Quick Look: Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance

There's lots of arm chopping to do, but first Jeff has to upgrade the firmware on his sword.

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Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance Review

4
  • PS3
  • X360

The points where the styles of Kojima Productions and PlatinumGames collide make playing Metal Gear Rising a short but enjoyable trip through a post-MGS4 world.

When you see that symbol appear on screen, it's time to cut.

Less talking, more cutting. Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance is an odd split, taking the concepts and a couple of characters from Kojima Productions' Metal Gear franchise and slamming them into a character action game developed by PlatinumGames, the studio that's increasingly known for being one of the best producers of this sort of hack-and-slash, combo-crazy action. The resulting mix is a game that tempers some of KojiPro's penchant for long-winded cutscenes by flooding it full of enemy cyborgs that are just begging for you to cut them into hundreds of tiny bits while also reigning in some of Platinum's wilder narrative tendencies. In short, it's a quick cut through the world of Metal Gear that mentions just enough about the Patriots and the War Economy to let you feel like you're keeping up on the state of post-MGS4 Metal Gear while also filling it full of ridiculous, entertaining combat sequences and, for whatever reason, a whole lot of cursing.

Set four years after the events of Metal Gear Solid 4, Rising is all about Raiden, who had been turned into a cyborg ninja the last time we saw him. These days, Raiden and his robot body are working for Maverick, one of several private military companies that rent out their services to the highest bidder. At the opening of the game, Maverick is overseeing security for an African prime minister that is on the verge of bringing peace to the region. A rival PMC intervenes, Raiden is outmatched, and a personal revenge tale is set into motion. Over seven chapters you'll chase down said rival PMC, deal with Raiden's past as a child soldier, and get yourself caught up in the sort of world-ending, conspiratorial gaga that can only come from a game with Metal Gear written on its box. It's a fun story that practically opens with Raiden dismantling a Metal Gear with his sword, and it just keeps escalating from there, culminating in a final, over-the-top confrontation that manages to meld the sensibilities of both of its development studios almost perfectly.

The combat in Rising isn't the most complex combat that Platinum has produced, but it strikes a rewarding balance between mashing on the attack buttons like a crazy person and using proper skill to to take out your foes more selectively. As you set the difficulty higher and higher, it gets harder and harder to mash your way out of trouble. The fighting starts with a standard two-button, light/heavy system that expands as you unlock additional moves. This gives you access to launchers, leg sweeps, and the ability to parry attacks while you're in the air. Defense is a pretty active system in Rising. Instead of giving you a block button, the only way to deal with incoming attacks is to either get out of the way or parry them with your light attack button and a push in that enemy's direction.

Well-timed parries set enemies up for quick kills via "blade mode," a sort of slow-motion effect that allows you to flick the right analog stick around to cut wildly, slicing dying enemies into hundreds of pieces along the way. Done after a parry or to a weakened enemy, blade mode sets up "zandatsu" kills, which draws a box over a target area on an enemy. Slicing that area gives you access to an enemy's innards, and if you grab said innards before they hit the ground, it'll refill your health and battery reserves. It's... pretty cool. Gruesome, you say? Well, what if I told you that every enemy in the game is a cyborg and that you're technically just cutting apart a lot of robotic limbs and torsos? No? That doesn't make you feel any better? Hmm. Well... it's still pretty cool, even if the process itself gets repetitive over the course of the game. Off of a perfect counter, zandatsu kills are the same basic per-enemy animation every time, so the better you are at playing defense, the more often you'll see the same things over and over again.

As you play, you'll unlock the ability to equip additional weapons, which replace your heavy attack with a pole, magnetic sai, and others. This gives you a bit of extra flexibility. The game also has disposable sub-weapons, like rocket launchers and grenades, but those seem like they're for chumps. You're a ninja-cyborg-guy with an electric sword designed to slice anything and everything into bits. Rockets and grenades just feel cheap and useless by comparison.

Rising looks nice on both the PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360, with a solid frame rate during gameplay that occasionally dips when codec sequences load up. The game's flashiest graphical feature is your ability to slice apart a lot of the objects in the environment, from fences that block your path to police cars that are just there for you to cut into tiny pieces. The slicing looks a little corny, especially when you're cutting humanoid enemies up into 200 pieces (the game helpfully keeps track of how many pieces you're creating), but it all comes together to benefit the game's over-the-top sensibilities. There's a batch of nice voice work throughout Rising, but I found Raiden, the main character himself, to sound worse as the game went on. As he runs himself more and more ragged over the course of the campaign, he starts to sound more and more gravelly, but it doesn't sound "tough." It sounds silly.

