A patriot is someone who is willing to fight for trivial matters.
A man's country is not a certain area of land, of mountains, rivers, and woods, but it is a principle and patriotism is loyalty to that principle.
For the very reason of definition of the word Patriot, it also is justified to be called an Idiot-concept. Being willing to kill for the sake of land is idiotic. Killing is never justified, and always wrong. Yet, patriotism is seen as a good thing in most countries. I am against such moronic principles. Why? Because just as I stated above, patriotism is "hero"ism when needed. It is senseless violence, like all violence.
Sacrifice is the pinnacle of patriotism. It is counter-productive to the human species, and the world overall. Mostly considering that it causes wars.
Nationalism and Patriotism, what really is the difference? To be a patriot is to be hateful or bitter toward the rest of mankind. It is as wrong as it can get, and as instinctively human-like as it can get. In a word, counter-productive.
I don't see a reason to be patriotic to a certain country, nor paying any respect to a certain country. This separates me from a lot of people, sadly. If anything, be patriotic, but be so about the entire Earth, not just one small part of it. - Try to imagine a world where patriotism wasn't. - Nobody would want to conquer another country, and maybe, i'd say it is probable... people of one country would help people in another country that isn't having such a good time.
Patriotism may cause a country to say "No" to help with modernizing it. - Let's look at Africa, an entire continent. It is in bad shape. Who helps the continent? A lot of people. Is that enough? No. Countries able to help, should help. Instead of rejecting to help people due to patriotism, and agreeing to be helped, we would advance civilization. Clean water in Africa, running through pipes, not through rivers, which is forcing people to drink dirty water and get sick from it.. this can happen. So what are we waiting for? We are waiting for people to help people, and for the people who wants the help, to accept getting helped.
Just blaming patriotism for this may seem unfair, but it is nontheless a huge part of the problem.
A quick look back at a day when I was 7 years old, it has come to be known as 9/11. Americans attacked Iraq because apparently, they had crashed two planes into the Twin Towers, and also, apparently Iraq had weapons of mass-destruction. No weapons of mass-destruction was ever found, although reported that there was. It was a lie to go to war due to... patriotism, as a revenge for killing 3,000~ "American" citizens, they now wanted the blood of several thousands of Iraqi people who probably had absolutely nothing to do with anything at all. - I'll say this: Killing 3000 humans, then killing 3000 more in a different place does not equal square. It equals 6000 dead humans.
"Heroism on command, senseless violence, and all the loathsome nonsense that goes by the name of patriotism - how passionately I hate them!"
- Albert Einstein
-
My replies:
@gamefreak9 said:
@Yagami said:
The war was a lie, I don't need to assume, the facts speak for themselves. Mr. Hans Blix, an expert in the field, and also one of the inspectors looking for the weapons of mass-destruction has stated that none was found. You now have a new problem, one source says there is, another that there isn't. What is the best thing to do? Send more researchers to solidify the evidence, not attack
Again... NOT A LIE. They had wrong information, if I tell you something and you repeat it to someone else, your not lying ur merely spreading false information. Common sense lacking in there? Assumptions like this are worse than nationalism, they give people wrong messages, which is worse than merely enforcing messages that lots of people believe in the same land mass as you.
The war was a lie, based upon false information. The administration claimed to have gathered solid information, the information was disputed by Mr. Hans Blix as non-true as he stated that Iraq didn't (DID NOT) have access to WMD. Please, do not consult me with "common sense" here, I have a hard time not to laugh as it is.
@baconbits33 said:
@Mirado said:
@Yagami said:
Killing is never justified, and always wrong.
Clearly, you have never heard of Klondike Bars.
Honestly you constantly preach about everyone who doesn't sport your views as being counter productive, and in a way hateful. Dude you seem more hateful and counter productive than those people you accuse.My last comment on this thread: Penis and vaginal fart.
I have never heard of a Klondike bar, but am now seriously considering, with this new information about this abominable thing, to support death sentences again. - Kidding.
