Elder Scrolls: The Lineage of Skills, and Skyrim's Possibilities

Posted by ahoodedfigure (4239 posts) -
This is just a note to folks who might be alienated by my attention to Elder Scrolls lately: I'm still into other stuff, and will talk about it when I feel the need, even if it doesn't rope as many comments.    I have to admit, I'm not the hugest fan of the Elder Scrolls series (I tend to skim the books unless I think they have direct bearing on the game world I'm actually playing in, for example), although I obviously like it a fair bit given the amount of energy I've put into these posts about it.
 
I guess part of this is the obsessive nerd in me trying to figure out the details of the new game, treating it like a logic puzzle or whatever. Ask me a month after Skyrim is released what I think of the game and I will probably ramble about my old XBox dying or finding some obscure game that deserves to see the light of day.  Right now, though I'm sort of an equal with everyone since we're all finding out about Skyrim at about the same time.  
 
That said, I wanna talk about skills in the Elder Scrolls series.
 

History of Skills in Elder Scrolls games

Here's a rundown of the skills featured in every major E.S. release, before I go into projections for Skyrim.
 

Arena

 
Technically, the first Elder Scrolls game had skills, but they were hidden, and they only increased with modifications based on attribute bonuses or special artifacts or spells, or advanced when you leveled. Hopping in place to boost your jump was non-existant; you killed dudes and completed quests to boost your skills, and that was it.
 

Daggerfall

 
The open skills system begins here, and it had a bunch of crazy skills that were not the most attractive choices. Still, there were a few interesting ideas here that were later abandoned when the game was streamlined.  Leveling is also tied directly into the skills, so there's a lot of trial and error in figuring out which skills are worthwhile.  Still, as far as character creation as a whole, I think Daggerfall had the biggest range of options, including stuff that would be considered the stuff of super powers or artifacts in later games, as well as game-breaking flaws.
 

Morrowind

 
Skills are really improved here, removing a lot of the chaff and giving you a bunch of different, interesting choices. The major and minor skills influencing leveling leaves some people taking forever to level, while others, especially mages, can manipulate the system and level by just hanging around in the inn and repeatedly casting.
 

Oblivion

 
Yeeeaaarrrrgggh.  Sorry, that's all I'm qualified to say, although I've read that the skills changed substantially from Morrowind, altering attribute connections and what skills actually do at certain times.
 

The Skill Lineage


OK, here we go. I'm including Arena's basic abilities, even though they may not be listed as open for the player.  
 

Spellcasting (including Alchemy):

 
ArenaDaggerfallMorrowindOblivionSkyrim(?)
 Spellcasting
AlterationAlterationAlteration Alteration
 .
DestructionDestruction
Destruction
 Destruction
 .IllusionIllusionIllusion
 Illusion
 .MysticismMysticismMysticism
 --
 .RestorationRestorationRestoration
 Restoration
 .Thaumaturgy
--
 -- --


Enchant*Enchanting
 
Alchemy
 AlchemyAlchemy
  Conjuration ConjurationConjuration

In Arena, your character class determined whether or not you could cast spells, and would also have a multiplier that was applied to your character's intelligence score that was also tied to your character's class. Starting with Daggerfall, spellcasting was no longer forbidden to players who wanted to cast and had no disadvantages preventing them from using Magicka.  Thaumaturgy and Mysticism over time had their contents juggled, and in the case of the former, their effects were usually folded into other spell schools.  Given that Mysticism will probably be gone as per the reports, I'm betting many of Mysticism's useful spell effects will find homes in other schools.
 
*Enchanting was still possible in Oblivion, but wasn't tied to a skill, instead requiring items or locations to help facilitate the creation of magical items.  Now it seems that Enchanting is back as a skill for Skyrim. There's another skill that I think will be separate from Enchanting, and I'll give you my theory about that farther down.
 

Communication 

 
ArenaDaggerfallMorrowindOblivionSkyrim(?)

