Sigh, another classic made into a mindless shooter?

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#1 Posted by Wuddel (2092 posts) -

Ok, it is no surprise that they made it a shooter, but apparently they ripped out R&D and taxation etc. Everything I liked about Syndicate.

#2 Posted by ZackHoagie (23 posts) -

I wouldn't go as far to call it mindless, Starbreeze has shown that they're at least willing to try new things when it comes to the FPS genre and the 4 player co-op makes me think that we're gonna have something along the lines of Deus Ex meets early Rainbow Six. And that's a good thing.

#3 Posted by alphanull (18 posts) -

ARE THERE NO MEDIATING FORCES DURING THESE SUIT MEETINGS?

HOW IS THIS ALLOWED TO HAPPEN. GOD FUCKING DAMN IT, SO GOD DAMN MAD.

Even if the shooter turns out to be any good: Why do it? Why Syndicate? Why now?

• because XCOM

• because Deus Ex Human Revolution

• because XCOM

So a big double fuck you to EA, always there to remind me why I hate this industry.

#4 Posted by RE_Player1 (7558 posts) -

I'm looking forward to it.

#5 Posted by SethPhotopoulos (5230 posts) -
I HAVE TO DO THIS WHEN AN OLD FRANCHISED GETS A SEQUEL BECAUSE I'M THE INTERNET!!!!!!
Online
#6 Posted by MooseyMcMan (10919 posts) -

Yes, because Starbreeze is known for making mindless shooters. You know, because Riddick and The Darkness were mad mindless.

Moderator
#7 Posted by RenegadeSaint (1540 posts) -

Just because something is an FPS doesn't make it mindless.

#8 Posted by Wuddel (2092 posts) -

@RenegadeSaint said:

Just because something is an FPS doesn't make it mindless.

No, but it is very likely if you make a former Strategy/RPG game into one.

#9 Posted by Oldirtybearon (4723 posts) -

@alphanull said:

ARE THERE NO MEDIATING FORCES DURING THESE SUIT MEETINGS?

HOW IS THIS ALLOWED TO HAPPEN. GOD FUCKING DAMN IT, SO GOD DAMN MAD.

Even if the shooter turns out to be any good: Why do it? Why Syndicate? Why now?

• because XCOM

• because Deus Ex Human Revolution

• because XCOM

So a big double fuck you to EA, always there to remind me why I hate this industry.

Syndicate has been "A Thing" since Starbreeze wrapped on The Darkness (2007). That Project Redlime that kept resurfacing every six to eight months? That was Starbreeze's Syndicate.

I don't get the huge kerfuffle over this. Isometric strategy games are not "in" this generation. Nobody cares to play them, and something like Starcraft II makes its bank on the pedigree of the developer and nostalgia for the IP. It also didn't hurt that Starcraft II was an awesome game, either.

So what of Syndicate? Aside from a few faithful fans that loved the original, there isn't much to say about it. It did a lot of cool things for sure, but it didn't set the world on fire. It's getting repackaged and refreshed in an interesting way, a way that will appeal to the modern consumer so, you know, they actually might turn a profit on it. If you really want to play Syndicate, load up DOSBox and have at it. Nobody's taken that game from you, so I don't see why this rage needs to happen when old IPs get updated for the modern audience.

#10 Posted by Christoffer (1799 posts) -

Let me just state the obvious... Syndicate Wars was totally mindless. If Starbreeze succeeds in being worst than that, then you've won the argument.

I played Wars when it was new so it's not that it's aged badly, it was just bad.

#11 Edited by Twisted_Scot (1177 posts) -

I'm not bothered. If its shit I'll ignore it and keep my fond memories of Syndicate, if it's great I'll play and enjoy it. I'm always hopeful that in the right hands a beloved game could be used as a basis for something new and interesting. It may become a Duke Nukem Forever but at least we'll always have Duke 3D to remember fondly. I want a new arcade version of Cannon Fodder with various remixes and covers of the "So much fun" theme song dammit.
 
  EDIT: This is a pretty awesome version of the song : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7XiXQ6wEyM
 
Or the original.....

