

We need not use such words. We just don't need to. It isn't a matter of censorship, its a matter of decency. Take two-seconds to just think about how your words might effect someone. Try to caring about someone other than yourself. And if you say something hurtful, apologize. Simple as that.

Context ALWAYS MATTERS. It's the only thing that takes language from noises to communication. Words are worthless without context. You can get mad, offended, whatever, but when you say that context is worthless you are leaving the realm of rationality. Straight up. Context is EVERYTHING.

So if I called you a racial or homophobic slur, it's all right for me to do so as long as I can claim you didn't understand the context behind my usage of the word?

Because that's fucking stupid.

Yeah, your situation you've invented and then blamed me for would be ridiculous, I think that's why you invented it. There's no easier way to make me unreasonable than invent unreasonable situations and accuse me of approving of them. If you called me a slur, I'd have to look at the context. My friends call each other slurs all the time, I know they're not racists (except for Adam). That would depend on how it was used, and what I know about you. Others would do the same thing. Maybe you're a bigot, probably you're not and just being offensive to be offensive. That social intelligence is all we have, if we start saying that ANY use of X word makes you a bigot/racist/whathaveyou, we're ignoring the thing that made us even capable of language. Straightforward, almost all the people here know Ryan isn't a bigot, and yet they're offended anyway. That doesn't make sense. If they think Ryan is a bigot, absolutely be offended, but that's not what's happening here. They're empowering a word more than the actual meaning. Among strangers, yeah they probably won't understand that you're not a bigot, you should wait until you have a rapport/persona that they can draw context from. But that's not what's happened here. I don't feel I'm being unreasonable.

News flash: You don't personally get to dictate the power words hold over others. If I call a woman (or a man) a cunt, even in a joking manner, I shouldn't be shocked if I receive an overtly hostile response of any sort. But by your logic, I should be just fine because, oh hey, I was joking when I said that. Sorry, but reality doesn't play that way.

People on GB have become desensitized to the word because lol Vinny, but it's still a highly offensive term.

Could you do me and everyone else a favor and drop the sarcasm? Can you respond without acting smarmy and condescending? I treat your argument with respect and you talk to me like that? Do you want to have a discussion, or do you just want to make snide comments from the sidelines? Once again you're inventing a scenario and then raking me for it. I don't appreciate it. I could say a million crazy things and attribute them to you, but I'm not going to. Did I say that I hold the power to decide how people react? No, I didn't. Did you respond to any of the points I articulated? No, you didn't. It makes sense to be upset over how someone is treating you. If they're being mean or prickish to you, yeah it makes sense to be offended and upset. The cunt situation makes sense that they know some people would hear it and jump to the conclusion that Vinny hates women. Keep in mind, they're still friends with Vinny EVEN THOUGH HE SAID CUNT. Because they know he doesn't hate women. If cunt is a sexist word, and Vinny said cunt, then by the transitive property Vinny must be sexist. But we're not children, we know better. We know it's more complicated than that. We hate sexism, and racism, and homophobia, and all forms of bigotry. But the use of a word we've associated to bigotry does not make the user a bigot. And we're left in a situation where people hate Ryan and Vinny despite nether of them being sexist or homophobic. Crude yes, bigots no. If you want to be offended by crudeness, you're within your rights. I'll be offended by ACTUAL racism and homophobia. By actual mistreatment of people. That's my right as well.

You did not treat my argument with respect. You shunted it to the side and said I invented it to make you look bad, when in fact that is exactly how I interpreted your argument. That it's all right to use such language even though the target of your words doesn't necessarily know your not intending offense. If I make the word bitch, or cunt, or f***** a part of my regular vernacular and go about using it as a common reference to anyone I meet, that does not excuse me if, in the course of my standard interaction, I cause offense to someone. If I go about calling everyone cunts with equal regard, that does not mean that someone that takes offense to that word has no right to feel offended by my usage of it, nor should I feel unapologetic regarding the offense I cause.

@Jimbo said:

@shivermetimbers said:

As I stated in Ryan's blog, I can understand being offended by something if he used the word to say some hateful message about the homosexual community, but I can't really understand why the word by itself would be considered offensive. This site uses the word "bitch" constantly, couldn't that offend women that use the site?

Of course, but you have to realise that it's not that most people are against the use of these words on principle, or based on any kind of coherent logic. They're against their use because the societal bubble they exist in has collectively decided that these specific words are off-limits, and they don't want to be judged negatively by the people around them for using or condoning them (no matter how random the logic behind that judgement is). For most it's about protecting their own image, not about protecting the people the words are derogatory against.

