Am I the only fan of the Virtua Fighter series?

#1 Posted by gordoa (50 posts) -

I seriously don't understand why these games garner a lot hate. The Virtua Fighter games {Except for the first one} are the deepest and balance fighting games of all time, it takes serious skill to play and it's not a n00b friendly button masher. A lot of people bash Virtua Fighter but gushingly praise Tekken, Dead or Alive, and Soul Calibur but in reality VF is far deeper than those games and make them seem like buttons mashers. Don't get me wrong, those games are good {Well, maybe except for DOA} but I don't feel like I'm in control of the frame inputs and they can be played as button mashers, considering Tekken's strategy mostly consists of air juggling which if you ask me is cheap and I don't know how air juggling became popular. Tekken, DOA, and Soul Calibur wouldn't exist if it weren't for VF considering the original game was the first 3D fighting game. There's a reason why this series dominates the arcades in Japan, but it's the most competitive fighting game ever made and it's practically the Counter-Strike of fighting games.
 
But really, am I the only Virtua Fighter fan around here?
#2 Posted by Artemis_D (817 posts) -

The forum for the Virtua Fighter games is probably full of Virtua Fighter fans.
 
But anyway, Virtua Fighter is great.  I like it better than Tekken, personally... but I'm not the biggest Tekken fan, so that's not saying much.  I enjoyed VF a lot more back in the Sega Saturn days, but I can still have fun with it.  Though I will say, I haven't touch VF since Street Fighter IV made it's way into my home.

#3 Posted by Diamond (8634 posts) -

Are the VF games hated?  I like it anyways, but it feels like the series is only losing popularity, despite VF5 being the best home port so far.  Anyways, Tekken is far more popular in Japan's arcades now...

#4 Posted by gordoa (50 posts) -
@Diamond said:
"Are the VF games hated?  I like it anyways, but it feels like the series is only losing popularity, despite VF5 being the best home port so far.  Anyways, Tekken is far more popular in Japan's arcades now... "
My dad's right, the intelligence of the worlds population is decreasing.
#5 Edited by C2C (855 posts) -
@gordoa: I personally haven't seen THAT much hate for the Virtua Fighter series in my region.  More like apathy for it if you ask me.  I hear it is huge in Japan though.
 
The reason for the lack of hype for it is because of how inaccessible it is to many fighting game players.  While the Virtua Fighter series is deep, it has probably the biggest learning curve of any 3D-fighting series out there.  The lack of any really flashy moves also really doesn't help its chances either.
#6 Posted by Bigandtasty (3202 posts) -

I don't know who hates it but it's true that they are not popular; however, since they're built from the ground up to be very technical with no flashiness, of course that's bound to be unpopular and more of a niche game.
 
As for my opinion on it I can see the value in the technical gameplay but I just can't get into it because I find the characters boring.

#7 Posted by gordoa (50 posts) -
@C2C said:
"@gordoa: I personally haven't seen THAT much hate for the Virtua Fighter series in my region.  More like apathy for it if you ask me.  I hear it is huge in Japan though. The reason for the lack of hype for it is because of how inaccessible it is to many fighting game players.  While the Virtua Fighter series is deep, it has probably the biggest learning curve of any 3D-fighting series out there.  The lack of any really flashy moves also really doesn't help its chances either. "
That's what makes Virtua Fighter  great, it focuses on core gameplay instead of flash and styel. Virtua Fighter is the epitome of substance over style. It's an accessible game if you use the right characters for beginners, they even show that in the character selection screen. Plus, there's only three buttons you can use, can anyone seriously find that complicated.
#8 Posted by gordoa (50 posts) -
@Bigandtasty said:
"I don't know who hates it but it's true that they are not popular; however, since they're built from the ground up to be very technical with no flashiness, of course that's bound to be unpopular and more of a niche game.  As for my opinion on it I can see the value in the technical gameplay but I just can't get into it because I find the characters boring. "
The characters aren't really supposed to be "cool" and "stylish" looking, they're just realistic portrayals of the fighting styles they use. The characters actually have deep fighting gameplay mechanics, unlike say DOA or probably Tekken. 
 