[Languages*]
--
 ----
(Affected solely by attributes)
Etiquette Speechcraft Speechcraft ?
.
Streetwise
 Speechcraft Speechcraft ?
.
Mercantile
 Mercantile Mercantile ?

 Etiquette was useful with royalty and academics, streetwise with commoners. Mercantile seems to have a strong following, and both Speechcraft and Mercantile may still find their way into Skyrim.
 
*The languages reduced NPC hostility during encounters if the roll was successful.  The languages available were:  Centaurian, Daedric, Dragon (they're babies, but they're tough), Giant, Harpy, Impish, Nymph, and Spriggan.  Depending upon what spawns, you may not even encounter the language specialty of choice, and as far as I know they didn't have much benefit as far as quests or actual communication with the NPCs; would have been cool if THAT had been the case.  It's a safe bet languages won't be making their glorious return in Skyrim, but I still think it was a cool idea, if poorly supported.
 

Environmental Interaction (including locks and stealing old ladies' wallets)

  
ArenaDaggerfallMorrowindOblivionSkyrim (?)
 Khajiit climbing bonus*
 ClimbAcrobatics(Acrobatics) ?
 Argonian swimming bonus*
 SwimmingAthleticismAthleticism ?
  RunningAthleticismAthleticism
 **
  JumpingAcrobaticsAcrobatics ?
 Lockpicking (by class)
 LockpickingSecurity
Security ?
 Pickpocketing ( " " )
 Pickpocketing(Sneak)(sneak) ?
 Travel Time Reduction ( " " )
 -- -- -- --
 
*In the first game, Argonians were strong swimmers who would receive only minimal stamina drain from negotiating through watery areas, and could move relatively quickly through water.  The Khajiit can vault out of pits, whether or not they're filled with water, almost instantly, reducing the danger of getting poked in the head with a skeleton's sword.  These abilities can also be approximated through the Acrobat character class.
 
**Skyrim will have a sprint feature, which may be sort of like running, or may be all the more dramatic and, because it's based on stamina, short in duration.
 

Defense, Maintenance, and Avoidance

 
ArenaDaggerfall
MorrowindOblivionSkyrim(?)
 Armor Proficiency*
 -- Light Armor
 Light Armor
 ?
 .  Medium Armor
 -- ?
 .  Heavy Armor
 Heavy Armor
 ?
 .  Block Block
 ?
 Dodge (by class)
 Dodge Unarmored -- ?
 Repair (by class)
 --  Armorer Armorer Smithing*
 Stealth ( " " )
 Stealth Sneak Sneak ?
 
In Arena, the armor you could wear was dictated by your class, and this seems to be true in Daggerfall as well, although you can set these things yourself when making a custom class, and they still aren't treated as skills in themselves.
 
My guess, based on a screenshot I saw, is that Smithing will be a skill, separate from Enchanting, where you can create an object from raw materials, possibly similar to Alchemy recipes.  I'm betting it would also help you recover item durability.  
 
As far as Armor, it seems like Oblivion moved in the right direction by reducing the types of Armor proficiencies, but I wonder if they might go a step further and have a single Armor proficiency (or possibly none at all). A single armor proficiency  would let the character be less encumbered with heavier armor as they grew in power, allowing for a natural character progression, if you bother with armor at all.
 
Block in Oblivion was expanded to include all defensive stopping power, not just the use of shields, and expanded through expertise to include abilities such as disarming.
 
Dodge has no direct equivalent, but I'm putting it in with unarmored since it's about avoiding being hit, rather than what armor you're wearing.

