Season 2 Episode 5 Decisions and thoughts. (spoilers)

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#1 Edited by Random45 (1233 posts) -

So I just beat episode 5, and I gotta say, bravo for making the ending as bleak and depressing as possible. Even the first season's ending with Lee's death didn't make me feel as shitty as this, because at least in the first season you ACCOMPLISHED something. Here it just feels like everything was so pointless. Also, I really liked that flashback to episode 3 of the first season, talking to Lee again was pretty rad.

Anyway my choices:

I protected the Baby - Seems like a pretty logical choice, and I'm not surprised to see this having a huge majority.

I tried to cover Luke instead of running to save him - I figured an extra 70~ pounds over on thin ice wouldn't do much to save him, so I covered him in hopes that he could get out on his own. When he fell through, I did everything in my fucking power to try saving him, even smashing through the ice and nearly dying myself. If you DO go over to him, I wonder if you can actually save him?

I didn't ask to leave with Mike - Wasn't too happy about this twist. I threatened to shoot him, and was kind of disappointed that I didn't even get the option to do so.

I shot Kenny - Perhaps the biggest choice I regret this entire episode (the other being not to go save Luke), when I learned that the baby died, I tried to reason with him, but I knew that he was extremely mentally unstable already, so I shot him to save Jane, figuring I could just travel with her, since she is a LOT more sane. And then you learn the baby is alive, with consequently led to...

I am alone with the baby - Fuck Jane. If she hadn't have done that, I wouldn't have had a reason to shoot Kenny! I told her she was nuts and that I refused to go with her, so now I'm all alone.

Talk about a depressing ending though, the conversations with Kenny this episode were all REALLY good, and the last one when he was dying I even got misty eyed over. Poor guy went through so much, and I betrayed him in the end thinking I was doing the right thing. I kind of want to replay it to see if I could have actually saved Luke, and to NOT kill Kenny in the end. Overall it was a pretty solid episode, definitely one of the best ones in the season.

#2 Edited by Meltdown547 (13 posts) -

Just finished.

I just want to say, I am in the Fuck Arvo 2014 bandwagon. They can show him sad and beaten and called a kid all they want, he lied about what we did, lead us into an ambush, and was ready to kill any of us at any moment. Very much seemed like he was the Clem of that Russian group, and that means he would take any opportunity to exploit perception. Took every chance I could to tell Kenny to put him down.

#3 Posted by Milkman (17029 posts) -

Wow.

  • Protected the baby, obviously.
  • Went after Luke to try and save him. If you're wondering what happens, you both fall through the ice and just as you're both about to swim to the surface, a walker grabs Luke's leg and pulls him down. I felt absolutely awful about this choice. It felt like this was completely my fault.
  • I didn't ask to leave with Mike. #FuckArvo
  • I shot Kenny. Wow, this was rough. I think I did the right thing. But man...
  • In the end, I'm with Jane and the family in Carver's HQ or whatever. I told Jane that I "forgive" her but it wasn't really about that. I think what she did was absolutely wrong and I hate that she did it but I know that sticking together is more important. Strength in numbers and all that.

Besides some minor annoyances of not being able to convey what I truly felt about the situation (the choice with Jane at the end and I was somewhere in the middle between Kenny's "I'm going to kill this kid" and everyone else's "he's just an innocent boy"), this was a great, great episode. There's no series that can make you feel quite as horrible as the Walking Dead.

The dream sequence with Lee was probably my favorite part of the episode, maybe of the entire season. It was weird because the last dialogue option of the dream gives you three choices: "promise me you'll never leave me", "promise me I won't have hurt anyone" and "tell me everything is going to be okay." At the time, I picked the second option and immediately I didn't really know why I picked that. It just seemed like kind of a weird thing to say. And then no less than 15 minutes later, I kill Kenny. Why you gotta do me like that game? ;_;

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#4 Edited by ThunderSlash (1829 posts) -

I'm going to have this buffer text here so that I don't accidentally spoil this game for the people who follow me.

So spoilers for Walking Dead Season 2 ya'll:

- Saved the baby (it was the only logical choice)

- Covered Luke. That ice looked like it wouldn't be able to hold the extra weight. Fuck Bonnie for freaking out and then being pissed at me. I tried to smash the ice but Luke drowned.

- I didn't ask to leave. I threatened Mike and got shot. Man, Arvo why'd you do that?!

- I didn't shoot Kenny. Jane looked like she was up to something when she told me to watch Kenny's reaction. I also hoped that Kenny would've stopped. Oh well, this decision was entirely justified once we found the baby. Jane was a crazy person to create artificial drama like that. I found it funny that you have the choice to shoot Kenny AFTER he kills Jane too. Who would do that!?

In the end Kenny, AJ, and Clem made it to Wellington. Saddest part was when Kenny asked me to leave him and go live in the community. I could've left with him but decided that this was best for Clementine. Man this episode felt like it had a ton of variables, I'm sure if I checked it's much less but still... I think it's the best one of the season.

That said, I'm REALLY surprised at the number of people who chose to shoot Kenny. Is the ending for that as impactful as the one with Kenny? I mean, you get Kenny's hat in the ending I got! Clementine: Hat Collector!

