EG fires Orb from broadcasts for dropping the N-Bomb in game

Posted by Slag (4864 posts) -

After the whole Aris FGC fiasco, it's refreshing to see someone of stature in the game community not tolerate this kind of abusive garbage.

here's the basic gist of what happened to my knowledge

Evil Geniuses (a Starcraft 2 clan) had recently announced that they had brought on Orb to cast their Master Cup Series. Almost immediately afterward screenshots surfaced on reddit showing Orb tossing out n-bombs at his opponent in a ladder match in a derogatory manner. Orbs denies that it was him, claiming it was a witch hunt and implying that a friend was using his account.

EG announces they are reviewing the situation, more screenshots surface, people start contacting EG's sponsors, EG terminates Orb. Orb owns up to the second batch of screenshots but not the first.

EG's CEO's statement on the matter

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=319018

Orb's apology

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=319038

I personally never seen someone actually get punished so publicly for this sort of thing before, so it's nice to see at least someone being held accountable for crossing the line. Eventhough the incidents didn't occur on the job (not sure if they occurred before he was hired or not), they certainly occurred in a manner that reflected on EG as an organization, so I think the firing is justifable. They've established a precedent now, it will be interesting to see if they actually continue to follow it later on.

It's also nice to see Orb owning up to basically all of it and accepting his punishment. Hopefully he'll bounce back from this.

and hopefully a sign of things to come. I know I have friends who won't game anymore because they are sick of dealing with garbage like this.

#1 Posted by Slag (4864 posts) -

After the whole Aris FGC fiasco, it's refreshing to see someone of stature in the game community not tolerate this kind of abusive garbage.

here's the basic gist of what happened to my knowledge

Evil Geniuses (a Starcraft 2 clan) had recently announced that they had brought on Orb to cast their Master Cup Series. Almost immediately afterward screenshots surfaced on reddit showing Orb tossing out n-bombs at his opponent in a ladder match in a derogatory manner. Orbs denies that it was him, claiming it was a witch hunt and implying that a friend was using his account.

EG announces they are reviewing the situation, more screenshots surface, people start contacting EG's sponsors, EG terminates Orb. Orb owns up to the second batch of screenshots but not the first.

EG's CEO's statement on the matter

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=319018

Orb's apology

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=319038

I personally never seen someone actually get punished so publicly for this sort of thing before, so it's nice to see at least someone being held accountable for crossing the line. Eventhough the incidents didn't occur on the job (not sure if they occurred before he was hired or not), they certainly occurred in a manner that reflected on EG as an organization, so I think the firing is justifable. They've established a precedent now, it will be interesting to see if they actually continue to follow it later on.

It's also nice to see Orb owning up to basically all of it and accepting his punishment. Hopefully he'll bounce back from this.

and hopefully a sign of things to come. I know I have friends who won't game anymore because they are sick of dealing with garbage like this.

#2 Posted by csl316 (9448 posts) -

Bummer for him, seemed like a nice guy based on the EG tournament from last week. But regardless, I support punishing people for saying things they shouldn't say. Could be a partial reaction to what happened with the fighting game community, as well, after the shitstorm that came down on them recently. Makes sense for EG to cut this at the bud.

I've always generally been of the mindset that saying something dumb in the middle of a high tension scenario doesn't immediately make you a racist/homophobe/sexist, etc. You may just be saying words without thinking about what they mean. Yet even if he's not on the job, technically, he was still doing something Starcraft related and should face some repercussions.

#3 Posted by MethodMan008 (822 posts) -

I love EG.. Don't know anything about the SC2, but EG and Complexity Cross Counter are two of the most exciting teams in the fighting game scene.

#4 Posted by GS_Dan (1397 posts) -

You're terminated, fucker.

#5 Edited by Grimluck343 (1160 posts) -

Edit: Fuck it, it's not worth pissing off all of the white knights.

#6 Posted by jkuc316 (981 posts) -

I knew you would bring up the FGC in this.

