GDC 2013: After Hours Livestream Spectacular - Part 02

It's more about the cultural aspect, the dynamic that women are 'expected' to fill these sorts of roles. This, of course, can vary greatly from company to company, or from country to country.

You're right; it's easy for this argument to get pigeonholed to specific examples of sexism, and this is when the conversation begins to miss the point. I think that's why this topic is so touchy, not just in games but all of society. It's important to keep a broad and complex view of the problem, because even though acts of sexism are of specific individuals, it's cultural standards that validate and continue such behavior which is the responsibility of EVERYBODY.

Quoted for truth! If anyone denies that stuff like Bioshock, or Dead Space 2, or even Saints Row 3 in its own way is a work of art, they're being exclusive and dickish. Then again, I have a really broad definition of art (The Room is one of my favorite movies, and it is a masterpiece of cinema in a really dumb way), but that's the problem anyway. You said it better than I could.

I thought the Paul Barnett story couldn't have been topped, but it was topped in the same stream with Ryan's sitting in a cake story.

Man, what an amazing stream. The Ocean Loader thing, the vomit story and then the cake bit, and all the golden little moments between... God, I love this website.

The Mojang debacle was outed as horseshit. Women are still ganged up on on-line and in the workforce. The status quo is unchanged.

That socially retarded mouth diarrhea of his did have one benefit, it was a bottoming-out of the blind willfully-ignorant dismissive slant against anything out of Japan, and also shown a light on the practice of talking up ones game by throwing competition under a bus with hyperbole and insinuated insults. Many gamers, being willfully ignorant, take it as gospel.

No that's a strangely reductive (given the actual brevity of the inflammatory statement) and sanitized description. He was asked by a Japanese dev what he thought of modern Japanese games, and he said "your games just suck." A rather personal and shitty way to address a stranger in a public setting just as a start.

people were just straight up happy to actually have some ladies speak up and show its not all doom and gloom as a women in the gaming industry, obviously its not the overall rule as there are others that have bad experiences,

but it was just straight up good to hear some nice down to earth ladies talk about the subject and talk about their positive experiences in the industry and just show that it isnt as bad as the media makes it out to be.

as someone that has avoided all sexism talk and doesnt care at all to listen to the subject, i will say, if "sexism" had a spokeswomen like carrie or stephanie rather than anita or patrick (say what you will and call me a bad person, but i just really dont like that girl, she doesnt seem like a likeable person at all.) i would be more inclined to fully listen. and judging by how much people felt some comfirmation bias in the chat by listening to carrie and stephanie, id imagine more would as well.

Actually no, that wouldn't bother me. As long as the music is good, your thoughts on brands of guitars don't really enter into anything for me. People change their minds about things all the time. If you realized that that brand of guitar was actually perfect for a song you were working on, it would make your music less "real" if you avoided using it just because of something you said off the cuff in an interview a year or two before.

I generally agree with realism being overrated. That said, if I could fly in through a real city, in an immersive way, that game would have my money, Superman theme optional.

While its true it was rude, I don't think thats why people got so angry. I mean, would there have been the same reaction if he was just rude to the guy and not said he disliked recent Japanese games? I doubt it. I think the main reason people reacted that way was because he said that something they really like "sucked." I can't help but feel people were just using the rudeness to try to justify how angry they were. Same with the racism accusations

As irrational as it is, people can feel personally offended by criticism of things things they like. Myself included.

PAUL BARNETT OH HOT DAMN YES LIFE IS OKAY

Wait, so people are actually mad at Phil Fish for not liking PCs or the state of the Japanese game industry (which is awful by the way) or some dumb shit?

I assumed that reaction was all a joke, because who the fuck could care about insignificant bullshit that much?

Grow the fuck up, internet.

Phil Fish is awesome, and if you genuinely think that spreadsheet comment makes him less credible you're an iiiiidiot.

Also he did respond to that comment, multiple times, so you're wrong. Actually.

Obviously the rudeness wasn't the whole of the outrage, hence why I said it was just the start or in analgous terms, the spark. And you're preaching to the choir. I said as much to someone else on another GB thread in regards to the constant loggerheads of internet haters vs [insert noun] defense leagues. People would rather be found right than factually correct, and denigrating a person's cherished thing calls into question that person's intelligence, taste, and frankly upbringing, hence their own vociferous defense of the thing in question. This would be the fuel. The internet being the internet, would be the bellows shoving oxygen into this.

All that said, it was still WAY effing rude, and for me more than enough to earn whatever ire, however misdirected (ie the calls of racism) at Fish.

I feel like people don't like what he represents and are looking for points to attack.

Really? To me he came off as someone who hadn't slept in about 4 years and whose life was falling apart around him. It's called stress. People act terribly when they're depressed and under tremendous stress. That doesn't make him an asshole. It was also a snapshot of a person in a very specific moment. How could you possibly know enough about the guy to declare him a "dickhead".