Combat and Recovery

 
ArenaDaggerfall
MorrowindOblivionSkyrim(?)
 Weapon Proficiencies
Short Blade
 Short Blade
 Blade --
 .Long Blade
 Long Blade
 Blade --
 .Archery
 Marksman Marksman Archery
 .Blunt Weapon
 Blunt Weapon
 Blunt --
 .Axe Axe Blunt --
 .  Spear -- --
  Hand to Hand
 Hand to Hand
 Hand to Hand
 ?
 Critical Hit (class chance)
 Critical Strike
 -- -- ?
 . Backstab (via Sneak) (via Sneak) ?
  Medical -- -- ?
 .
 . . . One-Handed Weapons
 . . . . Two-Handed Weapons
 . . . . Dual-Weapons
 

 Medical enhanced your ability to recover health when you sleep and to avoid disease, which would sneak up on you in the night. 
 
Critical Strike seems to have been folded into your base chance to hit.
 
So far that's 8 of the 18 skills for Skyrim (7 if you don't count my Smithing guess).  Given that all skills will now be available for players in Skyrim when trying to level, I wonder what they might be.  The trend seems to currently be about simplifying the combat skills to be a bit more manageable than, say, Morrowind's relatively wide selection, but if you count Oblivion as a template, minus Mysticism, there are still two skills to cull.  Wonder what they might be :) 
 
Feel free to speculate, if you like, in the comments.
#1 Posted by ahoodedfigure (4239 posts) -
This is just a note to folks who might be alienated by my attention to Elder Scrolls lately: I'm still into other stuff, and will talk about it when I feel the need, even if it doesn't rope as many comments.    I have to admit, I'm not the hugest fan of the Elder Scrolls series (I tend to skim the books unless I think they have direct bearing on the game world I'm actually playing in, for example), although I obviously like it a fair bit given the amount of energy I've put into these posts about it.
 
I guess part of this is the obsessive nerd in me trying to figure out the details of the new game, treating it like a logic puzzle or whatever. Ask me a month after Skyrim is released what I think of the game and I will probably ramble about my old XBox dying or finding some obscure game that deserves to see the light of day.  Right now, though I'm sort of an equal with everyone since we're all finding out about Skyrim at about the same time.  
 
That said, I wanna talk about skills in the Elder Scrolls series.
 

History of Skills in Elder Scrolls games

Here's a rundown of the skills featured in every major E.S. release, before I go into projections for Skyrim.
 

Arena

 
Technically, the first Elder Scrolls game had skills, but they were hidden, and they only increased with modifications based on attribute bonuses or special artifacts or spells, or advanced when you leveled. Hopping in place to boost your jump was non-existant; you killed dudes and completed quests to boost your skills, and that was it.
 

Daggerfall

 
The open skills system begins here, and it had a bunch of crazy skills that were not the most attractive choices. Still, there were a few interesting ideas here that were later abandoned when the game was streamlined.  Leveling is also tied directly into the skills, so there's a lot of trial and error in figuring out which skills are worthwhile.  Still, as far as character creation as a whole, I think Daggerfall had the biggest range of options, including stuff that would be considered the stuff of super powers or artifacts in later games, as well as game-breaking flaws.
 

Morrowind

 
Skills are really improved here, removing a lot of the chaff and giving you a bunch of different, interesting choices. The major and minor skills influencing leveling leaves some people taking forever to level, while others, especially mages, can manipulate the system and level by just hanging around in the inn and repeatedly casting.
 

Oblivion

 
Yeeeaaarrrrgggh.  Sorry, that's all I'm qualified to say, although I've read that the skills changed substantially from Morrowind, altering attribute connections and what skills actually do at certain times.
 

The Skill Lineage


OK, here we go. I'm including Arena's basic abilities, even though they may not be listed as open for the player.  
 

