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PAX East 2013: Giant Bomb Panel - Part 02

Our "experts" get to answering some Qs regarding divekicks, cannolis, and getting into the James industry.

Mar. 26 2013

Posted by: Drew

284 Comments

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Xeirus

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@legion_ said:

@scarycrayons said:

@legion_ said:

@xeirus said:

@leebmx said:

@legion_ said:

@xeirus: I just don't agree. If they're girls, call them girls. If they're women, call them women. Female just sounds weird.

I suppose the word girlfriend is disrespectful then? Is womanfriend or femalefriend the proper term?

I suppose the point is that you wouldn't say 'look at that male over there,' so why say female? It has always struck me as a term you can apply to all animals rather than just humans. From there it follows that it says something about societies idea of the status of women that they are prepared to use a general animal term to describe women but won't use the equlivalent term for men.

Its not a huge deal but it is just another example of how language was developed by men with their concepts and priorities in mind.

You're taking the word out of context from what i actually said. If I had said "look at that female in the video" then I might agree it sounded weird. But just using the word itself is not as strange as you people make it out to be.

Also, how in the hell is the word "female" an example of mens priorities? That's the most bizarre thing I've ever heard. By that logic "male" is inappropriate too?

I just think it's weird.

I know this doesn't count for much, but given that I'm female, I can confidently say that it's not weird at all to hear or say "This game stars a female character," or "The male protagonist has this kind of attitude (as opposed to the female protagonist)," or "The female fanbase" or whatever.

It is, however, kinda weird seeing men have hangups over it. C'mon now, there's nothing wrong with referring to female gamers as female gamers. They are, after all, female gamers.

Maybe it's just me. I do certainly find a difference between a sentence like "The male/female protagonist", and a sentence like "The girl with a question". It just sounds so detatched and weird to say "The female with a question". It sounds like someone is studying us. Just saying.

But I didn't say "The female with a question", that's my point, and it's why I'm curious what all the fuss from these other dudes.

I said, " First female I've seen to ask a question on one of these and IMO she had the best one, good job ma'am!"

I see nothing weird about that sentence at all...

Edit: Well RPS seems to have great timing, here's a post from today without any use of the word girl, SHOCKING, SEXIST, DETACHED!

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Edited By ucankurbaga

I wish Alex would stop trying hard.

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Edited By cb1115

Wow, the tone of the whole damn panel changed after that last question.

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Edited By antfoolish

I've got to be honest; I hadn't fully accepted Patrick as one of the crew until seeing this panel. Well done, Patrick. Some very well thought out, insightful answers.

Also, Alex really needs to tone it down some. His constant grabbing and shouting into the mic was really obnoxious. He even cut Jeff off at least once. Learn some restraint, bro.

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@zevvion said:

@meaninoflife42 said:

I'm playing Mass Effect 3 the way Brad went through it right now, with all the single player DLC, because I want to know and understand his mindset on that game.

I really think people disliked that ending more than anything because it wasn't clear what was going on. Leviathan cleared that up. I really enjoyed it, but some people, like the dude in this Q&A session, just won't rest until everyone hates the game as much as they do because they didn't understand what was going on.

I can see how you'd arrive to that conclusion, but the shit storm behind Mass Effect 3's ending was the flash point of many feelings and fears surrounding Bioware after Dragon Age 2. A major reason why the ending received so much negativity was because the previous 90+ hours of the trilogy were one thing, and in the last ten minutes the game said what the fuck ever and tried to be Deus Ex.

Mass Effect was never high concept or philosophically minded (not to say Deus Ex in particular is, but it tried to be that from the start). It was a character driven romp across the galaxy that inspired awe and wonder at the different alien species and worlds we went to. There's this strange sense of optimism that runs through the series (mostly perpetuated by Commander Shepard) that's like, no matter how bad this gets we'll find a way through it.

Then the ending happens and it's oh, right, there is no way through it. You're going to lose all of your friends, some of your friends, or horrifically rewrite the biology of everything alive because you're totally justified in making that decision for everyone. Oh and in two of the three endings you die for some baseless sense of martyrdom because everything you love about the Mass Effect universe being on the brink of destruction wasn't nail-biting enough for the climax.

The lack of "clarity" (people usually just call them "plot holes") didn't help matters, either, as the endings all finished with the Relay Network getting blown up. Without relays, you can't travel to half the systems where your fleets came from, which meant they'd be stuck in the Sol system and die from starvation or petty wars over the few resources left. The lack of clarity isn't what bugged me, it was all the (fucking terrible) implications it made about the universe after I leave it.