#12 Posted by alphanull (18 posts) -

My gripe is with the rape of a beloved franchise. All these games do is make the original fans mad and the newcomers are none-the-wiser. Hell, the Syndicate universe isn't even that unique for Christ's sake, why not whip up a generic cyberpunk story and make your stupid FPS around that? Is it too much to ask for a little respect?

You'd all be mad if in five years time they make bejewelled puzzle quest v zombies Heavy Rain game so nyeh

#13 Edited by ThePaleKing (613 posts) -

I'm incredibly sick of the people who back up these sorts of changes, and do it with nothing but catch phrases like " __ genre just isn't IN anymore" or "times are changing", etc. The fact is that the only reason developers go along with these changes, is because if they make an FPS the producers are going to grant them a far bigger budget. There is not an ounce of creativity in the reasoning behind these "re-imaginings", and anyone who thinks of gaming as more than a childish time sink shouldn't be supporting these greed driven changes.

Thankfully Paradox have been saying they may create a spiritual successor to Syndicate, utilizing the same gameplay style. And there is Xenonauts, for anyone who wants a true revival of X-Com.

#14 Posted by Vexed (313 posts) -

If the Persaudertron is in, I'm in. I don't care what genre it is.

#15 Posted by strangone (179 posts) -

Okay, everyone who is saying "it's Starbreeze so it'll be good": the Starbreeze that made The Darkness and Escape from Butcher Bay no longer exists. All the key personnel left years ago, the Syndicate FPS is not being developed by the Starbreeze that you have faith in.

http://www.1up.com/features/starbreeze-secret-history

Yes it's a bummer that the new Syndicate game will be a "visceral action FPS" but honestly is anyone actually surprised?

#16 Posted by ThePaleKing (613 posts) -
@strangone said:

Yes it's a bummer that the new Syndicate game will be a "visceral action FPS" but honestly is anyone actually surprised?

 
Well, no, it's not, and that's exactly the problem isn't it? It should be surprise, because it is a plague of a trend. It is also not a reason to not criticize the changes. 
#17 Edited by SeriouslyNow (8534 posts) -

@SethPhotopoulos said:

I HAVE TO DO THIS WHEN AN OLD FRANCHISED GETS A SEQUEL BECAUSE I'M THE INTERNET!!!!!!

Franchise.

There's truth in their complaints as neither game was an FPS and both are just being used in name alone to sell yet another FPS IP.

#18 Posted by PeasantAbuse (5138 posts) -

If it's going to be fun, I don't care.

#19 Posted by Tennmuerti (8073 posts) -

It's kinda sad.

Both this and the Xcom thing. I never felt much attachement to Xcom. But Syndicate was my thing, it made me love cyberpunk. There was so much awesome in that game, the premise itself, the fact that the agents were basically your puppets by fiction, improving your agents with implants, research, persuedatron, drugging them up, non standard missions, territory control. I was a kid granted but when I managed to complete any mission it always felt great.

Now it's just another FPS. Bummer.

The excuse of that this type of game is not relevant anymore is pure bullshit, DoW2 is practically the same type of game with some mechanical differences. Last time I checked that shit sold like hotcakes.

Like seriously tho, Why? Why do it like this? They knew those that loved the original game would be pissed off (if they didn't they are fucking stupid) And the rest of the people don't know or care about the Syndicate name. The only reasonable benefit I can see is to generate headlines and controversy by whoring the brand name. Hey publicity is publicity. And this makes it even worse.

It's big business fucking with my childhood.

#20 Posted by Mnemoidian (955 posts) -

@alphanull: You probably need to take a deep breath and calm down a bit. Don't you think it's a bit too soon to spew that much hate? The screenshots so far don't look terrible.

To put that comment into context: I'm annoyed (no longer angry) about the intitial announcement trailer for XCOM (it was terrible), and I really enjoyed Syndicate. Hell, I didn't think Syndicate Wars was terrible (it wasn't great) - but at least it was MORE Syndicate.

As for this, I think it looks ok - though I'm still hoping to hear more about what it is. I will at least wait for the announcement article (in Gamereactor?) to be released before I string them up.