This guy? Not your friend.

Metal Gear Rising is a short game. My first time through on normal took an afternoon, and that includes watching all of the cutscenes and dying three or four times along the way. The game keeps a clock that tracks your best times through each area and removes cutscene time. So, if you subtract the time I spent seeing the story and replaying parts where I died, it took me a little over four hours of gameplay to get to the end. If you're the type of person who thrives on getting S-ranks in every single combat chapter and wants to play through on all four difficulty settings and unlock every VR mission, you'll find plenty to do. But if you're just here to see the story, it's a little thin. I didn't find it to be criminally short, though, and artificially lengthening the game would make the issue of seeing the same zandatsu kills over and over again far worse. It's about as long as it needs to be to wring everything out of its mechanics. It's enjoyable, with a story that goes in some really wild directions, but don't come to Rising expecting a game that rivals typical Metal Gear Solid games in length. Even if you go out of your way to listen to as many optional codec conversations as you can (you can call a few key members of your support team at any time for a check-in), it might not hold your attention for very long.

Even with that in mind, I found Metal Gear Rising to be a thrilling and engaging experience. The swordplay is fun, and it's really fascinating to see the different spots where either Kojima's or Platinum's signature styles shine through. It also has a wild final confrontation that shows elements of both, doling out some heavy-handed political preaching while also putting a man-sized ninja cyborg up against... well, something way crazier (and dirty-mouthed) than a man-sized ninja cyborg. If you're a value-minded individual that doesn't tend to replay games, Metal Gear Rising will only make you angry. But if seeing the state of the post-MGS4 world while slicing your way through everything that gets in your way sounds like a good time, well, that's because it is.

Jeff Gerstmann on Google+
211 Comments
Edited by kennybaese

Ah, I quite like this new mobile site.

Also, I'm glad this game is good. I'll have to pick it and DmC up when I feel like some stylish action.

Posted by bunnymud

Getting this today when my hangover eases up a bit more

Posted by laserbolts

Not a fan of this type of game but it's nice to see that this game turned out well. Alot of people were looking forward to this.

Posted by AngelN7

Great I've been playing the demo and having fun cutting guys while sliding under them! I don't mind the game being a little short I think it better that way for this kind of game.

Posted by JesusHammer

@geteveryone: There are plenty of reasons to piss on DmC, but it's not like anyone would listen to any valid complaint anyways. Glad to see Jeff enjoyed this one though because I as well love it.

Posted by Krakn3Dfx

4-5 hours for a Metal Gear game sounds stupid short, but I guess given the format, it's understandable.

I'll pick it up when it's half price or better at some point.

Edited by CptBedlam

4-5 hours for a Metal Gear game sounds stupid short, but I guess given the format, it's understandable.

I'll pick it up when it's half price or better at some point.

Other Metal Gear games aren't much longer when you take out the cutscenes.

Posted by GetEveryone

@geteveryone: There are plenty of reasons to piss on DmC, but it's not like anyone would listen to any valid complaint anyways. Glad to see Jeff enjoyed this one though because I as well love it.

Shoot.

I don't think it's perfect, but it's a damn sight better than the internet hate machine would have you believe.

Posted by Elwoodan

I guess you could say he got his reviewgence?

Posted by Supertom11

I remember there was a speed run on MGS4 that was around 4 hours too. This should make for a great weekend Redbox rental.

Posted by DeVeAn

I guess tastes are changing. I expected to get bashed a little. But hey he gave Skylanders a chance. Never thought he would bat an eye towards that type of game.

Posted by WolfHazard

@randombattle said:

I have to laugh at DmC getting a perfect 5 and this getting a 4.

Why? DmC is basically a perfect game, clearly Jeff thinks MGR:REV is good too, just docked it a star probably for the length or maybe the redundant kills? Hard to say, but that in no way means MGR is bad. You can't expect all games to be as incredible as DmC. :p

Posted by White

I thought you CAN block in this game? It's just that well timed blockers result in parries?

Posted by GaspoweR

@sanious: I pointed this out earlier, but anyway...

People have already discovered some pretty fundamental cancels, which seem like they're definitely going form the backbone of how you play this thing.