Spellcasting (including Alchemy):

 
ArenaDaggerfallMorrowindOblivionSkyrim(?)
 Spellcasting
AlterationAlterationAlteration Alteration
 .
DestructionDestruction
Destruction
 Destruction
 .IllusionIllusionIllusion
 Illusion
 .MysticismMysticismMysticism
 --
 .RestorationRestorationRestoration
 Restoration
 .Thaumaturgy
--
 -- --


Enchant*Enchanting
 
Alchemy
 AlchemyAlchemy
  Conjuration ConjurationConjuration

In Arena, your character class determined whether or not you could cast spells, and would also have a multiplier that was applied to your character's intelligence score that was also tied to your character's class. Starting with Daggerfall, spellcasting was no longer forbidden to players who wanted to cast and had no disadvantages preventing them from using Magicka.  Thaumaturgy and Mysticism over time had their contents juggled, and in the case of the former, their effects were usually folded into other spell schools.  Given that Mysticism will probably be gone as per the reports, I'm betting many of Mysticism's useful spell effects will find homes in other schools.
 
*Enchanting was still possible in Oblivion, but wasn't tied to a skill, instead requiring items or locations to help facilitate the creation of magical items.  Now it seems that Enchanting is back as a skill for Skyrim. There's another skill that I think will be separate from Enchanting, and I'll give you my theory about that farther down.
 

Communication 

 
ArenaDaggerfallMorrowindOblivionSkyrim(?)

[Languages*]
--
 ----
(Affected solely by attributes)
Etiquette Speechcraft Speechcraft ?
.
Streetwise
 Speechcraft Speechcraft ?
.
Mercantile
 Mercantile Mercantile ?

 Etiquette was useful with royalty and academics, streetwise with commoners. Mercantile seems to have a strong following, and both Speechcraft and Mercantile may still find their way into Skyrim.
 
*The languages reduced NPC hostility during encounters if the roll was successful.  The languages available were:  Centaurian, Daedric, Dragon (they're babies, but they're tough), Giant, Harpy, Impish, Nymph, and Spriggan.  Depending upon what spawns, you may not even encounter the language specialty of choice, and as far as I know they didn't have much benefit as far as quests or actual communication with the NPCs; would have been cool if THAT had been the case.  It's a safe bet languages won't be making their glorious return in Skyrim, but I still think it was a cool idea, if poorly supported.
 

Environmental Interaction (including locks and stealing old ladies' wallets)

  
ArenaDaggerfallMorrowindOblivionSkyrim (?)
 Khajiit climbing bonus*
 ClimbAcrobatics(Acrobatics) ?
 Argonian swimming bonus*
 SwimmingAthleticismAthleticism ?
  RunningAthleticismAthleticism
 **
  JumpingAcrobaticsAcrobatics ?
 Lockpicking (by class)
 LockpickingSecurity
Security ?
 Pickpocketing ( " " )
 Pickpocketing(Sneak)(sneak) ?
 Travel Time Reduction ( " " )
 -- -- -- --
 
*In the first game, Argonians were strong swimmers who would receive only minimal stamina drain from negotiating through watery areas, and could move relatively quickly through water.  The Khajiit can vault out of pits, whether or not they're filled with water, almost instantly, reducing the danger of getting poked in the head with a skeleton's sword.  These abilities can also be approximated through the Acrobat character class.
 
**Skyrim will have a sprint feature, which may be sort of like running, or may be all the more dramatic and, because it's based on stamina, short in duration.
 

Defense, Maintenance, and Avoidance

 
ArenaDaggerfall
MorrowindOblivionSkyrim(?)
 Armor Proficiency*
 -- Light Armor
 Light Armor
 ?
 .  Medium Armor
 -- ?
 .  Heavy Armor
 Heavy Armor
 ?
 .  Block Block
 ?
 Dodge (by class)
 Dodge Unarmored -- ?
 Repair (by class)
 --  Armorer Armorer Smithing*
 Stealth ( " " )
 Stealth Sneak Sneak ?
 
In Arena, the armor you could wear was dictated by your class, and this seems to be true in Daggerfall as well, although you can set these things yourself when making a custom class, and they still aren't treated as skills in themselves.
 