#5 Posted by Natedogg2 (453 posts) -
  • I saved the baby. I wonder what the split on that one will be.
  • I tried to cover Luke. I thought he just needed a little time to save himself, and if I went over there, I'd just risk the ice breaking even more. And man, Bonnie really hated me for that decision. I guess she really did liked Luke (as hinted at by the scene at the fire).
  • I didn't ask to leave. I didn't think I'd be able to stop them, and I knew how toxic Kenny was becoming, so I was going to let them leave. But I knew I had to stay (at least because Jane was still around). But yeah, #FuckArgo. I tried to stick up for him as much as I could and protect him from Kenny when I could, and this is how he repays me? I didn't even steal his medicine in Chapter 4.
  • I shot Kenny. I felt like he was a lost cause. He was fine when he was just talking to me, but any other time, he was angry jerk to everyone. He just lost too much and just fell too far into the darkness, and rather than continuing to put up with his crap, I had to end him.
  • I'm with Jane and I let the family in. With Jane, I didn't like her plan, but it accomplished what it needed to - it got Kenny out of the way permanently. That, and two people are better than one. With the family, I figure we probably wouldn't stay around too long, so I saw little harm in letting the family in. All I'm really interested in is the formula and maybe some other supplies, and I can't imagine we'd be able to carry everything anyways, so I might as well share what I can with the family. Kindness has to start somewhere.

I loved that flashback scene too. It even used my choices from that scene (Lily was laying down in the back, after having shot Carley). Overall, this season was good, not as good as the first season, but still good. The middle episodes seem to wander a bit with not much focus, but especially this last episode made up for it.

#6 Posted by ToTheNines (753 posts) -

*protected the baby, of course.
*covered for Luke, because he told me to trust him and I did. fuck you, Bonnie. I actually really really liked Luke and if I could pick one person to have survive with Clem it be him. He was emotionally stable and capable, but it was not to be. So that bummed me out quite a bit.
* Didn't ask to leave with Mike, was trying to guilt them into staying. Also gave him my gun. I liked Mike.
* Shot Kenny, which broke my heart, but he was losing it.
* I went with Jane, because her intentions were good and she's pretty damn good at surviving. And I didn't want me killing Kenny to stand for nothing. Also let the survivors into the compound, seemed like reasonable enough people.

Very depressing/great episode. I loved the Lee sequence. I am not a crying man, but this episode did hit me in just the right emotional spots. Good season! Though I still have beef with sitting through credits, telltale!

#7 Edited by Aegon (5704 posts) -

Throughout this season I was realizing more and more that despite his emotional problems, Kenny is THE most reliable person Clem has met. I definitely didn't always agree with him, but I knew he just wanted to do what he thought was best for the group. I saw through Jane's trick and stood back and tried to calm Kenny down and get him to listen to what Jane had to say, but she wasn't saying shit anyways. When she pulled that knife out and slashed Kenny, I wanted to take her out. When I was reaching for the gun, it was for the purpose of shooting her myself rather than leaving Kenny to struggle with her. So it was disappointing when the choice was Shoot Kenny or Look away. I didn't look away. That bitch. She set it up so that she'd have an excuse to murder Kenny. I was on friendly terms with her throughout the whole thing, until she did something so monumentally stupid. Also the fact that she was non-strop riling up Kenny while he was driving didn't help her cause.

Kenny, man...he made plenty of mistakes. Some fucked up decisions even, but he just wanted the best for the group.

This was the best episode, but...I don't know how to feel about it. It's fucked up that everyone betrays you and then you're given the choice to kill the person who's been there through thick and thin.

SUCKS!

  • Didn't protect the baby: Wasn't sure whether it was even a choice, but once I got into cover, I realized the Ruskies weren't concerned with the baby anyways, so it would be safer to shoot at them first and then get the baby. Of course Luke had to be a hero and get shot in the leg.
  • Covered Luke: Bonny's idea was stupid. Of course I frantically tried to save both of them when they were drowning.
  • Didn't ask to leave with Mike: Should've gotten a choice to shoot Arvo.
  • Didn't shoot Kenny, Didn't look away.
  • AJ and Clem at Wellington.
#8 Edited by Vessel28 (120 posts) -

Did everything the same as the OP but ended up with Jane because I stalled too long and the game decided for me. I saw the baby thing coming but still shot Kenny due to uncertainty and not wanting to just let him murder Jane in anger. I was kind of bummed that in my game, Clem forgives Jane quite easily but in the end I don't entirely regret it cause I think she needs an ally, going off with a baby alone seems insane. I could also tell something was going to happen with Arvo, he gave so many dirty looks to Clem that you could tell he was going to take revenge at some point, no matter how nice you try to be to him. Not sure how I feel about the Mike and Bonnie thing, I thought they would have at least tried to take the baby or something, maybe even try to convince Jane.

Thinking about it, does that mean people get to have Kenny in their season 3. If so, and if he ends up sane, I will probably be a little jealous.

#9 Edited by TheBlue (395 posts) -

Man, this one was a doozy. I had a harder time with the choices in this one than ever before. Obviously, the biggest choice with the biggest impact was the Kenny vs Jane one. I'm actually surprised a lot of people sided with Jane on that. Yeah, Kenny did become a little unstable and I definitely hesitated deciding who to side with, but in the end I just couldn't kill Kenny. Throughout the entire season, Kenny had made numerous questionable choices, but he had always had Clem's back. As soon as Jane came back without the baby and told Clem to wait and see what Kenny did, I knew I couldn't side with her. Anyone willing to manipulate someone and put everyone's lives at risk to make a point told me that she was the more dangerous one of the two.

Watching Kenny sacrifice his own safety for Clem and the baby was heartbreaking, though. I stood at the door for like 10 minutes trying to decide what to do. I imagine Kenny forces Clem to stay if you say you want to go with him. Really interested if those of us that didn't kill him will see him again or not in Season 3.

#10 Posted by anden4300 (14 posts) -

@random45: I did all the exact same things as you. the scene where Kenny died was so strong, and i was really feeling relieved after i shot him.. Then 30 seconds after when you find out that jane just did it to prove a point. The whole episode just fell to the ground for me, felt so pointless and empty.