Also, MGR is less DmC than it is something like Ninja Gaiden. The action is more grounded, but there are still a ton of tools to play around with. Hopefully we see more tech being discovered now that the game is officially out.

Holy shit, when I saw that attacks are cancellable with the pseudo-dodge, NG did pop up into my mind. I also feel like good character action games need to somewhat feel like a fighting game in terms of depth and execution. I'm actually pretty happy with what I played with the demo but there is just so many games coming out right now, I don't want to turn my wallet into a bottomless pit

@randombattle said:

I have to laugh at DmC getting a perfect 5 and this getting a 4.

We all knew this would happen. The guys just don't know enough about this type of game and the flashy but shallow game would of course score higher than the game that offers depth and challenge. ;)

You also need to consider that Jeff reviewed this game and Brad reviewed DmC. Who knows, if Jeff reviewed DmC he would have probably given a different score, which is very likely. I have not heard Jeff playing through DmC yet, but maybe because he's pretty busy with reviewing other games and he also had to fly out to events during the past few weeks (one of which is the Destiny press reveal and the other being Skylanders). I really want to know Jeff's opinion on DmC though so he can compare it to this game.

Edited by Flappy

Fuck...Platinum Games has me wrapped around their finger. I'm not sure when it's gonna happen, but I'm going to buy this game and play the everlovin' poopoo outta it.

Nice review Jeff.

Posted by Lukos

Well this is a surprised. After the shaky development of the game I didn't expect it would turn out anything good. I'm glad it did but it seams that how much they try they cannot turn Raiden in a beloved character for MGS fans.

Posted by Nekroskop
Posted by Animasta

@randombattle said:

I have to laugh at DmC getting a perfect 5 and this getting a 4.

We all knew this would happen. The guys just don't know enough about this type of game and the flashy but shallow game would of course score higher than the game that offers depth and challenge. ;)

or, you know, jeff and brad have different reviewing styles and like different things...

but nope it's because giant bomb as a whole hates depth and challenge

Posted by Blimble

@animasta said:
@cptbedlam said:

@randombattle said:

I have to laugh at DmC getting a perfect 5 and this getting a 4.

We all knew this would happen. The guys just don't know enough about this type of game and the flashy but shallow game would of course score higher than the game that offers depth and challenge. ;)

or, you know, jeff and brad have different reviewing styles and like different things...

but nope it's because giant bomb as a whole hates depth and challenge

That's not what he said at all. The GB crew just generally don't dig deep into games like this, they've barely played any like this and have said so. Jeff's gone as far to say he doesn't really like character action games

Edited by GetEveryone

@gaspower said:

@geteveryone said:

@sanious: I pointed this out earlier, but anyway...

People have already discovered some pretty fundamental cancels, which seem like they're definitely going form the backbone of how you play this thing.

Also, MGR is less DmC than it is something like Ninja Gaiden. The action is more grounded, but there are still a ton of tools to play around with. Hopefully we see more tech being discovered now that the game is officially out.

Holy shit, when I saw that attacks are cancellable with the pseudo-dodge, NG did pop up into my mind. I also feel like good character action games need to somewhat feel like a fighting game in terms of depth and execution. I'm actually pretty happy with what I played with the demo but there is just so many games coming out right now, I don't want to turn my wallet into a bottomless pit

Yeah, definitely agreed on the fighting game front. Action games are basically fighters transposed into a single-player, story driven experience. That's how I view them.

With that in mind, the best are always the ones that offer the most from a combat perspective, and all the usual brawler trappings apply (cancels, juggles, strings and frame-data to an extent).

I wasn't feeling any particular vibe from it initially (before I'd really sat down and tried out some of the stuff people have discovered), but it definitely has that NG feel, even if only comes down to the offense-based combat similarities.

Go on, man. Do it! Think of all that chopping.

Posted by The_Nubster

I was pumped to pick this up, and I still may, but I think I'll wait on it. DMC is giving me my fair share of over-the-top action and curse words.

Posted by Animasta

@blimble said:

@animasta said:
@cptbedlam said:

@randombattle said:

I have to laugh at DmC getting a perfect 5 and this getting a 4.

We all knew this would happen. The guys just don't know enough about this type of game and the flashy but shallow game would of course score higher than the game that offers depth and challenge. ;)

or, you know, jeff and brad have different reviewing styles and like different things...

but nope it's because giant bomb as a whole hates depth and challenge

That's not what he said at all. The GB crew just generally don't dig deep into games like this, they've barely played any like this and have said so. Jeff's gone as far to say he doesn't really like character action games

no, he's saying that DmC doesn't deserve to be higher than MGR because MGR has more depth.