After that I was pretty depressed because I had spent the previous five years loving this series. I'm a fan of Mass Effect in the way I used to laugh at people who loved Star Wars or Star Trek. It wasn't "just a game" for a lot of us, and the ending was a stab in the fucking heart from something we loved very much.

So yeah, I get where you're coming from, and I get where that guy was coming from as well. I've replayed the trilogy with all DLC from all games (ugh Pinnacle Station blows), and with all the DLC installed for ME3 (especially Citadel) the final game time for ME3 was 47h 56m and it was, in my estimation, the most satisfying conclusion I could've had for the trilogy. It's a shame I got the complete and proper experience a year later, and not on March 5th as I'm sure it would've been Game of All Years in that context. I guess what I'm trying to say with this paragraph is that for me the wound has healed and I've shaken off my initial depression about the ending, but part of me will always resent the fact that I had to experience that bullshit to start with.

Hope this long-winded bullshit widened your perspective on the matter.

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@antfoolish said:

I've got to be honest; I hadn't fully accepted Patrick as one of the crew until seeing this panel. Well done, Patrick. Some very well thought out, insightful answers.

Also, Alex really needs to tone it down some. His constant grabbing and shouting into the mic was really obnoxious. He even cut Jeff off at least once. Learn some restraint, bro.

I feel like we've discovered what it takes to make Patrick seem more endearing to the community; just pair him up with Alex all the time.

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@xeirus said:

@legion_ said:

@scarycrayons said:

@legion_ said:

@xeirus said:

@leebmx said:

@legion_ said:

@xeirus: I just don't agree. If they're girls, call them girls. If they're women, call them women. Female just sounds weird.

I suppose the word girlfriend is disrespectful then? Is womanfriend or femalefriend the proper term?

I suppose the point is that you wouldn't say 'look at that male over there,' so why say female? It has always struck me as a term you can apply to all animals rather than just humans. From there it follows that it says something about societies idea of the status of women that they are prepared to use a general animal term to describe women but won't use the equlivalent term for men.

Its not a huge deal but it is just another example of how language was developed by men with their concepts and priorities in mind.

You're taking the word out of context from what i actually said. If I had said "look at that female in the video" then I might agree it sounded weird. But just using the word itself is not as strange as you people make it out to be.

Also, how in the hell is the word "female" an example of mens priorities? That's the most bizarre thing I've ever heard. By that logic "male" is inappropriate too?

I just think it's weird.

I know this doesn't count for much, but given that I'm female, I can confidently say that it's not weird at all to hear or say "This game stars a female character," or "The male protagonist has this kind of attitude (as opposed to the female protagonist)," or "The female fanbase" or whatever.

It is, however, kinda weird seeing men have hangups over it. C'mon now, there's nothing wrong with referring to female gamers as female gamers. They are, after all, female gamers.

Maybe it's just me. I do certainly find a difference between a sentence like "The male/female protagonist", and a sentence like "The girl with a question". It just sounds so detatched and weird to say "The female with a question". It sounds like someone is studying us. Just saying.

But I didn't say "The female with a question", that's my point, and it's why I'm curious what all the fuss from these other dudes.

I said, " First female I've seen to ask a question on one of these and IMO she had the best one, good job ma'am!"

I see nothing weird about that sentence at all...

Edit: Well RPS seems to have great timing, here's a post from today without any use of the word girl, SHOCKING, SEXIST, DETACHED!

Weeell, I find that weird. Really weird.

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@legion_: ...maybe you're the weird one?

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"Yeah, I have a question: What do you think Brad's Game of the Year should have been?"

UGH. CARAVELLA. HOW ARE YOU ALWAYS THE BEST?

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I don't comment a whole lot on the site, but I have to say, the majority of the questions were abysmal.

I assume most of the people asking questions are dedicated GiantBomb fans, right? I'm sure they visit the site at least once a day, have watched more than one livestream and yadda yadda. So, how is it that most of these questions were so dry and seemingly unprepared?

There were a couple good ones, like the girl at the very end started a really good discussion, but wow guys, c'mon we can do better than that.

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This Q&A was fucking hilarious.

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Everyone is so awkward when asking questions. Think of a question before speaking.

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@xeirus said:

@legion_: ...maybe you're the weird one?

Maybe. Maybe not. Maybe fuck yourself. Don't worry, I just had to say that. You set me up so good for the Dignam comeback in The Departed.