Tekken is good, but Virtua Fighter is f@*#ing hardcore!
#9 Posted by Bigandtasty (3202 posts) -
@gordoa: I realize that but I just don't find any of them fun, and obviously it's hard to get into a fighting game without any character that screams "I'm your kind of guy/girl". It's just personal preference.
 
To be fair I feel the same way about the other 3d fighters so maybe it's a genre-related personal preference as well.
#10 Posted by C2C (855 posts) -
@gordoa said:
" That's what makes Virtua Fighter  great, it focuses on core gameplay instead of flash and styel. Virtua Fighter is the epitome of substance over style. It's an accessible game if you use the right characters for beginners, they even show that in the character selection screen. Plus, there's only three buttons you can use, can anyone seriously find that complicated. "
I would really beg to differ on the beginner characters part.  Even what the series has been labeling as "beginning" characters require a lot of investment.  And while the buttons themselves are not complicated (like you said there's only three), the actual attack properties and button combnations are many and require much more time to know in any useful capacity. 
 
I admire the series from a distance, but when you make a game that inaccessible, it does nothing to invite more players to an already niche genre.
#11 Posted by Al3xand3r (7574 posts) -

Tekken is more popular in Japanese arcades than VF nowadays? WTF? Where's that info from?!

#12 Posted by Cerza (1653 posts) -

No you're not the only Virtua Fighter fan out there. There are others such as myself.

#13 Edited by The_A_Drain (3910 posts) -

"The Virtua Fighter games {Except for the first one} are the deepest and balance fighting games of all time, it takes serious skill to play and it's not a n00b friendly button masher " 
 
Stopped reading here, basic tactics and a 3 button setup do not = depth, balance or strategy. Virtua Fighter contains only  a small amount of these things, this is coming from someone who made great efforts to play the most recent release, and to research and understand it's mechanics. My conclusion was that it was in fact rather shallow, and much like other 3D fighters too focused on the memorisation of lengthy combos over strategic thought to be a decent fighter. It's better than Tekken, DoA and other 3D fighters for sure, but theres no way in hell it compares to Soul Calibur II or almost any 2D fighter around. 
 
the rest of your comment is misinformed garbage as well, it does not dominate the arcade scene, nor the competetive fighting scene. Nor does being the first series of 3D fighter automatically mean it's the 'best'. Also, for your information, other fighters used 3D before virtua fighter.
#14 Edited by skrutop (3615 posts) -

I could never get into the VF series, though it is certainly an amazing fighting series.  I've always enjoyed the combat in Tekken to a much bigger extent.  To me, Tekken is the best 3D fighting game series.

#15 Posted by gordoa (50 posts) -
@The_A_Drain said:
""The Virtua Fighter games {Except for the first one} are the deepest and balance fighting games of all time, it takes serious skill to play and it's not a n00b friendly button masher "  Stopped reading here, basic tactics and a 3 button setup do not = depth, balance or strategy. Virtua Fighter contains only  a small amount of these things, this is coming from someone who made great efforts to play the most recent release, and to research and understand it's mechanics. My conclusion was that it was in fact rather shallow, and much like other 3D fighters too focused on the memorisation of lengthy combos over strategic thought to be a decent fighter. It's better than Tekken, DoA and other 3D fighters for sure, but theres no way in hell it compares to Soul Calibur II or almost any 2D fighter around.  the rest of your comment is misinformed garbage as well, it does not dominate the arcade scene, nor the competetive fighting scene. Nor does being the first series of 3D fighter automatically mean it's the 'best'. Also, for your information, other fighters used 3D before virtua fighter. "
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 Yeah, after all not using brain power doesn't take skill in any shape or form. 
 
