Are they censoring nazis ?

#1 Posted by turbomonkey138 (4950 posts) -

Just saw the pre-order trailer for The Saboteur on youtube . If you look at the video the Nazi does not have a 
swastika it is just a cross 
 
 

 
 What do you guys think ? 
 
Has anyone seen if there are swastikas in this game ? 
 
If they are censoring it do you think they should ?

#2 Posted by Seedofpower (3937 posts) -

Wow, they soooo totally are. Well that's fucking lame..... its history.... now I have a head ache.

#3 Posted by HandsomeDead (11863 posts) -

I've seen a few trailers with some censoring the swastikas and others not. I hope they're not censoring them otherwise what's the point?

#4 Posted by turbomonkey138 (4950 posts) -
@HandsomeDead said:
" I've seen a few trailers with some censoring the swastikas and others not. I hope they're not censoring them otherwise what's the point? "

If they do censor this for the final release then political correctness has gone too far .
#5 Posted by Linkyshinks (9880 posts) -

It's probably only removed in advertising, as it's not really necessary, I doubt it's censored in the game itself.  
 
Many people continue to find the use of a one time religious symbol deeply offensive.

#6 Posted by turbomonkey138 (4950 posts) -
@Linkyshinks said:
" It's probably only removed in advertising, as it's not really necessary, I doubt it's censored in the game itself.   Many people continue to find the use of a one time religious symbol deeply offensive. "
The thing is the Buddhist symbol is the other way around .
#7 Posted by FlamingHobo (4483 posts) -

If they censor this in the actual game then I'll be really disappointed.

#8 Posted by Meltac (2003 posts) -

Hm, I'm pretty sure I saw a gameplay trailer which wasn't censored. I'll see if I can find it ^^

#9 Posted by End_Boss (3220 posts) -

Everyone relax. Saboteur won't be the first time games have seen uncensored swastikas. Censoring the trailers really isn't that big of a deal.

#10 Edited by Meltac (2003 posts) -
#11 Posted by turbomonkey138 (4950 posts) -
@Meltac said:

"   
It's about 0:55

 

"
Is that the E3 presentation ?
#12 Edited by Meltac (2003 posts) -
@turbomonkey138: Nope, it's from October 16th, so it's pretty new
#13 Posted by Meowayne (6084 posts) -

 its history

*facepalm*
#14 Posted by turbomonkey138 (4950 posts) -
@Meltac said:
" @turbomonkey138: Nope, it's from October 16th, so it's pretty new "
Maybe there is hope then  :0
#15 Posted by turbomonkey138 (4950 posts) -

See told you look at the quick look 
 
 

#16 Posted by Milkman (17001 posts) -
@turbomonkey138: From the comments of that video: Jeff says " We almost mentioned the no swastikas thing, but forgot. The full version of the game will have them in regions where they are allowed. They've been showing this version off because they've been taking it around the world and didn't want to deal with two separate builds." 
 
Don't worry, you'll get your swastikas.
#17 Edited by turbomonkey138 (4950 posts) -
@Milkman said:

" @turbomonkey138: From the comments of that video: Jeff says " We almost mentioned the no swastikas thing, but forgot. The full version of the game will have them in regions where they are allowed. They've been showing this version off because they've been taking it around the world and didn't want to deal with two separate builds."   Don't worry, you'll get your swastikas. "

Lol now  i sound like a psycho ....
#18 Posted by AjayRaz (12440 posts) -
@Milkman said:
 Don't worry, you'll get your swastikas. "
thank god. 
#19 Posted by Famov (768 posts) -

Going by what Milkman said, I'm assuming the censorship will apply to PAL regions. The United States and Canada will probably be uncensored.
  
This goes nicely with the free speech discussion in the other thread, and in this one I'll say that I'll tattoo a swastika on my head if I frickin' want to. It is my right to do so, and the government should not be engaged in this sort of blatant restriction of free speech. Indeed, it is very easy to draw parallels to the censorship of the facist state to the censorship of any modern European state that wishes to atone for 20th century Nazism by pretending it never happened.
#20 Posted by PeasForFees (2411 posts) -
@turbomonkey138: German releases of the game might be the only ones censored, (I think due to a law) It is common practice to not use Swastikas in advertising now anyway.
#21 Posted by Bald3rdash (253 posts) -

They're only censoring in certain regions, I'd imagine Australia is at the top of the censored regions list.