But seriously, no, I don't think so. Saying female in that context is weird.

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@legion_ said:

@xeirus said:

@legion_: ...maybe you're the weird one?

Maybe. Maybe not. Maybe fuck yourself. Don't worry, I just had to say that. You set me up so good for the Dignam comeback in The Departed.

But seriously, no, I don't think so. Saying female in that context is weird.

Nope, I was right, you're weird. CASE CLOSED PEOPLE.

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Like it or not, what comes out of Patrick's mouth screams passion. He is who he is, he's working on his weak spots, and will come back better as times goes on.

This is exactly why I love Patrick.

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Fuck eSports.

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@xeirus said:

@legion_ said:

@xeirus said:

@legion_: ...maybe you're the weird one?

Maybe. Maybe not. Maybe fuck yourself. Don't worry, I just had to say that. You set me up so good for the Dignam comeback in The Departed.

But seriously, no, I don't think so. Saying female in that context is weird.

Nope, I was right, you're weird. CASE CLOSED PEOPLE.

I'm breaking this case wide open.

It's still weird.

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Oh god, Jeff just made a reference to MASE's 24 Hrs. to Live. I can't...

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Oh, live questions. Here comes the cringe.

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@legion_ said:

@xeirus said:

@legion_ said:

@xeirus said:

@legion_: ...maybe you're the weird one?

Maybe. Maybe not. Maybe fuck yourself. Don't worry, I just had to say that. You set me up so good for the Dignam comeback in The Departed.

But seriously, no, I don't think so. Saying female in that context is weird.

Nope, I was right, you're weird. CASE CLOSED PEOPLE.

I'm breaking this case wide open.

It's still weird.

Nah bro, case closed.

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Great panel, but came to a grinding halt during Q&A as usual.

Someone says something. Alex gives snarky, insincere response.

Someone asks something for the group. Alex answers for group snarkily and insincerely ("Does this keep you up at night?").

Does his sense of humor only have one gear?

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@xeirus said:

@legion_ said:

@xeirus said:

@legion_ said:

@xeirus said:

@legion_: ...maybe you're the weird one?

Maybe. Maybe not. Maybe fuck yourself. Don't worry, I just had to say that. You set me up so good for the Dignam comeback in The Departed.

But seriously, no, I don't think so. Saying female in that context is weird.

Nope, I was right, you're weird. CASE CLOSED PEOPLE.

I'm breaking this case wide open.

It's still weird.

Nah bro, case closed.

Hey "bro". Let's just agree that using the word female in this context is weird. It's like when you get a baby, and the nurse says "It's a beautiful baby female".

Case motherfucking closed.

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God Damn It Alex!

EDIT: Don't get me wrong.. I love Alex.. but... God Damn It Alex!

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Gotta love Vinny putting down the Souls elitists =)

Also Brads tough guy/approval/whatever it is face is really silly.

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My experience in looking for video production work is that I hear people say one needs experience in the field before they can get hired somewhere, which makes some sense, but how does one get experience in the field if no one will let you work due to lack of experience? It's this weird Catch-22.

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Prog Rock is one of my favorite genres.

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You know what, Giant Bomb content makes me feel tingly too. I KNOW I'M NOT ALONE!

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Brad, stop talking so much.

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I wonder how cliché question guy will follow up this panel next year. I seriously wonder if he even watches any of these videos or listens to the podcast.

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@zevvion said:

@meaninoflife42 said:

I'm playing Mass Effect 3 the way Brad went through it right now, with all the single player DLC, because I want to know and understand his mindset on that game.

I really think people disliked that ending more than anything because it wasn't clear what was going on. Leviathan cleared that up. I really enjoyed it, but some people, like the dude in this Q&A session, just won't rest until everyone hates the game as much as they do because they didn't understand what was going on.

I can see how you'd arrive to that conclusion, but the shit storm behind Mass Effect 3's ending was the flash point of many feelings and fears surrounding Bioware after Dragon Age 2. A major reason why the ending received so much negativity was because the previous 90+ hours of the trilogy were one thing, and in the last ten minutes the game said what the fuck ever and tried to be Deus Ex.

Mass Effect was never high concept or philosophically minded (not to say Deus Ex in particular is, but it tried to be that from the start). It was a character driven romp across the galaxy that inspired awe and wonder at the different alien species and worlds we went to. There's this strange sense of optimism that runs through the series (mostly perpetuated by Commander Shepard) that's like, no matter how bad this gets we'll find a way through it.