I'm pretty sure Bayonetta got a 4, this got a 4, DmC got a 4 if you take into account that brad sometimes inflates scores if he's really excited about a game, this is nothing new and nothing surprising.

and I'm pretty sure Jeff meant the earlier DMC's with that comment and not all character action games ever.

Posted by Blimble

@animasta said:

@blimble said:

@animasta said:
@cptbedlam said:

@randombattle said:

I have to laugh at DmC getting a perfect 5 and this getting a 4.

We all knew this would happen. The guys just don't know enough about this type of game and the flashy but shallow game would of course score higher than the game that offers depth and challenge. ;)

or, you know, jeff and brad have different reviewing styles and like different things...

but nope it's because giant bomb as a whole hates depth and challenge

That's not what he said at all. The GB crew just generally don't dig deep into games like this, they've barely played any like this and have said so. Jeff's gone as far to say he doesn't really like character action games

no, he's saying that DmC doesn't deserve to be higher than MGR because MGR has more depth.

I'm pretty sure Bayonetta got a 4, this got a 4, DmC got a 4 if you take into account that brad sometimes inflates scores if he's really excited about a game, this is nothing new and nothing surprising.

and I'm pretty sure Jeff meant the earlier DMC's with that comment and not all character action games ever.

Wait so you say he shouldn't be annoyed at the score and then say basically what he did. Brad was excited cause the game is very flashy so boosted the score when really the GB crew probably feel the same about both games. Only bit you disagree on is if DmC is deep or not

And I'm pretty sure he said character action games throwing them all under that name but I can't remember if it was a bombcast or the DmC QL so yeah

Posted by GaspoweR

Check this out:

Aside from the decent juggling/string system, there are parries and cancels, too (though, less than I'd like). It most definitely has depth. The system may be changed from previous iterations, but you're confusing accessible with shallow.

This isn't high-school where you need to fight one for the other's affection. We've just seen two awesome action games released within a couple weeks of each other, and you're pissing all over DmC for no reason.

Have you played through MGR?

Okay, that combo video just looked fucking redunkulous....

Posted by ImmortalSaiyan

@animasta said:

@blimble said:

@animasta said:
@cptbedlam said:

@randombattle said:

I have to laugh at DmC getting a perfect 5 and this getting a 4.

We all knew this would happen. The guys just don't know enough about this type of game and the flashy but shallow game would of course score higher than the game that offers depth and challenge. ;)

or, you know, jeff and brad have different reviewing styles and like different things...

but nope it's because giant bomb as a whole hates depth and challenge

That's not what he said at all. The GB crew just generally don't dig deep into games like this, they've barely played any like this and have said so. Jeff's gone as far to say he doesn't really like character action games

no, he's saying that DmC doesn't deserve to be higher than MGR because MGR has more depth.

I'm pretty sure Bayonetta got a 4, this got a 4, DmC got a 4 if you take into account that brad sometimes inflates scores if he's really excited about a game, this is nothing new and nothing surprising.

and I'm pretty sure Jeff meant the earlier DMC's with that comment and not all character action games ever.

The person has a point. The staff are not big on character action games and don't go in depth in them. That is why something like Bayonetta got 4 stars when Ryan had nothing bad to say about it. The gameplay is just not his thing. DmC made this type of game more accesible. Even then Brad has said it's the visuals that put DmC at 5 stars. So, I dunno.

Posted by PrioritySeven

@blimble said:

@animasta said:

@blimble said:

@animasta said:
@cptbedlam said:

@randombattle said:

I have to laugh at DmC getting a perfect 5 and this getting a 4.

We all knew this would happen. The guys just don't know enough about this type of game and the flashy but shallow game would of course score higher than the game that offers depth and challenge. ;)

or, you know, jeff and brad have different reviewing styles and like different things...

but nope it's because giant bomb as a whole hates depth and challenge

That's not what he said at all. The GB crew just generally don't dig deep into games like this, they've barely played any like this and have said so. Jeff's gone as far to say he doesn't really like character action games

no, he's saying that DmC doesn't deserve to be higher than MGR because MGR has more depth.

