So, i'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that Street Fighter IV won't have any kind of story, or adventure mode. Which is a bummer. I think that has become a must for any game nowadays. Would you spend 60 bucks on a FPS game that had no storyline whatsoever? That is just a few multiplayer maps and that's it? Obviously some people out there would, but i sure as hell wouldn't. I'm going to make sure that i'm getting the most out of my 60 bucks. I want a lot of content for that pricetag.
I think Super Smash Bros. Brawl really set an example for all that you can cram into a fighting game. It wasn't just a few multiplayer maps, and that's it. SSBB had tons of stuff crammed into it, not to mention an adventure/story mode. All for 50 bucks. This isn't me saying that the SSB series is better then SF. I'm just pointing out the fact that you can have a LOT more in a fighting game then just multiplayer on different level backgrounds.
Basically Street Fighter IV doesn't have anything in it that appeals to me more then say Super Street Fighter HD Remix. Sure, SF4 has better graphics, a few more characters, and trophies. But from what i hear, that's all that is going to be different. And that is not enough to make me want to fork over 60 bucks for it... The gaming experience i would get from SF4, is not going to be that much different from the gaming experience i get from Super Street Fighter HD Remix.
Now, that's not to say i don't appreciate Street Fighter games. I have a lot of fun playing them, especially against friends in the same room. I will buy a game solely for it's multiplayer, but not for the "full-game" price of 60 bucks. I'm sure i'll even eventually buy SF4 when it's down to half price. I just don't think the price vs. content is fair when a game is just multiplayer, and that's it.
I realize that there are some crazy, nutty SF4 people out there. And that yes, they will fork over that 60 bucks in a heartbeat. As long as the game has multiplayer, that's all they care about (maybe that's why the SF4 developers can get away with such little content). But what about you less "blind" people out there? Will you fork over 60 bucks for a game that's basically just different backgrounds, a few more characters, and slightly better graphics?
I for one plan on getting more life out of my Super Street Fighter HD Remix purchase before i move on to any other SF game. Unless i read in a game review that SF4 has a lot more content then i first thought. Enough to warrant that 60 bucks.
Street Fighter IV
Game » consists of 9 releases. Released Jul 18, 2008
After nearly a decade in hiatus, Capcom's signature mainline fighting game series resurfaces with its fourth main installment, combining the traditional 2D gameplay with modern fully-3D graphics.
Fighters Without a Story
Judging by the arcade game the game should have great single player. Even better cause that was the arcade. Also would I spend 60 bucks on an fps game with no story? Well I find it ironic that you specifically picked the fps game for your point despite the fact that some of the most popular fps games have shitty to no stories (halo 3) (metroid Prime 3)
And I am spending 150 bucks for the 80 dollar arcade stick with the 70 dollar collectors edition and I doubt I will have anyone to play with. I always tend to have way more fun with fighting games single player than most people do I dont see whats so hard about it. Just play the game a lot. If it has lots of unlockables for letting me play through with each character multiple times (achievements can count too) thats all I need and it will last me a long ass time.
"Judging by the arcade game the game should have great single player. Even better cause that was the arcade. Also would I spend 60 bucks on an fps game with no story? Well I find it ironic that you specifically picked the fps game for your point despite the fact that some of the most popular fps games have shitty to no stories (halo 3) (metroid Prime 3)Metroid Prime does not have a shitty story. Change that shit.
And I am spending 150 bucks for the 80 dollar arcade stick with the 70 dollar collectors edition and I doubt I will have anyone to play with. I always tend to have way more fun with fighting games single player than most people do I dont see whats so hard about it. Just play the game a lot. If it has lots of unlockables for letting me play through with each character multiple times (achievements can count too) thats all I need and it will last me a long ass time."
"So, i'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that Street Fighter IV won't have any kind of story, or adventure mode. Which is a bummer. I think that has become a must for any game nowadays. Would you spend 60 bucks on a FPS game that had no storyline whatsoever? That is just a few multiplayer maps and that's it? Obviously some people out there would, but i sure as hell wouldn't. I'm going to make sure that i'm getting the most out of my 60 bucks. I want a lot of content for that pricetag.You are the like opposite of those people that flame on bioshock for having no multiplayer.
I think Super Smash Bros. Brawl really set an example for all that you can cram into a fighting game. It wasn't just a few multiplayer maps, and that's it. SSBB had tons of stuff crammed into it, not to mention an adventure/story mode. All for 50 bucks. This isn't me saying that the SSB series is better then SF. I'm just pointing out the fact that you can have a LOT more in a fighting game then just multiplayer on different level backgrounds.
