Why Do I Loathe PoP and XBLA Achievement Issues

In my ever-expanding quest to gain those lovely achievement points, I decided to head down to my beloved local Games 'n' Things to pick up a new game...since they still happen to offer super low ass prices.  What to buy, though?  We all end up facing that problem at some point:  staring at the endless line of games at our favorite local boutiques when we know damn well we shouldn't even be spending the money anyways, but there's that void that needs to be filled with a new interactive experience.  In other words - I was fucking fiending, fool!!!  Three F's in a row there...did I unlock an achievement?


I can't lie...I caught myself staring a few times...
Anyways, I was originally walking in because I remembered seeing a used copy of Sacred 2 for around $30.00, which after doing some hearty research, I've come to realize it's a game that I REALLY want to play...glitches and bugs and all.  However, they sold it.  -_-  Damn.  Luckily, I had noticed a copy of Prince of Persia for $18.95 and said "dood, that's hard to pass up, and I've been talking about how I want to play it...so let's rock".

......I really did give the game a chance.  Two chances, actually.  I just couldn't get into it.  I'm not saying it's a bad game.  I'm just saying it's not for me.  I loved the trilogy, but the lack of multi-enemy combat and a general sense of "meh" while playing it just weren't boding well.  The 1v1 combat felt dull and repetitive, the lack of decent depth of field and bad camera angels...I could go into a tirade of issues that I personally have with the game, but I just don't think you'll want to read all that shit.  Plus, I need to save room for this...

Unreal Engine 3 - now with 75% less texture pop-in...I hope!
Shadow Complex is a game that I'm seriously looking forward to ever since I had heard about it at E3.  I know that's not a very long time to get excited over a game, but between the use of Orson Scott Card's Empire as source material and the fact that it's a 2D side-scrolling asskicker like Metroid and Castlevania, I'm psyched.  It'll probably end up being the first Arcade game that I buy which isn't featured on a compilation disc...along with 'Splosion Man.  Nonetheless, I have this issue that some other people seem to agree on:  why the Hell is this FULL GAME at $15 only coming with 200 achievement points?  I know, I know...it's a small complaint to many that don't seem to give a shit.  However, just because YOU may not give a shit, that doesn't make it less of a problem.  It just means you don't care what the result is.  There are those of us who think that it IS a problem.  So, here's my argument, bare with me and see what you think:

Terminator Salvation is a $60 retail game that lasts around 4 to 5 hours on the hardest difficulty and comes with 1000 points for achievements.

Bionic Commando Rearmed is a $10 downloadable game that lasts 3 to 4 hours on the hardest difficulty and comes with 200 points for achievements.

Where do we draw the line?  I understand that one is a licensed property and the other is a remake.  Nonetheless, what makes a game any less full than another game?  Looking at games like Battlefield 1943, Shadow Complex, Braid, Bionic Commando Rearmed...as well as re-releases like Duke Nukem 3D, Doom, Castlevania: SOTN...

I'm just saying that it's starting to feel a little uneven for completionist gamers out there.  The main reason I bring this up is because I know damn well I'm going to buy Shadow Complex, but I'm going to be pissed when those 200 points are completed...because I will know that there should be more.

Oh, Chow...I missed you so...
With that said, achievements update:  due to my lack of interest in Prince of Persia, I decided to pick up a game that I always wanted to play but never did - Stranglehold.  As a martial arts and Hong Kong flick enthusiast (I'm not the biggest of fans, but I know enough to hold up against other enthusiasts), I owed it to myself to finally see what John and Chow had to offer...and I like it.  Is it great?  No.  Is it fun?  Sure.  Does it have achievements?  Fuck yes.  Amazingly enough, there were actually a couple of people online the night that I started playing!!!  So I even got a couple of those rare achievements for the multiplayer.  = D  I'm going to be breaking 30K soon, but I need to figure out what game to do it with.  Anyone have suggestions?

Until next time...PIECE!!!
34 Comments
34 Comments
Posted by jakob187

In my ever-expanding quest to gain those lovely achievement points, I decided to head down to my beloved local Games 'n' Things to pick up a new game...since they still happen to offer super low ass prices.  What to buy, though?  We all end up facing that problem at some point:  staring at the endless line of games at our favorite local boutiques when we know damn well we shouldn't even be spending the money anyways, but there's that void that needs to be filled with a new interactive experience.  In other words - I was fucking fiending, fool!!!  Three F's in a row there...did I unlock an achievement?