@MethodMan008: I would agree with you. But I also love Team Madcatz(Most of them on it) and eLive(Good team of KOF and SF Players).

#7 Posted by ShadowConqueror (3085 posts) -

If I understand correctly, he got fired for saying "nigger" in his spare time? Or was this during an EG-sponsored event?

I'm not a racist, but I don't agree with firing him if it wasn't during an event. What he says in his private time should have nothing to do with his job status. Now, if he were to say it during an event, it would be unprofessional and I would be more willing to accept his termination. Sure it is a "hateful" word, but people put too much emphasis on swear words in general. Stop letting it offend you and it loses its power, and would probably be used less.

Now, if this occurred in his spare time (even if it was streamed, as is often the case with Starcraft 2), I would say firing him was wrong. They may not want someone who might be seen as racist representing them, but if everyone got fired for something they said in their private time that was taken out of context there would be far less people with jobs.

#8 Posted by StarvingGamer (8555 posts) -
@ShadowConqueror It's a good thing you're not a business like EG then. Either they fire Orb and everyone says, "yeah ok, makes sense," or they keep him on and tacitly condone his hateful actions leading to a loss of fans and, ultimately, a loss of revenue. A team like EG trades almost exclusively off of good will and public perception in regards to their brand. Even if you don't agree with the morality of their decision, you can't argue with the economics of it.
#9 Posted by Woodroez (346 posts) -

@ShadowConqueror said:

If I understand correctly, he got fired for saying "nigger" in his spare time? Or was this during an EG-sponsored event?

I'm not a racist, but I don't agree with firing him if it wasn't during an event. What he says in his private time should have nothing to do with his job status. Now, if he were to say it during an event, it would be unprofessional and I would be more willing to accept his termination. Sure it is a "hateful" word, but people put too much emphasis on swear words in general. Stop letting it offend you and it loses its power, and would probably be used less.

Now, if this occurred in his spare time (even if it was streamed, as is often the case with Starcraft 2), I would say firing him was wrong. They may not want someone who might be seen as racist representing them, but if everyone got fired for something they said in their private time that was taken out of context there would be far less people with jobs.

People are constantly held accountable within their profession for their actions outside of their professional lives. Politicians losing their position because of scandal or professional athletes getting fined for tweeting something of questionable taste are a couple of the higher-profile examples of somebody being punished for doing something they pretty obviously shouldn't do.

And that's fair. Professionals can inevitably become the face of their organization, whether they're on the clock or not, and politicians can potentially represent citizens populating vast swathes of land. Whether it be an organization's leadership or a politician's constituents, those folks are paying someone to perform a skill and do it in a dignified manner that reflects well upon them. Why should they ask for any less, when they have a financial and/or societal stake in that employee?

The statement from EG's CEO as linked in the OP does a fine job of explaining why the n-word will never "lose its power", but in short, I'd ask you to find a black man old enough to remember America before MLK and the civil rights movement; a man who knows the history and blood that that word is soaked in, and tell him to "Stop letting it offend you." It is not and will never be that simple for most people, and for the rest, speaks to their ignorance of where that word came and just why most people aren't even willing to spell it out.

#10 Edited by WilltheMagicAsian (1542 posts) -

@MethodMan008 said:

I love EG.. Don't know anything about the SC2, but EG and Complexity Cross Counter are two of the most exciting teams in the fighting game scene.

I find that ironic, because I don't know anything about SC2 and the FGC but EG (after they picked up old Complexity) and Complexity were two of the most exciting teams in the CS 1.6 scene.

#11 Posted by GunslingerPanda (4859 posts) -

It's a bit of a overreaction. If the incident in question had happened like last week then fine, but it was two years ago or something?

#12 Posted by Contrarian (1143 posts) -

It is only offensive if you choose it to be. That is the problem, people choose to be offended. it gives them power. No real opinion on this though other than, using the "n" word in public is just asking for trouble, work related or not.