My favourite moment was the flashback to episode 3 of season 1, flashback to Lee, which unfortunately also reminded me how much more i liked everything about season 1, and how the ending was miles better.

#11 Posted by ThunderSlash (1829 posts) -

@theblue: Sounds like you can refuse and join him if you wanted to. As much as I like him, I don't want to see him ever again. That guy's fate is now determinant. And we all know what happens to characters with that mark. *coughNickCarleyDougcough*

#12 Posted by meissnerd (12 posts) -

I ended up killing Kenny and leaving Jane. I thought it actually felt very liberating, like two great weights had lifted from my shoulders. In a way, I listened to both of them: I'm still taking care of that kid for Kenny, but I'm not letting people slow me down, like Jane always advised. I feel very optimistic for Clem and Alvin Jr., which is the first time I've felt like that throughout the series. A phenomenal ending.

#13 Edited by RecSpec (3853 posts) -

I let Kenny kill Jane because she made it sound like she was just trying to "test" him and fuck that. I liked her but she went way too far there, and I couldn't kill Kenny. The scene with him outside of Wellington was easily the hardest choice in both seasons, I didn't want to leave Kenny, but this was what he was working for, what everything was for, to reject that would've made everything he did a waste.. Goddamn, what an ending to a season I haven't really had strong feelings for. Team Kenny motherfuckers.

My choices glitched out but based on above

  • Didn't protect the baby
  • Covered Luke
  • Didn't ask to leave
  • Looked away, didn't shoot Kenny
  • Stayed at Wellington with AJ

#14 Posted by Landon (4152 posts) -

What a boring last episode. I've felt like this game always did a pretty good job at getting across how I felt, but this episode I felt like everyone was against me and I didn't know why.

Why the fuck was everyone so defensive of Arvo? Did we all just forget that his group was planning on robbing us and leaving us for dead? EVEN THOUGH I DID NOT STEAL FROM HOM AND CONVINCED JANE TO GIVE HOM HIS SUPPLIES BACK?

I didn't want Kenny to beat the shit out of him, so I pretty much tried to stay neutral on that, but Arvo was an asshole and everyone seemed to love him.

#15 Posted by Voxus (343 posts) -

Fuck everything. #teamkenny

#16 Posted by Xanadu (371 posts) -
  • protected baby
  • tried to save Luke
  • didnt ask to leave
  • shot Kenny
  • stuck with Jane

I felt a little bored and underwhelmed during this episode. I didn't connect with the characters nearly as much as the first season. Also if you're with Jane and the Family I laughed out loud at the the final line of the episode. "Cool hat."

#17 Edited by JeanLuc (3591 posts) -

I shot Kenny and left Jane. Certainly the bleakest choice but my personal favorite in terms of leading to the most interesting situations. I watched the other choices and going with Kenny seems the most heartfelt and uplifting.

Definitely seems like this is the ending to Clementine's story. Not sure how I feel around this. On the one hand I really love Clementine as a character and I want to keep seeing her, but on the other hand I don't know what else they could do with her.

Overall I'd say this season was good. Its not the masterpiece that I consider Season One to be, but it had a lot of really good stuff in it and I'm glad I played it.

#18 Edited by myketuna (1725 posts) -

I'm in the minority it seems.

  • Protected the baby.
  • Covered Luke on the ice.
  • Didn't ask to go/threatened Mike.
  • Shot Kenny.
  • Stuck with Jane at Howe's with the random family.

I didn't really mind shooting Kenny. I've never really liked Kenny. Stuck with Jane in the end. Don't really like her that much, but certainly like her more than Kenny. And I have a baby, so I figured 2 people would be better than one. Overall, the episode was pretty good, but the season definitely peaked at episode 3 for me.

#19 Edited by meaninoflife42 (521 posts) -

I thought this season overall was a good followup to the fantastic first season. I`m glad there`s a third season coming and I`ll gladly play it.

Also, I`ll post this gif here summarizing my state of mind after I`ve finished each episode:

Now Telltale needs to release Tales from the Borderlands soon. I need to feel some kind of joy in my life again.

#20 Edited by mixedupzombies (95 posts) -

I have done a very bad thing. (If you don't listen to bombin the am you won't understand)

I fucked up big

I am not continuing this convo at the very least.

Also I kinda thought the ending was okay to shit. At some point I didn't care what I was doing.

#21 Posted by Bobafeet (65 posts) -

There actually might be a lot of ending variation.

  • Protected the baby.
  • Covered Luke on the ice.
  • Didn't ask to go/threatened Mike.
  • Shot Kenny.
  • Totally alone with AJ not in Wellington

Did anyone else get the same end result as me? It cut to Nine Days Later and it's me in a field walking with AJ spreading walker guts on us so they wont notice us.

The flashback and the Kenny monologue when he was dying really got to me. Still don't really know how I feel about the season as a whole, but this was definitely one of the better episodes of the season.

#22 Posted by Sparky_Buzzsaw (6312 posts) -

The Lee moment was amazing. Just very well done.

Moderator
#23 Posted by Octaslash (551 posts) -
  • I ran for cover. Fuck the baby.
  • Covered Luke. Running towards breaking ice didn't seem like a good idea.
  • Threatened Mike. I was disappointing there wasn't an option to execute all three of them. Or at the very least, attempt to shoot at Arvo
  • Shot Kenny. I love Kenny, but he was turning into an asshole and I kind of just wanted to put him out of his misery, so I shot him. In the end he apoligized and told Clem she did the right thing. I can count on two hands moments in media that have made me cry. This was one of them.
  • I forgave Jane. What she did was stupid, but she was right about Kenny. Also, fuck the baby.

