i know this has nothing to do with the topic being discussed but I would like to know from who ever knows specs n stuff, just how much stronger is this xbox or ps4 compared to the current gen? given the specs(rumored) it has.

do what i do and just say no to consoles and yes to PC. gabe newell has to be salivating thinking about this.

I can't wait for actual information to come out so we can stop with these fucking rumors.

As someone who uses Gamefly a lot, if true, I respond to this policy with a resounding "FUCK THAT."

But it seems a little far fetched.

either both Sony and Msoft will do this, or no one will. It will be just be a stupid move business wise.

I would say this won't happen for this coming gen but the one after. Internet connection and what not are not quite just there to completely justify this.

Also if you have a good online store like Steam, used game become a non issue because you can discount new games much easier (always have these games available) and with less hit to the bottom line. So overall not a big deal if its done right, I haven't bought a used game in years because it just doesn't make sense financially. PC ports have been consistently cheaper for the last 2 years. Steam like stores is the future for consoles anyway, just a matter of time.

I use gamefly and sometimes borrow games. This is a no sale for me.

@golguin said:

I use gamefly and sometimes borrow games. This is a no sale for me.

Who knows they might just work with those companies (e.g. Gamefly, Redbox) and probably give them special codes or discs just for that purpose. This will also probably mean a system that might encourage users to send back discs because you won't be able to game in you system after month or maybe having to ask for another code if you want to extend for another month with the game that you haven't sent back yet. Just some possible scenarios wherein this can work with second hand parties.

As a user of Gamefly I guess I'll be getting a PS4 if this is true.

Thank you for stating rumour as fact, I'm sure this won't prove to be inaccurate in any way.

@GnaTSoL: I mean, I'd rather help kill GameStop and get incentives for having Xbox Live. ~

And its not like my computer can handle Steam, in any way. My PC is absolute shit. Even if I had money for a $1,500 rig, I still wouldn't wanna learn how to maintain it. I'd rather drink and hang out with with my friends, playing Battlefield and Bungie Destiny, than accidentally breaking a PC part because I bent the RAM. Oh shit! I dinged the CPU, and my elbow bumped the hard drive. Now it skips! Fuck that, I'm clumsy. I don't trust myself ANY, so I just don't see me getting into Steam any time soon. Steam kids can do whatever they want.

I'll be (hopefully) playing Nuts & Bolts 2, showing my friend a bad ass plane I made, blowing it up, and then sharing a screenshot me jumping out the wreckage.

@Blimble said:

I don't like to go into rumours about new consoles, but if this happens Microsoft have lost a customer

If you're buying used games you're already not a customer and they don't give a shit about you. @Sooty is right, piracy and used games are practically the same thing. No money goes to the developer, publisher or console maker.

i think this might end up being half true. They will probably have some sort of 10 dollar unlock fee like they do with multiplayer passes already.

What's the big deal steam already does it

What the fuck is going on in this comments section?

Let's assume this rumor is true, okay. I present a question to you all: how many of you spew on a regular fucking basis "GAMESTOP IS EVIL, FUCK THOSE GUYS?" I ask because I know specifically that there are people in here saying "this is the worst thing ever" and "I won't buy the system if they do that" who have also said that Gamestop, a secondhand used game retail space, are evil.

MAKE. UP. YOUR. FUCKING. MINDS.

You don't get to say something is evil and then say the thing that would kill that evil thing is evil as well. Pick one or the other. If you don't, then both evils exist regardless!

Beyond that, I say this: Origin, Steam, Uplay, Capsule, etc etc etc etc. These are systems that have already been in place for a LONG time with PC gamers. Steam is considered by MANY MANY MANY people to be the ONLY way to do this shit. Moreover, the console games market wants to go with no secondhand sales and online activation codes? GREAT! It also means they might be able to start being cheaper in their pricing and put shit on sale more often. It can easily be a GOOD THING.

SO...quit yer bitchin', wait for any form of confirmation, and pick a side.

@Jayzilla said:

do what i do and just say no to consoles and yes to PC. gabe newell has to be salivating thinking about this.

Well, from one of the more recent articles though it seems that Gabe isn't really worried about the current console platforms but he's more worried about Apple when they decide to tackle the TV market and expand to games.

@jakob187: But what about all those times you're playing your xbox on a plane during a plane trip man??! What about all those times your xbox isn't at your house 2 feet away from your router? What then? Game over man.