@strangone: Sure, a lot of people may have left Starbreeze, including Magnus Högdahl - but that doesn't mean that they are going to put out crap. At least give them a chance? Even entirely unproven studios can do good things, and Starbreeze at least has had something that allowed them to make good games.

Even if Starbreeze has a new guard, I'm excited to see what they can produce.

#21 Edited by ProfessorEss (7324 posts) -

@Twisted_Scot said:

...new and interesting.

How dare you!

@Twisted_Scot said:

I'm not bothered. If its shit I'll ignore it and keep my fond memories of Syndicate, if it's great I'll play and enjoy it.

Yup, that's my way of thinking too. 


Though I must admit, I do enjoy reading posts using words like "rape" and "plague".

#22 Posted by HandsomeDead (11863 posts) -

Well, it is a video game. What do you expect?

#23 Posted by Capt_Ventris (592 posts) -

@alphanull said:

ARE THERE NO MEDIATING FORCES DURING THESE SUIT MEETINGS?

HOW IS THIS ALLOWED TO HAPPEN. GOD FUCKING DAMN IT, SO GOD DAMN MAD.

Even if the shooter turns out to be any good: Why do it? Why Syndicate? Why now?

• because XCOM

• because Deus Ex Human Revolution

• because XCOM

So a big double fuck you to EA, always there to remind me why I hate this industry.

FUCK THIS GAME INTO THE GROUND

Extreme yes. But why does it have to be another shooter?

#24 Posted by dhaikage (17 posts) -

@SethPhotopoulos: If I could like posts, I would like this post.

#25 Posted by Bozo (33 posts) -

The game certainly wasn't going to be an isometric strategy/action game. If you thought that, you are some kind of ding dong.

Did I expect choreographed action sequences where you jump between hover scooters and shoot miniguns? While listening to dubstep?

Maybe I expected the revival would contain one of those things ... but all three? Well Ill be.

At least this isn't a System Shock revival .... I don't think I could take that.

#26 Posted by AlexanderSheen (4977 posts) -

@Twisted_Scot: Oh man, now that you mentioned it, I wanna play it again. That game is awesome.

#27 Posted by Masha2932 (1241 posts) -

First Person is just a perspective. Just because a game uses this perspective does not mean it's mindless.I think it's a bit presumptuous of you to judge the game this early. Starbreeze could do something revolutionary with the game. A few months ago there was no hope of a new Syndicate. Now you get a chance to see the game in a new form and if the game is bad i'm sure you could go back and play the old games and keep your memories of the franchise.Or at least hope they'll have the original games as an unlockable.

#28 Posted by Twisted_Scot (1177 posts) -

@AlexanderSheen: it's the right thing to do.

#29 Edited by GaspoweR (2961 posts) -

@Wuddel: Have you seen the new trailer...featuring wobble bass? WUB WUB WUB WUB WUB WUB WUB WOOB WOOB WOOB WOOB WOOB

But seriously though, I could care less that it was a shooter but what Starbreeze is doing with the game is just fucking amazing.

#30 Posted by ryanwho (12082 posts) -

This game is plaguerape holocaust.

#31 Posted by Mr_Skeleton (5144 posts) -

Don't know what your talking about Fallout 3 was great and XCOM looks very promising.

#32 Posted by TomA (2531 posts) -

Sigh, another hipster who complains about a boring game being made into an awesome game.

#33 Posted by TomA (2531 posts) -

@Tennmuerti: Too bad your childhood doesn't make millions of dollars.

#34 Posted by ImmortalSaiyan (4676 posts) -

I have not played the old Syndicate game and even I wish they kept it the same. Not everything needs to be a shooter, guys.

#35 Posted by Chemin (632 posts) -

@ImmortalSaiyan said:

I have not played the old Syndicate game and even I wish they kept it the same. Not everything needs to be a shooter, guys.

Amen brother.

#36 Posted by buzz_clik (6971 posts) -

If the possibility of variations/combinations of attacks rivals Psi-Ops, but is delivered via a first person shooter, then I think it will have captured the spirit of Syndicate if not all of the intricacies. If that's the game I'm getting into, then I couldn't give two shits if it's isometric or FPS.