I can't lie...I caught myself staring a few times...
Anyways, I was originally walking in because I remembered seeing a used copy of Sacred 2 for around $30.00, which after doing some hearty research, I've come to realize it's a game that I REALLY want to play...glitches and bugs and all.  However, they sold it.  -_-  Damn.  Luckily, I had noticed a copy of Prince of Persia for $18.95 and said "dood, that's hard to pass up, and I've been talking about how I want to play it...so let's rock".

......I really did give the game a chance.  Two chances, actually.  I just couldn't get into it.  I'm not saying it's a bad game.  I'm just saying it's not for me.  I loved the trilogy, but the lack of multi-enemy combat and a general sense of "meh" while playing it just weren't boding well.  The 1v1 combat felt dull and repetitive, the lack of decent depth of field and bad camera angels...I could go into a tirade of issues that I personally have with the game, but I just don't think you'll want to read all that shit.  Plus, I need to save room for this...

Unreal Engine 3 - now with 75% less texture pop-in...I hope!
Shadow Complex is a game that I'm seriously looking forward to ever since I had heard about it at E3.  I know that's not a very long time to get excited over a game, but between the use of Orson Scott Card's Empire as source material and the fact that it's a 2D side-scrolling asskicker like Metroid and Castlevania, I'm psyched.  It'll probably end up being the first Arcade game that I buy which isn't featured on a compilation disc...along with 'Splosion Man.  Nonetheless, I have this issue that some other people seem to agree on:  why the Hell is this FULL GAME at $15 only coming with 200 achievement points?  I know, I know...it's a small complaint to many that don't seem to give a shit.  However, just because YOU may not give a shit, that doesn't make it less of a problem.  It just means you don't care what the result is.  There are those of us who think that it IS a problem.  So, here's my argument, bare with me and see what you think:

Terminator Salvation is a $60 retail game that lasts around 4 to 5 hours on the hardest difficulty and comes with 1000 points for achievements.

Bionic Commando Rearmed is a $10 downloadable game that lasts 3 to 4 hours on the hardest difficulty and comes with 200 points for achievements.

Where do we draw the line?  I understand that one is a licensed property and the other is a remake.  Nonetheless, what makes a game any less full than another game?  Looking at games like Battlefield 1943, Shadow Complex, Braid, Bionic Commando Rearmed...as well as re-releases like Duke Nukem 3D, Doom, Castlevania: SOTN...

I'm just saying that it's starting to feel a little uneven for completionist gamers out there.  The main reason I bring this up is because I know damn well I'm going to buy Shadow Complex, but I'm going to be pissed when those 200 points are completed...because I will know that there should be more.

Oh, Chow...I missed you so...
With that said, achievements update:  due to my lack of interest in Prince of Persia, I decided to pick up a game that I always wanted to play but never did - Stranglehold.  As a martial arts and Hong Kong flick enthusiast (I'm not the biggest of fans, but I know enough to hold up against other enthusiasts), I owed it to myself to finally see what John and Chow had to offer...and I like it.  Is it great?  No.  Is it fun?  Sure.  Does it have achievements?  Fuck yes.  Amazingly enough, there were actually a couple of people online the night that I started playing!!!  So I even got a couple of those rare achievements for the multiplayer.  = D  I'm going to be breaking 30K soon, but I need to figure out what game to do it with.  Anyone have suggestions?

Until next time...PIECE!!!
Posted by RHCPfan24

Awesome blog, mate. I would love Shadow Complex to have more achievements because, you know, achievements are the best things in the world. The side-by-side argument is a good one; why is the way we are receiving the game the reason it is getting a smaller share? With Games on Demand arriving soon, it is going to be hard to tell the difference.

Stranglehold is also a fun game. Yeah, it wasn't great but I had a fun time with it. It got way repetitious at spots but the action was lively and there was a healthy dosage of achievements.

