The Force Unleashed: That is Why You Fail

Topic started by SpikeDelight on Aug. 23, 2008. Last post by Thermonuclear 3 years, 9 months ago.
Post by SpikeDelight (278 posts) See mini bio Level 14 / 2081 ACH / 33595 P
This was a blog post I made but I think it encompasses every problem with The Force Unleashed demo. If you're a Star Wars fan you should read this:

I waited with baited breath for the release of the Star Wars: The Force Unleashed demo, and like many, was sorely disappointed when I finally got my hands on the actual game. But before I get into all these specifics, let me describe myself a little bit, as it might be a factor in all this that I am quite demanding of my Star Wars games. 'Huge' wouldn't be an adequate description of my Star Wars fandom. I am the kind of fan who, if you asked me "How long did Han Solo say it took him to complete the Kessel Run with the Millennium Falcon?" I would know to reply, "It's a trick question because he says he did it in less than 12 parsecs, but a parsec is a unit of measurement not a unit of time. That still indirectly references how fast his ship is however, because the route where the Kessel Run would take only 12 parsecs to complete would pass near a black hole, whose gravitational pull would pull in all but the fastest ships." Yeah.

So when I first heard around a year or two ago that this was touted as a true canonical followup to Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith, I was very excited to play it and see how the story unfolds. I am also a huge gamer though, so I was hoping for a revolutionary game to go along with what was supposed to be a revolutionary story. This was back in the time of hype for Bioshock, Portal, GTA IV (before it was delayed) and so on, so a boy could dream about how good his games would be and the result wouldn't be so far off the mark in many cases. When I saw those videos of Euphoria and DMM, with the way that wood splintered when R2D2 was thrown at it, I was amazed. Then I saw videos of it all working in-game, with the Apprentice shattering glass that looked lifelike and metal bent just like one would expect. It was a Star Wars fan's dreams come true. Every fantasy anyone ever had about using the force in real life was about to be realized through this game that crossed my, and many others' two great loves: Star Wars and video games.

Then I played the demo.

I should have seen this coming in all of the video coverage I'd see of the game, but I was blinded by how awesome I had imagined the game to be. While at face value, yes the things Haden Blackman raved about were in the game, but just like Assassin's Creed, there wasn't much else. They showed almost everything that could be done in the game with a clever presentation which made it look as if the possibilities were endless. It was exactly like how My Cousin Vinny explains the playing card looking like a brick.

<Beginning here is a bunch of nitpicking. If you want to read about actual problems then go down to the end of this part>
They didn't even get this part right
They didn't even get this part right

The first problem starts as soon as the game is launched. The opening Lucasarts video isn't synced up to the audio. I played this video a few times too, and it didn't stop having issues. This shows such a lack of attention by the developers it is disturbing. The same problems occur with the ending montage, even the Xbox 360 'Jump In' thing was off. Then I tried to adjust the video and audio settings, as my TV usually needs the brightness turned up a bit for most games, and I wanted to turn off subtitles, so I press the button for OPTIONS.

Loading...

Yes the OPTIONS screen has to LOAD! How could such a screen have ANY assets, graphical or otherwise, that require their own loading time? It's ridiculous. So I get there and there are no options besides brightness and a couple of audio settings. You can't even access the other ones until you start the game. This makes no sense, because if you want to have subtitles turned off for the first cutscene or do anything like that you can't. So I turn up the brightness (which, to make a longer story short, didn't even save and I had to adjust it again when I got into the game anyway.)

Loading...

Yes, it loads both ways. This especially makes it a bitch when you accidentally press B and have to go to the menu and then back into the Options screen. So when I finally got to the opening cutscene, when Darth Vader activates his lightsaber the game hitches at the same part every time, stopping (thankfully) the video and audio, so at least everything stays synced up there. Speaking of audio, in this cutscene one really starts wishing that they didn't get Chad Vader to do a James Earl Jones impression. He starts off sounding alright, but it's easy to see through his ruse at the parts where he says "Critical Imperial shipyard" and "Kill everyone aboard, Imperials and Kota's men alike." I don't want to knock Chad, because he does an admirable job for someone trying to imitate one of the most iconic voices ever, but I don't think anyone could have done it perfectly but James himself. Another thing that rears its ugly head before the game proper even starts, the subtitles (which can't be turned off for this cutscene) are in the kind of Star Wars font that you'd download from a font website and is of the actual Star Wars logo. It's bulky and annoying to read, and when the cutscene ends and Juno Eclipse radios you, there's a wall of text with this stupid font, taking up like a third or half of the screen. Apparently nobody at Lucasarts learned how to write subtitles correctly.