Critics beg to differ as Virtua Fighter 4 currently holds a 94 rating on metacritic.com


 
 
 
 
#16 Posted by gordoa (50 posts) -
@C2C said:
" @gordoa said:
" That's what makes Virtua Fighter  great, it focuses on core gameplay instead of flash and styel. Virtua Fighter is the epitome of substance over style. It's an accessible game if you use the right characters for beginners, they even show that in the character selection screen. Plus, there's only three buttons you can use, can anyone seriously find that complicated. "
I would really beg to differ on the beginner characters part.  Even what the series has been labeling as "beginning" characters require a lot of investment.  And while the buttons themselves are not complicated (like you said there's only three), the actual attack properties and button combnations are many and require much more time to know in any useful capacity.   I admire the series from a distance, but when you make a game that inaccessible, it does nothing to invite more players to an already niche genre. "
The training mode perfectly helps the player understand how each fighting move and style works. It's quite easy to master for begginer fighters. It takes practice to master which becomes rewarding to the players, it works the same way as Counter-Strike or Tribes {Wow, I just mentioned a game few people have heard of.}
#17 Edited by MetalGearSunny (6988 posts) -

The home version makes you use the D-pad.
 
This isn't the 90s, Sega.

#18 Edited by Diamond (8634 posts) -
@Al3xand3r said:

" Tekken is more popular in Japanese arcades than VF nowadays? WTF? Where's that info from?! "

Arcade tracking sites, there are other fighting games more popular than VF than Tekken 6 in Japan even.
 
here's one : 
http://www.am-j.co.jp/
Tekken 6 BR is #1
some Gundam game is #2
VF5R is #3
Street Fighter IV is #4
Blazblue is #5
#19 Posted by The_A_Drain (3910 posts) -
@gordoa said:
"@The_A_Drain said:
""The Virtua Fighter games {Except for the first one} are the deepest and balance fighting games of all time, it takes serious skill to play and it's not a n00b friendly button masher "  Stopped reading here, basic tactics and a 3 button setup do not = depth, balance or strategy. Virtua Fighter contains only  a small amount of these things, this is coming from someone who made great efforts to play the most recent release, and to research and understand it's mechanics. My conclusion was that it was in fact rather shallow, and much like other 3D fighters too focused on the memorisation of lengthy combos over strategic thought to be a decent fighter. It's better than Tekken, DoA and other 3D fighters for sure, but theres no way in hell it compares to Soul Calibur II or almost any 2D fighter around.  the rest of your comment is misinformed garbage as well, it does not dominate the arcade scene, nor the competetive fighting scene. Nor does being the first series of 3D fighter automatically mean it's the 'best'. Also, for your information, other fighters used 3D before virtua fighter. "
 
          Yeah, after all not using brain power doesn't take skill in any shape or form.  Critics beg to differ as Virtua Fighter 4 currently holds a 94 rating on metacritic.com     "

 
 
 
 
 
You're quoting me metacritic in order to back your opinion that Virtua Fighter has merit on the competitive scene? Wow, give me that facepalm.jpg, I need to use it more than you do. 
 
The competetive scene and the critical scene judge fighters on two completely different sets of criteria, they aren't even comparable. 
 
How about you link me to a thriving tournament and competetive play community instead? Oh wait, you can't, because there isn't one, because the game has no competetive merit. It certainly has more than other popular 3D fighters, but nowhere near enough that any serious competetive community bothers with it.  
 
It's ok to be a fan of Virtua Fighter, noones denying you that, but you can't come up in here claiming it's "Teh bestest" spouting factually incorrect information about it's popularity on the competetive scene and the arcade scene without expecting a volatile response. It's not popular in the arcades or on the competetive scene for a reason, reason being depth, strategy and balance are important to those scenes, Virtua Fighter has very little of those things, whether you want to see it or not. If it did, it would have a thriving tournament scene, after all it's not like tournament scenes die out because a game is old, if VF4 really was 'teh bested evar' it would still have a thriving tournament scene, like many other older fighters (much older fighters).
#20 Edited by Al3xand3r (7574 posts) -
#21 Posted by The_A_Drain (3910 posts) -
@Al3xand3r:

Yeah but the scene is nowhere near that of other 2D fighters, it's tiny in comparison.  
 
My points are all still valid, and they all still stand. There is very little depth of strategy in Virtua Fighter, sure, there is some, but it's like comparing Yu-Gi-Oh to Magic: The Gathering, it's just ludicrous to even propose it's better than the high profile 2D fighters or Soul Calibur 2.
#22 Edited by Al3xand3r (7574 posts) -

Who proposed it's better? I think that's down to personal opinion, and yes, your own opinion still stands as well. As just that.
 