- Yes, some people's views are counter-productive. - I won't deny that there are people who's thoughs I hate, I don't stop them from holding them however. Nor do I call them names for doing so, with the exception for "idiot" and... way more offensive things, however they must have said something really daft for me to go into rage-mode. - In here, I am the underdog for the sole reason of my age, and due to the way I think. People tend to dislike other younger persons who they may find smarter than they are, it is a sense of self-defense I think. A way to buff themselves up, and that is fine with me. I DO actually care for these people, I pity them lots.
@McGhee said:
Creating your own definition for what patriotism is and then attacking that definition is a logical fallacy.
Also, you are kind of annoying, a far greater crime.
The definition of patriotism: A devoted love, support, and defense of one’s country; national loyalty.
There you go. It fits what I said perfectly. - I find people who does not look things up before stating things as self-created rather annoying. :3
@punkxblaze said:
I don't like you very much. I don't say this very much to very many people, but you get the honor. I do not like you, no I don't.
Good post, this brings up my next topic. - What it is? Ooooh you wouldn't want to know, so I won't say it. - It is okay to not like me, I see no reason to why you shouldn't be allowed to do that. :3
@SpikeSpiegel said:
I pity your professors. How do people become so opinionated on things they are not even well informed about?
My professors have little to say about what I should think about Patriotism, and other stuff not related to school. I make up my own mind based upon what I see, read, and learn. If I feel like I am misinformed or uneducated about a certain thing, I make sure to learn, or let the people I speak to, know that I am not well versed in whatever the subject may be. If I were you, i'd do the same. You can't just go around expecting other people to tell you what to think about everything. Surely you have your own reasons for why you think certain things? :3
@StaticFalconar said:
@No0b0rAmA said:
From now on, when you feel like you want to vent some bullshit, open up notepad and write there. Not here.
@Yagami said:
.A quick look back at a day when I was 7 years old, it has come to be known as 9/11. Americans attacked Iraq because apparently, they had crashed two planes into the Twin Towers, and also, apparently Iraq had weapons of mass-destruction. No weapons of mass-destruction was ever found, although reported that there was. It was a lie to go to war due to... patriotism, as a revenge for killing 3,000~ "American" citizens, they now wanted the blood of several thousands of Iraqi people who probably had absolutely nothing to do with anything at all. - I'll say this: Killing 3000 humans, then killing 3000 more in a different place does not equal square. It equals 6000 dead humans.
Of course, the U.S went to Iraq with the intention of killing innocent people. You seriously have no idea what the fuck your talking about.
You misunderstand the point. When I say USA went, I meant that the American people were all fired up, wanting to get to war. That is not the way to treat such a situation. Most of the American people was in favor of war.
And right there you are wrong. There were protest all through out america pointing out why we shouldn't go to war. With each passing day with more news of soldiers deaths mounting left and right, public opinion of the war only got lower.
I'll cut you off here because here is where there's a collision. - I was talking about before the war had started. Not after. I do appreciate your long post however and you have my thanks for that. - I am well aware about freedom of speech and Whiskey Media not having to let me speak. It would seem a bit unfair however as I help their sites running, and I think I should have the right to speak my mind, it is not like my intention is to kill anyone. :3 Some people may be offended, but anyone can get offended by anything.
I do not appreciate however, again, that people reword my posts as to say something I didn't say. However I was perhaps unclear but I think not when I said the majority was in favor of war. - And I just have to ask... why are there still soldiers there? Let them come home. ^.^
@AlmostSwedish said:
@Yagami said:
@oatz said:
Aren't you the guy who said we're running out of oxygen?
The very same. :3 - I also pointed out and gave evidence for that it actually does as well, you may want to check that out.
@AlmostSwedish said:
Oh geez, here we go again.
@Yagami said:
Sacrifice is the pinnacle of patriotism. It is counter-productive to the human species, and the world overall. Mostly considering that it causes wars.
Nationalism and Patriotism, what really is the difference? To be a patriot is to be hateful or bitter toward the rest of mankind. It is as wrong as it can get, and as instinctively human-like as it can get. In a word, counter-productive.