<The nitpicking ends here, although this whole blog entry could be considered nitpicking>

I even discovered this easter egg. Yes that was me on GameTrailers.
I even discovered this easter egg. Yes that was me on GameTrailers.
I think one thing that everyone noticed when this demo began was when the windows are shattered on the ship, the explosive decompression that follows isn't very satisfying. Even when a bunch of crates are in front of a broken window, only a few of them will decide to fly out. Second, the Apprentice can't jump out of the window (which makes sense) but he isn't affected by the air flying out either. He just stands there, breathing (which he really shouldn't be able to do until that blast shield closes) and does nothing. Also the droids in the game don't get sliced very satisfyingly either. It's not because of the way he slices them th same way every time, but because of the disappointment that follows when the blast door is forced open and humans can't share the same fate. They just take it, with huge (and unnecessary beacause almost everybody dies in about three hits) health bars over their heads, only showing scoring from the lightsaber when the game feels like it, but never letting themselves get cut into pieces. I suppose I could understand Lucasarts' logic behind this, but not in exactly the same way that everyone else assumes. I figure that if everyone's limbs were flying off left and right, the game would end up the same way the Godfather game ended up, way overly gory compared to the movies it came from. The Godfather film probably would have been as brutal as the game, but it didn't show the violence as much, so when the game showed everything behind the scenes, it looked way over the top. I think it would have been the same with this game. No one in a Star Wars film ever chops up that many humanoids, so if a player was to see thousands of humanoids being dismembered in this video game it would look repulsive, even if there was no blood.

Another thing I have a huge problem with is waiting right at the end of the first hallway in the TIE Fighter hangar. Why would a game with technology behind the scenes so advanced resort to including 'Unlimited Force Usage' or 'Extra Damage' powerups? Why would it have any powerups? It's the year 2008, Lucasarts, we're not running away from ghosts and eating pellets, we want some kind of depth in our games--or at least give the powerup some kind of veil behind Star Wars lure. I'm sure you could have thought of something if you actually put your minds to it. I wouldn't really have a problem with this, but this game was riding on its technology and how advanced it was for a Stormtrooper to think about grabbing onto something to not get pushed off a ledge or how wood splinters like real wood. It's trying to be realistic (within the context of the subject matter at least) so it's kind of stupid that they shoehorn these powerups in there.

The lightsaber combat isn't very satisfying either. It's controlled by simple 'combos.' I know that a lot of games do this, but with the extremely visceral feeling one gets from using the Force in this game, this lightsaber swinging pales in comparison. I appreciate combining moves like infusing the lightsaber with lightning, and I understood that there are multiple combos depending on how many times the saber is swung, but how much better would it have been to have The Force Unleashed control like a faster version of Assassin's Creed? You would have to block all the blaster shots (instead of be able to get hit with like 15 shots before dying) and you could run while blocking, a feature conspicuously absent from the demo, which now forces the Apprentice to look like an idiot using the 'Force propel forward' move like a million times to get away from the AT-ST's fire. He could then press X while blocking to try to counter a blaster shot back to the guy who shot it. If he messed up a counter move it would just be a 'sloppy block' like in Assassin's Creed and he would lose health, but without actually being hit. Then when his health is gone, the next time he messes up a block he would be hit with a blaster shot and he'd die. When the apprentice was close he could do whatever combo he wanted to do, but with a more visceral feeling. It never feels like the Apprentice is paying attention to who he's slicing, like he doesn't know anybody's there. It just looks like he's flailing his saber about and people are falling down because of it. He never even impales people personally like Altair does, only when he's doing his lightsaber impale from afar.

They also missed the chance to do a few cool moves that Sith would be able to do, such as Force Choke. Perhaps this will be in the real game, but instead of L just flinging a guy straight up (which can already be done by flicking RS up) a player could hold it to choke the guy. Maybe you could feel his heartbeat with your controller like in The Godfather game or something. Jedi mind tricks would be cool too, maybe he could turn a guy (or an AT-ST) against his comrades. There are a lot of other powers that could be put to use, but I can't think of any others at the moment.