#22 Posted by PeasForFees (2411 posts) -
@Bald3rdash said:
" They're only censoring in certain regions, I'd imagine Australia is at the top of the censored regions list. "
I would expect Germany to be at the top
#23 Edited by Bald3rdash (253 posts) -
@PeasForFees said:

" @Bald3rdash said:

" They're only censoring in certain regions, I'd imagine Australia is at the top of the censored regions list. "

I would expect Germany to be at the top "
I was just joking about Aussi-land because of the censoring of  L4D2 and other games ;)
#24 Posted by ryanwho (12082 posts) -

I don't feel okay about breaking necks unless they got real deal swasticas on their arms. 
But I mean, if this is the pal version, shouldn't the soldiers be robots with black blood or something? That'll never get into Germany as is.

#25 Posted by Hailinel (25179 posts) -

If you want to see retarded levels of censorship, you should check out Wolfenstein RPG on the iPhone.  Their fake Hitler has a soul patch instead of the mustache in addition to the removal of swastikas.

#26 Posted by Godlyawesomeguy (6399 posts) -

You should see the censored pictures of topless girls on gamespot from this game. Its a fucking disgrace that censorship exists, especially the kind that censors sexuality and not violence (cough, cough gamespot)
#27 Posted by AgentofChaos (1565 posts) -

Its different in Germany, where displaying the Swatstika is not allowed (for obvious reasons)

#28 Posted by Suicrat (3764 posts) -
@Famov said:
" Going by what Milkman said, I'm assuming the censorship will apply to PAL regions. The United States and Canada will probably be uncensored.  This goes nicely with the free speech discussion in the other thread, and in this one I'll say that I'll tattoo a swastika on my head if I frickin' want to. It is my right to do so, and the government should not be engaged in this sort of blatant restriction of free speech. Indeed, it is very easy to draw parallels to the censorship of the facist state to the censorship of any modern European state that wishes to atone for 20th century Nazism by pretending it never happened. "
That's not entirely true. In Germany, pretending it never happened is a crime.
#29 Posted by Hailinel (25179 posts) -
@Suicrat said:
" @Famov said:
" Going by what Milkman said, I'm assuming the censorship will apply to PAL regions. The United States and Canada will probably be uncensored.  This goes nicely with the free speech discussion in the other thread, and in this one I'll say that I'll tattoo a swastika on my head if I frickin' want to. It is my right to do so, and the government should not be engaged in this sort of blatant restriction of free speech. Indeed, it is very easy to draw parallels to the censorship of the facist state to the censorship of any modern European state that wishes to atone for 20th century Nazism by pretending it never happened. "
That's not entirely true. In Germany, pretending it never happened is a crime. "
True.  While it is forbidden to display Nazi-related iconography in Germany, it's also a crime to deny the events that took place under the Third Reich never took place.  It is paradoxical, but at the same time, Germany neither wants to promote nor make people forget about what happened.
#30 Posted by Suicrat (3764 posts) -
@Hailinel: It's only a paradox if you see communications control as the proper role of government. If you don't then you realize that both actions serve the same ends: to control speech and thought.
#31 Edited by Famov (768 posts) -
@Suicrat:
Well yes, its illegal to deny the Holocaust, but I'm speaking of the spirit of a swastika ban. When you ban certain imagery simply because it symbolizes a dark part of your natoinal past, it seems (to me, anyway) as an unhealthy way of burying it.
#32 Posted by Captainlunchbox (445 posts) -

Real quick, just feel like I need to add this: There have been other WWII games where they have censored the swastika, and those games were supposed to be more on the historically accurate side. This like more fantasy WWII so I don't really mind it as much.

#33 Posted by jakob187 (21690 posts) -

Nazi stuff is being censored out for the display versions as well as for press showings, as they don't want to potentially offend anyone while they are trying to show off the game.  I completely understand this reasoning, as it means they can sell THE GAME rather than someone saying "OMG, NAZI SYMBOL" and starting a whole shitload of controversy that's unnecessary.  Also, it allows the press to show the game off in any country without worrying if they can't show the Nazi stuff or not, etc etc. 
 