There is no logic whatsoever which makes 'faggot' off-limits but makes the use of 'bitch' or 'cunt' ok - that's just how it is apparently. It should go without saying that it's completely fucking inane to remove posts simply because the words have been used in the course of discussing the use of said words, but that's about par for the course.

That's more than a little cynical and off base, IMO. How about people don't use those words b/c those words have a long history of causing pain for very specific groups of people? I keep repeating myself here, but "cunt" and "bitch" don't have anywhere near that baggage.

@Sweep said:

@ThePickle said:

Can any mods make sense of why cunt is a perfectly fine thing to say but these words aren't?

Cunt is offensive, sure, but it doesn't have the same connotations that make racial or homophobic slurs unacceptable. It's not a word designed to offend based on prejudice. It's just really fucking rude.

Sorry, but this is just completely false. Where do you think 'cunt' as an insult stems from? It's every bit as derogatory against women as 'f****' is against gay people.

I honestly have no idea why so much shit is being stirred up over nothing. So Ryan slipped up on live camera and said a word he shouldn't have, big fucking deal, it happens all the time. I honestly do not understand why this community cannot just let the past be the past and have left it with Ryan's apology, but no, now there are 15 fucking threads about the same thing. Additionally, as with many here, i am INCREDIBLY confused by the double standard being established allowing "cunt" to remain in use but the N-word and F-word are completely out. Cunt carries pretty much the same weight in the realm of sexism that the word Ryan uttered does in the realm of homophobia. Additionally, i'm aware cunt does not have the same impact across the pond as it does here, but that could really matter less according to the logic you guys are using for banning the F-word and N-word. Like the others Cunt is a tool used for prejudice and you should either allow all words or none related to intolerance in any way shape or form.

@AhmadMetallic said:

@SpikeSpiegel said:

Man, these last few days have really exposed the Giant Bomb community for what it is: hypocritical, insensitive, and juvenile.

I never understand these posts. Someone walks in, calls the community out for being so and so, drops a fullstop at the end and leaves the thread. What the hell are you talking about? Who is being " hypocritical, insensitive, and juvenile" and how? Or do you just enjoy lining up a mouthful of adjectives?

I thought my point was fairly obvious, but maybe I should have been more clear. I did not mean that the entire community is those things, but the last couple days have definitely brought out those users.

We have the users who are obsessed with the context of the word (I don't know if we are even allowed to type it now).

We have the users who really don't care about how words harm others and only care about shouting "No censorship!"

I also find it amusing that this is the first word that has been given a this sort of ban considering the common use of other offensive words on these forums.

Like I said, hypocritical, insensitive, and juvenile.

Why are you trying to start shit with me, Ahmad?

@AhmadMetallic said:

@SpikeSpiegel said:

Man, these last few days have really exposed the Giant Bomb community for what it is: hypocritical, insensitive, and juvenile.

I never understand these posts. Someone walks in, calls the community out for being so and so, drops a fullstop at the end and leaves the thread. What the hell are you talking about? Who is being " hypocritical, insensitive, and juvenile" and how? Or do you just enjoy lining up a mouthful of adjectives?

I hope you know, your part of the community too.

I agree that a lot of people got out of control in that thread and those are the kind of people who shouldn't be on this site anyway so I'm fine with moderating them. However, I do think there is a big difference between calling someone a racist/homophobic slur and using the word in another context. Is there really any difference between saying the "n-word" or the actual word? Anyone who reads that posts know what you're saying. 
 
Let me be clear that there are very, very few instances where I would say using the word would be okay. But having a full-stop rule of "this word is banned and if you say it, you get moderated" doesn't seem to really be helping anything. Also, let me make it clear, that I'm not one of those "it's just a word" people. I think there's a way to be mature and responsible about this but yeah, the comments on Ryan's post are certainly not it.

@Jimbo said:

@ZombiePie said:

@LordAndrew said:

I think people might have had an easier time understanding if it wasn't considered A-OK to casually utter the word "cunt", one of the most shocking and offensive words available today. Where is the line drawn?

The line gets drawn when the staff say that they don't want users posting that word on the forums. That's happened with the homophobic slur that Ryan said, but it has not happened to the C-word.

In that case the argument being made amounts to no more than "follow the rules", which is fine, but a completely different issue as to the right or wrong behind it. You could say "don't use nouns" and it would have as much legitimacy as the argument you just made for 'faggot' being one side of the line and 'cunt' being the other.

If they wan't to make sure no absolutely sure no one gets offended this site is going to become really lame, really fast. So they have to draw the line somewhere and let "don't be a jerk" carry it from there on out. This is probably as good of place as any.