Posted by jakob187
@RHCPfan24 said:
" Awesome blog, mate. I would love Shadow Complex to have more achievements because, you know, achievements are the best things in the world. The side-by-side argument is a good one; why is the way we are receiving the game the reason it is getting a smaller share? With Games on Demand arriving soon, it is going to be hard to tell the difference.Stranglehold is also a fun game. Yeah, it wasn't great but I had a fun time with it. It got way repetitious at spots but the action was lively and there was a healthy dosage of achievements. "
The Games on Demand thing does mean that the distribution issue holding back more achievements from Arcade games will be an interesting and compelling one.  The only excuse at that point will be that it's on the XBLA with no retail copy available.  =  /

As for Stranglehold...yeah, it's fun.  The achievements actually make it more fun for me, much the same way they did for Crackdown or Ghostbusters.  I'm considering doing a video achievement guide for it, solely because I've found some very quick and easy ways to pull some of these single player achievements off.  = D  Then again, I still need to make videos (and actually get some of the achievements done on this Xbox account) for my World at War achievement guide.  =  /
Posted by RHCPfan24
@jakob187: Yes, the only reason I could see them argue about XBLA is that that is the only option to buy it. Nonetheless, we are feeling squeezed when it comes to points. Expand!! Expand!!

Stranglehold was fun though. I played it awhile ago (2007) and I remember, before trading it in, I tried to get a lot of achievements I missed. I got the weird, funny ones like knocking down the entire T-Rex fossil but I should have tried the multiplayer ones as well. I am very surprised you found anyone online.
Posted by Claude

Fuck, I was hoping you would have picked up Sacred 2, just curious about that game.

Posted by Everyones_A_Critic

I completely agree with you, arcade games need 1,000 achievement points. Having "200" just sitting there in your recent games list just looks weird, especially if it's surrounded by 900-1,000 scores.

Edited by The_A_Drain

I honestly disagree. I mean, sure not all of them, but a large amount of downloadable games are short and don't offer an awful lot of room to flesh out 1000 points. Sure, some do but those larger games are exceptions, not the norm.

I honestly think that for a $60 retail game that comes with 1000, 5 smaller games each coming with 200 for about the same price works out about just fine imo.

I'm a huge acheivement whore, but somehow I just reckon most XBLA games would feel very very hollow with 1000 points, especially stuff like say, Worms, or Monkey Island for example, they are already clutching at straws for their achievements, giving them 1000 just means they have to spend more time programming for almost no reason in order to track more things, that or they simply use the same achieves but boost the score up, which makes no difference the number just gets bigger.

Besides, it's kinda nice the way 12 acheivements fit nicely on the one card next to the game when you're browsing. Maybe that's just me, but yeah I feel there should be a tough stance drawn on this stuff whatever the case, problems happen when MS make rules and don't stick to them. As we've seen prior to the 1k rule, and now with popular games being given leeway to have more achievements than others.

I still feel cheated Sega didnt put out an update for Condemned, it's not so much the fact it's onyl got 8something, but that i'm missing 2 and i'm too afraid to go back and get them because theres a glitch that gives you the same achieve over and over again because it doesnt registers, but it still registers that you've earned it, people have glitched millions of GS this way, somehow it actually ups your score :S So yeah, I dont want that glitch to happen and to get banned so i'm never playing it again lol.

Edit: Just to add to that, achievement glitches that don't get fixed irk me more than any achievement amount issue ever could. Games like Command and Conquer 3, the above mentioned condemned, and tons tons more with glitched achievements piss me off so much, especially ones that are difficult, they make me not want to even play the game.

Posted by CanuckEh

Well...the issue about Achievements is that if your $5 Arcade game has the same quantity of points as your $60 game, then the Achievement Point-hoarding nutcases would just buy every $5 Live Arcade game) and load up on points faster. Which goes against the company's preferred approach of those same people loading up on the $60 games instead.

Posted by jakob187

Both Canuck and A Drain bring up good points each.  By no means am I saying that EVERY Arcade game should have 1,000 points.  Peggle just doesn't need that many...maybe.  Actually, let me pick a different game.  LOL  Geometry Wars doesn't need 1,000 points.  200 fits it quite well.