He didn't come proposing it's better than your beloved games, he was wondering if he's the only one that likes it, and you came to shit on it.
 
Edit: Oh wait, just saw it, he said it's the best ever. Yeah that's overboard, no shit (perhaps if he said 3D). But so is shitting on the franchise.
 
Also Diamond's stats show it's even more played than SFIV in Japanese arcades. Of course they also play a Gundam game more... Just saying.

#23 Posted by Spike94 (735 posts) -
@gordoa said:
"I seriously don't understand why these games garner a lot hate. The Virtua Fighter games {Except for the first one} are the deepest and balance fighting games of all time, it takes serious skill to play and it's not a n00b friendly button masher. A lot of people bash Virtua Fighter but gushingly praise Tekken, Dead or Alive, and Soul Calibur but in reality VF is far deeper than those games and make them seem like buttons mashers. Don't get me wrong, those games are good {Well, maybe except for DOA} but I don't feel like I'm in control of the frame inputs and they can be played as button mashers, considering Tekken's strategy mostly consists of air juggling which if you ask me is cheap and I don't know how air juggling became popular. Tekken, DOA, and Soul Calibur wouldn't exist if it weren't for VF considering the original game was the first 3D fighting game. There's a reason why this series dominates the arcades in Japan, but it's the most competitive fighting game ever made and it's practically the Counter-Strike of fighting games. But really, am I the only Virtua Fighter fan around here? "

No, I am a fan too. I don't have 5 though, might get it someday (should I? I have 4, but still). And though I love the series, in my opinion Tekken is better, and Soul Calibur is as well, if only by a little bit (and if only because I have 2, ,3 and 4 and therefore a lot of nostalgia with the terrific series), but again, this is all in my opinion. I have yet to play any DOA game, so I can't comment on that. As far as people hating it goes, I have not heard of anything of the sort, but I do agree with Diamond in that it seems the series has lost popularity.
#24 Edited by The_A_Drain (3910 posts) -
@Al3xand3r said:

"Who proposed it's better? I think that's down to personal opinion, and yes, your own opinion still stands as well. As just that.  He didn't come proposing it's better than your beloved games, he was wondering if he's the only one that likes it, and you came to shit on it. Also Diamond's stats show it's even more played than SFIV in Japanese arcades. Of course they also play a Gundam game more... Just saying. "


Actually he's systematically insulted everyone in this thread who has remotely poo-poo'ed Virtua Fighter in any way. 
 
My opinions are precisely that yes, but I have offered a somewhat more rational and logical view than simply "I love it, it's amazing it's got all teh depths and whatnot, if you hate it your stupid" which is what the OP seems to be offering to anybody who doesn't seem to agree. 
 
Yet again, you cannot apply mainstream popularity or critical reception as a guide to a games competetive merit, I have no doubt that there are more people playing Gundam and Virtua Fighter in Japans arcades, much in the same way there are more people here playing Halo 3 and CoD:WaW than there is CoD: Modern Warfare.
#25 Posted by Spike94 (735 posts) -

@gordoa said:

"@C2C said:
" @gordoa said:
" That's what makes Virtua Fighter  great, it focuses on core gameplay instead of flash and styel. Virtua Fighter is the epitome of substance over style. It's an accessible game if you use the right characters for beginners, they even show that in the character selection screen. Plus, there's only three buttons you can use, can anyone seriously find that complicated. "
I would really beg to differ on the beginner characters part.  Even what the series has been labeling as "beginning" characters require a lot of investment.  And while the buttons themselves are not complicated (like you said there's only three), the actual attack properties and button combnations are many and require much more time to know in any useful capacity.   I admire the series from a distance, but when you make a game that inaccessible, it does nothing to invite more players to an already niche genre. "
The training mode perfectly helps the player understand how each fighting move and style works. It's quite easy to master for begginer fighters. It takes practice to master which becomes rewarding to the players, it works the same way as Counter-Strike or Tribes {Wow, I just mentioned a game few people have heard of.} "


 

I've heard of Tribes, no worries :D
#26 Posted by gordoa (50 posts) -
@The_A_Drain said:
"@Al3xand3r said:

"Who proposed it's better? I think that's down to personal opinion, and yes, your own opinion still stands as well. As just that.  He didn't come proposing it's better than your beloved games, he was wondering if he's the only one that likes it, and you came to shit on it. Also Diamond's stats show it's even more played than SFIV in Japanese arcades. Of course they also play a Gundam game more... Just saying. "

Actually he's systematically insulted everyone in this thread who has remotely poo-poo'ed Virtua Fighter in any way.  My opinions are precisely that yes, but I have offered a somewhat more rational and logical view than simply "I love it, it's amazing it's got all teh depths and whatnot, if you hate it your stupid" which is what the OP seems to be offering to anybody who doesn't seem to agree.  Yet again, you cannot apply mainstream popularity or critical reception as a guide to a games competetive merit, I have no doubt that there are more people playing Gundam and Virtua Fighter in Japans arcades, much in the same way there are more people here playing Halo 3 and CoD:WaW than there is CoD: Modern Warfare. "
You think Call of Duty 4 has competitive online gameplay?
#27 Edited by gordoa (50 posts) -
@Metal_Gear_Sunny said:

"The home version makes you use the D-pad.  This isn't the 90s, Sega. "

Same with Tekken, but you can buy a fucking arcade game pad and play it with that.
#28 Posted by C2C (855 posts) -
@gordoa said:
"You think Call of Duty 4 has competitive online gameplay? "
Wow, just wow.
#29 Posted by ArclightBorealis (1563 posts) -

I like the series.

#30 Posted by gordoa (50 posts) -
@C2C said:
" @gordoa said:
"You think Call of Duty 4 has competitive online gameplay? "
Wow, just wow. "
I know, even Halo 2 takes more skill to play than COD4.
#31 Posted by ArbitraryWater (11619 posts) -
@gordoa: 
Hello new troll user. Believe it or not, people will have opinions that are different than yours. You don't need to constantly insult people who feel differently than you, unless you are 13 years old like your posts seem to reflect. It's ok to disagree, but unless you have valid arguments to back up your points instead of name-calling nobody is going to help you.
 
Oh, and one more thing. Every single time anyone ever posts a thread title with the phrase "Am I the only...?" I feel like punching them. Of course you are not the only fan of Virtua Fighter on this website. The user base is large and diverse enough that it's statistically improbable for you to be the only one. 
#32 Posted by gordoa (50 posts) -
@ArbitraryWater said:
" @gordoa:  Hello new troll user. Believe it or not, people will have opinions that are different than yours. You don't need to constantly insult people who feel differently than you, unless you are 13 years old like your posts seem to reflect. It's ok to disagree, but unless you have valid arguments to back up your points instead of name-calling nobody is going to help you. Oh, and one more thing. Every single time anyone ever posts a thread title with the phrase "Am I the only...?" I feel like punching them. Of course you are not the only fan of Virtua Fighter on this website. The user base is large and diverse enough that it's statistically improbable for you to be the only one.  "
And I like Pie, do you like Pie?
#33 Posted by JJOR64 (18955 posts) -

I don't know why but, I never really cared for the series.

#34 Posted by King9999 (613 posts) -

I haven't seen hate for the VF series, just ignorance and a lack of interest.  I like the games myself, but I only played VF2, 4 and 5.  Brad is my main.

#35 Posted by yakov456 (1905 posts) -

I love VF, at least the latter games. It just sucks that it's so god damn hard.
#36 Posted by Ping5000 (385 posts) -
@gordoa: Yes. The only fan. Just one. You.
#37 Posted by gordoa (50 posts) -
@JJOR64 said:

"I don't know why but, I never really cared for the series. "

Eh, it's cool bro. 
 