Also, and many people don't understand that this is what's happening, the targeting system for using Force Grip is relative to the Apprentice's position, and not relative to the camera's position. This means a player has to position the Apprentice exactly towards something to grab it, but most people just try to point the camera at whatever the thing is and cry when he picks up the wrong thing. This is a flaw with the game, however because if the player is pointing towards something there is no way for the game to tell the difference between two targeted things if they're vertically stacked. A camera pointing towards them would be able to though, so I don't know why they didn't implement the targeting system that way, or at least give the option to do it either way like DEAD RISING did for Frank's camera's controls (by that I mean his camera used for photography, not the game's camera). And why can't you repeatedly fling a guy into a wall, like in the target video for the game that was released with the game's announcement?

Really?
Really?
Last, and certainly not least is the weak boss battle against the AT-ST at the end of the demo. I know a lot of people speculate that this is not going to be in the real game, but whether it is or not is irrelevant. The problem still stands in that is how you have to kill an AT-ST in the game, and most likely all other bosses. The stupid 'weaken him by beating him with your lightsaber and other moves ad nauseum and then do a quicktime event' is so archaic it's laughable. God of War does it well, but in a setting where a player is under the impression that he can kill almost anything with his "Unleashed" Force powers, it's stupid to say that an AT-ST is a formidable foe. It explodes after tripping on a bunch of logs set up by Ewoks! You think it takes this much effort to destroy an AT-ST? A strong wind can blow one of those over! The stomp attack it does is stupid because it doesn't even make sense in this physics-based world the game sets up, and the 'two shot' attack is annoying, knocking the player yards back, and usually off the edge of the platform he's on. The ultimate frustration sets in when the player realizes just how useless the block move really is when the '20 blaster shots' attack can't even be escaped after a successful block because apparently it takes less time to reload than it takes for a Sith warrior to get off his ass and move out of the way. I could have thought of so many better ways to take care of an AT-ST in an Unleashed fashion it's not even funny. Not in a finisher, just right when you encounter him. In fact:
  • Target his legs and take them out from under him
  • Target his head and push him off the edge
  • Use the Force to bend the guns so when they tried to shoot they would explode
  • Use the Force to open the hatch where the Stormtroopers inside see from and pull them out, disabling it
  • Use your lightsaber (which can still cut through metal like a hot knife through butter in the game) and cut his legs off
  • Use your jughtsaber and cut it anywhere. It'd probably go down.
  • Use Force Lightning on the power source, overloading it and probably making it explode or something.
  • Jump on top of it and thrust your lightsaber into the top of its head like a Colossus

Those are just a couple of ideas I had that would be better than this generic miniboss encounter.

These are all the problems with this game I can think of at the moment, and nothing would make me happier than to be proved wrong by the final game when it's released. I will still be purchasing it and I'll probably still enjoy it for the story, but I couldn't help but vocalize the thoughts that were brewing in my head. I wanted very much to like this game, and I thought it would be just as revolutionary for gaming as Star Wars was for films. But sadly, it's more generic than almost anything out there today. Maybe someday Lucasarts will come to their senses, but I guess for now I'll just have to continue holding Star Wars Republic Commando as the only symbol of Star Wars gaming nirvana for all future games to strive for. At least it's the only one set during the Galactic Civil War that's great.

also, inb4 stfu, why are you so serious about this, etc.
If you're not interested in this topic then don't fucking read this blog, don't give me negative feedback solely because you don't like the fact that I wrote volumes on this subject. I swear if somebody writes a comment like that please refer them to this.
Post by MB (9,250 posts) See mini bio Level 24 / 1646 ACH / 28259 P
Moderator
I agree with you on virtually every point you made, and I could even add some of my own, but I won't.  I'm glad a demo was released for Force Unleashed...I'll rent it now.
Post by DualReaver (3,433 posts) See mini bio Level 6
Great read and I agree with you on everything.

I almost yelled what the fuck, when the word  "loading" came up when I was trying to get to the options menu.
Post by Demyx (2,750 posts) See mini bio Level 12 / 393 ACH / 2395 P
Too much for me to read, but I did my best.
You made some valid points, but as someone who hasn't been able to download the demo, I can't exactly say much.

But it seems that this game isn't as good as everyone thought it would be. I'll wait to make a decision if I ever get to DL the demo.
Post by Lies (2,951 posts) See mini bio Level 32 / 1068 ACH / 21370 P
I thought the options screen having to load was hilarious. Really, just completely poor. However, I'm guessing the video probs were just the demo, they won't end up like that in the full game.