Basically Street Fighter IV doesn't have anything in it that appeals to me more then say Super Street Fighter HD Remix. Sure, SF4 has better graphics, a few more characters, and trophies. But from what i hear, that's all that is going to be different. And that is not enough to make me want to fork over 60 bucks for it... The gaming experience i would get from SF4, is not going to be that much different from the gaming experience i get from Super Street Fighter HD Remix.
Now, that's not to say i don't appreciate Street Fighter games. I have a lot of fun playing them, especially against friends in the same room. I will buy a game solely for it's multiplayer, but not for the "full-game" price of 60 bucks. I'm sure i'll even eventually buy SF4 when it's down to half price. I just don't think the price vs. content is fair when a game is just multiplayer, and that's it.
I realize that there are some crazy, nutty SF4 people out there. And that yes, they will fork over that 60 bucks in a heartbeat. As long as the game has multiplayer, that's all they care about (maybe that's why the SF4 developers can get away with such little content). But what about you less "blind" people out there? Will you fork over 60 bucks for a game that's basically just different backgrounds, a few more characters, and slightly better graphics?
I for one plan on getting more life out of my Super Street Fighter HD Remix purchase before i move on to any other SF game. Unless i read in a game review that SF4 has a lot more content then i first thought. Enough to warrant that 60 bucks."
Think of it this way, does madden ever really have a storyline? How about CS? TF2 had no storyline either. Left 4 dead?
A good fighting game is much like a game of chess; the more you know the game of chess, the more fun it becomes; you truely never "beat" chess just like you truely never beat a fighting game.
IMO a good fighting is worth 60 bucks especially nowadays since I can find myself playing at least 50 hours on HD remix.
From your post it doesn't seem you are that into fighting games anyway so we basically don't care if you would fork over 60 now or pay a little less later; You'll probably just complain people spam too much fireballs or something anyway. If SF4 has all the same features as HD remix including the online modes I'm fine with that. Just add the old fashion bonus stages and I know I will get my worth when I play over 100 hours on it.
Hell MvC2 had absolutely no story, but I would gladly pay 60 for a remix version (with redrawn sprites in HD) of that today.
"End_Boss said:"PureRok said:How do you do that? It's wireless.""Metroid Prime does not have a shitty story. Change that shit."Do it, before he strangles you with his Wiimote."
Not when it's connected to the Nunchuck...
"MAST said:
Think of it this way, does madden ever really have a storyline? How about CS? TF2 had no storyline either. Left 4 dead?
From your post it doesn't seem you are that into fighting games anyway so we basically don't care if you would fork over 60 now or pay a little less later; You'll probably just complain people spam too much fireballs or something anyway. If SF4 has all the same features as HD remix including the online modes I'm fine with that. Just add the old fashion bonus stages and I know I will get my worth when I play over 100 hours on it.
Well first off, i wasn't trying to start an argument. So there is no need to get defensive. Secondly, you obviously didn't read my entire post. So that makes me almost not even want to respond to you. If you had read my post, you'd see that i really, really like Street Fighter games. I played them as a kid, i bought Super Street Fighter HD Remix when it came out, and i'm positive that i will eventually buy Street Fighter 4. The point of my post, was just to express an opinion about the 60 dollar pricetag on a game that doesn't have much to it. And also, see what others thought about it. So don't try to make it out like i'm bashing Street Fighter, because i'm not.
You mention games like CS, and TF2, and you are inadvertantly proving my point. Are those games worth 60 dollars by themselves? Hell no! I mean, i'm sure there are some people out there that would fork over 60 bucks for them, but there is a reason why Valve didn't sell TF2 by itself for 60 bucks. TF2 came with like 5 other games in the Orange Box, all for 50 dollars, becuase it's not worth 50 on it's own. The same thing applies to CS, and the same thing applies again to Street Fighter 4.
It doesn't matter how competitve or in-depth the multiplayer aspect of these games are. Hell, people are still playing the original CS competitevly. But that doesn't mean it's worth 50-60 bucks. Even when CS first came out, i don't think they charged 50+ dollars for it. If they did, i'm sure it came bundled with Half-Life and other stuff. Which made it worth it... So while it's true that SF4 is an extremely in-depth, enjoyable multiplayer experience. That doesn't mean it's worth 60 dollars. Because when you get down to it, that's all Street Fighter is. Multiplayer with different backgrounds and a few more characters. As i said in my original post, you can get an almost equal experience from SSFHDRemix for only 15 bucks. The small amount of new content in SF4, the rebalancing, and the new graphics doesn't justify that much more of a cost.