However, look at games like Battlefield 1943, Shadow Complex, Bionic Commando Rearmed, and other games that are pretty big titles.  While I haven't played Shadow Complex, I'm willing to bet they could've EASILY come up with 1,000 achievements points worth of achievements for that game, and I can easily EASILY guarantee that 1943 could come up with them in no time.

Therefore, the question is less "shouldn't all Arcade games have 1,000 achievement points" and more "when the game is so big that it's almost blending the point between Arcade game and retail release, should it get some of the benefits of a retail release"?

Personally, I'm thinking that the number of achievement points should be directly related to the size of the game, the content it holds, and the price it costs.  It only seems fair.  Again, though, this is such an aesthetic argument that it's really more of a nitpicking thing.  I mean, for $15, I'm sure that Shadow Complex and Battlefield 1943 are super badass deals.  Nonetheless, part of the price we end up paying is for achievements REGARDLESS...so again, for those of us who are mad about completion in ALL aspects (although as usual, I'll say that my gamerscore completion rate doesn't necessarily say that...but I can tell you that I AM a completionist fanatic)...it does become something we have to look at.

Honestly, arguing or even trying to justify this is like trying to say "well, Roger Clemens was a great pitcher even BEFORE we was on steroids".
Edited by The_A_Drain
@jakob187:

I honestly still think that it depends on the retail price. The ratio adds up nicely and no matter the size of the game, I feel they have to be fairly distributed otherwise like everything else in this world, they become unfairly abused by publishers.

If a game retails for $10 imo 200 points is a fair distribution model, although some arcade games are indeed huge and 1000 points would fit them quite well, allowing any of them to actually have 1000 points gives that game an incredibly unfair advantage over others on the service. Extra sales is nearly always a good thing, but you can guarantee lawsuits would popup.

One suggestion I would support however, wholeheartedly, is more than 12 achievements, cramming everything from a big game into 200 points can be a bit of a shame, handing out more of them still sates the completionist giving them more to complete, but it doesnt disrupt the balance or cause lawsuits :D

I still think it all comes back to retail price though imo, games at 1600+ points, and approproatte size and length, should be given the option of having 400 points. But I still feel that 4 to 6 games to the rpice of a full retail $60 is a nice weigh in and makes them about the same. If Terminator Salvation is short as hell, that doesnt necessarily mean that some XBLA games are as big as retail games, it means Terminator barely qualifies as a retail game :P imo anyhow.
Posted by jakob187
@The_A_Drain said:
"One suggestion I would support however, wholeheartedly, is more than 12 achievements, cramming everything from a big game into 200 points can be a bit of a shame, handing out more of them still sates the completionist giving them more to complete, but it doesnt disrupt the balance or cause lawsuits :D "
I could get behind more than 12 achievements easily, even though it would make the distribution of points a little awkward.  I don't know why, but it's just something that's driving me nuts.  I want to buy Shadow Complex...I ABSOLUTELY want to buy it...and I WILL buy it...but at the same time, I know I'm going to play through that game and end up going "200 points just isn't enough for this thing".  I'm not going to lie when I say it's the sole reason I haven't dropped points down for 1943.  Hell, I think there are more than 200 points in the multiplayer of Bad Company and Modern Combat!!!

There's really no right or wrong to it all, just what each person wants and thinks.  =  /  It's kind of a shitty situation, eh?
Edited by The_A_Drain
@jakob187:

Oh yeah definately there's no right or wrong to it. But for the moment it looks like even if retail prices goes up for XBLA games, they won't be implementing any more points unfortunately. Mayhaps you should wean yourself off them and go for the completion percentage instead? :D
 
Edit: Multiplayer achieves are a different discussion :D imo they shouldnt even exist, i'm out 400 points on Double Agent because nobody plays. I had to waste 6 hours of my like grinding out the last 300 in Prey because nobody plays, I havnt even looked at The Darkness etc etc etc. Imo Modern Warfare got it right by having a seperate system of awards and ranks, but no actual achievements.
Posted by jakob187
@The_A_Drain: But achievements are so damn tasty, sir!  They are smothered in chocolate and peanut butter!  I just can't get enough!!!  *scratches neck*