Then the ending happens and it's oh, right, there is no way through it. You're going to lose all of your friends, some of your friends, or horrifically rewrite the biology of everything alive because you're totally justified in making that decision for everyone. Oh and in two of the three endings you die for some baseless sense of martyrdom because everything you love about the Mass Effect universe being on the brink of destruction wasn't nail-biting enough for the climax.

The lack of "clarity" (people usually just call them "plot holes") didn't help matters, either, as the endings all finished with the Relay Network getting blown up. Without relays, you can't travel to half the systems where your fleets came from, which meant they'd be stuck in the Sol system and die from starvation or petty wars over the few resources left. The lack of clarity isn't what bugged me, it was all the (fucking terrible) implications it made about the universe after I leave it.

After that I was pretty depressed because I had spent the previous five years loving this series. I'm a fan of Mass Effect in the way I used to laugh at people who loved Star Wars or Star Trek. It wasn't "just a game" for a lot of us, and the ending was a stab in the fucking heart from something we loved very much.

So yeah, I get where you're coming from, and I get where that guy was coming from as well. I've replayed the trilogy with all DLC from all games (ugh Pinnacle Station blows), and with all the DLC installed for ME3 (especially Citadel) the final game time for ME3 was 47h 56m and it was, in my estimation, the most satisfying conclusion I could've had for the trilogy. It's a shame I got the complete and proper experience a year later, and not on March 5th as I'm sure it would've been Game of All Years in that context. I guess what I'm trying to say with this paragraph is that for me the wound has healed and I've shaken off my initial depression about the ending, but part of me will always resent the fact that I had to experience that bullshit to start with.

Hope this long-winded bullshit widened your perspective on the matter.

I'm not sure I understand you. You're saying the reason you disliked the ending is pretty much because allot of people die and there are implications to the universe, like the Mass Relays being destroyed. But then when you played the DLC you suddenly really like the ending? I mean, all those implications still exist based on the decision you made. What made you like that ending more then?

Personally, I never thought the Mass Effect series was about that. It was clear to me from the start that allot of people were going to die in an effort to stop the Reapers. The way Shepard behaves is what makes him the guy to stop the Reapers. The optimism you talk about is exactly why he is the one to do it, because he affects the people around him even though the situation is dire. I mean, even in the first game at least one of your squad members died. In the second game it was possible to save them all and most of your crew, but you could also lose all of them.

This was all done fighting one Reaper or one Reaper who controlled Collectors. It was pretty clear to me that if the Reapers would attack in full numbers, shit would go bad. I don't think there ever was a point in the series where it wasn't clear that there were going to be allot of casualties.

By the way, the way the internet uses 'plot holes' is really, really, really dumb. Essentially, if something isn't explained, they see it as a plot hole. In reality a plot hole is when something is impossible in the universe that is created. So people not knowing who the Star Child is, is very clearly not a plot hole as it makes sense in the universe. It just lacked the explanation that Leviathan gave.

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Really enjoyed watching this years PAX Panel. They were awesome.

CBM2013! (Certified! Breast Milk)

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@slashdance: So true. It's one of his best skills. He doesn't even lose his temper at the millionth question about "are games art?" or "How do I break into the biz?"

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@duxa@cale I also felt bad for some, imo, overly harsh reactions to the question askers. I mean, it takes balls to get up their and ask a question. Also, people not being totally concise isn't really that surprising: It's THEIR chance to talk to the guys they love, so they try and put in as much info in the question to convey that and show that they are also 'cool', 'clever', 'funny', etc. Long setups show that they thought a lot about what they want to say.

I always feel alienated from the site when I see those people being put down in a vulnerable moment, people really just expressing how much they appreciate the guys at the front of the panel. I think being concise and, often very emotional, appreciation just conflict with each other, as shown by numerous other panels at diverse conventions.

Whatever, the bomb crew are just people too, but even though I often have to speak professionally, I probably wouldn't ask a question at a bomb panel, unless I really prepared it. Which seems a bit preposterous for a panel that doesn't really have that much prep to it itself.

That said, of course the panel was entertaining, Jeff rapped, Patrick was really cool, Vinny sincere, Drew was thoughtful as ever. In fact, I don't really want to post this comment...

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@zevvion: The DLC included the Extended Cut ending, which retconned and fixed a lot of the gnarly implications over where the universe winds up after you leave/die/whatever. For me it fixed the most glaring problems and yeah, I'm happy about that.