The 9 days later epilogue showed Clem and Jane going back to Carver's place. A family and their child asked if they could stay and have some of the little food that there was. The guy looked shady and clearly was packing, but I would have told them to fuck off either way. Which I did. The guy said, "We could be dangerous." to which Clem responded as she pulled out her gun, "So could I." I was pretty happy with the entire epidsode overall.

#24 Posted by AccidentalPancakes (47 posts) -

Shot Kenny and left alone with the baby.

The Lee flashback scene was amazing and really well placed. I'm pretty sure my heart skipped a beat when Clem woke up in the van. Damn, Lee was such a great character. Kenny's death scene was also really well done if you shot him. The repeated heel to face flipping that Kenny did through the season (hell, both seasons) seemed to underscore that he couldn't really control himself despite being a well meaning person. In the end, I think Kenny really meant it when he said Clem made the right choice by shooting him because he was out of control. But yeah, screw Jane for manipulating that like, so I was out of there.

But really tho, the biggest reveal in all of this is the very real possibility that Clementine won't be the main character in Season 3. Very different branching endings at the end of this season doesn't bode well for Clem returning. In fact, it seems very much not possible unless they make a mid-season episode that ties everything back into a common thread somehow.

#25 Edited by Random45 (1233 posts) -

So I just watched all the alternate endings, and I feel like I pretty much got the 'Bad Ending' of sorts. The ending with Kenny is SO much more fulfilling and heartfelt than the one where you're all alone. Hell, even the one with Jane at least makes you feel like something was accomplished. The Kenny Ending is definitely the 'Good Ending' in my eyes, since you succeed in your goal.

Shot Kenny and left alone with the baby.

The Lee flashback scene was amazing and really well placed. I'm pretty sure my heart skipped a beat when Clem woke up in the van. Damn, Lee was such a great character. Kenny's death scene was also really well done if you shot him. The repeated heel to face flipping that Kenny did through the season (hell, both seasons) seemed to underscore that he couldn't really control himself despite being a well meaning person. In the end, I think Kenny really meant it when he said Clem made the right choice by shooting him because he was out of control. But yeah, screw Jane for manipulating that like, so I was out of there.

But really tho, the biggest reveal in all of this is the very real possibility that Clementine won't be the main character in Season 3. Very different branching endings at the end of this season doesn't bode well for Clem returning. In fact, it seems very much not possible unless they make a mid-season episode that ties everything back into a common thread somehow.

The fact that season 3 might be a new cast is very exciting. Even before the second season was announced to star Clementine I was hoping for a new cast. As much fun as it was to be a kid and looked down on the entire time, I would rather play as an adult again.

#26 Edited by rusalkagirl (66 posts) -
  • I protected the baby. I didn't really do it consciously, or for any particular moral reason, it just seemed pretty simple to me.
  • I tried to save Luke. I had a feeling that he would die either way, and I did not want Bonnie to hate me for not trying to go after him like she was begging for me to. Of course, I did not know that Bonnie was going to betray us, so that is null at this point. I also figured that people were behind me; they had weapons, they could "cover" him as well as I could. It was better to do a group effort with Clem up close, plus the others shooting walkers from far away.
  • I did not ask to leave with Mike. I do wonder how that conversation would have went, though, and I did not choose to threaten him either.
  • I looked away. I am surprised by how many people chose to kill Kenny. I wanted to like Jane a lot, honestly, I think it would be great for Clem to have a lady friend/older sister type person, especially since she is almost a teenager. But, in the end, I could not trust her - at least Kenny's outbursts are predictable. Jane just came and went as she wanted to, and I had some issues regarding her choices with Sarah. I think she has way too much of a tendency to project her problems onto other circumstances and people. And playing around with people's emotions, faking AJ's death as a 'test'. She seems like the type of person who has no issue betraying those closest to her, and I personally have way too big of a fear of abandonment to put Clementine through that again.
  • I am with Kenny and AJ. I chose not to stay at Wellington and, instead, leave with Kenny. This ending was amazing, super duper heartfelt, I think, I am really really happy I did not kill him. I was not expecting to be able to stay with Kenny; I assumed there would be one ending if you chose Kenny, and another if you chose Jane. So, I was pleased to see that my Clementine did not have to be alone in the end.

I am going to watch the alternate endings soon and see what I missed. I've read the spoilers, though, and don't see how any ending could be better for me than the one I got. EDIT: I watched the others.

Holy fucking shit @ the ending if you choose to stay in Wellington. Kenny giving Clem his hat had me all broken up. That is intense.

And with Jane, you sure do have the option to be a real meanie. I almost feel like it could be considered out of character - but maybe that's just for my Clem, not sure how others' are. It just seems like there should have been a more neutral option, to turn the family down nicely, rather than point a gun at a starving kid or accept them with little to no hesitation. But really, does the decision even really matter *that* much? In comparison to your choices with Kenny, it seems like small potatoes whether you feed a few people for a while. You have been making that decision almost constantly throughout the game. If I had chosen that the first time around, I would be pretty disappointed in the game. Like I said, it could just be me, and I don't want to insult anyone's decisions. Maybe there was more emotional impact to other people.

Clementine being alone with the baby is what I expected the ending for everyone to be from the beginning. It seemed like something TT would do. I kind of hoped that it would be Clem + Sarah + AJ for a while, because it would open up the possibility of a whole new 'generation' of sorts for S3. Although that would have been cool to see, I am glad there was so much variation in our stories. Made it feel like our choices matter.