I don't see a reason to be patriotic to a certain country, nor paying any respect to a certain country. This separates me from a lot of people, sadly. If anything, be patriotic, but be so about the entire Earth, not just one small part of it. - Try to imagine a world where patriotism wasn't. - Nobody would want to conquer another country, and maybe, i'd say it is probable... people of one country would help people in another country that isn't having such a good time.
Patriotism may cause a country to say "No" to help with modernizing it. - Let's look at Africa, an entire continent. It is in bad shape. Who helps the continent? A lot of people. Is that enough? No. Countries able to help, should help. Instead of rejecting to help people due to patriotism, and agreeing to be helped, we would advance civilization. Clean water in Africa, running through pipes, not through rivers, which is forcing people to drink dirty water and get sick from it.. this can happen. So what are we waiting for? We are waiting for people to help people, and for the people who wants the help, to accept getting helped.
Just blaming patriotism for this may seem unfair, but it is nontheless a huge part of the problem.
A quick look back at a day when I was 7 years old, it has come to be known as 9/11. Americans attacked Iraq because apparently, they had crashed two planes into the Twin Towers, and also, apparently Iraq had weapons of mass-destruction. No weapons of mass-destruction was ever found, although reported that there was. It was a lie to go to war due to... patriotism, as a revenge for killing 3,000~ "American" citizens, they now wanted the blood of several thousands of Iraqi people who probably had absolutely nothing to do with anything at all. - I'll say this: Killing 3000 humans, then killing 3000 more in a different place does not equal square. It equals 6000 dead humans.
"Heroism on command, senseless violence, and all the loathsome nonsense that goes by the name of patriotism - how passionately I hate them!"
- Albert Einstein
First of all, patriotism is not about hating rest of mankind, it's about being proud of your heritage and your own country. That is not the same thing.
As such, being patriotic doesn't mean that you refuse to help other countries. On the contrary, you might be proud of you country for lending help to other countries. Similarly, why would a patriot want to hinder the technological advancement of his/her country? Wouldn't they want it to be the most "modern" country in the world, at the edge of science and technology?.
You paragraph on the situation in Africa is incredibly misinformed. A lot of help is already being provided. But you seem to think that it's as simple as giving more and more resources. It's not. A civilization that depends on others can never blossom in it's own right. Where's the incentive to grow when you don't need to? And frankly, I don't see how patriotism has anything to do with this.
People have already pointed out how you are wrong on Iraq, so I'll leave that be.
Look, I don't really see what you want to accomplish here. If you're trying to start a serious discussion, you should at least get your facts straight and not simplify matters so much. You already know how well that went over last time.
If you're interested in learning more, that's fine. But there are better ways of going about in than this.
Patriotism is about showing bitterness and hatered/dislike for other countries whereas holding highly to ones own country, and not so highly to the others. That is the same thing. - I agree with that it doesn't straight up lead into instant refusal of aiding other countries, but it plays a big part. - I am indeed proud to know that countries help eachother, but it could be so much better. - Now you touch on culture and "mordernity". Here I will have to say... No. Not all want to do with modernity, for example the middle-east. Iran does not want a civilized modern society. They want to be a medieval people. Atleast that's what one gets the impression of.
My paragraph about Africa is NOT misinformed, rather misread by you as I clearly state how different countries work together to lighten the continent up. - And no, I never said anything about resources, so don't put words in my mouth. I dislike that... I said that if more countries helped out, and stopped to hold back on helping, we'd make progress more quickly. You totally misunderstand the word civilization... In space, as far as we know, the only advanced civilization there is, is our own. If you want to separate Africans as a different civilization, go ahead. They are still part of the rest of the world in being one human civilization overall.
I find it incredibly close-minded of you to say that a civilization that is aided by others can't blossom in it's own right.
If you don't see how patriotism has anything to do with the will of aiding other countries... I feel bad for you.
Your definition of patriotism is not the same as the common one. Here is link to how patriotism might be defined:
- Special affection for one's own country
- A sense of personal identification with the country
- Special concern for the well-being of the country
- Willingness to sacrifice to promote the country's good
No where does it say anything about hating other countries. I think you are confusing patriotism with some form of fascism. As some one already said, making up you own definition of a word and arguing against it is a logical fallacy. Beware of those.