Moderator
#37 Posted by Knetic2341 (243 posts) -

@alphanull: Then don't play? I don't know, simple solution.

#38 Posted by Deusoma (3006 posts) -
@alphanull: Not sure what Deus Ex: HR is doing in there, given that A) it was definitely worthy as a sequel to Deus Ex, and B) Deus Ex was a first-person-RPG to begin with in that case.
#39 Posted by Tennmuerti (8073 posts) -
@Bozo said:

The game certainly wasn't going to be an isometric strategy/action game. If you thought that, you are some kind of ding dong.

Entire DoW series begs to differ on the profitability of isometric RTS/RTT franchises.

@TomA said:

@Tennmuerti: Too bad your childhood doesn't make millions of dollars

Except that it does. Mine and those like me obviously. Both in terms of setting and gameplay mechanics. As proven by current existing products.
#40 Edited by amomjc (977 posts) -

@SethPhotopoulos said:

I HAVE TO DO THIS WHEN AN OLD FRANCHISED GETS A SEQUEL BECAUSE I'M THE INTERNET!!!!!!

That picture is worth a thousand words.

#41 Posted by Oldirtybearon (4723 posts) -

@Tennmuerti said:

@Bozo said:

The game certainly wasn't going to be an isometric strategy/action game. If you thought that, you are some kind of ding dong.

Entire DoW series begs to differ on the profitability of isometric RTS/RTT franchises.

@TomA said:

@Tennmuerti: Too bad your childhood doesn't make millions of dollars

Except that it does. Mine and those like me obviously. Both in terms of setting and gameplay mechanics. As proven by current existing products.

I love Dawn of War for reinventing an RTS, but dude... really? DoW and DoW 2 sold well, but they also didn't have the kind of budget and marketing dollar that's going into Syndicate. Syndicate is a -big- game for EA. It's going to be a tent pole attraction for their fourth fiscal quarter. Notice how one month later Mass Effect 3 comes out? This is the period of the year where all the publishers throw anything they have left in the tank at a wall. Tent pole games are not RTS games. Tent pole games are console games.

I know it's shitty that you're not getting an isometric, strategic shooter this time, but you can't sit there and act like a reboot featuring the early 90's gameplay of Syndicate would've made a dime for EA.

#42 Edited by Tennmuerti (8073 posts) -
@KingWilly said:

I love Dawn of War for reinventing an RTS, but dude... really? DoW and DoW 2 sold well, but they also didn't have the kind of budget and marketing dollar that's going into Syndicate. Syndicate is a -big- game for EA. It's going to be a tent pole attraction for their fourth fiscal quarter. Notice how one month later Mass Effect 3 comes out? This is the period of the year where all the publishers throw anything they have left in the tank at a wall. Tent pole games are not RTS games. Tent pole games are console games.

I know it's shitty that you're not getting an isometric, strategic shooter this time, but you can't sit there and act like a reboot featuring the early 90's gameplay of Syndicate would've made a dime for EA.

I'm sure neither you nor me know the budget for Syndicate.
"Syndicate is a -big- game for EA" - aparrently not so big with marketing only starting now and the game already line for the Feb21 release date. It honestly looks more like it's being pushed out. BF3 is big for EA. ME3 is big for EA. Syndicate looks more like it's being sent out to die.
 
This is all however irrelevant, the budged the expectations etc.
It's not the point I'm making.
The point is that developers with balls who are willing to step up and put in the effort have proven that the geanre is viable and profitable like DoW series.

So yes an top down RTT Syndicate can make profit. With proper development, positioning, marketing etc. If they want to spend more money on developing/marketing Syndicate then THQ on DoW series, that's purely their decision and even that can be made to balance the books if done well. Besides which we still don't know either of those budgets.
 
EDIT: and I'm pretty sure DoW series makes a crapola with all their expansions, those games are still being played daily through Steam by the thousands, months and years after release. safe to assume imo since they keep making them
#43 Posted by fullmetal5550 (345 posts) -

@alphanull said:

ARE THERE NO MEDIATING FORCES DURING THESE SUIT MEETINGS?