I'm pretty sure Bayonetta got a 4, this got a 4, DmC got a 4 if you take into account that brad sometimes inflates scores if he's really excited about a game, this is nothing new and nothing surprising.

and I'm pretty sure Jeff meant the earlier DMC's with that comment and not all character action games ever.

Wait so you say he shouldn't be annoyed at the score and then say basically what he did. Brad was excited cause the game is very flashy so boosted the score when really the GB crew probably feel the same about both games. Only bit you disagree on is if DmC is deep or not

And I'm pretty sure he said character action games throwing them all under that name but I can't remember if it was a bombcast or the DmC QL so yeah

Why would someone be annoyed at the score of a game they've already decided to buy, and already have decided that the game is worthy of a 5-star review without playing it?

Edited by Blimble

@priorityseven: Where did I say i was? 4 stars seems right for this game

Posted by PrioritySeven
@blimble said:

@priorityseven: Where did I say i was? 4 stars seems right for this game

Not you, sir. The others quoted in there. Sorry, I should have made that distinction.

Posted by Undeadpool

@cptbedlam said:

@randombattle said:

I have to laugh at DmC getting a perfect 5 and this getting a 4.

We all knew this would happen. The guys just don't know enough about this type of game and the flashy but shallow game would of course score higher than the game that offers depth and challenge. ;)

Knew what would happen? That they would have a different opinion and affix one less totally irrelevant star than you would have liked?

Check this out:

Aside from the decent juggling/string system, there are parries and cancels, too (though, less than I'd like). It most definitely has depth. The system may be changed from previous iterations, but you're confusing accessible with shallow.

This isn't high-school where you need to fight one for the other's affection. We've just seen two awesome action games released within a couple weeks of each other, and you're pissing all over DmC for no reason.

Have you played through MGR?

More precisely: they're confusing complexity for depth.

It is AWFULLY fun to watch people insert their own narrative to justify their worldview, though.

Posted by JRock3x8

"If you're a value-minded individual that doesn't tend to replay games, Metal Gear Rising will only make you angry."

Thank you - that's all I needed to know on this one.

Posted by GaspoweR

Glad that this turned out well, so pissed off that there isn't a PC version though!

I don't think Platinum has ever built a game that had a PC version.

Posted by Tesla

Nice review Jeff.

I love me some Metal Gear and Platinum Games, but I think I might wait for a price drop. I can't do full price for such a short game.

Posted by notdavid

Wait. This takes place AFTER Guns of the Patriots? I thought that it was going to take place in between 2 and 4. Besides, didn't Raiden get rid of his cyborg bits at the end of 4?

Edited by Peacemaker

Man, shame about the length since everything else seems pretty awesome. I just can't spend 60 bucks on a game that short. I'll be waiting for a price drop.

Edited by GetEveryone

@undeadpool: Was that a stab at me? The tone of this thread has me assuming an automatic defensive stance, so I don't even know what to think anymore.

*curls up into a ball*

Posted by laxbro19

I honestly expected this game to either not come out or be sub par. Surprises in games are always good.

Posted by drumgroovy

Ah... Platinum Games. You're so awesome.

Vanquish was absolutely amazing so I guess I'll be picking this up.

Posted by GaspoweR

@undeadpool: Was that a stab at me? The tone of this thread has me assuming an automatic defensive stand, so I don't even know what to think anymore.

*curls up into a ball*

No, he was adding to what you already said. Sorry to jump in by the way @undeadpool

Posted by Pr1mus

People that compare review scores of two different games from 2 different developers reviewed by 2 different persons are just sad.

Online
Posted by MormonWarrior

I played the demo and didn't like what I saw at all. Not being able to dodge was a real bummer to me and the camera was insanely bad. I dunno...maybe the actual game would be alright but it just didn't feel as tight as Bayonetta or DmC and the slicing got old by the end of the demo.

And I'd consider myself a mild MGS fan as well. Hmm...

Edited by SpasticHeathen

@lurkero said:

Thanks, that's one thing I was waiting on someone to confirm. I saw something that looked like a dodge in trailers, but it wasn't in the demo.

It was in the demo. The footage you saw was recorded off the demo build, they just did a poor job in the tutorial showing the player what they can do.

@cptbedlam said:

@krakn3dfx said:

4-5 hours for a Metal Gear game sounds stupid short, but I guess given the format, it's understandable.

I'll pick it up when it's half price or better at some point.

Other Metal Gear games aren't much longer when you take out the cutscenes.