And the powerups are less of an annoyance to me, because it seems that Force Unleashed is going less the "immersive" route and is instead more focusing on being a game. Yeah, it's a bit cheesy, but whatever. Not a huge problem.

And they've said Apprentice never gets force choke. Which is really just like: "What the fuck?" since THEY ALREADY CODED IT FOR VADER (He has it in the tutorial level). That's just stupid to me, since there are only like four powers for the Apprentice in the whole game (Grip, push, lightning, and repulse).

Running while blocking will presumably be one of the character upgrades available when you level up, although I could be wrong.

QTE's suck.

So yeah, the demo was kinda less than I expected, buut I'm willing to let it slide a bit. I've got a weak spot for Star Wars, and this certainy looks better than the clone wars tripe they got coming. And I'm the kinda of Star Wars fan who knows about the Yuuzhan Vong, so I wouldn't entirely discount my opinion because I don't like Star Wars as much as you do ;)
Post by Otacon (1,591 posts) See mini bio Level 12 / 559 ACH / 10035 P
I agree, but I'm afraid that I was expecting exactly what the game delivered, like you I will still purchase because I'm a fan. Nice blog structure and phrasing also.
Post by BiggerBomb (5,747 posts) See mini bio Level 6
Dude, that was awesome. I agree with you on every point and I'm really impressed on how elaborate and thorough your "vocalization" was. You even mentioned issues within the demo that retrospectively (after reading your article) I now notice, though were subliminal to me at the time. Mad props.

I only have to disagree with you in one spot....

SpikeDelight said:
 Maybe someday Lucasarts will come to their senses, but I guess for now I'll just have to continue holding Star Wars Republic Commando as the only symbol of Star Wars gaming nirvana for all future games to strive for.
Woah man, easy there! What about Knights of the Old Republic?! How could you possibly omit the (imo) single greatest RPG of all time and possibly one of the greatest games of all time. Not to mention the best Star Wars game out there. If RPGs are just not your cup of tea, I wholeheartedly understand. Otherwise, don't forget the KOTOR!

Good work.

/pats you on the back
Post by SpikeDelight (278 posts) See mini bio Level 14 / 2081 ACH / 33595 P
Lies said:
And I'm the kinda of Star Wars fan who knows about the Yuuzhan Vong, so I wouldn't entirely discount my opinion because I don't like Star Wars as much as you do ;)"
Hey man I would never discount someone's opinion just because they don't know obscure trivia like you and I, I just put that part in there to show how pumped I was for this game. Also you made some great points, and I hope running while blocking will make its way into the game eventually! :D
Post by MB (9,250 posts) See mini bio Level 24 / 1646 ACH / 28259 P
Moderator
Lies said:


Running while blocking will presumably be one of the character upgrades available when you level up, although I could be wrong.
Is that just a guess?  That's one of my major hangups about this game.
Post by Lies (2,951 posts) See mini bio Level 32 / 1068 ACH / 21370 P
MB said:
"Lies said:


Running while blocking will presumably be one of the character upgrades available when you level up, although I could be wrong.
Is that just a guess?  That's one of my major hangups about this game."
I know for sure they mentioned that you would be able to buy an ability to passively block more shots with your lightsaber. Being able to do a full block while moving is speculation, but if they're upgrading your passive block ability, it only follows that they'd upgrade your full block ability also.
Post by MB (9,250 posts) See mini bio Level 24 / 1646 ACH / 28259 P
Moderator
Well, that's better than nothing...I'd like to know more about the mechanics of this game but LucasArts sure is being tight-lipped with details.  That's probably not a good sign.
Post by Lies (2,951 posts) See mini bio Level 32 / 1068 ACH / 21370 P
Well, it's pretty much that demo. Plus force repulse.

Although I was watching a developer walkthrough on Gametrailers, and the guy said six force powers. And I went: WHHHAAAA? Because they've been pretty adamant about only having four so far. Grip, push, lightning, repulse. I guess if you count saber throw that's five... I can't account for #6 though.

Was listening to the 1UpYours podcast today, and the guys who reviewed it weren't so hot on it, although they said they were holdng back their full impressions until their magazine hit, which is understandable. Apparently though, you DO get to pull a Star Destroyer out of the sky, and apparently it's NOT THAT COOL?!?! Not really sure how that works. Seems pretty fucking awesome to me.