Your example of the middle-east his not very good. That is not due to patriotism, it's due to religion. And even so, if (hypothetically) the people thought that having religious leaders where a good thing, who are we to deny them that?
It seems to be you who misunderstand the word resources. Did you not give the example of water pipes. What would it take to accomplish that? Money, material and experienced personel - resources.
"I find it incredibly close-minded of you to say that a civilization that is aided by others can't blossom in it's own right."I did not say helped by others, I said depend on others. There is a difference. I see no problem in providing education and such basic things, but at some point the society needs to be able to take care of itself. Otherwise you just pumping in resources into a doomed project. If the society can't survive on it's own, even given a solid starting ground, why should it exist? In harsh terms, it's survival of the fittest. Note that this is not a simple subject, I'm merely showing a different side of the coin. There is always ongoing debate on what the best approach to these thing is.
"If you don't see how patriotism has anything to do with the will of aiding other countries... I feel bad for you."
Wow, great argument. Really, bravo. If you want to have a serious, open minded discussion on these matters, please try to refrain from this kind of behaviour.
I'm sorry, I missed your post. - That is the very definition I use. I then think about what it logically does to the human brain. It should degrade the liking for other countries, that is what (sadly) makes sense. Remember, men like their country not because it is great, but because it is theirs. Just like you liking your money. Money can be great, but the real reason you like money is when the money is yours. I'd say it isn't a logical fallacy at all but to think one step further. - Why does a country need to "depend" upon another? And what is the problem of depending? If a handicapped kid needs someone to depend upon, would you deny him/her that? I think if you let that kid depend upon a person, steps forward can be taken by that kid. Not absolutely positively, but there's a chance. Not to call Africa a "handicapped kid" but I see no harm in humanity depending on humanity, it is a need, and reality.
Survival of the fittest is a barbaric term, it is to say "demolish the weakest". The very opposite to "help eachother and grow stronger in eachother". I very well see your point is not to cause harm with what you're saying, and what you say is indeed true. The laws of nature is harsh, very harsh, however we should know better, don't you think?
I am serious with what I say. It is only reasonable to me that people think of two things and what the result is after adding them. The negative here being the dislike of other countries. - I am not a patriot because I am not an idiot. However there are cultures in countries which I dislike a lot. Iran being one, USA being another, Israel being a third. I have my reasons for the dislike, mainly the FUCKING RETARDED RELIGIOUS MAJORITY THAT FUCKS UP NOT ONLY USA BUT CAN ALSO AFFECT OTHERS, but even if I do dislike, there are things to like as well. Like NASA, one of the most interesting places on the planet according to me. :3
@frythefly said:
In 10 years you will become the engineer of a gaming website Emo Dave.
Hahaha! I think I like you. :3
@plaintomato said:
Did I read this? I want those precious seconds of my life back...but this is kind of like Jack Ass; maybe it's not what I was looking for, but damn if it isn't hard to look away. Stupidity screams for attention, and the title alone told me I would get to read something drafted by a child (or someone with an intellect that has allowed them to glean only a toddler's experience out of whatever life span they've exhausted so far) pretending to be a sage.
Patriotism is a lot like religion in that they are really easy to bash on just by referencing all of the horrible things that have ever been done "in the name of". It doesn't take a whole lot of brain power to recognize that baaad people will use whatever tools available to manipulate others - whether they might call on patriotism, faith, or whatever else to draw support to their base - and it doesn't change that a lot of good is done in the same way; patriotism's manipulation by baaad people doesn't make it baaad. Else you best get off these here baaad internets where criminals collude and Pedo Bear stalks his pray.
People unite, for good or ill, and they always will. You just go ahead and get over that now, okay?
-
I'd love to see you point out some of that stupidity. I said it before and I'll say it again, I like to learn so point out my flaws so I can learn more. :3
I agree with you on the second part about patriotism being like a religion. - Patriotism is bad overall when surrounding one small landmass and not the entire Earth. :3
Log in to comment