#13 Posted by notlupus (45 posts) -

kind of an overreaction here. Also based on past EG behavior I would love to point out that this is the pot calling the kettle black. Back around the time Idra left the SC2 scene in the GSL and they brought on Kelly as an announcer I remember him and Incontrol re-streaming the matches on Incontrol's justintv account and talking shit and using ethnic insults for her and some of the players. It was bad enough that a justin admin came into the chat and told them they had to stop their re-stream and cut down on the shit talking or incontrol's account would end up banned.

Fast forward a year later....oh no Orb used the N word, you are fired! Hey Grack...Geoff how are you guys?

#14 Posted by Tarsier (1078 posts) -

you guys its 2012 seriously african american black people have been using the N word for years and gays have begun using the F and G words these words change their meanings and nobody finds them offensive any more and if they are theyre just playing victims .

#15 Posted by CFOP (4 posts) -

Reminds me of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Richards#Laugh_Factory_incident.

I've been following SC2 pretty closely for over a year and I had never even heard of Orb before this. I don't think should be as big as it is in the scene right now, like it's some kind of huge drama. It seems worse how he lied about it several times trying to cover his ass than the fact that he said something like that in the first place. Maybe Orb is a bigger deal than I think he is, but either way it really sucks that things like this are what manages to surface outside of the SC world and give it bad exposer. Like people who never fly being afraid of flying because you never hear news of the endless successful takeoffs and landings, only the rare crashes.

#16 Posted by FluxWaveZ (19388 posts) -

@Tarsier said:

you guys its 2012 seriously african american black people have been using the N word for years and gays have begun using the F and G words these words change their meanings and nobody finds them offensive any more and if they are theyre just playing victims .

Don't speak for others if you're not the target of such discrimination.

#17 Posted by Animasta (14723 posts) -

good on em, that post was pretty fucking rad (the one where the CEO explains why). all you people saying "people choose to be offended" and "it's just a wooooooooord", fuck you

#18 Posted by Tarsier (1078 posts) -

@FluxWaveZ said:

@Tarsier said:

you guys its 2012 seriously african american black people have been using the N word for years and gays have begun using the F and G words these words change their meanings and nobody finds them offensive any more and if they are theyre just playing victims .

Don't speak for others if you're not the target of such discrimination.

ok anime guy

#19 Posted by baldgye (757 posts) -

never liked orb, so i dont really care about him being a a stupid fuck

#20 Posted by NickL (2247 posts) -

What I hate about this whole situation is that so many people complained to EG's sponsors before EG even decided what to do with orb (EG's owner said he would develop a well thought out decision and asked the community for a little time to do so)

I wouldn't be surprised if one or more of EGs sponsors pulls out after all the shit they got from the community and that just hurts the scene.

I fucking love SC2, still play it regularly and still watch every tournament I have time for, but I don't want anything to do with the shitheads that make up the community.

In short, the community is killing esports.

#21 Posted by Bwast (1342 posts) -

He's calling people niggers because they beat him at a computer game. You can defend his use of the word all you want, it's still incredibly immature.

#22 Posted by spartanlolz92 (511 posts) -

@ShadowConqueror said:

If I understand correctly, he got fired for saying "nigger" in his spare time? Or was this during an EG-sponsored event?

I'm not a racist, but I don't agree with firing him if it wasn't during an event. What he says in his private time should have nothing to do with his job status. Now, if he were to say it during an event, it would be unprofessional and I would be more willing to accept his termination. Sure it is a "hateful" word, but people put too much emphasis on swear words in general. Stop letting it offend you and it loses its power, and would probably be used less.

Now, if this occurred in his spare time (even if it was streamed, as is often the case with Starcraft 2), I would say firing him was wrong. They may not want someone who might be seen as racist representing them, but if everyone got fired for something they said in their private time that was taken out of context there would be far less people with jobs.

this. jus tlike a gestured a person calling you a dumba** or stupid is pretty much the same. if you dont care it loses its power just like the c word has no effect on me

#23 Posted by Milkman (17320 posts) -
@Tarsier said:

you guys its 2012 seriously african american black people have been using the N word for years and gays have begun using the F and G words these words change their meanings and nobody finds them offensive any more and if they are theyre just playing victims .