In the end, I do wonder what this means for next season. I want Clem to still be the protagonist, but it is definitely possible she won't be. I cannot see how they could tie a coherent story together from all these different endings, even with a new lead. That sure will be interesting! And sorry for this huge block of text for a post.

#27 Posted by Octaslash (551 posts) -

@rusalkagirl: I feel like I molded Clem into a hard ass and every mean-spirited choice I made felt true to the character. The game never made me feel truly evil for playing the way I did, which was great. I definitely want to see what happens when Kenny lives now, but I don't regret my decisions. Kenny's death scene was one of the most emotional effective things I've seen in a game in a long, long time and I'm glad I saw it.

#28 Edited by Dan_CiTi (3377 posts) -
Mark-ass Bitch of the Year 2014

Seriously fuck this guy. I stuck up for him every chance I got and he still fucked me in the ass and shot me. If I could I would have smacked the fuck out of this guy and put him in is place after leaving him in the dirt. Seriously. Just dirt.

Anyway, I protected the baby because why wouldn't you? When it came down to it I tried to save Luke and almost froze to death...I guess it was worth it? Why was the dude hanging onto his rifle the whole time?? I did not ask to leave with Mike, I'm pretty sure jolly ol' Arvo would have done the same no matter what, seeing as how the situation seems to have little wiggle room. I looked away (and did not shoot Kenny)...I wanted to like Jane really bad. She was cute, cool, and interesting but kind of erratic...Kenny is broken as hell but I understand how his head works at least. Did she really stash the baby or what?? That was confusing. Then went into Wellington with Alvin Jr. which was tough as fuck, though I just imagined Kenny setting up camp close by anyway. I thought it was best, and leaves me wondering how they will approach the next season. An adult Clem and teenaged Alvin would be pretty cool.

#29 Edited by ThunderSlash (1829 posts) -
@random45 said:

So I just watched all the alternate endings, and I feel like I pretty much got the 'Bad Ending' of sorts. The ending with Kenny is SO much more fulfilling and heartfelt than the one where you're all alone. Hell, even the one with Jane at least makes you feel like something was accomplished. The Kenny Ending is definitely the 'Good Ending' in my eyes, since you succeed in your goal.

Hell yeah! I'm with you on that. Kenny begging Clem to leave him brought back memories of the last bits of the first season. If I had gotten the other endings I would've been super bummed, and not in the good way; more so if it was the alone one (taking a baby that can cry at a moment's notice right into a herd sounds like a really bad idea). The Jane ones are okay, but they kinda feel... incomplete? Clem is now with a person she knows for 2 whole episodes and is still in a precarious situation.

Kenny's death speech was pretty good though.
If you haven't seen it yet, you should do yourself a favor and look up what happens when you don't shoot Kenny. It is appropriately devastating.
#30 Edited by AndrewB (7669 posts) -

Yeah, I don't know about some of my choices. This episode was kind of a whirlwind. I made some pretty dumb choices in hindsight. Most of them didn't seem to make the "major choices" cut.

I protected the baby. Durf? I mean, the problem is that I don't feel like putting the main character in danger is a big thing because they would only die when they were supposed to anyway. Plus whatever. It's a baby. You'd already done enough to protect it up until that point that it would have made all that in vain.

I tried to help Luke. Weren't both options technically helping? Basically amounted to not trusting him to be able to actually get out of it in time and him seeming to act so self-sacrificial in the moment.

I didn't ask to leave with Mike, and I regretted not going with my gut and placing the gun cursor over them instead of approaching first; though given the way the game is written I imagine that wouldn't have taken a shot, but probably just pointed the gun at them like Clementine does anyway. Man, choices in video games!

I shot Kenny. Reading about the alternative options makes me super bummed about that, but look - in the moment, Kenny was psychotic, and even though he's always been the most level-headed character in the game despite being that way, he also *wanted to die.* I felt like it was about time to see that through. Also, yeah, his death speech is awesome. Also, fuck the way Clementine was written that she didn't realize the baby was just fine. Also, I never forgave Jane. I called her out as being crazy and then remained silent.

So in the end, I'm with Jane and the *clearly* not threatening family who was ready to pull an obviously concealed weapon on me. At least the characters were smart enough to notice too, and I guess anyone not capable of protecting their family would probably not be a group of survivors I'd want with me in the first place.

Much as I really want the next season to diverge onto different characters, I could see them going either way with it. There are plenty of characters from the pool of "potentially still alive" that you can draw from for some familiarity, but the whole tie of Clementine grounds the two seasons together nicely, and they spent a good while building up the relationship with the baby. Though yeah, given how the story diverges and the way Telltale's recent games work, that's too much of a pathing branch to work out properly for a direct continuation. Plus I just kind of hope we see something different out of a third season to keep it fresh.

#31 Posted by Sparky_Buzzsaw (6312 posts) -

I think if anything is going to be the basis of the third season, it'll be Clem, alone with the baby. From a narrative standpoint, it would be easy to dismiss Jane or Kenny at the beginning if you allowed them to live by giving them an on-or-off camera exit. Maybe Kenny's eye gets too infected or Jane takes off because of guilt. A tighter focus on characters would be better, as opposed to the whack-a-mole aspect to all these names and faces that cropped up. Give us some time to grow fond of these characters and their deaths will mean more.

Moderator
#32 Posted by Random45 (1233 posts) -

@sparky_buzzsaw: This is very true. The first season's deaths hit a lot harder because you usually had several episodes to get to know the people - Katjaa, Duck, Doug/Carley, and even Ben. The second season starts killing people too often and too quickly. The Cabin survivors dropped like flies, and other than feeling annoyed at some of their deaths (Sarah and Nick come to mind immediately), I never felt that down by them. The only deaths in season 2 that really held any sort of meaning to me were Kenny's and Luke's deaths, and that's because both were with you for a significant amount of time, and both were well developed characters.