Anyways, here are those videos I was talking about (When he say droid jedi master, he means a jedi droid maker. Just to avert any nerd rage :P):
  

  
Post by SpikeDelight (278 posts) See mini bio Level 14 / 2081 ACH / 33595 P
BiggerBomb said:
"Dude, that was awesome. I agree with you on every point and I'm really impressed on how elaborate and thorough your "vocalization" was. You even mentioned issues within the demo that retrospectively (after reading your article) I now notice, though were subliminal to me at the time. Mad props.

I only have to disagree with you in one spot....

SpikeDelight said:
 Maybe someday Lucasarts will come to their senses, but I guess for now I'll just have to continue holding Star Wars Republic Commando as the only symbol of Star Wars gaming nirvana for all future games to strive for.
Woah man, easy there! What about Knights of the Old Republic?! How could you possibly omit the (imo) single greatest RPG of all time and possibly one of the greatest games of all time. Not to mention the best Star Wars game out there. If RPGs are just not your cup of tea, I wholeheartedly understand. Otherwise, don't forget the KOTOR!

Good work.

/pats you on the back"

Thanks for the kind words. I guess I did kind of forget about KOTOR, although Republic Commando still stands as the best Galactic Civil War era Star Wars
game out there. ;)
Post by BiggerBomb (5,747 posts) See mini bio Level 6
I still might get the game, gameplay footage outside of the demo looks better. Though that is isolated and on the developer's terms. The demo wasn't devoid of fun and I enjoyed many aspects of the game. I just had to say this so my subconscious doesn't label me as a hypocrite if I do indeed get it.

D:
Post by Rowr (3,494 posts) See mini bio Level 15 / 1875 ACH / 25706 P
Its not awful.

Its just not perfect.

put in some better lightsaber stuff, put another coat of polish on, and im fine with it.

get rid of that godawful font. I dont know whether its supposed to be the "star wars" font, but it brings the whole look of the game down.


Post by Lies (2,951 posts) See mini bio Level 32 / 1068 ACH / 21370 P
Rowr said:
"Its not awful.

Its just not perfect.

put in some better lightsaber stuff, put another coat of polish on, and im fine with it.

get rid of that godawful font. I dont know whether its supposed to be the "star wars" font, but it brings the whole look of the game down.


"
There ain't no more polish coming buddy. Game's out in three weeks.
Post by zitosilva (1,161 posts) See mini bio Level 17 / 2575 ACH / 43725 P
Well, I'll wait to see some gamer's impressions of the full game once it's out.

But I was sorely disapointed with the demo. I really expected something great. Aside from some camera, targeting and controller issues I think this game has a potential of being another Assassin's Creed. Waaaaaay too repetitive if all we get is to play around with the force. I was bored with it in the middle of the demo, I don't dare think how the whole game will feel.
Post by Demilich (2,146 posts) See mini bio Level 11 / 985 ACH / 6805 P
I enjoyed aspects of the demo. That said, I think it was way too easy. Your enemies felt small and insignificant. I like them to have some sort of presence.
Post by Patchinko (590 posts) See mini bio Level 4 / 145 ACH / 0 P
Nice post. I don't have a lot of time (taking a break from writing a paper), but I'll address a couple of your points. The reason I'm bothering is because unlike you, I generally enjoyed the demo, and wasn't hyping it too much. I admit, I used to be a big Star Wars geek, but the newer trilogy kind of left me less than impressed story-wise, and I stopped reading Star Wars books quite a long time ago.

Also, bear with me as I try to answer a post on GiantBomb point for point... harder to do than it should be on this forum.
I should have seen this coming in all of the video coverage I'd see of the game, but I was blinded by how awesome I had imagined the game to be. While at face value, yes the things Haden Blackman raved about were in the game, but just like Assassin's Creed, there wasn't much else. They showed almost everything that could be done in the game with a clever presentation which made it look as if the possibilities were endless. It was exactly like how My Cousin Vinny explains the playing card looking like a brick.
I guess... I mean, that's sort of what a demo is supposed to do. I want to be able to try just about everything, at least everything basic, in the demo to know if I'm going to like it. I don't want the first fifteen minutes, I want fifteen minutes in a sandbox where I get to play around. That's what I got, and I found it diverting enough to play through a couple of times.

The first problem starts as soon as the game is launched. The opening Lucasarts video isn't synced up to the audio. I played this video a few times too, and it didn't stop having issues. This shows such a lack of attention by the developers it is disturbing. The same problems occur with the ending montage, even the Xbox 360 'Jump In' thing was off. Then I tried to adjust the video and audio settings, as my TV usually needs the brightness turned up a bit for most games, and I wanted to turn off subtitles, so I press the button for OPTIONS.