Oh good lord, please fuck yourself. 
#24 Posted by strangone (179 posts) -

Pretty hypocritical of EG to punish Orb in this way, when Idra regularly says "faggot" on stream.

#25 Posted by Dagbiker (6978 posts) -

He used a Neutron Bomb?

FUCK...

#26 Posted by Tarsier (1078 posts) -

@Milkman said:

@Tarsier said:

you guys its 2012 seriously african american black people have been using the N word for years and gays have begun using the F and G words these words change their meanings and nobody finds them offensive any more and if they are theyre just playing victims .

Oh good lord, please fuck yourself.

discrimination

#27 Posted by haffy (674 posts) -

@NickL said:

What I hate about this whole situation is that so many people complained to EG's sponsors before EG even decided what to do with orb (EG's owner said he would develop a well thought out decision and asked the community for a little time to do so)

I wouldn't be surprised if one or more of EGs sponsors pulls out after all the shit they got from the community and that just hurts the scene.

I fucking love SC2, still play it regularly and still watch every tournament I have time for, but I don't want anything to do with the shitheads that make up the community.

In short, the community is killing esports.

I really doubt EG sponsors will be pulling out anytime soon. I can probably name every EG sponsor off the top of my head just because of how much they're drilled into you when watching streams, listening to plays like Incontrol on SOTG, inside the game, all the players streams etc... they're getting what they want.

This shit about Orb doesn't bother me in the slightest, I don't really get too easily offended, especially if the word has no meaning or connection to me. It's immature yes, but really who cares, especially in the context the word was used in. I guess it's a good thing in the end though. If SC was a small community, next to no one would give a shit. But as it stands, threads on multi forums, a 60+ and a 170+ page threads on TL. At least people care enough to not want this sort of behavior of the people they see as professionals, which annoying as it is to me, is only a good thing in the end.

#28 Posted by Katkillad (142 posts) -

You all are missing the bests parts from his apology...
 
"My judgement was clouded by anger, rage, and frustration, and I thought the offensive language would be interpreted as comedy and venting rather than legitimate world views of mine. "
 
"I want to make absolutely clear that I am not a racist. The accusations against me could not be farther from the truth. The 'N word' was used in a replacable fashion, in that any other curse word would have held the exact same meaning for me."
 
"I judge people based on who they are, not the color of their skin, and I would challenge anyone to debate me on this matter. I have never once held any bit of racism in my heart,"  Except for that part where...you know, you are calling people racist names.
 
I love it when things people say behind the curtain of the internet is translated into real life, mostly with these competitive video game broadcasts, and they are surprised that society is offended.   If the first thing you want to do when you get mad/angry is call someone an N word, you need a reality check.  You can justify it however you want to yourself, that doesn't mean society agrees. 

#29 Posted by baldgye (757 posts) -

@strangone said:

Pretty hypocritical of EG to punish Orb in this way, when Idra regularly says "faggot" on stream.

except IdrA is actually worth something, Orb isn't.

#30 Posted by Twinsun (495 posts) -

He is obviously just some immature dude, no need for all this drama.

#31 Posted by haffy (674 posts) -

@Katkillad said:

You all are missing the bests parts from his apology... "My judgement was clouded by anger, rage, and frustration, and I thought the offensive language would be interpreted as comedy and venting rather than legitimate world views of mine. " "I want to make absolutely clear that I am not a racist. The accusations against me could not be farther from the truth. The 'N word' was used in a replacable fashion, in that any other curse word would have held the exact same meaning for me." "I judge people based on who they are, not the color of their skin, and I would challenge anyone to debate me on this matter. I have never once held any bit of racism in my heart," Except for that part where...you know, you are calling people racist names. I love it when things people say behind the curtain of the internet is translated into real life, mostly with these competitive video game broadcasts, and they are surprised that society is offended. If the first thing you want to do when you get mad/angry is call someone an N word, you need a reality check. You can justify it however you want to yourself, that doesn't mean society agrees.