I kind of hope the next season has a MUCH more focused plot as well as more developed characters. Like you said, they should stop introducing characters so rapidly who just immediately die off in the same episode. Instead, give us time with the people in our group so we can come to know them.

#33 Posted by Supa_Kappa (68 posts) -

I ended up with Jane, AJ and the family at the shitty hardware store. I would have much preferred to end up in Wellington. I am annoyed there was no option to debate that with Jane. The ending just left me feeling angry and I want to storm off with the baby now.

As good as the scene with Lee was I feel it's telling of how weak the characters this season were. They had to rely on a moment from last season to be the emotional crux of the episode. This episode had some great development though, I wish it were like that throughout the season.

Overall I think this season had too many characters. The deaths just stopped having any weight to them and there wasn't enough time to develop them like in the first season.

I feel done with The Walking Dead, they'll have to really sell me on a third season. I'd be all for more Wolf Among Us though.

#34 Edited by BeachThunder (12094 posts) -

Finally finished the episode, after numerous crashes.

Anyway:

Overall, I thought it was a good season, but the climax was the end of Season 3. Once Carver died, it seemed like there was no goal anymore. I did tear up at the ending a bit though. I'll have to go check out the other endings - there seems to be some interesting alternatives to ending up at Wellington with AJ. Unfortunately, I barely felt any connection to most of the new characters - I kept forgetting the names of many of them, which is just as well, since a lot of them died.

Also, just for the record: I preferred TWAU over TWD2. TWD2 seemed a lot less polished: A bunch of glitches, slidey animations, the conspicuous recycling of the same zombie models.

Edit: Okay, just finished watching all the other endings. My face is wet.

#35 Edited by TheAcidSkull (567 posts) -

Fuck telltale games for making me nearly cry. TWICE. I didn't really think the episode was going to be as depressing Lee's death, but damn, it was. Anyways..

I saved the baby- This one is a no brainer, I mean, unless you're the kind of guy who wants to to tailor the game in an interesting way, this choice was pretty damn obvious. Seems a bit disappointing too, but I guess it was meant to show that clementine was a selfish brat who cared on about herself? Can't say.

I tried to Help Luke-I know he said I shouldn't, but I decided to do it anyway. In all honesty I just thought that the ice would hold Clems weight, but I pretty much guessed that Luke would die either ways. But the fact that I approached him made it clear to me that it was basically my fault. I broke the ice, which is something that will probably be on clementines mind.

Threatened Mike- I really regretted not calling for Kenny right away. If they were so afraid of him why would they leave me behind? (Clementine that is) Yeah, Kenny trusted her, but if they had legitimate concerns, leaving a kid with a man you are so certain( Sure enough to run away and take the car. Pricks) will lose it is kind of a bitch thing to do don't you think? I don't even believe that Give mike the gun or Threaten Mikewere the game changing choices. I think it was either call Kenny or don't. Still, it was a pretty intense scene. Also, I hope Arvo is mowed down by a huge truck, little motherfucker.

I looked the other way-I couldn't bring myself to shoot Kenny, probably because I figured out that the baby was still very much alive. Say what you will about Kenny but he was going through some serious stuff, and he was emotionally unstable, you don't fucking poke around with a guy who has lost his loved ones to prove a fucking point. If I could have saved both, I would have, but no matter how unreasonably they were acting Kenny wasn't wrong in this fucking case. Jane knew what she was doing, and she could have yelled mid fight that "Guess what, the baby is in the car, she isn't dead!" but nooooooooooooo she had to fight Kenny to prove that he was just as bad as Carver.

I'm alone with AJ- I'm not really sure that this is the final choice i'll go with, but Kenny can't be around people for some time, he needs his time to clear his fucking head, and as much as It broke my heart to leave without him, it was the right choice. Not sure if I'll see him again, but given that he is still indeed alive, I reckon he still pop up in the third season.

Ending Scenario 2: I'm with Kenny: You know what? I decided to play through the last part again. I was wondering what would happen if I didn't tell Kenny he was fucking dangerous, and what happened next was awesome. Kenny redeemed himself by offering to give his place at wellington up, which made me reconsider to stay there at all.

Overall, aside from the first no-brainer choice, I fucking loved this episode. it was extremely intense and well made. I cared about the characters, so much so that I was angered by Mikes/Bonnies betrayal, I was pissed at jane and Kenny, I was fucking heartbroken when I left kenny(or when he redeemed himself), and when I finished the game the feeling still followed me around, and that's saying something.

Overall, 4.5/for me.

#36 Edited by Tearhead (2179 posts) -
  • Protected the baby - He's a defenceless baby. Had to do it.
  • Covered Luke on the ice - The ice was clearly too thin to support any more weight. I thought dealing with the walkers first and giving Luke a chance to get out on his own was the best option.
  • Didn't ask to leave with Mike - Dude, fuck Mike and those other two assholes.
  • Didn't shoot Kenny (looked away) - I just couldn't do it. They were both wrong, and shitty people, but I just couldn't make myself shoot Kenny.
  • With A.J. at Wellington - Thought this was the best potential outcome. Kenny finally redeems himself by doing some good and ensuring the children's survival, but Clem also rids herself of a budding psychopath. It also felt good that I ended the episode with someone from the original group, and in Kenny's own fucked up way helped Clem in the end, like his friend Lee would have wanted.
#37 Edited by rusalkagirl (66 posts) -

@octaslash: Yeah, don't get me wrong, I am glad the Kenny death scene exists. I totally get why someone would kill him, I thought about it myself for a while, and they seemed to treat it with enough respect to create a good scene with impact. It is cool that they let people make that big, big choice, even if I did not make it myself.