Loading...

Yes the OPTIONS screen has to LOAD! How could such a screen have ANY assets, graphical or otherwise, that require their own loading time? It's ridiculous. So I get there and there are no options besides brightness and a couple of audio settings. You can't even access the other ones until you start the game. This makes no sense, because if you want to have subtitles turned off for the first cutscene or do anything like that you can't. So I turn up the brightness (which, to make a longer story short, didn't even save and I had to adjust it again when I got into the game anyway.)

Loading...

Yes, it loads both ways. This especially makes it a bitch when you accidentally press B and have to go to the menu and then back into the Options screen. So when I finally got to the opening cutscene, when Darth Vader activates his lightsaber the game hitches at the same part every time, stopping (thankfully) the video and audio, so at least everything stays synced up there. Speaking of audio, in this cutscene one really starts wishing that they didn't get Chad Vader to do a James Earl Jones impression. He starts off sounding alright, but it's easy to see through his ruse at the parts where he says "Critical Imperial shipyard" and "Kill everyone aboard, Imperials and Kota's men alike." I don't want to knock Chad, because he does an admirable job for someone trying to imitate one of the most iconic voices ever, but I don't think anyone could have done it perfectly but James himself. Another thing that rears its ugly head before the game proper even starts, the subtitles (which can't be turned off for this cutscene) are in the kind of Star Wars font that you'd download from a font website and is of the actual Star Wars logo. It's bulky and annoying to read, and when the cutscene ends and Juno Eclipse radios you, there's a wall of text with this stupid font, taking up like a third or half of the screen. Apparently nobody at Lucasarts learned how to write subtitles correctly.

The first problem you listed--the opening video--isn't a problem on the PS3 version that I played. In fact, I'll bring up right now that a lot of the more nit-pick-y things I'm reading from people about this demo seem to come from 360 players. I don't know what was in that extra 3-400MB of data that was in the PS3 version compared to the 360 version, but I suppose it could have been things like this. Sufficed to say, it's not a good sign for their cross-platform approach. From what I recall, the game was ultimately made to work equally on the Wii, PS3, and 360, and the technologically superior versions weren't getting their own development queue, but were ports. I could be wrong, please say so if I am. But that may explain this kid of thing.

The options screen loading situation I also didn't notice. When I paused, the screen came up immediately. Again, could be a version issue. They may have pushed for a simultaneous release on the demo with the 360 one not as complete. I have no idea. But I didn't notice this issue.

To the scene with Darth Vader, that common complaint about the scene skipping on the 360 again doesn't happen in the PS3 version. At this point, if I had to choose between the two, I'd pick PS3 based solely on this demo. (Then again, my choice is between Wii and PS3, so I have no idea... going to have to wait for reviews of the Wii version...)

As for Chad Vader. It was so Chad Vader. My lord, was it ever Chad Vader. I was laughing out loud.

And for the cut-scene text, I'm imaging that will be something one can turn on and off in the final game. My options menu didn't seem complete, at least. But time will tell. It's a fairly minor thing, like you said, in either case.

I do hope, however, the game itself lets us install it so we don't have to sit through the cutscenes every time it's loading a level.
I think one thing that everyone noticed when this demo began was when the windows are shattered on the ship, the explosive decompression that follows isn't very satisfying. Even when a bunch of crates are in front of a broken window, only a few of them will decide to fly out. Second, the Apprentice can't jump out of the window (which makes sense) but he isn't affected by the air flying out either. He just stands there, breathing (which he really shouldn't be able to do until that blast shield closes) and does nothing. Also the droids in the game don't get sliced very satisfyingly either. It's not because of the way he slices them th same way every time, but because of the disappointment that follows when the blast door is forced open and humans can't share the same fate. They just take it, with huge (and unnecessary beacause almost everybody dies in about three hits) health bars over their heads, only showing scoring from the lightsaber when the game feels like it, but never letting themselves get cut into pieces. I suppose I could understand Lucasarts' logic behind this, but not in exactly the same way that everyone else assumes. I figure that if everyone's limbs were flying off left and right, the game would end up the same way the Godfather game ended up, way overly gory compared to the movies it came from. The Godfather film probably would have been as brutal as the game, but it didn't show the violence as much, so when the game showed everything behind the scenes, it looked way over the top. I think it would have been the same with this game. No one in a Star Wars film ever chops up that many humanoids, so if a player was to see thousands of humanoids being dismembered in this video game it would look repulsive, even if there was no blood.