Unfortunately, after watching the quick look, I'm just not sure about the idea of an Irish race car driver climbing buildings with Altair-like ease.

#34 Posted by Meowayne (6084 posts) -

That people here actually believe the swastika ban in Germany exist because of any kind of identification is extremely sad and pathetic.
 
Swastikas (as well as other symbols) are banned in trivial and commercial contexts if they are "glorified"; this extends to public assemblies, advertisements, and (as of yet) games or album covers (among other I suppose, but I can't think of any more context where anyone has been sensitive about them)
 
You see swastikas in German movies, TV, plays, books, comedy shows, etc. all the time.

#35 Posted by turbomonkey138 (4950 posts) -

so looks like its not being censored in America . But i think the PAL version will be

#36 Posted by atomic_dumpling (2474 posts) -
@Meowayne said:

" That people here actually believe the swastika ban in Germany exist because of any kind of identification is extremely sad and pathetic.  Swastikas (as well as other symbols) are banned in trivial and commercial contexts if they are "glorified"; this extends to public assemblies, advertisements, and (as of yet) games or album covers (among other I suppose, but I can't think of any more context where anyone has been sensitive about them) You see swastikas in German movies, TV, plays, books, comedy shows, etc. all the time. "

I explained it in some detail at the Germany page in the giantbomb wiki.
 
Ironically, Germany itself applies the regular German Civil Code to video games, effectively prohibiting any depiction of flags or symbols used by the NSDAP. Even the smallest swastika has to be edited out or changed (often to a simple cross), much to the dismay of foreign developers, who have to adapt their content accordingly. Adolf Hitler usually gets written out of such games altogether, often leading to outlandish storytelling in the german editions. Many german gamers are upset by the apparent double standard since movies - being considered an art form by law - are not limited in this manner at all, as long as they don't aggrandize the Third Reich.
#37 Posted by mrfizzy (1541 posts) -

Well i have the Aussie version (which is a PAL region) and our version is completely uncensored, swastikas, violence, nudity (if you download it) is all in there. As others have said, Germany (and maybe some other European countries?) have laws that ban the use of the swastika. My guess is that the developed only wanted to make one trailer so they edited it out. 

#38 Posted by mrfizzy (1541 posts) -
@turbomonkey138: believe me, its not. 
#39 Posted by atomic_dumpling (2474 posts) -
@mrfizzy said:
"As others have said, Germany (and maybe some other European countries?) have laws that ban the use of the swastika.
As far as I know Germany is the only country that doesn't allow video games to show NSDAP symbols while TV and films can freely show them. It's a double standard and the reasoning behind it is, well, non-existent, really.
#40 Edited by adam_grif (1144 posts) -

A lot of games remove Swastikas and replace them with Iron Crosses, because it's illegal to display Swastikas in Germany in videogames. In other nations, the use of it is frowned upon, so sometimes devs either have two versions, one with one without, or just develop it without swastikas from the start to save trouble later.

#41 Posted by Yummylee (22039 posts) -

I'm just grateful it wasn't censored to the extremes of say....Wolfenstein 3D's console port lol

 
  

  

#42 Posted by Shadow (4981 posts) -

wow...that is really, really stupid.  Is 4Kids directing pre-order trailers now?

#43 Posted by TooWalrus (13234 posts) -

Anyone remember this? My bud had one, it was SO cool! Man, I miss elementary school.

#44 Posted by nanikore (2740 posts) -
@TooWalrus said:
" Anyone remember this? My bud had one, it was SO cool! Man, I miss elementary school.

"
Man, Nazi Pokémons. That's amazing.
#45 Posted by xMP44x (2193 posts) -

There are swastikas in the game, both on the flags, and on the Nazi soldiers armbands. There is a swastika on the door of the Gestapo Cruiser as well as one of the tanks. The tank also has a Schutzstaffel (SS) logo on it, but I'm not sure which tank this is. I think it might be the Panzer, but I'm not certain. If you take a Nazi's uniform from his corpse, Sean does not wear the armband for some reason.

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