My guess, based on a screenshot I saw, is that Smithing will be a skill, separate from Enchanting, where you can create an object from raw materials, possibly similar to Alchemy recipes.  I'm betting it would also help you recover item durability.  
 
As far as Armor, it seems like Oblivion moved in the right direction by reducing the types of Armor proficiencies, but I wonder if they might go a step further and have a single Armor proficiency (or possibly none at all). A single armor proficiency  would let the character be less encumbered with heavier armor as they grew in power, allowing for a natural character progression, if you bother with armor at all.
 
Block in Oblivion was expanded to include all defensive stopping power, not just the use of shields, and expanded through expertise to include abilities such as disarming.
 
Dodge has no direct equivalent, but I'm putting it in with unarmored since it's about avoiding being hit, rather than what armor you're wearing.

Combat and Recovery

 
ArenaDaggerfall
MorrowindOblivionSkyrim(?)
 Weapon Proficiencies
Short Blade
 Short Blade
 Blade --
 .Long Blade
 Long Blade
 Blade --
 .Archery
 Marksman Marksman Archery
 .Blunt Weapon
 Blunt Weapon
 Blunt --
 .Axe Axe Blunt --
 .  Spear -- --
  Hand to Hand
 Hand to Hand
 Hand to Hand
 ?
 Critical Hit (class chance)
 Critical Strike
 -- -- ?
 . Backstab (via Sneak) (via Sneak) ?
  Medical -- -- ?
 .
 . . . One-Handed Weapons
 . . . . Two-Handed Weapons
 . . . . Dual-Weapons
 

 Medical enhanced your ability to recover health when you sleep and to avoid disease, which would sneak up on you in the night. 
 
Critical Strike seems to have been folded into your base chance to hit.
 
So far that's 8 of the 18 skills for Skyrim (7 if you don't count my Smithing guess).  Given that all skills will now be available for players in Skyrim when trying to level, I wonder what they might be.  The trend seems to currently be about simplifying the combat skills to be a bit more manageable than, say, Morrowind's relatively wide selection, but if you count Oblivion as a template, minus Mysticism, there are still two skills to cull.  Wonder what they might be :) 
 
Feel free to speculate, if you like, in the comments.
#2 Posted by ArbitraryWater (11587 posts) -

I think one of the reasons Oblivion had fewer skills than Morrowind is because most of the skills removed weren't that useful in the first place. There weren't very many good spears, nor very many good medium armors, and being unarmored unless you were roleplaying as a monk (and really, who does that? I have yet to meet anyone who actually thinks that Monks are cool character classes in any incarnation they are present in), is paramount to self-handicap. Balanced character development has never been Bethesda's forte, and I doubt it will be in Skyrim either.  Similarly, I hope that hand to hand isn't total garbage. Because of all the "weapon" skills available, I think that could have been axed (hilarious pun) with the least amount of hassle. Because nobody ever says "I want to make a character that can't take advantage of any of the loot I find"
 
But, if I could guess, I would say that they merge Acrobatics and Athletics and Mercantile and Speechcraft, thus filling in those two remaining removed skills. Considering that those 4 skills weren't ever really useful on their own, it would make sense to merge them. That is streamlining.

#3 Posted by SathingtonWaltz (2053 posts) -
@ArbitraryWater: I agree. I think that merging Athletics/Acrobatics and Speechcraft/Mercantile would NOT be "dumbing down", it would be as you put it: STREAMLINING  
 Merging those skills would make them far more advantageous to have, and would only be an improvement. If your an "athlete" why wouldn't you be able to jump better than someone who isn't? Same with Speechcraft. If you were a master with words how would that not translate into better haggling with merchants? Streamlining only makes this series better and more playable.
#4 Posted by GunslingerPanda (4689 posts) -
@SathingtonWaltz
@ArbitraryWater: I agree. I think that merging Athletics/Acrobatics and Speechcraft/Mercantile would NOT be "dumbing down", it would be as you put it: STREAMLINING  
 Merging those skills would make them far more advantageous to have, and would only be an improvement. If your an "athlete" why wouldn't you be able to jump better than someone who isn't? Same with Speechcraft. If you were a master with words how would that not translate into better haggling with merchants? Streamlining only makes this series better and more playable.
Ugh. What disgusting sentiments.
#5 Posted by ArbitraryWater (11587 posts) -
@GunslingerPanda:  Please tell me of any occasion where having a high acrobatics, athletics, speechcraft, or mercantile ever gave you a major advantage in any elder scrolls game as opposed to having high blade, sneak, destruction, etc.
 