Another thing I have a huge problem with is waiting right at the end of the first hallway in the TIE Fighter hangar. Why would a game with technology behind the scenes so advanced resort to including 'Unlimited Force Usage' or 'Extra Damage' powerups? Why would it have any powerups? It's the year 2008, Lucasarts, we're not running away from ghosts and eating pellets, we want some kind of depth in our games--or at least give the powerup some kind of veil behind Star Wars lure. I'm sure you could have thought of something if you actually put your minds to it. I wouldn't really have a problem with this, but this game was riding on its technology and how advanced it was for a Stormtrooper to think about grabbing onto something to not get pushed off a ledge or how wood splinters like real wood. It's trying to be realistic (within the context of the subject matter at least) so it's kind of stupid that they shoehorn these powerups in there.

Eh, you said the nit-picking was over, but a lot of this seems nit-picky to me. That said, however, it doesn't mean it doesn't matter. I basically agree with your points, and let me put it into perspective. If I saw this kind of inattention to detail in, say, Metal Gear Solid 4, I would be appalled. But, as this is a LucasArts game in the Star Wars setting, I didn't have expectations up where I do for a Metal Gear Solid game. Things like the Apprentice not reacting when the window explodes or not having a satisfying reason for why people aren't dying to a single light-saber stroke didn't bug me much because I didn't expect them from this game. BUT, if the devs wanted this game to be revolutionary, to be the second coming of Star Wars videogames, those kinds of attention to detail would have been in there. So yeah, it's nit-picking, but it's justified. But it wouldn't stop me from playing the game, either.

Oh, and word to the powerups thing. It's just lazy.


The lightsaber combat isn't very satisfying either. It's controlled by simple 'combos.' I know that a lot of games do this, but with the extremely visceral feeling one gets from using the Force in this game, this lightsaber swinging pales in comparison. I appreciate combining moves like infusing the lightsaber with lightning, and I understood that there are multiple combos depending on how many times the saber is swung, but how much better would it have been to have The Force Unleashed control like a faster version of Assassin's Creed? You would have to block all the blaster shots (instead of be able to get hit with like 15 shots before dying) and you could run while blocking, a feature conspicuously absent from the demo, which now forces the Apprentice to look like an idiot using the 'Force propel forward' move like a million times to get away from the AT-ST's fire. He could then press X while blocking to try to counter a blaster shot back to the guy who shot it. If he messed up a counter move it would just be a 'sloppy block' like in Assassin's Creed and he would lose health, but without actually being hit. Then when his health is gone, the next time he messes up a block he would be hit with a blaster shot and he'd die. When the apprentice was close he could do whatever combo he wanted to do, but with a more visceral feeling. It never feels like the Apprentice is paying attention to who he's slicing, like he doesn't know anybody's there. It just looks like he's flailing his saber about and people are falling down because of it. He never even impales people personally like Altair does, only when he's doing his lightsaber impale from afar.

They also missed the chance to do a few cool moves that Sith would be able to do, such as Force Choke. Perhaps this will be in the real game, but instead of L just flinging a guy straight up (which can already be done by flicking RS up) a player could hold it to choke the guy. Maybe you could feel his heartbeat with your controller like in The Godfather game or something. Jedi mind tricks would be cool too, maybe he could turn a guy (or an AT-ST) against his comrades. There are a lot of other powers that could be put to use, but I can't think of any others at the moment.

Also, and many people don't understand that this is what's happening, the targeting system for using Force Grip is relative to the Apprentice's position, and not relative to the camera's position. This means a player has to position the Apprentice exactly towards something to grab it, but most people just try to point the camera at whatever the thing is and cry when he picks up the wrong thing. This is a flaw with the game, however because if the player is pointing towards something there is no way for the game to tell the difference between two targeted things if they're vertically stacked. A camera pointing towards them would be able to though, so I don't know why they didn't implement the targeting system that way, or at least give the option to do it either way like DEAD RISING did for Frank's camera's controls (by that I mean his camera used for photography, not the game's camera). And why can't you repeatedly fling a guy into a wall, like in the target video for the game that was released with the game's announcement?

A couple of things in regards to your comments:

First, I don't get why everyone wants "run while blocking". Blocking makes Starkiller nearly invulnerable. There are enough barriers in the game that you don't need to block while running. Run behind a barrier, take care of the close enemies, move up behind the next barrier. That's the kind of game we're playing here. I disagree with the run while blocking complaint I keep seeing. It would make it far too easy, in my opinion.