I'm totally trying to work on my completion percentage, but I'm a conflicted human being.  I want to get EVERYTHING in the games...but I also want to play so many different games.  It's such a tough balancing act.  I've gotten to the point that if I pull at least half of the game and/or 500 points, I'm usually satisfied enough to know that I'll pick it back up at a later date.  lol

I just bought Phantasy Star Universe for $8 this morning.  Does that make me a bad person...knowing that it's got a pretty streamlined 1000 points?
Edited by The_A_Drain
@jakob187:

Hell no, it's enjoyable for that kinda cash. I'm a huge fan of buying games cheap because at that price you could get, what, Worms off XBLA lol, I just got through Eat Lead and The Simpsons past couple days, tenner each and well worth it, both hella fun for that price but not for full retail.

I played a bit of PSU, I got like 5 chapters, and 400 points in but didnt finish it. It's a long hard slog i'll warn you, but its relaxing and enjoyable for the most part, only troubles are a couple of bosses and theres nothing fancy, it's a simple 100 points for each chapter. Well worth the $8 though, the only game I ever regretted for that kinda price was Too Human.

Edit:

another thing they need to do imo is start releasing retail compilations of XBLA games again, they did two and I bought them both second hand for like, £4 each, that's cheaper than one single game, even though I already owned like 4 games out of the 9 it was still well worth it. They need to do more of those compilations.
Posted by jakob187
@The_A_Drain: I enjoyed Too Human.  I need to get that again.  The only thing I didn't necessarily enjoy was the 4 hour treks through dungeons!!!  My GOD, they just never ended!!!  Then again, I never bothered going back to town or anything.  =  /  Can you even do that in the game?

I'm sure that PSU isn't going to be a simple walkthrough of 10 hours.  That's why I chose the word "streamlined", as I can stay on the straight and narrow with a mission rather than jumping off to a million side points and trying to satisfy a bunch of fuckers I don't honestly care about *cough*OBLIVION*cough*.
Posted by The_A_Drain
@jakob187:

Well, weirdly I enjoyed PSU more than Oblivion, but got sick of the repetetive missions. But I 1k'ed Oblivion :P I can't remember how long it is, but those missions go on forever too, I must have played like 5 or 6 hours and like I said only 4 or 5 missions in.
Posted by CanuckEh

should@jakob187 said:

" @The_A_Drain: But achievements are so damn tasty, sir!  They are smothered in chocolate and peanut butter!  I just can't get enough!!!  *scratches neck*

I'm totally trying to work on my completion percentage, but I'm a conflicted human being.  I want to get EVERYTHING in the games...but I also want to play so many different games.  It's such a tough balancing act.  I've gotten to the point that if I pull at least half of the game and/or 500 points, I'm usually satisfied enough to know that I'll pick it back up at a later date.  lol

I just bought Phantasy Star Universe for $8 this morning.  Does that make me a bad person...knowing that it's got a pretty streamlined 1000 points?
"
Will it help make up your mind if I told you "you can't take your Achievement Points to the grave"?
Edited by jakob187
@CanuckEh: NOPE!  I plan on being buried with chocolate and peanut butter as well.  I can take whatever I want to the grave.
Posted by The_A_Drain
@CanuckEh said:
"should@jakob187 said:
" @The_A_Drain: But achievements are so damn tasty, sir!  They are smothered in chocolate and peanut butter!  I just can't get enough!!!  *scratches neck*

I'm totally trying to work on my completion percentage, but I'm a conflicted human being.  I want to get EVERYTHING in the games...but I also want to play so many different games.  It's such a tough balancing act.  I've gotten to the point that if I pull at least half of the game and/or 500 points, I'm usually satisfied enough to know that I'll pick it back up at a later date.  lol

I just bought Phantasy Star Universe for $8 this morning.  Does that make me a bad person...knowing that it's got a pretty streamlined 1000 points?
"
Will it help make up your mind if I told you "you can't take your Achievement Points to the grave"? "

I'm taking mine lol. I'm gonna have a huge mausoleum built to house all my games, and solar powered monitors displaying action replays of my greatest achievements 24/7. And people will pay an entry fee to come see this stuff, which will go toward the "Bring The_A_Drain back to life" fund :P
Posted by jakob187
@The_A_Drain: Shit.  Your idea totally trumps mine...
Posted by CanuckEh
@jakob187: Now that's a Mother Teresa-level of generosity you're showing to the maggots waiting for ya.
Posted by jakob187
@CanuckEh: Why should the worms that return me to the nothing from which I came not get a treat once in a while?
Posted by ZombiePie

Great blog as always! Well I've been doing a little bargain hunting and was able to pick up Dead Space for $19.99, so I guess we'll see how this goes. 