HOW IS THIS ALLOWED TO HAPPEN. GOD FUCKING DAMN IT, SO GOD DAMN MAD.

Even if the shooter turns out to be any good: Why do it? Why Syndicate? Why now?

• because XCOM

• because Deus Ex Human Revolution

• because XCOM

So a big double fuck you to EA, always there to remind me why I hate this industry.

I think Square Enix were the ones to publish Deus Ex: Human Revolution. From what I hear many people have loved it. Yes, the boss battles sucked but everything else about the game was pretty good.

#44 Posted by Humanity (9062 posts) -

Dunno how much I'd want to play an isometric strat game on the 360 at this point.

#45 Posted by WMoyer83 (639 posts) -

I can accept that the game is borrowing storyline concepts and aesthetic from the original games, but I will have to judge it on its own merits when I play it. I can understand that if it sucks, it could be a embarrassment for the franchise. If its an awesome game, it will be a welcome edition. Only time will tell.

#46 Posted by Deranged (1837 posts) -

@ZackHoagie said:

I wouldn't go as far to call it mindless, Starbreeze has shown that they're at least willing to try new things when it comes to the FPS genre and the 4 player co-op makes me think that we're gonna have something along the lines of Deus Ex meets early Rainbow Six. And that's a good thing.

This.

#47 Posted by Wuddel (2092 posts) -

@mcderby4 said:

@ZackHoagie said:

I wouldn't go as far to call it mindless, Starbreeze has shown that they're at least willing to try new things when it comes to the FPS genre and the 4 player co-op makes me think that we're gonna have something along the lines of Deus Ex meets early Rainbow Six. And that's a good thing.

This.

I am the OP of this thread, I am not surprised that initial reviews seem to prove me right. In the Brad vs. Darkness video the GB guys mentioned that most people behind these games are not longer at Starbreeze.

#48 Posted by Deranged (1837 posts) -

@Wuddel said:

@mcderby4 said:

@ZackHoagie said:

I wouldn't go as far to call it mindless, Starbreeze has shown that they're at least willing to try new things when it comes to the FPS genre and the 4 player co-op makes me think that we're gonna have something along the lines of Deus Ex meets early Rainbow Six. And that's a good thing.

This.

I am the OP of this thread, I am not surprised that initial reviews seem to prove me right. In the Brad vs. Darkness video the GB guys mentioned that most people behind these games are not longer at Starbreeze.

There are reviews out already? Listen dude, you are completely entitled to your own opinion and I know that you might be irritated that they turned an old classic that you used to love into a "mindless" shooter. But personally, I think you should wait till the final product to fully judge the game. Hell, try the demo which is pretty damn fun.

#49 Posted by cuffyone (6 posts) -

Do you really think that if in 1993 the creative minds behind syndicate had had access to today's hardware and not the amiga the game would have been the same,really? also i think its a little selfish to think that an awesome universe like that should only be seen from you're favorite perspective.Its called progress.I'm 36 and Ive been playing console rpgs since they were invented but im not really missing the old 8 bit games,I have very fond memory's of spending hour upon hour playing dragon warrior on the nes but the thought of playing it now that ive played skyrim makes me cringe.Thats just me though.I understand having youre youth raped though,the new G.I. Joe movies make me want to cry.

#50 Posted by The_Laughing_Man (13629 posts) -
@Wuddel said:

@mcderby4 said:

@ZackHoagie said:

I wouldn't go as far to call it mindless, Starbreeze has shown that they're at least willing to try new things when it comes to the FPS genre and the 4 player co-op makes me think that we're gonna have something along the lines of Deus Ex meets early Rainbow Six. And that's a good thing.

This.

I am the OP of this thread, I am not surprised that initial reviews seem to prove me right. @mcderby4 In the Brad vs. Darkness video the GB guys mentioned that most people behind these games are not longer at Starbreeze.

Your the OP of the thread? And? And the review on this site was very positive. 

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