You think he's a racist based on the fact that he used the word nigger? Does that me a racist now?

On the internet, in general your alone. You can't see the other persons face or eyes, so you treat people different. It's not as if it's an internet thing either.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_prison_experiment

Here's Zimbardo's experiment, just having different uniforms and always wearing glasses made the mock prison officers from similar backgrounds completely miss treat the mock prisoners. So expecting people to never vent frustration on others whiling using the internet is pretty ridiculous.

Also how do you know society is offended? Where did you find out that society disagrees on this particular issue? Are you really offended or did you just want to voice your opinion? Personally, I couldn't give a shit. And you have no real evidence to show a majority of people agree with your opinion. This isn't even taking into account for people who don't even bother to read and replay to the thread. It's pretty rare for someone to read something like this going on and to post that they're indifferent.

One more thing, people vent frustration on their own all the time. He doesn't need a reality check... but maybe you could do with one. Considering you think society agrees with you on all your opinions. Seems pretty delusional to me.

About my last sentence; it's not really nice or fair when someone takes what you say out of context to further their argument. And it's not really difficult to do, it was the point I was trying to make with the delusional statement.

#32 Posted by BrockNRolla (1694 posts) -

@Tarsier said:

you guys its 2012 seriously african american black people have been using the N word for years and gays have begun using the F and G words these words change their meanings and nobody finds them offensive any more and if they are theyre just playing victims .

I find the words offensive and I belong to neither group. I yell at my gay roommate all the time for using the word "fag." I see no need for throwing around slurs. They are forms of hate speech regardless of how anyone uses them and unless you're having an academic discussion about the words, I can't imagine a scenario where a better word, less the terribly negative connotations, couldn't be used.

#33 Posted by BrockNRolla (1694 posts) -

@haffy said:

@Katkillad said:

You all are missing the bests parts from his apology... "My judgement was clouded by anger, rage, and frustration, and I thought the offensive language would be interpreted as comedy and venting rather than legitimate world views of mine. " "I want to make absolutely clear that I am not a racist. The accusations against me could not be farther from the truth. The 'N word' was used in a replacable fashion, in that any other curse word would have held the exact same meaning for me." "I judge people based on who they are, not the color of their skin, and I would challenge anyone to debate me on this matter. I have never once held any bit of racism in my heart," Except for that part where...you know, you are calling people racist names. I love it when things people say behind the curtain of the internet is translated into real life, mostly with these competitive video game broadcasts, and they are surprised that society is offended. If the first thing you want to do when you get mad/angry is call someone an N word, you need a reality check. You can justify it however you want to yourself, that doesn't mean society agrees.

You think he's a racist based on the fact that he used the word nigger? Does that me a racist now?

On the internet, in general your alone. You can't see the other persons face or eyes, so you treat people different. It's not as if it's an internet thing either.

Also how do you know society is offended? Where did you find out that society disagrees on this particular issue? Are you really offended or did you just want to voice your opinion? Personally, I couldn't give a shit. And you have no real evidence to show a majority of people agree with your opinion. This isn't even taking into account for people who don't even bother to read and replay to the thread. It's pretty rare for someone to read something like this going on and to post that they're indifferent.

One more thing, people vent frustration on their own all the time. He doesn't need a reality check... but maybe you could do with one. Considering you think society agrees with you on all your opinions. Seems pretty delusional to me.

But that's the problem with people's behavior on the internet. They act like they are alone, but you are never alone on the internet. The internet is a public forum, and people should act in a manner that they would be comfortable with in public. Just because you don't have to face the people you might effect doesn't mean you shouldn't act in an appropriate manner.

I think it's wrong to use hate-speech in place of generic expletives. If you want to "vent" then there are many way to do it that don't involve words that carry such charged, negative connotations. We wouldn't (well, most of us anyway) use hate-speech in the general public to vent our frustration because we know that it isn't acceptable. We shouldn't be acting differently simply because we don't have to face people on the internet. That's common sense instilled from generally held public values, and it applies here as well as anywhere.