In addition, just because there are some out there that will fork over that much for it. That doesn't mean it is worth that much. Take Left4Dead for example. Is that worth 50+ dollars? In my book, no. Absolutely not. Yes, there are people out there forking over 50 dollars for it, but that doesn't mean it's worth 50 bucks. If you take an honest, worthwhile look at how much content you get from Left4Dead for 50 dollars, you'd agree it's not worth it. I mean, compare the Orange Box with Left4Dead. Compare how much content you get in the Orange Box for 50 bucks, vs. how much you get with Left4Dead for 50 bucks. There is absolutely no comparison.
If people put aside their blind fanboism for Street Fighter games, and really analyzed what they are getting for their money. Most people would agree it's not really worth the 60 bucks. Yes, there are some hardcore Street Fighter people out there that will probably put a bajillion hours into playing Street Fighter 4 online. I'd say they are getting their money's worth. But for people like me, even though i really like Street Fighter, it's not worth the 60 dollars at all. Considering all the other games out there that have 20 times more content then SF4, plus multiplayer that is equally engrossing, all for the same price.
Well there is where our opinion differs because IMO the games I listed is worth 50 bucks. I did read your entire post and my overall rebuttal is yes, the quality is good enough that I would spend 50 on it.
My evaluation of how people get their worth in games isn't how many maps it has or how many characters or game modes. Its all about how much time you spend on it. I've spent about 80 hours in TF2 and at least 200 on CS so I would say I would gladly pay 60 bucks for each of them.
An Epic RPG (lets say Fallout or Persona) may definitely take you 80 hours to complete everything and you feel you have gotten your worth. But if I play TF2 or CS or HD remix or L4D (where it doesn't have enough content in your opinion), is it not worth at least the same amount? Lets be honest, the point of these games is to keep us entertained. Freaking contra for the NES wasn't more than 20 minutes long but we all gladly paid 60 for it; because the replay value is there.
If you really want to "compare" these games, compare the amount of time you spend on it and not how many different stages or characters there are.
(the GB crew has a similar stance this issue as well as stated in their past bombcasts; when somebody actually emailed them the very exact question of games that are "lacking" in content.)
My evaluation of how people get their worth in games isn't how many maps it has or how many characters or game modes. Its all about how much time you spend on it. I've spent about 80 hours in TF2 and at least 200 on CS so I would say I would gladly pay 60 bucks for each of them.
... And that's absolutely great that you get a bang for your buck. As i said in my above post. I realize that there are people that put a huge amount of playtime into their multiplayer games, and that's great. I guess what it boils down to is that i look at something like the Orange Box, which comes with what? 5 games? Portals, Half-Life 2, Half-Life 2 Episode 1, TF2, and i think Half-Life 2 Episode 2. And can't help but be disappointed in Street Fighter 4. Hell, TF2 alone amounts to hundreds of hours of gameplay for some, yet Valve realizes that's not enough, so they lumped it in with all these other single-player games. Because they realize that for a full pricetag to be justified, it needs to be singeplayer + multiplayer. Not just multiplayer.
I think Call of Duty is a good example i can use. COD4 has a short, but great single-player experience, plus a multiplayer experience that people have downed 100's of hours on. There is no reason fighting games can't do the same. No reason why they can't have more to them then multiplayer, and that's it.
I also can't help but notice how other fighting games have already set the bar in the area of "content." I already mentioned Super Smash Bros. Brawl, which has tons of other things to do other then fight people online. Soul Calibur 4 is another game that has more to it then multiplayer. The ability to create your own character, and customize their abilities and looks for example. These games have shown that a fighting game can, and should have more to it then multiplayer.
I can't help but feel like Street Fighter 4 hasn't really progressed much farther then the Super Nintendo Street Fighter games. Other then online capability. And that's disappointing. Games should be evolving, and moving forward. Expanding. I just don't feel like "but i'll spend 100+ hours on X games multiplayer" is a valid excuse for the game to cost 60 bucks. People spend 100+ hours on games like TF2, yet that game goes for about 20 bucks by itself. People spend 100+ hours on LittleBigPlanet, yet that game still comes with a singeplayer story mode.
Enough content to suite the pricetag is a requirement nowadays. And that doesn't mean that if your game has an addictive multiplayer, the game is automatically worth a full price tag. If that was a valid argument, then you would see a lot more Xbox live, and Playstation Network games that cost 60 bucks. After all, there are so many games on there that have addicting multiplayer, so addicting that a lot of people spend 100's of hours on them. Yet they are only 10-15 bucks. Not 50-60.