Also, we did not get to experience everything the Apprentice gets to do nor every facet of the game in this demo, apparently. Reading the 1Up preview, it sounds like we missed out on quite a bit, which may help a lot with the things being complained about here (run while blocking, limited moveset, limited lightsaber fighting, etc.). Time (and reviews) will tell if the things that weren't in the demo make up for the problems people felt were in the demo. It does seem, based on videos and previews, that much of the fighting is combos of lightsaber and force, and that the focus in combat is on those combinations. And that's okay with me if there's enough variety and enough carrots of them throughout the game.

Last, and certainly not least is the weak boss battle against the AT-ST at the end of the demo. I know a lot of people speculate that this is not going to be in the real game, but whether it is or not is irrelevant. The problem still stands in that is how you have to kill an AT-ST in the game, and most likely all other bosses. The stupid 'weaken him by beating him with your lightsaber and other moves ad nauseum and then do a quicktime event' is so archaic it's laughable. God of War does it well, but in a setting where a player is under the impression that he can kill almost anything with his "Unleashed" Force powers, it's stupid to say that an AT-ST is a formidable foe. It explodes after tripping on a bunch of logs set up by Ewoks! You think it takes this much effort to destroy an AT-ST? A strong wind can blow one of those over! The stomp attack it does is stupid because it doesn't even make sense in this physics-based world the game sets up, and the 'two shot' attack is annoying, knocking the player yards back, and usually off the edge of the platform he's on. The ultimate frustration sets in when the player realizes just how useless the block move really is when the '20 blaster shots' attack can't even be escaped after a successful block because apparently it takes less time to reload than it takes for a Sith warrior to get off his ass and move out of the way. I could have thought of so many better ways to take care of an AT-ST in an Unleashed fashion it's not even funny. Not in a finisher, just right when you encounter him. In fact:
  • Target his legs and take them out from under him
  • Target his head and push him off the edge
  • Use the Force to bend the guns so when they tried to shoot they would explode
  • Use the Force to open the hatch where the Stormtroopers inside see from and pull them out, disabling it
  • Use your lightsaber (which can still cut through metal like a hot knife through butter in the game) and cut his legs off
  • Use your jughtsaber and cut it anywhere. It'd probably go down.
  • Use Force Lightning on the power source, overloading it and probably making it explode or something.
  • Jump on top of it and thrust your lightsaber into the top of its head like a Colossus

Those are just a couple of ideas I had that would be better than this generic miniboss encounter.

So many complaints about the AT-ST fight. I agree that it was a lame fight example. It was most definitely tacked on, and I couldn't see the AT-ST as an "end-boss" for a zone. But then again, it's probably more of a miniboss than anything.

Anyhow, when I first did it, I also had trouble. Mostly because the ATE didn't pop up for me and I just kept attacking the damn thing til I was dead. Second try I nailed it quite a bit, killed it's friends, then the ATE finally went off and I finished him.

We've known for a long time this game was going to have tons of ATE events. And that's fine. But what's not fine, in my opinion, is for the ATEs to be placed at the bottom of the screen so we can't even see the action! Very poor choice. If they insist on ATEs, which they did, they should have made them more dynamic, where we can choose which button to hit and the game tells us when to hit it by a screen effect or sound or SOMETHING other than random buttons at the bottom of the screen, and depending on our choice, we either damage it a lot or a little.

So yes, I agree generally with the complaint. I'll be disappointed if all the boss encounters turn out to be ATEs. And yeah, when Starkiller can pick up a TIE bomber without flinching but not flick an AT-ST off the edge of a platform with his pinky finger, something's up.

Anyway, I'm hoping the demo is just a taste, and not the whole package.
I hope it turns out that this kind of zone is just a small part of what we encounter. We'll see. Jury's still out, and I'm still wondering if I'll get the Wii version, the PS3 version, or no version at all!
Post by zityz (1,644 posts) See mini bio Level 19 / 2104 ACH / 23160 P
Thing that bugged me is why I couldn't deflect blaster shots back at the troopers?

I tried to time it and everything, he just blocks them away.

Oh well, does look good, but It will have to wait until the end of the year before I get it. I'll still buy it, my last favorite star wars game was Battlefront 2, the jedi and sith were a bit cheap, but still fun none the less.

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