#34 Posted by TheSouthernDandy (3924 posts) -
@Tarsier

@FluxWaveZ said:

@Tarsier said:

you guys its 2012 seriously african american black people have been using the N word for years and gays have begun using the F and G words these words change their meanings and nobody finds them offensive any more and if they are theyre just playing victims .

Don't speak for others if you're not the target of such discrimination.

ok anime guy

Fantastic job defending your point.

I think its good he was held accountable. I don't think he should be blacklisted from anything in the future, he's taken his lumps and apologized but as this became public, EG needed to take action.
#35 Posted by BrockNRolla (1694 posts) -

@TheSouthernDandy said:

@Tarsier

@FluxWaveZ said:

@Tarsier said:

you guys its 2012 seriously african american black people have been using the N word for years and gays have begun using the F and G words these words change their meanings and nobody finds them offensive any more and if they are theyre just playing victims .

Don't speak for others if you're not the target of such discrimination.

ok anime guy

Fantastic job defending your point. I think its good he was held accountable. I don't think he should be blacklisted from anything in the future, he's taken his lumps and apologized but as this became public, EG needed to take action.

That's right. Apologizing should make everything better.

#36 Posted by baldgye (757 posts) -

@TheSouthernDandy said:

@Tarsier

@FluxWaveZ said:

@Tarsier said:

you guys its 2012 seriously african american black people have been using the N word for years and gays have begun using the F and G words these words change their meanings and nobody finds them offensive any more and if they are theyre just playing victims .

Don't speak for others if you're not the target of such discrimination.

ok anime guy

Fantastic job defending your point. I think its good he was held accountable. I don't think he should be blacklisted from anything in the future, he's taken his lumps and apologized but as this became public, EG needed to take action.

No, what he did was deny the whole thing on redit and call out anyone who thought he said the 'n' word... including people like TB... the guys an average caster, a worse obs and apparentally also not very bright. I don't see any reason why people like him should be put in positions at teams like EG.

#37 Posted by TheSouthernDandy (3924 posts) -

I'm just going by what I've read on here haven't had the chance to look at everything that happened. If that's the case then maybe he's burned his bridges. Ultimately my point was EG was in the right.

#38 Posted by baldgye (757 posts) -

if you've not read about the whole thing, then your opinion on the subject is meaningless.

#39 Posted by Katkillad (142 posts) -
@haffy said:

@Katkillad said:

You all are missing the bests parts from his apology... "My judgement was clouded by anger, rage, and frustration, and I thought the offensive language would be interpreted as comedy and venting rather than legitimate world views of mine. " "I want to make absolutely clear that I am not a racist. The accusations against me could not be farther from the truth. The 'N word' was used in a replacable fashion, in that any other curse word would have held the exact same meaning for me." "I judge people based on who they are, not the color of their skin, and I would challenge anyone to debate me on this matter. I have never once held any bit of racism in my heart," Except for that part where...you know, you are calling people racist names. I love it when things people say behind the curtain of the internet is translated into real life, mostly with these competitive video game broadcasts, and they are surprised that society is offended. If the first thing you want to do when you get mad/angry is call someone an N word, you need a reality check. You can justify it however you want to yourself, that doesn't mean society agrees.

You think he's a racist based on the fact that he used the word nigger? Does that me a racist now?

On the internet, in general your alone. You can't see the other persons face or eyes, so you treat people different. It's not as if it's an internet thing either.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_prison_experiment

Here's Zimbardo's experiment, just having different uniforms and always wearing glasses made the mock prison officers from similar backgrounds completely miss treat the mock prisoners. So expecting people to never vent frustration on others whiling using the internet is pretty ridiculous.