Moderator
Posted by Fosssil

I completely agree with your point about increasing Achievement totals for certain Arcade games, especially in light of some recent DLC trends. I don't see how it's fair for a full $15 game like Battlefield 1943 or Banjo-Kazooie to be limited to only 200 points, when each $10 DLC map pack for Halo 3 adds another 250 points to the game's point total.

Posted by jakob187
@Fosssil: That's the other side of the good argument for increasing achievements on certain games.  Gears of War DLC, Halo 3 DLC, and even the Jedi Temple for Force Unleashed all featured 250 extra achievement points, and yet Battlefield 1943 only has 200 because it was released only via XBLA?  It seems a bit uneven at times.
Posted by GamerGeek360

I almost bought Prince of Persia over Mirror's Edge back a couple weeks ago. From what you said, I'm glad I didn't. Also, I never got into the Stranglehold game when I played the demo but I hope you enjoy it. Oh and one last thing, I stared too.

Posted by jakob187
@GamerGeek360: You gotta remember that I personally didn't dig the new PoP.  I'm not saying that it's a bad game.  It IS a good game, but my personal tastes weren't able to attach to the 1v1 combat, some of the controls, etc etc.  I would suggest checking it out.
Posted by L33tfella_H

Talking about the new PoP game...it's ok for the first few hours, but then you start realizing how linear EVERYTHING is..the fighting is really boring, the platforming can't keep me interested long enough and the story is pretty shit. One thing i will give the game is that it looks beautiful..stunning visuals but that's pretty much it.

Also, are you honestly bitching about not having enough Achievements in a game to keep you interested?
Did you play games Pre 2005?

Posted by jakob187
@L33tfella_H: Are you questioning my gaming heritage and roots?

I don't know how old you are, good sir...but I'm pretty sure I was gaming when you were still shitting in your Huggies.  I'm also one of the few human beings on the planet with 100% completion on SSX3.  That's a BEAST to complete.  I have 232% completion on Castlevania: SOTN.  I've beaten Vagrant Story 9 times and have a save file for every set of different weaponry in different forms of metal combinations.  I played Doom for two weeks straight when it was first released.  I didn't miss a single episode of Video Power.  If I had, I might've gone into con-fucking-vulsions.  I bought a Game Genie for my 8-bit...and not because of the cheat codes.  I bought it so I could actually play my Nintendo games again...as the metal contacts were trashed on most of my games and my NES.  I still own a Sega Saturn with Scud the Disposable Assassin.  I was in line for the Dreamcast launch night.  I had an Atari Jaguar and remember quite vividly the shock of amazingness I got from playing Alien vs. Predator.  I remember when the ESRB was created!!!

Needless to say...don't question my fucking gaming pedigree, good sir.  Not all of us are dumbass 12-year-olds whose first crack at games involved Kratos or driving in San Andreas.

Yes, I'm HONESTLY bitching about games which are just as big as some other full retail $60 games not getting the same achievement point treatment as those games.  Again, why should Terminator Salvation get 1000 points yet Battlefield 1943 only gets 200?  There have been good points brought up for both sides of this argument.

Forgive my hostility if I have your comments about "did you play games pre-2005" out of context...but it seriously sounds like you are trying to tell me I don't know shit about games...
Edited by L33tfella_H
@jakob187:

I Touched a pretty Sensitive Nerve, didn't i?

the fact that you wrote a 3 paragraph reply to my post kinda shows that you're taking my post way too seriously.
Posted by Keyser_Soze

Because most people played the new PoP as a challenge, it's not, it's an experience, you sit down like a movie and let the game flow. Oh and the visuals were breathtaking, I've never said "wow" so many times whilst looking at just the beauty of the game. The soundtrack is awesome too.

