This game doesn't turn into utter garbage like the last two games. From the looks of it, it appears to be modern Assassins Creed with a depth well suited for 8-10 year-olds... Anyone else concerned with the direction this once great franchise has taken (and the casualization of games in general)?

I feel bad for the Splinter Cell team. There are so many divergent opinions on what the games should be at this point. You and alot of other fans are shitting on it for looking too much like Conviction. Ryan is convinced it is not enough like Conviction.

My opinion is that Double Agent was good, Conviction was great, Chaos Theory was really great, and I like the way this game looks so far.

@TentPole said:

I feel bad for the Splinter Cell team. There are so many divergent opinions on what the games should be at this point. You and alot of other fans are shitting on it for looking too much like Conviction. Ryan is convinced it is not enough like Conviction.

My opinion is that Double Agent was good, Conviction was great, Chaos Theory was really great, and I like the way this game looks so far.

I'm going to disagree and say Conviction was a trashy action game designed for children. Chaos Theory was a masterpiece tho.

I remember playing one of the older games by going in rambo style...didn't work out well. Judging by the trailer, they have the action down, unfortunately splinter cell was at one time a stealth game, one i enjoyed greatly. If it turns out to be a simplified action game, vote with your wallet man.

You know what I want out of Splinter Cell?

I want to sneak around realistic environments and kill dudes, and possibly save the world.

My bar for entry is pretty fucking low at this point.

I didn't mind Conviction or even Double Agent (when it was new). After the bummer story elements in Double Agent, I was very happy to see that it was all essentially retconned in Conviction. If I need the old style of sneaking around, I can just go play Chaos Theory again, the epitome of Splinter Cells.

I really am enjoying my time with Conviction (backlog yo!) and if they tighten up the shooting it will be awesome.

While shooting is not the primary focus in a stealth game, you should not be punished (harshly) for screwing up. If I screw up, I should be able shoot my way back to a safe position, in stead of trying to fumble around only to get shoot and taken too a checkpoint far away. Since modern games prefer Checkpoint saves in stead of manual saves.

@RustledJimmies117 said:

@TentPole said:

I feel bad for the Splinter Cell team. There are so many divergent opinions on what the games should be at this point. You and alot of other fans are shitting on it for looking too much like Conviction. Ryan is convinced it is not enough like Conviction.

My opinion is that Double Agent was good, Conviction was great, Chaos Theory was really great, and I like the way this game looks so far.

I'm going to disagree and say Conviction was a trashy action game designed for children. Chaos Theory was a masterpiece tho.

• If you want to argue that it does not have the elements of a traditional Splinter Cell game, then I would agree with you.
• If you want to argue that it is not a "real" Splinter Cell game, then I could at least understand where you are coming from.
• If you want to argue that taken on it's own merits it is shallow experience, then I would respectfully disagree.
• If you want to throw a hissy fit insulting people for liking a game that you don't, then I would call you juvenile brat who can fuck right off.

In conclusion: Fuck off.

@TentPole said:

In conclusion: Fuck off.

A volatile overreaction to the clashing of two subjective viewpoints?

This is gonna get good.

@allworkandlowpay: I had no problem with his view until he decided to declare those who like the game children.

@TentPole said:

@allworkandlowpay: I had no problem with his view until he decided to declare those who like the game children.

Except for the part where he didn't.

He said that the game was designed, in his opinion, with children in mind. As in the "Bam bam you're dead" 12 year old Call of Duty demographic, I'm going to surmise

I like Conviction a lot. Then again, I haven't played the other Splinter Cell games.

@allworkandlowpay:

@RustledJimmies117 said:

I'm going to disagree and say Conviction was a trashy action game designed for children.

What the fuck does that mean then. Please explain it for me.

It always goes back to Chaos Theory. Always. No love for anything else.

@TentPole said:

@allworkandlowpay:

@RustledJimmies117 said:

I'm going to disagree and say Conviction was a trashy action game designed for children.

What the fuck does that mean then. Please explain it for me.

It means what it says. He felt it was designed FOR children.

There's a leap between a person labeling what he felt was a targeted demographic (which in his first post was " 8-10 year-olds") and labeling all those who played it children by dint of said demographic. It's completely different.

@allworkandlowpay said:

@TentPole said:

@allworkandlowpay:

@RustledJimmies117 said:

I'm going to disagree and say Conviction was a trashy action game designed for children.

What the fuck does that mean then. Please explain it for me.

It means what it says. He felt it was designed FOR children.

There's a leap between a person labeling what he felt was a targeted demographic (which in his first post was " 8-10 year-olds") and labeling all those who played it children by dint of said demographic. It's completely different.

He did not mean designed for children in a Lego or Skylanders sense because it is quite apparent that it wasn't with the ridiculously forced swearing and violence. It very clearly was not aimed at 8-10 year old demographic. Don't be fucking stupid.

He means in the sense that it was designed for those with the mental capacity of a child and you fucking know it.

@TentPole: It certainly wasn't aimed for an 8-10 year old crowd. But it definitely was aimed at a more action-oriented palette. The Call of Duty player, for example, fell exactly into Conviction's demographic. When you look at the COD demo, you are looking at a higher percentage of 14-16 year old gamers for certain. I'm assuming that is what he was insinuating, albeit with a heavy bit of hyperbole on his part.

@Ne0teric: No. You would simply be outside of the targeted demographic.