Also how do you know society is offended? Where did you find out that society disagrees on this particular issue? Are you really offended or did you just want to voice your opinion? Personally, I couldn't give a shit. And you have no real evidence to show a majority of people agree with your opinion. This isn't even taking into account for people who don't even bother to read and replay to the thread. It's pretty rare for someone to read something like this going on and to post that they're indifferent.

One more thing, people vent frustration on their own all the time. He doesn't need a reality check... but maybe you could do with one. Considering you think society agrees with you on all your opinions. Seems pretty delusional to me. 

About my last sentence; it's not really nice or fair when someone takes what you say out of context to further their argument. And it's not really difficult to do, it was the point I was trying to make with the delusional statement.

First of all i'm well aware of the Stanford prison experiment and it has nothing to do with society's tolerance or lack thereof in regards to hate speech.
 
To answer your question, do i think you are racist if you freely use derogatory words because you are mad, joking and/or frustrated?  Absolutely and if you can't understand why then you need to contemplate on how things you say can be hurtful to others.  To help you understand, it's similar to why you'll never find anyone outside of the KKK naming their children Adolf.  People use derogatory words on the internet because it is the most offensive, it has nothing to do with knowing what race the other person is.  I don't need society in general to review a very specific case of some kid on the internet getting caught using racists terms, because i'm educated enough to know the norms of society.  Here is a good test, if you have a legitimate job, do you think you could get away with calling someone a n-word at work, even if it was a joke?  What if you called someone a jerk?  One might get you reprimanded and the other will get you fired.
 
And i didn't take anything out of context with those quotes, its obvious the guy is sorry people took it the wrong way according to his internet standards of what is acceptable and he isn't sorry for actually using the word.
#40 Posted by NaDannMaGoGo (338 posts) -

@baldgye said:

@TheSouthernDandy said:

@Tarsier

@FluxWaveZ said:

@Tarsier said:

you guys its 2012 seriously african american black people have been using the N word for years and gays have begun using the F and G words these words change their meanings and nobody finds them offensive any more and if they are theyre just playing victims .

Don't speak for others if you're not the target of such discrimination.

ok anime guy

Fantastic job defending your point. I think its good he was held accountable. I don't think he should be blacklisted from anything in the future, he's taken his lumps and apologized but as this became public, EG needed to take action.

No, what he did was deny the whole thing on redit and call out anyone who thought he said the 'n' word... including people like TB... the guys an average caster, a worse obs and apparentally also not very bright. I don't see any reason why people like him should be put in positions at teams like EG.

Yep.

Seriously, it's entirely Orb's loss. I still remember his beta stream: <play bad>, <insult opponent>, <repeat previous action>. You know, one of those childish morons that keeps telling his audience how fucking retarded everyone is whenever he loses.

So apparently in the meantime he became another one of those meh-Casters for NASL. I've not seen a lot because the NASL is seriously just bad, but from what I've seen he sits there like some Mr. Nice Guy telling us: "Yes player XYZ is really a good player. I like his playstyle and [...]"

Now when I saw that I was rather surprised. After all Orb was a prick before, but it looked like he changed.

WRONG. Apparently he still does the same childish flaming as before when laddering? While being a "professional" Caster at the same time? Was he so fucking dumb to actually not even consider any possible consequences? I can't believe that he didn't stop doing this. It's moronic enough by itself, but after getting a professional casting job? That's just dumb.

I don't know if he is still part of the NASL caster team, but if so, what a joke. How could anyone not see some little actor playing Mr. Nice Guy in front of the camera sitting there.

#41 Posted by EkajArmstro (397 posts) -

Didn't read the whole thread so I don't know if this has been said, but I think one of the main reasons EG got rid of him is that he lied and said he didn't do it (said someone else was on his account). EG said that they trusted him but if they found out he was lying they'd get rid of him. And that's just what happened.

#42 Posted by Jimi (1126 posts) -

I honestly don't understand why they took Orb on in the first place, he is known for being a complete asshole and just comes off as out of his depth.

#43 Posted by StepwiseDuchess (79 posts) -

Orb has a bright career ahead of him. Jk.