There's more to it than that, but sure okay. You're right.

What does he represent, exactly? He's an indie game designer who made a rad game and said some hyperbolic nonsense a few times. It's totally OK to read the dumb bullshit people (Phil Fish) say and respond with "Wow, that's pretty dumb". It's not normal to read the same sentence and decide "Wow, that guy's the devil. I fucking hate him". You know who reacts like that? Children. Adults are supposed to have some kind of emotional barometer whose needle doesn't only fluctuate between "adore" and "despise".

Q: "Oh, boo hoo Phil Fish said he doesn't like PCs one time, what the fuck are we going to do, internet?!?!"

A: "Let's hate him forever and vent our rage across the internet for years and years!"

Q: "Great idea! I have all of the emotional stability of a 6 year old! LOL!"

Phill Fish seemed a lot nicer/cooler than the internet portrays him. Or maybe it was because of the liqs....

I did not know that was what C418 looked like.

Here's what he said:

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-03-07-fez-creator-phil-fish-declares-modern-japanese-games-just-suck

I'll say it again. Fuck him. Get back to me when you've made something worthwhile.

Of course there is a scale, but you don't notice the mid-range. And well, he made a pixelated platformer with 8bit music and deeper meaning behind it and is very expressive about his opinions. People see him as a video game hipster, it's foreign and an easy target. You see it here in the comments too, where even parts of old tweets get singled out to make him look bad. It's crazy.

Phil Fish is a cool dude and I would love to party with him. He has his own opinions and says them in an extremely crude manner that apparently causes the children of the internet to go full blown nerd rage. To me it just seems he is a huge troll and all of you freaking out are falling for it.

Phil Fish is awesome. Anyone who is honest about their opinions is gonna have people hate them, so who gives a fuck about internet hate.

Phil Fish was the best part of that stream. Also: Japanese games are bad.

People hated the (badass) alternate cover for Resistance 3? That was the only good thing about that game!

Right, I agree. I guess my point is that I am the mid-range! I don't know Phil Fish at all. I've seen about 45 minutes of his life in a movie and read some quotable bullshit he said. I don't like him or hate him. I don't care! I don't understand why people care so much about things that literally don't matter at all.

What you're basically saying is that people see him as an "other" and hate him accordingly. So essentially we have a bunch of video game nerds (and I say that with pride, btw) bullying someone because he's "weird". Will the stupefying irony ever cease?

This was a great Livestream. Thanks!

People who think people are only nice to women because of "white knighting" are the worst, most hideous, misogynistic, disgusting pricks in the world. Because that means that YOU are only nice to women because you want them to fuck you. Sick sad pathetic little boy.

So he was rude and now you hate him? Have you never been rude to anyone, ever? If so, you're a better person than just about everyone else on this planet. Congratulations.

Also Fez was universally regarded as one of the best games of last year. The fact that you don't agree is totally fine, because you're entitled to your own opinion. But he has made something worthwhile in the eyes of many, many people, including the creators and staffers of the site you're commenting on!

the music talk with the composer guys was SUPER interesting. really glad they did it

People get offended too easily

this

Jeff and Carrie need to hurry up and just get married already.

That and during a PAX pannel a few years ago (or last year? Can't remember) I kept thinking it was just my imagination, but now that some other people are pointing out yeah I see it.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought that.

Yeah pretty much.

This is the point we were at a year ago: people being dicks to defend a person accused being a dick. Because the former are dicks, they feel this is effective at defending charges of dickishness in others.

The best part comes when they start to defend THEIR OWN dickishness.

I completely agree. I never found booth babes to be personally offensive at all when it came to their presence at E3. I've gotten used to marketing types trying to market to their target market, which is (or atleast was) 15-year old boys filled with unchecked sexual desire... and the models are obviously there become marketing paid them to be, it's their job just like any other. The thing is, at E3 it's easy for me to ignore, but I could see why others could get upset about it.
For me, it's basically the equivalent of a model on a motorcycle at a consumer trade show for bikes. Any actual motorcycle enthusiast isn't there for the chick on the motorcycle, so I'm sure it's easy for them to ignore.

However, when it comes to something like GDC it just comes off as super tasteless and out of place, because you're basically calling every professional in the games industry sexually frustrated little boys who just want to see some tits.

Great podcast all-around. Seriously, there was some good discussion in here (the video; not the comments).

I love that Paul Barnett sits crosslegged.

What he said.

This is maybe not the video I should have watched just before attending a birthday party... I wonder if there will be cake... >.>

THIS, OH MY GOD, THIS.

Okay so now I love Phil Fish, maybe he has come off wrong before to people but he is the kind of person I want to hang out with.

Is no one else desperate to buy a pair of the jeans with track stripes that Paul Barnett is wearing?! Where the hell do those come from??

I wish there was a like feature so I could like this post. I'll settle for quoting. Bang on.