Or maybe you're against the sentiment that streamlining makes things better? In that case, perhaps I would be more apt to understand. Sometimes complexity is lost when removing excess mechanics.
#6 Posted by ahoodedfigure (4239 posts) -
@ArbitraryWater:  That was my impression, from what I'd seen. The spears were especially disappointing, and I couldn't quite understand why they had a separate listing except that they didn't quite fit with the others (longest reach, I've read.  Meh).  As a quick aside, advanced DnD had optional rules for the type of attack a weapon could have (slashing, bashing, stabbing).  Given that ES already has different "fire modes" for melee weapons as it were, with different damage ratings (at least in Morrowind they did that), why not make that the source of skill, with weapons that complement that particular style of attack?  It would be a bit silly if this approach were with the old major/minor skill advancement, but if there's no specific skills tied to advancement anymore, maybe it might work.
 
Unarmored in Morrowind, I've read, didn't work at all unless you had at least one piece of armor on. Otherwise you were at zero defense.  I think it was more for wizards who didn't want to do the armor thing. It's weird that they allow for monks to happen, since they don't seem to like the idea of them being in there. Unarmored wound up being advanced in games I played, though, because the beast races couldn't wear boots or certain helmets, so when those places were hit their unarmored skill was checked.
 
I like the idea of hand-to-hand mattering, but I don't really know anyone who uses it except as a stunt. I usually have a backup weapon in case the other one breaks, so it never really came up. Would be nice, though, if you could choose to subdue someone rather than kill them, say if they went psycho on you and you're defending yourself but not exactly eager to reduce the population of the tiny town you're visiting.  Maybe I'll have wait a few sequels for stuff like that, though.
 
I'm not a big fan of merging those four you mention, but I guess it's because I'd like them not to be "skills" at all so much as stats that are off to the side. You could improve your running by practicing but it doesn't have anything to do with your level advancement. It's just a thing you do to get better at it, maybe like San Andreas stat boosting. I also...  I think I've said this before but I hate social skills being stats. I sort of want the player to treat those as a puzzle rather than the game just telling me "oh, you're really charming. Everyone likes you." It treats the whole world as varying degrees of the same person, with very little in the way of variance. In real life I find that if I do things that some people like, other people hate me for it. It's not a faction thing so much as their particular life experience telling them that that kind of behavior means I'm a bad person, whether or not there's any objective truth to that. 
#7 Posted by Bollard (5396 posts) -

Just so you know, your guess about what's happening with Mysticism skills was right - they've been spread of the other schools. 
 
I'm not too bothered about skills really - I'm not a heavy roleplayer, I just like stealth and stealing things, so as long as I can still level Archery, Sneak, Security and Agility/Athletics I'm happy (I might bother with some Mercantile this time)*. My god did my Oblivion character move fast. I could literally jump about 14 feet. The only problem was you could turn in mid air which made it feel like you were on the moon. And playing Morrowind afterwards with its cripplingly slow walking speed was a nightmare. Hopefully that isn't messed up. 
 