#44 Posted by S0ndor (2716 posts) -

Saying nigger or any other swear word when frustrated or angry doesn't make a person racist or evil. Using such terms while being recorded is just plain dumb however.

The community's reaction is grossly exaggerated, but it's necessary to set an example sometimes. Sucks for him that he was the chosen one this time around.

#45 Posted by haffy (674 posts) -

@Katkillad said:

@haffy said:

@Katkillad said:

You all are missing the bests parts from his apology... "My judgement was clouded by anger, rage, and frustration, and I thought the offensive language would be interpreted as comedy and venting rather than legitimate world views of mine. " "I want to make absolutely clear that I am not a racist. The accusations against me could not be farther from the truth. The 'N word' was used in a replacable fashion, in that any other curse word would have held the exact same meaning for me." "I judge people based on who they are, not the color of their skin, and I would challenge anyone to debate me on this matter. I have never once held any bit of racism in my heart," Except for that part where...you know, you are calling people racist names. I love it when things people say behind the curtain of the internet is translated into real life, mostly with these competitive video game broadcasts, and they are surprised that society is offended. If the first thing you want to do when you get mad/angry is call someone an N word, you need a reality check. You can justify it however you want to yourself, that doesn't mean society agrees.

You think he's a racist based on the fact that he used the word nigger? Does that me a racist now?

On the internet, in general your alone. You can't see the other persons face or eyes, so you treat people different. It's not as if it's an internet thing either.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_prison_experiment

Here's Zimbardo's experiment, just having different uniforms and always wearing glasses made the mock prison officers from similar backgrounds completely miss treat the mock prisoners. So expecting people to never vent frustration on others whiling using the internet is pretty ridiculous.

Also how do you know society is offended? Where did you find out that society disagrees on this particular issue? Are you really offended or did you just want to voice your opinion? Personally, I couldn't give a shit. And you have no real evidence to show a majority of people agree with your opinion. This isn't even taking into account for people who don't even bother to read and replay to the thread. It's pretty rare for someone to read something like this going on and to post that they're indifferent.

One more thing, people vent frustration on their own all the time. He doesn't need a reality check... but maybe you could do with one. Considering you think society agrees with you on all your opinions. Seems pretty delusional to me.

About my last sentence; it's not really nice or fair when someone takes what you say out of context to further their argument. And it's not really difficult to do, it was the point I was trying to make with the delusional statement.

First of all i'm well aware of the Stanford prison experiment and it has nothing to do with society's tolerance or lack thereof in regards to hate speech. To answer your question, do i think you are racist if you freely use derogatory words because you are mad, joking and/or frustrated? Absolutely and if you can't understand why then you need to contemplate on how things you say can be hurtful to others. To help you understand, it's similar to why you'll never find anyone outside of the KKK naming their children Adolf. People use derogatory words on the internet because it is the most offensive, it has nothing to do with knowing what race the other person is. I don't need society in general to review a very specific case of some kid on the internet getting caught using racists terms, because i'm educated enough to know the norms of society. Here is a good test, if you have a legitimate job, do you think you could get away with calling someone a n-word at work, even if it was a joke? What if you called someone a jerk? One might get you reprimanded and the other will get you fired. And i didn't take anything out of context with those quotes, its obvious the guy is sorry people took it the wrong way according to his internet standards of what is acceptable and he isn't sorry for actually using the word.

I mentioned Zimbardo's experiment in regards to how people act differently in different situations. It's easy to judge someone by how they act in a specific circumstance but it doesn't reflect their full personality.

Alright, so you back your opinion of how you know society responds to a person's frustration in an isolated situation by anecdotes and more personal opinion.

Again I, I'll refer to Zimbardo. Different circumstances means different reactions. I could call my sort of boss all sorts of racist shit outside of work or when we play badminton. But obviously if I do at work or in front of people it's different. So stop coming up with the worst possible situation that an event can occur and think of the other possibility's. Orb was not at work when this situation happened. Start using comparisons that are actually relevant.

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