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Edited By Xeirus

@legion_ said:

@xeirus said:

@legion_ said:

@xeirus said:

@legion_ said:

@xeirus said:

@legion_: ...maybe you're the weird one?

Maybe. Maybe not. Maybe fuck yourself. Don't worry, I just had to say that. You set me up so good for the Dignam comeback in The Departed.

But seriously, no, I don't think so. Saying female in that context is weird.

Nope, I was right, you're weird. CASE CLOSED PEOPLE.

I'm breaking this case wide open.

It's still weird.

Nah bro, case closed.

Hey "bro". Let's just agree that using the word female in this context is weird. It's like when you get a baby, and the nurse says "It's a beautiful baby female".

Case motherfucking closed.

Stop taking it out of context and making it sounds different than it was intended or originally stated. It's not "like when" anything, it's a completely different situation, context, and tone. Of course changing all of those it's going to sound different, you don't win the conversation by changing all of the factors.

I won't respond since I feel like we're getting no where, but have a great day ma'am!

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I found Patrick's sincerity in these Q&As really commendable, good stuff.

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So many bad questions with even dumber answers. I can appreciate Patrick giving some actual insight.

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I'M A CAMERA MAN!! :D

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@xeirus said:

@legion_ said:

@xeirus said:

@legion_ said:

@xeirus said:

@legion_ said:

@xeirus said:

@legion_: ...maybe you're the weird one?

Maybe. Maybe not. Maybe fuck yourself. Don't worry, I just had to say that. You set me up so good for the Dignam comeback in The Departed.

But seriously, no, I don't think so. Saying female in that context is weird.

Nope, I was right, you're weird. CASE CLOSED PEOPLE.

I'm breaking this case wide open.

It's still weird.

Nah bro, case closed.

Hey "bro". Let's just agree that using the word female in this context is weird. It's like when you get a baby, and the nurse says "It's a beautiful baby female".

Case motherfucking closed.

Stop taking it out of context and making it sounds different than it was intended or originally stated. It's not "like when" anything, it's a completely different situation, context, and tone. Of course changing all of those it's going to sound different, you don't win the conversation by changing all of the factors.

I won't respond since I feel like we're getting no where, but have a great day ma'am!

It's just as weird as it was in the context you used it. All the examples I've given are exactly in the same vein that you used it. The fact that you constantly have to shoot down the other normal sentences I use, just showes what we already knew:

It's hella weird.

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tourgen

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Ryan and Alex laying into the monkeys with dumb questions and 2 pages of preamble... THE BEST!!!! Oh god so fun to watch

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Hector

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Edited By Hector

I'm definitely not missing out PAX East next year.

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FearMyFlop

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I'm glad I am not alone in feeling bad for some the fans that asked the questions. Aren't we all really the reason Giant Bomb is what it is? Putting down your most die hard fans comes off as really childish and lame. It wasn't as bad as it has been in the past but some of what Alex would say I just know had to cut deep for some of these dudes.

Hell they went out of their way to get the panel, found the courage to stand up in front of all of those people, and face the crew they probably look up to. All that to get bullied on. Good on Patrick and Jeff for really giving a shit.

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JamieOD

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Jeff gave Addidas Power Soccer an 8.5? Good on ya, Jeff.

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Paul_Tillich

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Edited By Paul_Tillich

What is lost amid the criticism that fans sounded bad on mic is the fact that the guys gave great answers. If the question was serious, someone gave real insight, and if the question was meant to be nonsense, people just went off. Even the tired "how do I get a job" questions were treated well.

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ValeYard

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Edited By ValeYard

@fearmyflop: my sentiments too, although @paul_tillich: is also right that good answers were given. I already wrote a longer comment on negative answers in this thread, so won't get into that again.

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captainanarchy

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If we took a sample population of this panel of whether or not Americans know how to use a microphone, the data would show that Americans have never touched a god damned microphone.

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thornie

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Edited By thornie

@eckster said:

Are you guys looking for another fulltime cameraman or editor? I would love to apply and send my resume and/or video reel.

You should follow the job openings at CBSi's website. There were a couple openings a few months ago, but to be honest the pay wasn't that great. Mostly junior level positions. Don't get me wrong, I would take a pay cut to work for GB, but right now I'm a full time DP/Lighting tech and I don't think they are looking for any one like that. GB is a super lean website, and Vinny and Drew pretty much fill every hat. If you are just starting out, best of luck to you!