*On a note about the Speechcraft/Mercantile merge, I do think that makes much more sense... I mean, logically they are interlinked so being good at one relates to the other surely, but the real problem I find is making a way to level in Speechcraft which actually feels engaging. The mini-games so to speak in Oblivion and Morrowind were dull and made almost no sense as to what you had to do to get it right. I swear it was down to luck most of the time, and usually to level the skill up more involved making everyone hate you, because you were so bad at the skill, which is backwards and makes it pointless. I hope they find a better way to include that in Skyrim.

#8 Posted by MasterGohan (1 posts) -

Todd Howard has confirmed that there will be no spear skill in Skyrim. He did, however, confirm other skills. Using the screenshot  ahoodedfigure saw and Todd Howard's podcast interview, I have gathered 12 of the 18 skills in Skyrim: 

One-Handed Weapons
Two-Handed Weapons
Archery
Duel Weapons
Alchemy
Illusion
Conjuration
Destruction
Restoration
Alteration
Enchanting
Smithing
 
There are still 6 unconfirmed skills so we'll just have to speculate as to what they are until they are all revealed.

#9 Posted by President_Barackbar (3448 posts) -
@MasterGohan:  Oh wow, now even blade and blunt are gone. I do like the streamlining there, and Dual weapons excites me. Hopefully spears could still come back as a two-handed weapon.
Online
#10 Posted by ahoodedfigure (4239 posts) -
@President_Barackbar:  It's funny, I pretty much ignored spears in Morrowind, but now some of my top weapons are spears (and I don't even have a major or minor skill in spears, I actually use them to build my endurance).
 
@MasterGohan: Excellent detective work, Master Gohan. I'll add the information to my entry. This seems to back up their design choice of having handedness in combat be essential to how you build your character. 
 
@Chavtheworld: Playing Morrowind right now, and Speechcraft takes forever to level. I usually don't risk the attempts to up the skill through attitude and just try to bribe. It's sort of like a much more expensive way of paying a trainer. I wonder if speechcraft should just be hidden dice rolls or something, and the better you are at it the more information you get out of people. Every unique person you talk to you get a bit of a bump in the skill, and so the more people you talk to the more you learn, and the more you can talk about with people you've already met. Something a bit more engaging than tweaking a few buttons.
#11 Posted by velucyraptor (358 posts) -
@ahoodedfigure: Woah. Was largely already familiar with the way skillsets differed between each Elder Scrolls game, but seeing everything sorted into tables like that was just awesome. Nice work (: Also empathy for the Speechcraft levelling in Morrowind, ugh 
#12 Posted by FreakAche (2951 posts) -
@ArbitraryWater said:
" I think one of the reasons Oblivion had fewer skills than Morrowind is because most of the skills removed weren't that useful in the first place. There weren't very many good spears..."
Simon the Argonian Spearman wants you to take that back!
#13 Posted by DaemonBlack (342 posts) -

The whole " hanging around in the inn and repeatedly casting" thing is what drove me up a god damn wall about Oblivion. I mean I loved the game but upgrade the skills when you use the skill to kill something for gods sake so I can at least be exploring the world while I'm leveling skills at a decent pace.

#14 Posted by ahoodedfigure (4239 posts) -
@velucyraptor: Thanks :) I guess I wanted to see such a table online already and found that there wasn't any, as far as I could see. I thought it might be appreciated here so I went for it.
 
@FreakAche: You remember which spears you got? I just got a Blessed Spear from [a god], which is pretty useful.
 
@DaemonBlack: I used to think I was clever for making a largely useless spell to spam in the inn to level, but I tried to do that now and found it way too tedious. Since the new level scheme has you leveling no matter what you do, then I guess that's sort of solved, although I'm beginning to wonder if I've been doing it wrong all these years since I started Morrowind a bit differently this time and put many of the useful skills off the leveling list, only keeping a few of the ones I know I'm going to use constantly. Been a better experience, mostly, since leveling just sort of happens as I play.
#15 Posted by FreakAche (2951 posts) -
@ahoodedfigure: Seriously I don't remember at all. It's been a while since I've played Morrowind.

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