Hell, DmC's about the same length - My first playthrough on Nephilim was five and a half hours, and that was only because I didn't skip the cutscenes in the second half of the game (Which is counted in those five and a half hours). I rather an action game be designed with as little filler between the meaningful content that it feels like it's over so soon compared to another which pads it out with so many dull tedious traversal or puzzle elements that it feels like a significantly longer experience for it.

Posted by GetEveryone

@gaspower: Ah! Well, between the redbull, it being close to 5 o'clock and reading far too much of this thread for my own sanity, I did wonder...

(Why do all of my replies have a capitalized letter at the start?)

Edited by honkyjesus

If this site gets any more like the look of IGN I will puke.

Edited by CptBedlam

@mormonwarrior said:

I played the demo and didn't like what I saw at all. Not being able to dodge was a real bummer to me and the camera was insanely bad. I dunno...maybe the actual game would be alright but it just didn't feel as tight as Bayonetta or DmC and the slicing got old by the end of the demo.

And I'd consider myself a mild MGS fan as well. Hmm...

What is it with people thinking that there's no dodge mechanic? There totally is and it's pretty intricate stuff (and it definitely was in the demo):

I didn't like the demo very much at first glance either but after I gave it another shot it grew on me really fast and I became practically addicted to the gameplay. It's so satisfying.

Edited by Blimble

I played the demo and didn't like what I saw at all. Not being able to dodge was a real bummer to me

That just isn't true. The demo was just pretty bad at explaining itself, most people didn't even know about the ninja run or even half of the abilities they give you in that game

@undeadpool: Does it really mater if people are using a different word but mean the same thing, as long as people can understand what they mean it shouldn't be a problem. It's not like depth is an insulting term either, no need to get hung up on it

Posted by NaeemTHM

@cptbedlam said:

@randombattle said:

I have to laugh at DmC getting a perfect 5 and this getting a 4.

We all knew this would happen. The guys just don't know enough about this type of game and the flashy but shallow game would of course score higher than the game that offers depth and challenge. ;)

Knew what would happen? That they would have a different opinion and affix one less totally irrelevant star than you would have liked?

Check this out:

Aside from the decent juggling/string system, there are parries and cancels, too (though, less than I'd like). It most definitely has depth. The system may be changed from previous iterations, but you're confusing accessible with shallow.

This isn't high-school where you need to fight one for the other's affection. We've just seen two awesome action games released within a couple weeks of each other, and you're pissing all over DmC for no reason.

Have you played through MGR?

Wow thanks for posting that video. I'm pretty good at getting SSS rank on Son of Sparda, but this guy...SWEET JESUS. His reflex's border on supernatural.

Posted by GetEveryone

@blimble said:

@undeadpool: Does it really mater if people are using a different word but mean the same thing, as long as people can understand what they mean it shouldn't be a problem. It's not like depth is an insulting term either, no need to get hung up on it

*whoosh*

The inference was that they are not interchangeable.

Complexity =/= depth

Just because there are a lot of systems, doesn't mean that those systems come together in any meaningful way.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_mechanics

Posted by Blimble

@geteveryone: I'd argue that even if a rule set is simple it having a lot of depth that you can do a lot with stuff with makes it complex. Having a lot of strategies and understanding what is best to use is a complex process

And I agree with the point about a lot of systems but it isn't very relevant here

Edited by GetEveryone

@blimble said:

@geteveryone: I'd argue that even if a rule set is simple it having a lot of depth that you can do a lot with stuff with makes it complex. Having a lot of strategies and understanding what is best to use is a complex process

And I agree with the point about a lot of systems but it isn't very relevant here

By systems, I mean mechanics or otherwise (parrying, etc). It's essential to the point I was making about complexity.

I know this comes close to refuting the point I was making earlier about DmC's depth, but I'd argue that the systems in that way act as a cohesive whole, affording the player the flexibility to approach the combat in different ways.

Posted by Blimble

@blimble said:

@geteveryone: I'd argue that even if a rule set is simple it having a lot of depth that you can do a lot with stuff with makes it complex. Having a lot of strategies and understanding what is best to use is a complex process

And I agree with the point about a lot of systems but it isn't very relevant here

By systems, I mean mechanics or otherwise (ie. rules in a board game).

It's still not really relevant. A game could have a couple of deep and complex mechanics that don't fit together, they can be deep and complex on there own. Like a game where you could fight or talk your way out a situation, both could be deep and complex on their own