@allworkandlowpay said:

@TentPole: It certainly wasn't aimed for an 8-10 year old crowd. But it definitely was aimed at a more action-oriented palette. The Call of Duty player, for example, fell exactly into Conviction's demographic. When you look at the COD demo, you are looking at a higher percentage of 14-16 year old gamers for certain. I'm assuming that is what he was insinuating, albeit with a heavy bit of hyperbole on his part.

I would definitely agree with this. And notice how you are able to articulate your feelings without insulting anybody.

Edit: I agree with the exception of the last sentence.

@Ne0teric: Yes sir.

Over the Ubisoft forums, the devs are promising almost all the gadgets and stealth elements from Chaos Theory will be back in some form. While I was mildly disappointed with Conviction's direction, I really liked the smoothness and the sense of movement and traversal it had. Combined that with Chaos Theory and a more open-ended level design then we'll probably get a really great Splinter Cell game. I sure hope so...

Blacklist tries to please everyone, and instead has just made it so those who loved conviction (Me, it was amazing) and those who didn't (you) are not excited for the new game.

I think that Chaos Theory is AMAZING, I thought Conviction was great. What I want out of a game, ANY GAME, is the most important element. Fun.

Game HAVE TO evolve. If you don't believe that look at Call of Duty.

@RustledJimmies117: We're looking for play testers if you want to make sure the game isn't turning to garbage.

http://playtest.ubisoft.ca/index_en.htm

:)

@RustledJimmies117 said:

@TentPole said:

I feel bad for the Splinter Cell team. There are so many divergent opinions on what the games should be at this point. You and alot of other fans are shitting on it for looking too much like Conviction. Ryan is convinced it is not enough like Conviction.

My opinion is that Double Agent was good, Conviction was great, Chaos Theory was really great, and I like the way this game looks so far.

I'm going to disagree and say Conviction was a trashy action game designed for children. Chaos Theory was a masterpiece tho.

I'm just curious what you mean when you say it is designed for children. Like the violence isn't so bad or something?

Stealth games cannot survive on trial and error in this ever-evolving skinner box we call gaming. The only way that stealth games were going to reinvent themselves and survive this console generation was by shifting the focus from being prey (early 00's stealth games) to predator (current stealth games).

While Batman: Arkham Asylum is often heralded as the game that brought this shift to bear, it was actually the much-lauded (and fucking awesome) Chaos Theory that planted the seed for what Splinter Cell became. They realized in 2005 that stealth games as a trial and error simulator weren't much fun anymore. They then found a way around that by removing mission-ending alarms and providing Sam Fisher with a fucking arsenal to take on every level. You could totally play Chaos Theory as a shooter, if you wanted to. That's something people around here seem to forget.

Splinter Cell: Conviction only expanded upon Chaos Theory's seed. With the Mark and Execute system and expanded/more well-rounded stealth mechanics, you could (and I have) ghost through the entire game without being spotted once. It requires the same level of patience as the older games did, but it can be done. The only difference between Chaos Theory and Conviction is in how mobile Sam Fisher is. It used to take somewhere around three clicks of an A button to open a door in Chaos Theory, while in Conviction, it only takes one. It used to take cycling through inventory and gadget screens to prepare for your current objective/level, and in Conviction you're equipped to deal with any situation from the get-go. I fail to see the major difference between the two games.

As for Blacklist, the demo we saw was a further evolution of what Splinter Cell: Conviction promised. Possibly now fully realizing the promises in Chaos Theory and Conviction. What we saw was someone running through a level with big fat red markers telling the player that they were detected, that they should probably go hide, and that they should probably not fuck up like that in the future. Of course people want to ignore the stealth mechanics present in the demo and focus on a dude playing the game (on fucking GOD MODE no less) in the most "exciting" way to a broad audience. Rest assured that if you want all the sneaky-sneak Splinter Cell offers, it will be there. That said, there's nothing wrong with giving the player variety.

@Oldirtybearon: Take my +1's, ALL OF THEM !

I do get why seasoned SC fans may be disheartened by that demo. But as someone who never liked the original and it's expansion (despite finishing them, as was the case back then), I do feel excited for the premise that SCC's systems will be further iterated upon.

Now, if we get predator stylings in Thief 4, then I'll happily enjoy the nearest pitchfork gang.

I'm kind of neutral on it. Doesn't look particularly shitty, but it doesn't look spectacular or anything either.

@RustledJimmies117: If your thread doesn't get locked like mine did, I'm going to be souuuurrrrr.

The mod's reason was essentially," HEY! You can't have a negative outlook on what's shown of a game until you've played it."

No logic, no warning, and fucking apparently no consistency. Keep it up mods, you're really doing a cracker jack job.

@Packie said:

Over the Ubisoft forums, the devs are promising almost all the gadgets and stealth elements from Chaos Theory will be back in some form. While I was mildly disappointed with Conviction's direction, I really liked the smoothness and the sense of movement and traversal it had. Combined that with Chaos Theory and a more open-ended level design then we'll probably get a really great Splinter Cell game. I sure hope so...

I agree with this guy.

Just wait until the damn game comes out guys. Sure, Conviction was more action oriented, but there were a lot of improvements in it as well. This happened with the Hitman game and I guess every other sequel that hasn't been released. Give a rest.

I never played a Splinter Cell game, and from my experience so far I'm not that good at stealth. I don't like to avoid enemies, it makes me nervous if they're still around. So sneaking up at them and kill them is my favourite playstyle. I'm punching everyone unconscious in DE:HR :D

However, from what I've seen so far from Blacklist does look a lot like a modern Assassins Creed. If that's the case, I'm gonna love this game. A lot. Plus, revised and updated Sam Fisher? HOT.