About Clementine: I just didn't know how tough you could make her, if that makes sense? I chose the *paragon* options in most cases, and never really got to experience how badass she truly could become. I guess I've realized that I meant more in character of the game, than Clem; usually, there is a neutral option in dialogue, so it seemed with that sort of moral choice, there might have been too. I don't know. Those scenes might have just fallen flat for me personally.

#38 Edited by BeachThunder (12094 posts) -

Oh, by the way, I need to share this interesting glitch (yes, I know it's from Episode 4, but I don't want to go and bump that thread):

#39 Edited by I_Stay_Puft (3575 posts) -

After the ending I eventually went ahead and watched all the ending for that series on youtube. It seems like Kenny was actually the good ending between the 3 choices. I think the game tried to convincingly sell you the point that Kenny was crazy as fuck and needed to be put down. He was pretty much the wounded warrior who was in a sense searching for a way out through death. It actually made me tear up after I shot him when he told you that he was "asking for this but he was pretty much scared." It seemed like the most logical choice and I think telltale knew that so that's why they kinda hid the better choices of ending on Kenny cause most people probably wouldn't side with a very controlling unstable guy like Kenny over the big sis type like Jane.

Kenny was the best of the decisions from my view point because at the end he gave Clem the choice of sticking it out with him or staying in Wellington (with himself pushing you to stay in Wellington without him). He cared so much for the children he'd give up his own welfare for them as long as they were in a safe secure place. His short talk about how he would like for them to be children again made me realize the one thing that pushed him on was Clem and AJ. Pretty much in this season Kenny is the Rick of the comics. He does bad things which would make any good man break under the pressure but his be all end all goal is to bring some normalcy to the childrens lives in a very much fucked up world.

I could honestly never see him pull what Jane did and leave a baby in a car just to prove a point or he might of in the first season and I just don't remember XD. I swear after finding out I seriously had questions about Jane as a person. She's like Molly from season one, a self reliant person I'd like to see Clem grow up to be. She's the big sis who has shown prowess as a person who can survive on her own but comes back for Clem anyways. The thing that makes me question her is the depndency factor. While Kenny can seriously give up his own safety for the safety for Clem, could Jane make the same difficult choice? Jane even states that "she can't do this without you" if you tell her "I'm not going anywhere with you" after you find AJ.

If you do make the decision to go with Jane she would probably of given Clem the survival skills needed to survive but from my viewpoint at the risk of losing her compassion for people. While it seems like that's the best way to survive I felt that choosing this would result in Clem lacking empathy for people which felt like was against what Lee stood for.

Still though, the shit Clem and Kenny went through was whole something else. Kenny freakin redeems himself and I really wish I hadn't shot him. My ending was I shot Kenny and said fuck it to Jane, Lone Wolf Cubbing it with AJ on my side. I'm happy with my ending as it showcases that Clem is grown up and has taken what she learned from those she met to forge her own path with AJ.

Seriously though who would leave a baby in a car just to prove a point?

...and fuck Arvo.

#40 Posted by TheAcidSkull (567 posts) -

@i_stay_puft: Yeah, agreed. Kenny was fucked up in a way but in the end he was still a good guy. I played the ending twice; I once saved Kenny and then left him because I thought he was too dangerous(which he was surpassingly cool with), and in the other I stayed with him instead of running off to Wellington because I honestly thought he redeemed himself.

Also, Jane was asking for it. She was basically coaxing an emotionally damaged guy to fight. She could have ended everything at a certain point by SAYING that AJ was still alive, but she didn't.

#41 Posted by AccidentalPancakes (47 posts) -

As good as the scene with Lee was I feel it's telling of how weak the characters this season were. They had to rely on a moment from last season to be the emotional crux of the episode. This episode had some great development though, I wish it were like that throughout the season.

I don't disagree that the characters from this season were weaker than those from season 1, mostly because you don't spend nearly as much time getting to know them. But even if this season did have strong characters, Clem dreaming about Lee just makes sense. After the world 'ended' with the zombie outbreak, with Lee was the only place Clem ever really felt safe. With him is her 'happy place' so to speak. It seems natural to me that after being betrayed and then shot, her mind would retreat back to that moment as a coping mechanism. Then this Lee (be it something that really happened or not) gave her advice on how to proceed forward and its Lee chosen to deliver this point because he is the only person that Clem has implicitly trusted since the beginning.

#42 Edited by LackingSaint (1833 posts) -

Fantastic episode. I shot Kenny and started a new community with Jane in Carver's old place. There was something so beautiful about having a main father-figure die by Clementine's hand at the end of both seasons, for completely different reasons, and it was also nice to put a stop to a character who was clearly going on Carver's direction after being warned about it so much. I haven't thought much of Season 2, especially compared to Season 1, but man was this a redeeming episode. Overall;

S1E3 > S2E5 > S1E5 > S2E2 > S1E2 > S1E4 > S2E3 > S1E1 > S2E1 > S2E4 > (400 Days)

So wait, 400 Days had ZERO impact on ANYTHING in Season 2?

#43 Edited by OneManX (1693 posts) -

@dan_citi said:
Mark-ass Bitch of the Year 2014

Seriously fuck this guy. I stuck up for him every chance I got and he still fucked me in the ass and shot me. If I could I would have smacked the fuck out of this guy and put him in is place after leaving him in the dirt. Seriously. Just dirt.