Street Fighter 4 doesn't have any more content, any more addictiveness then a 15 dollar downloadable game. Period.
So a game's story is equal to it's quality which is equal to the amount you're willing to play?
That's fine by me but there are plenty of people looking forward to a brand new Street Fighter and claiming that because it's a fighter and will not have a major story makes it unworthy of being $60 is ridiculous. It's a new game, improved graphics (and not slightly, as you oh so condescendingly claim) new fighting mechanics and new characters (if you think six new characters is "few" than you clearly don't play many fighters, which begs the question why the hell you care about SF4). That's a new game and it's more than worth $60, you don't think so? Wait until it lowers in price or just don't but the damn thing.
"So a game's story is equal to it's quality which is equal to the amount you're willing to play?
It's not just story, it's the amount of content in a 60 dollar game. Whether that be a story, or some other gameplay addition besides multiplayer... Improved graphics, changed fighting mechanics, and 6 new characters is not a "new" game. It's an altered, re-skinned game. The same as Super Street Fighter HD Remix is a re-skinning, rebalancing of another game. Just as Left4Dead is not a new game, it's a Half Life 2 mod that they somehow suckered people into paying full price for.
I fully plan on waiting until the price drops before i buy it, i said exactly that in the initial post. I think the fact that you guys are getting so angry, and defensive. And the fact that you can't form a more valid argument other than "Yeah well, i'll spend a lot of time on the multiplayer, so it's worth it to me" shows that i'm hitting a nerve here. The examples i provided with the amount of content in the Orange Box, all for 50 bucks, Soul Calibur 4 having more to it then just versus fighting (Ie. Character Creation, etc.), and Super Smash Bros. Brawl having a silly amount of other stuff to do in addition to online multiplayer, all of that proves my point.
I realize you, and others are extreme fans of Street Fighter, and are willing to pay 60 bucks for it. But if you'll just calm down, and face facts. You'll admit that compared to other games (like the Orange Box), Street Fighter 4 doesn't justify the 60 dollar pricetag. It just doesn't have anywhere near a comparable amount of content, multiplayer included. TF2 alone will match, and probably even trump Street Fighter 4's culmative multiplayer game time. Yet TF2 came with 4 other games, and was selling for only 30 bucks by itself when it first came out... Sure, many will spend the 60 bucks on SF4, but that doesn't mean it's worth it. It just means that they want it, it's 60 bucks, and they don't have a choice.
No matter how much you like something, it still hits a point where it has to be worth the price. Let say, for example, that you really, really like a certain brand of gum. Would you pay 2 bucks for it? Sure. 5 bucks? Probably. 20 bucks? If you are fanatically in love with this gum, you probably will. 100 bucks? At a certian pricetag you'll eventually say "hell no." Because you aren't getting your moneys worth, even though you really like that gum.
So i personally have got to that point with Street Fighter 4. I really, really like Street Fighter. But suddenly the pricetag has jumped way up on a game that hasn't changed much over it's predecessors, and that is really skimping on how much content it includes. Like i said, you get practically the same game experience from SSFHDRemix for only 15 bucks.
I was just trying to see if anyone else felt the same way, but, apparently my opinions and ideas are just way out of left field, have no basis for reason, and aren't valid whatsoever. So i'm just going to shut up, and go away.
You clearly are reading way to much into my words. Angry? Why would I be angry debateing a point and at the same time being "defensive" is simply a result of defending a point. I don't understand why that's a bad thing.
I fully plan on waiting until the price drops before i buy it, i said exactly that in the initial post. I think the fact that you guys are getting so angry, and defensive. And the fact that you can't form a more valid argument other than "Yeah well, i'll spend a lot of time on the multiplayer, so it's worth it to me" shows that i'm hitting a nerve here. The examples i provided with the amount of content in the Orange Box, all for 50 bucks, Soul Calibur 4 having more to it then just versus fighting (Ie. Character Creation, etc.), and Super Smash Bros. Brawl having a silly amount of other stuff to do in addition to online multiplayer, all of that proves my point.
I realize you, and others are extreme fans of Street Fighter, and are willing to pay 60 bucks for it. But if you'll just calm down, and face facts. You'll admit that compared to other games (like the Orange Box), Street Fighter 4 doesn't justify the 60 dollar pricetag. It just doesn't have anywhere near a comparable amount of content, multiplayer included. TF2 alone will match, and probably even trump Street Fighter 4's culmative multiplayer game time. Yet TF2 came with 4 other games, and was selling for only 30 bucks by itself when it first came out... Sure, many will spend the 60 bucks on SF4, but that doesn't mean it's worth it. It just means that they want it, it's 60 bucks, and they don't have a choice.