I find this hard to believe because i buy new 99% of the time and buying games 60 to 40 dollars a pop the minute i lose internet connection or server go down i'm SOL on playing any of the games i paid for. That would not be cool with me at all given that your easily dropping $1000+ dollar on next gens systems with games, controllers, hard drives or whatever included.

So i can't see this happening and i have a hard time seeing why people would be cool with this. This is not nelflix, hulu, or any other service where you have a pay wall and everything else is free. It would seem more likely if you had a chip on the disc or its connected to your system or profiles.

...Well, since i don't have XBOX Live, i suppose i'm fucked.

@jakob187: there are used games at amazon too!

I feel much better about those, personally

I'll just be interested here to see who pulls the trigger first. This cold war on this issue is what is exciting really. Who is going to have the balls to make the first move on this?

DISCLAIMER: IF THIS IS TRUE...

To me, its not about Gamestop or used games. It's about my own family and how we borrow each others games.

But now, i have to buy my own copy of Halo because your console dosen't play used/borrowed games? Man, fuck you.

If this rumor turns out to be false?

Then... Good.

If it lets me install games, register them, and then not require the disc for installed games, works for me. Even better if they run a Steam-like service for retail games same as they do for XBLA games now, so I can uninstall/redownload at my will and not have to buy discs and keep them at the ready to play games. As is when the price is right I prefer games on demand for both the Xbox and PS3, so I don't have to get things shipped and fuck around with discs. Makes it very easy to shuffle through and pick something to play.

Really, I stopped buying used a long time ago, and I have reliable Internet, so this doesn't affect me at all. Killing used games is a benefit, if anything. PC's always-on Internet I actually care more about, because my laptop may be in places without access to the Internet. My consoles are plugged in at all times. I'm all for day one digital purchases and account-level game registration for the new consoles.

@ProfessorEss said:

@leebmx said:

I also think it would however be very interesting if this did happen - and in a weird way it might actually be a good thing for the quality of our games:

With all the money going back to publishers/developers rather than third parties there will be a lot more available for development and this could allow for greater risk taking than we currently have in the console space.

Do you believe this? Because I'm not sure I do. I have a real hard time believing any of this money is going to be used on creativity or risk-taking as opposed to being used for profit increasing and executive bonuses. And frankly, I personally believe after the used market is crushed we'll still be hearing endless complaints about how they can't make any money.

I suspect the next big thing in the "Poor Ol' Publishers" story will be how "it's not economically feasible to continue to giving customers so much content for only 60 dollars" and their next big project will be finding out how to get as little on the disk (aka: original purchase) and as much into DLC packages (aka: additional costs) as possible. I don't mean to be so cynical, guess I'm just trying to be as negative as possible in the hopes that I'll be pleasantly surprised :P

It's very sad for collectors or just people who like to get old systems and play games on them. It's eliminating an entire sector of the market and kind of damning the future of gaming in general. Good luck 20 years from now trying to pick up a 720/PS4 and grabbing some cheap games for them for nostalgia's sake. Now you buy that old system, turn it on, the online market has been shut down and no games are available. You get a specific collection of games on then current market of the current console and you get to pay 50 dollars for them.

I also feel like it eliminates a key feature of consoles in the first place. Gone are the days of letting a friend borrow a game to try it out. Gone are the days of being able to easily go over to a friends house and play a game with them seamlessly on their console. It ultimately makes consoles finally nothing more than an overpriced, outdated PC with everything locked to an account or an individual console. Full retard.

I don't mind the used game thing but I am more upset about always online. So what happens when the servers get turned off? We can never play those games again? Lets not forget the horrible launch of Diablo 3. Always online is not the answer, all these bad decisions are killing gaming faster than anything else going on. Punishing honest customers just seems to be getting worse.

@jakob187 said:

What the fuck is going on in this comments section?

Let's assume this rumor is true, okay. I present a question to you all: how many of you spew on a regular fucking basis "GAMESTOP IS EVIL, FUCK THOSE GUYS?"

Gamestop is not the end all, be all of used games. I don't do business there so I couldn't care one way or the other what the health of their company is. Gamestop has zero to do with my opinion of this strategy, if true, to be fucking garbage.

------

And since a similar "kill used games" rumor has come up with the new Playstation...well, if I can't sell my games as I see fit, I'm done with "modern console gaming," whatever that winds up being. I don't go down the PC path either so I guess I'm done with new gaming, period. Fuck digital distribution only, and fuck it hard. And fuck the people who think it's "what's best" even harder. If you like the big console companies having tighter control over pricing and distribution, you're an idiot.