Anyway, I protected the baby because why wouldn't you? When it came down to it I tried to save Luke and almost froze to death...I guess it was worth it? Why was the dude hanging onto his rifle the whole time?? I did not ask to leave with Mike, I'm pretty sure jolly ol' Arvo would have done the same no matter what, seeing as how the situation seems to have little wiggle room. I looked away (and did not shoot Kenny)...I wanted to like Jane really bad. She was cute, cool, and interesting but kind of erratic...Kenny is broken as hell but I understand how his head works at least. Did she really stash the baby or what?? That was confusing. Then went into Wellington with Alvin Jr. which was tough as fuck, though I just imagined Kenny setting up camp close by anyway. I thought it was best, and leaves me wondering how they will approach the next season. An adult Clem and teenaged Alvin would be pretty cool.

#FuckArvo

Saved the Baby, I know the Russians weren't gonna shoot him, but I didn't want to chance it.

Cover Luke, no point in both of us going down. and FUCK BONNIE.. I tried, what the fuck were you doing? Fucking drowning, like a bustah..

Didn't ask to leave with Mike: If you're gonna leave, man up and say something, not try to sneak out and take our supplies... Fuck. Arvo

Shot Kenny: Since Episode 2, everyone has been like, 'He's too far gone', andI tried, TRIED to pull him back, but I couldn't. Kenny had to be dealt with.

I forgave Jane, so now I'm with her and the family. What Jane did was fucked... but she's still a valuable asset.

Overall bravo, I opted togo Wolf Among Us over Season 2 and I marathoned Episodes 1-4, but I really like what they are doing, the world is fucked and youare just trying to put some kind of hope in the World.

One thing that got me interested, can you end up Alone, like no baby?

#44 Posted by TheAcidSkull (567 posts) -

I'm surprised at how many people killed Kenny. I just couldn't do it.

#45 Edited by I_Stay_Puft (3575 posts) -

Speaking to how season 3 goes I'd assume no matter what choice you make you'd probably end up in Wellington somehow and Kenny / Jane would get killed along the way. Wellington just seems like a more important place than going back to Carver's old stomping grounds and setting shop there. Also I'd assume there would be too much divergence of players picking Kenny or Jane that they'd probably just go back to square one when season 3 starts. Very interesting alternative endings in this season, way bigger pay off than season 1 where there really wasn't much of a choice.

#46 Posted by TheAcidSkull (567 posts) -

Speaking to how season 3 goes I'd assume no matter what choice you make you'd probably end up in Wellington somehow and Kenny / Jane would get killed along the way. Wellington just seems like a more important place than going back to Carver's old stomping grounds and setting shop there. Also I'd assume there would be too much divergence of players picking Kenny or Jane that they'd probably just go back to square one when season 3 starts. Very interesting alternative endings in this season, way bigger pay off than season 1 where there really wasn't much of a choice.

That would suck, because it would totally devalue the impact of the last episode of season two. I hated the fact that Omid and Christa had to die in the very fist minute of the second season.

#47 Posted by mmslayer (17 posts) -

I did things a little different around Kenny / Jane. Jane said to trust her, so I had a feeling the baby was ok. Both these guys were seemed unstable, so I spent the following conversations trying to talk them both down. I looked away, hoping enough of Kenny was still there not to kill Jane. I was so angry when he did it anyway, I put him down like the rabid dog he had be come. I am fine with my decisions here, because Kenny had reverted to early Season 1 Kenny - bullying, disagreeing with everyone, no compromise. Jane is also an irredeemable nutbag - she left a frickin baby in a car with the window down and no heat in sub-zero weather, in the middle of a herd of zombies, just to prove a point. Screw both those guys, me and Jr are going it alone.

PS - Would anyone else love to see Molly from Season 1 return?

#48 Edited by MachoFantastico (4790 posts) -

Screw those that hate on Telltale's The Walking Dead, I effing love this game and I'm sure it'll be on my list of games of 2014. Phew! what an episode, one I thought they did a great job wrapping up actually especially concentrating on Kenny's mental well-being and the baby. I have played Clem with a very distinct mindset and I'm happy the game allowed me to do that. Killing Kenny though hurt like hell, he's such a great character but even I at to put him out of his misery and it felt like the final cutting of connection with the old group (and Lee) which was strangely sad in a way. Oh and also screw the hell out of Jane after using the baby to upset an already unbalanced Kenny, I left her with AJ in my arms and walked away without her. It's me an AJ facing the world now, you can only trust yourself.

Overall I'm sad it's over but delighted we're getting a third season.

Clementine becoming a mentor character for AJ , aka what Lee was for Clem in Season Three, calling it here.

#49 Posted by BeachThunder (12094 posts) -
#50 Posted by StarvingGamer (8379 posts) -

The endings sound pretty drastically different so maybe I'll go back and watch them, but I ended up shooting Kenny and forgiving Jane. Kenny was out of control for most of the season and I was sick of sticking up for him/putting up with his bullshit. Jane did a fucked up, manipulative thing, but she was right and after episode 4 I felt like she had developed a real sisterly bond with Clem. She was being overprotective in a real stupid way, but it was such a specific situation and she was always the smartest/most level-headed person in the group otherwise. Also I turned away the family at the end because even though it felt wrong to me, it also felt right for the place Clem was at.

Lee cameo was great. Fuck stupid Luke even if I tried to save him. Fuck Mike and Bonnie. Also, thinking back on Arvo shooting Clem, wasn't Clem the one that put the final bullet in his sister? Not saying I don't hate the guy, but I can kinda get where he's coming from. Kenny still shouldn't have punched him all those times.

So wait, 400 Days had ZERO impact on ANYTHING in Season 2?

It determines which cameos you get when you first get to Carver's place?

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