People expected it to be like the new Sands of Time, but Ubisoft chose to go down a whole different path, focus less on combat and more on environment, though the combat in the new PoP does get boring after a while, with focus on the same combo's over and over again.

Posted by jakob187
@Keyser_Soze said:
" Because most people played the new PoP as a challenge, it's not, it's an experience, you sit down like a movie and let the game flow. Oh and the visuals were breathtaking, I've never said "wow" so many times whilst looking at just the beauty of the game. The soundtrack is awesome too. People expected it to be like the new Sands of Time, but Ubisoft chose to go down a whole different path, focus less on combat and more on environment, though the combat in the new PoP does get boring after a while, with focus on the same combo's over and over again. "
I went into it knowing what I was getting into.  My problems with the game really are many and some of them are nitpicking.  The 1v1 combat really turned me off for the exact reasons you pointed out:  repetitive and boring.  I can only do Y X Y B Y A Y X do many times before I say "why the FUCK is the computer still failing to kick my ass".  With the PoP games, it's always been about challenge, and don't get me wrong:  some of those platforming areas were some decent challenges.  However, I don't think they were challenges for the reasons they should've been.  Instead, I was having to wrestle with the damn controls for some reason.  I would hold A to wallrun, and for some fucking reason, it would register as a jump...and when you are trying to go for an achievement where you die less than 100 times...that's no good!  This was something that occured so many times, and I just didn't understand WHY.  PoP always had great controls.  There was also this issue I had with collecting shit until I realized that I had to collect Sand in the last three...so I'm not too worried about it now.  I also didn't think that the environments were as varied as they tried to make you believe.  It was still mostly cliff walls and shit.  Then again, I only made it through two full areas (the Alchemist and the Concubine).

There's so many other things, but in the end, it's all very much my own personal things with the game.  Nonetheless, I know there is a good game in there.  It just doesn't seem to sit well with me for some damn reason.  I absolutely agree that this is ONE GORGEOUS GAME!!!  I was completely taken aback with how good the graphics looked in it...even with the jaggies.  I won't lie:  I don't think Elika would've been nearly as beautiful without the lines.  I loved the character designs as well.

I'm going to rent the game again one of these days, if just to finish out the achievements for it.  Hopefully I'll dig it more than I did this last time.

@L33tfella_H said:
" @jakob187: I Touched a pretty Sensitive Nerve, didn't i?the fact that you wrote a 3 paragraph reply to my post kinda shows that you're taking my post way too seriously. "
You questioned my gaming lineage.  What the fuck do you expect?  Was I supposed to invite you over for milk and cookies?  Also, YOU were the one that came into MY BLOG and took a swipe at me.
Posted by L33tfella_H
@jakob187:

'You questioned my gaming lineage.  What the fuck do you expect?  Was I supposed to invite you over for milk and cookies?  Also, YOU were the one that came into MY BLOG and took a swipe at me.'

A-You....Boo-Hoo.

Questioned Your Gaming Lineage...wow..that's fucking pathetic, also..i did no such thing....it was a joke you fucking scrotum, but mr.HVYWEIGHT GMR obviously didn't get it. Well done Champ!
Posted by Lind_L_Taylor
@jakob187 said:
Bionic Commando Rearmed is a $10 downloadable game that lasts 3 to 4 hours on the hardest difficulty and comes with 200 points for achievements.
You say you haven't downloaded any arcades so how the hell do you know how long they take?  I have Bionic Command Rearmed & it's no simple 3-4 hour game that gives you all the achievements!  Some of those challenge maps take forever or are pretty much impossible to get through. I think I spent 3-4 hours on one shitty challenge level & just gave up after that.  There were plenty others that I just said fuck it & skipped.

It's going to take awhile to get through Bionic Commando.  Also, if you had paid any attention in the past, you could have BOUGHT Bionic Commando for $5 when they had their weekly 50% off on it.  I bought Bionic, N+, & Ikagura for $5 each.

Anyhow, those 200 points for Shadow Complex are going to be some of the fucking hardest achievements to obtain. They've already stated their love of Bionic's challenge levels, which I hate with a passion.  So they'll be there to piss off the masses.