All that said - the title of the thread is pretty baiting. This is just a rumor. I don't think MS is crazy enough to shut out the percentage of people who buy an XBox and don't connect to the internet. I know it's supposedly a minority now, but 40% (or whatever it is) is still a pretty fucking big chunk of people.

@Branthog said:

I've been looking forward to new consoles like crazy, but if they do stuff like this, I'll just return to my life-long hardcore PC gaming. It won't be a huge loss to me and the couple thousand I'd spend on consoles and peripherals will go a long way in PC gaming. I'll be bummed out, but I won't be part of that crap.

. . . if any of that ends up being even remotely true, mind you.

But isn't that what PC's do know anyway, I'm defiantly against this but seeing complaints from PC gamers is quite strange as it's been this way for years on that platform.

@Demoskinos said:

Yeah That would piss off some places like gamestop. Then again if Microsoft doesn't think they need Gamestop....

Gamestop needs Microsoft even more.

@RedRoach said:

@Blimble said:

I don't like to go into rumours about new consoles, but if this happens Microsoft have lost a customer

If you're buying used games you're already not a customer and they don't give a shit about you. @Sooty is right, piracy and used games are practically the same thing. No money goes to the developer, publisher or console maker.

I really don't see how stealing games vs purchasing them from someone else is similar at all.

I doubt this rumor is true. Just scale back on the hysteria and let's see what gets announced.

Consoles to me are becoming a pain in the ass PC just seems easier to me on every level I use to like consoles but I hate how they are more about gimmicks these days like motion controls ect.Glad I skipped this generation and got into PC gaming to me PS2 era was the last best generation it was more simple but anyways I hope everybody that plays the new consoles enjoys them I'm sticking with my computer.

@SathingtonWaltz said:

@RedRoach said:

@Blimble said:

I don't like to go into rumours about new consoles, but if this happens Microsoft have lost a customer

If you're buying used games you're already not a customer and they don't give a shit about you. @Sooty is right, piracy and used games are practically the same thing. No money goes to the developer, publisher or console maker.

I really don't see how stealing games vs purchasing them from someone else is similar at all.

because the publisher and developer don't care about GameStop getting paid, they want the money to make these games, not to keep a retail store afloat.

used games and piracy both give no money directly to pubs/devs, of course people can pirate a game or buy used then buy DLC, but the initial sale of that game isn't going to the pub/dev, that's how they are similar.

@KaneRobot said:

@jakob187 said:

What the fuck is going on in this comments section?

Let's assume this rumor is true, okay. I present a question to you all: how many of you spew on a regular fucking basis "GAMESTOP IS EVIL, FUCK THOSE GUYS?"

Gamestop is not the end all, be all of used games. I don't do business there so I couldn't care one way or the other what the health of their company is. Gamestop has zero to do with my opinion of this strategy, if true, to be fucking garbage.

------

And since a similar "kill used games" rumor has come up with the new Playstation...well, if I can't sell my games as I see fit, I'm done with "modern console gaming," whatever that winds up being. I don't go down the PC path either so I guess I'm done with new gaming, period. Fuck digital distribution only, and fuck it hard. And fuck the people who think it's "what's best" even harder. If you like the big console companies having tighter control over pricing and distribution, you're an idiot.

All that said - the title of the thread is pretty baiting. This is just a rumor. I don't think MS is crazy enough to shut out the percentage of people who buy an XBox and don't connect to the internet. I know it's supposedly a minority now, but 40% (or whatever it is) is still a pretty fucking big chunk of people.

Agree 100%. I can't believe there are so many people in this thread fucking cheering as these corporate assholes destroy their consumer freedoms.

unless the market has changed since i last heard, i thought half of the consoles bought weren't hooked up to the internet at all. How will they deal with people who don't have the internet? This rumor just doesn't make sense to me.

@Sooty said:

@SathingtonWaltz said:

@RedRoach said:

@Blimble said:

I don't like to go into rumours about new consoles, but if this happens Microsoft have lost a customer

If you're buying used games you're already not a customer and they don't give a shit about you. @Sooty is right, piracy and used games are practically the same thing. No money goes to the developer, publisher or console maker.

I really don't see how stealing games vs purchasing them from someone else is similar at all.

because the publisher and developer don't care about GameStop getting paid, they want the money to make these games, not to keep a retail store afloat.

used games and piracy both give no money directly to pubs/devs, of course people can pirate a game or buy used then buy DLC, but the initial sale of that game isn't going to the pub/dev, that's how they are similar.