Ha ha! See ArbitraryWater? I'm not such a troll and fanboy am I.... am I?
#38 Posted by ArbitraryWater (11619 posts) -
@gordoa: Pie is delicious. That is all.
#39 Posted by Godwind (2597 posts) -
@The_A_Drain said:
" @Al3xand3r: Yeah but the scene is nowhere near that of other 2D fighters, it's tiny in comparison.   My points are all still valid, and they all still stand. There is very little depth of strategy in Virtua Fighter, sure, there is some, but it's like comparing Yu-Gi-Oh to Magic: The Gathering, it's just ludicrous to even propose it's better than the high profile 2D fighters or Soul Calibur 2. "
Soul Calibur 2 isn't deep, it is a button masher.  I own and can easily say the only reason why I bought is because it had Link.  This is coming from someone whose favorite console is the Dreamcast and I can confirm that the Soul Calibur franchise is overrated.
#40 Posted by The_A_Drain (3910 posts) -
@Godwind said:
" @The_A_Drain said:
" @Al3xand3r: Yeah but the scene is nowhere near that of other 2D fighters, it's tiny in comparison.   My points are all still valid, and they all still stand. There is very little depth of strategy in Virtua Fighter, sure, there is some, but it's like comparing Yu-Gi-Oh to Magic: The Gathering, it's just ludicrous to even propose it's better than the high profile 2D fighters or Soul Calibur 2. "
Soul Calibur 2 isn't deep, it is a button masher.  I own and can easily say the only reason why I bought is because it had Link.  This is coming from someone whose favorite console is the Dreamcast and I can confirm that the Soul Calibur franchise is overrated. "

You can't 'confirm' opinion.  
 
You can button mash if you like, but surely you can't be so ignorant. Soul Calibur 2 has a good deal of depth to it, a large number of strategies and variety of gameplay styles and characters, the difference is you can get a flashy looking match just by button mashing, but saying it's a button masher is as untrue as saying any fighter is a button masher, truly I can't think of one single fighter where button mashing outweighs legitimate strategy and technique. 
 
Seriously, take your head out of your arse and take a look, go and do some research, play the game with other experienced players. It's only a 'button masher' if you sit there and do nothing but mash buttons. Soul Calibur 2 had somewhat of a competetive scene on my small hometown (which is fucking insane, nobody here is even into games, let alone fighters) and I can say from experience, if you button mash, you get your ass kicked. In any fighter.
#41 Posted by leky1 (829 posts) -
@gordoa said:
" @Metal_Gear_Sunny said:

"The home version makes you use the D-pad.  This isn't the 90s, Sega. "

Same with Tekken, but you can buy a fucking arcade game pad and play it with that. "
?!No it does not!You get to use the frikkin buttons....
#42 Posted by SeriouslyNow (8534 posts) -

ANYONE who calls Soul Cali a button masher either has no friends to consistently play competitvely or only consistently play against lesser players.  
 
VF is like Soul Cali is like DoA is like ANY FUCKING DECENT FIGHTING GAME
 
Once you know the parries, breaks and combos to use and how and when they're most effective and your opponent does too it becomes like a game of chess.
 
There is no such thing as an overrated fighting game, there is only a weakness in people who buy into the "that game is overrated because of X, here let me show you" crap because they lack the conviction to enjoy the game they enjoy with begging for the support and attention of their so called friends.

#43 Edited by SeriouslyNow (8534 posts) -

People who call Soul Cali a button masher either have no friends to consistently play competitvely or only consistently play against lesser players.  
 
VF is like Soul Cali is like DoA is like ANY FUCKING DECENT FIGHTING GAME
 
Once you know the parries, breaks and combos to use and how and when they're most effective and your opponent does too it becomes like a game of chess.
 
There is no such thing as an overrated fighting game, there is only a weakness in people who buy into the "that game is overrated because of X, here let me show you" crap because they lack the conviction to enjoy the game they enjoy without begging for the support and attention of their so called friends.

#44 Posted by captain_clayman (3320 posts) -

i have virtua fighter 5 for ps3 if you wanna play onl-- 
OH WAIT! 
 
nah i like virtua fighter, it's one of the first games i bought for ps3, i had fun kicking my brothers ass.

#45 Posted by Nasar7 (2612 posts) -

I used to be way into VF back in the Saturn days but I haven't played one since 4 came out. Speaking of which, VF6 is overdue I think.

#46 Posted by neoepoch (1295 posts) -

I like it way more than Dead or Alive. I would always boil down the top 5 fighting series as Street Fighter, Mortal Kombat, King of Fighters (Anything SNK really.), Tekken, and Virtua Fighter. So...it's up there for me anyway.

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