"
Anyway, your point so far has been, "There isn't enough content" (I'm paraphrasing, of course) which others have rebutted, "there is enough content." You compare the series to games within the Orange Box, SSBB, and SC4 but the fact is none of these games are in the same genre of SF4, so while you will continue to tell me that the shooting game, the pushing game and, the closest of the bunch, the 3d figher are of value above SF4 the claim has no grounds.
This is a pointless argument, your going to tell me $60 is too much for a game because there isn't enough content. I'm going to tell you there is enough content. Your going to disagree. I'm going to disagree. This might as well end now. And for the record I'm not an "extreme fan" of Street Fighter (Actually I'll be in the same boat as you, waiting for a price drop), the first SF game that I've ever played in ernest was SSFHDR, which I purchased yesterday. It's pretty good but I'm not really a huge fan of fighting games in general.
A "must", for a fighting game :? I can think of many games in the current that do not concentrate on story, because the gameplay and enjoyment found within these games is not dependent on story at all.
SF always has a story for it's individual characters, and they have always been very light hearted, it's likely to be the same here only with far better presentation values. From what I gather there are anime style cut scenes in the game that look gorgeous.
I have to lol at someone looking for a substantial story within a fighting game, I myself could not give a flying fuck and they are my game of choice. My only concern for this new, ground up Street Fighter game, is playbility. Anything else is lesser and secondary to that.
It's not just story, it's the amount of content in a 60 dollar game. Whether that be a story, or some other gameplay addition besides multiplayer... Improved graphics, changed fighting mechanics, and 6 new characters is not a "new" game. It's an altered, re-skinned game. The same as Super Street Fighter HD Remix is a re-skinning, rebalancing of another game. Just as Left4Dead is not a new game, it's a Half Life 2 mod that they somehow suckered people into paying full price for.
It's a ground up fourth game, certainly not another cash in of SF2, like you bought. They have not implanted code from any previous game, so how can it be re skinned?. What lies beneath the skin in your opinion?, which SF game?.
"You'll admit that compared to other games (like the Orange Box), Street Fighter 4 doesn't justify the 60 dollar pricetag."
Lol at the comparison there. I like how you compare one of the best deals ever in the industry, to this new 2D fighting game which could possibly provide years of enjoyment down the line.
Street Fighter 4 doesn't have any more content, any more addictiveness then a 15 dollar downloadable game. Period.
You sound like someone who has played the home versions. Where exactly did you get hands on time with the home version?, and a full rundown of the content that will be available at launch and possibly via download at a later date. ???
Some people may prefer staring at HD sprites which ultimately look like shit, even with Udon art, because they do not animate on par, but hey, each to their own blindness. Some choose not to buy a clearly re-skinned SF2 Turbo HD like you, in favour of this ground up new game which is fresh in so many ways.
I would say those buying this game will get ample for their bucks.
You do realize that people still play Street Fighter 2 after something like 16 years. I think this game has a good chance of being worth it's price tag if you look at it's history of on-going playing. The inclusion of multiplayer can only help but extend that.
Even if you ignore that, it's still worth the money.
"Weltal said:Well at the risk of sounding like an angry person, the mechanics of SF4 is not another retooling of HD remix. There are EX moves, revenge meters, focus/kinda parrying attacks, none of which was in hd remix. I just don't see you are as big of a SF fan as you claim to be. Just how many games can you actually compare to the orange box anyway? maybe a greatest hits collection? and how often are they?"So a game's story is equal to it's quality which is equal to the amount you're willing to play?
It's not just story, it's the amount of content in a 60 dollar game. Whether that be a story, or some other gameplay addition besides multiplayer... Improved graphics, changed fighting mechanics, and 6 new characters is not a "new" game. It's an altered, re-skinned game. The same as Super Street Fighter HD Remix is a re-skinning, rebalancing of another game. Just as Left4Dead is not a new game, it's a Half Life 2 mod that they somehow suckered people into paying full price for.
"
I rather have Capcom make sure all the new characters they add in is perfectly balanced than say add in SF kart racer, or SF chess mode, how about a secret game of space defenders in SF4; An adventure mode where its basically one big tutorial in disgiuse, character maker, etc. Maybe you should just get some Mk games since thats what MK is all about.
You have obviously made up your mind and is defending your point like a mother to a newborn; so we're just gonna have to agree to disagree.
only last words:
"Everything is worth what its purchaser will pay for it."
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