I see how they are similar in that sense, but I don't see how they are ethically similar at all. In one case an individual isn't spending money and in the other he/she is.

If the current Xbox used this anti-piracy measures, god dammit I would still have all my games from this generation, instead of trading in greats like Fallout 3, RDR and Burnout Paradise for like 20 bucks combined......

@SathingtonWaltz said:

@Sooty said:

@SathingtonWaltz said:

@RedRoach said:

@Blimble said:

I don't like to go into rumours about new consoles, but if this happens Microsoft have lost a customer

If you're buying used games you're already not a customer and they don't give a shit about you. @Sooty is right, piracy and used games are practically the same thing. No money goes to the developer, publisher or console maker.

I really don't see how stealing games vs purchasing them from someone else is similar at all.

because the publisher and developer don't care about GameStop getting paid, they want the money to make these games, not to keep a retail store afloat.

used games and piracy both give no money directly to pubs/devs, of course people can pirate a game or buy used then buy DLC, but the initial sale of that game isn't going to the pub/dev, that's how they are similar.

I see how they are similar in that sense, but I don't see how they are ethically similar at all. In one case an individual isn't spending money and in the other he/she is.

I dunno if a used game buyer is really much better than a pirate, after all, you aren't helping that game make a profit, just like a pirate isn't. Does paying some guy on eBay money make it ethically better than pirating? I'd say noooooot really.

It doesn't bother me at all, I just find it funny some people lament pirates but buy used games. It's a funny contradiction.

If you wanna support the industry you buy new, if you want to be cheap you either buy used or pirate, there's just no need to take the moral highground if you're not contributing to the development of these damn games!

I buy used sometimes, I buy new most of the time, and as for piracy, well I'm saying nothing. I've been all over the place!

I'll wait and see but if this happens, they've lost my moolah

I wasn't planning on buying the next Xbox but if they do that I really don't want to support them with my money. But this seems highly unlikely since I don't think we've hit the saturation point of the internet for them to even try something like that. I could be wrong about that but this just seems like a bad way to start a new console.

I currently have a pretty spotty internet connection, and every time the phone rings, the wifi cuts out for a minute or so. If this is true, then Gabe Newell might be making more money than he already is.

When this doesn't happen can we all promise not to be surprised?

@PandaBear said:

When this doesn't happen can we all promise not to be surprised?

As vocal as I've been in this thread, I honestly don't think these rumors are true.

There will be hours and hours of discussion on this topic as we get closer to E3 and launch; I'm with @TooWalrus on this one.

Out of all this, its almost a little obvious that the vocal majority of GiantBomb is a Steam follower. If so, you don't Really care what happens on the console market. You still got Steam. Steam will continue to grow exponentially without Microsoft and Sony giving a fuck. SteamSales all year, i.e. Summer Sale, Christmas sale, Black Friday, good tidings ahead!

Both MS and SY are after the WalMart shopper. A large portion of the retail games market comes from there, then GameStop and then Best Buy probably. The WalMart shopper is in there to buy groceries, half a banana, and copy of Madden for the kid. The Retail market, including GameStop, is where the developers deserved money is going down the drain, in the USED bucket.

Point is, GiantBomb is not the majority of the whole games market, we just like to act like it is.

If the new consoles get anti-used game protection on them. Then I'm growing a neckbeard and building myself a gaming PC.

This is the lengths that MS and Sony will have pushed me too.

 To be fair, rumors emerged first that the PS4 would block used games. Honestly since Sony is so big on online passes I don't think they'd skip out on this.
 
But on topic: I think an always online connection is stupid. I always buy my games new (though occasionally rent ones I'm on the fence about) so that part doesn't bother me as much.

@JCGamer said:

@FourWude

If the new consoles get anti-used game protection on them. Then I'm growing a neckbeard and building myself a gaming PC.

This is the lengths that MS and Sony will have pushed me too.

Isn't the PC basically an always connected system already? Unless you are talking about pirating, the PC already has DRM very similar to what the next Xbox and PS4 are rumored to be thinking of. Even Steam is a kind of DRM.

As people pointed out, while PC has the most DRM services like Steam (and now competing storefronts like Amazon and Green Man Gaming) have sales that utterly embarrass what is seen on consoles. While I find PSN+'s deals to be decent, XBLs weekly sales are a joke. A sale for a game comes once in a blue moon and downloadable titles rarely ever get a permanent price drop. This generation of physical copies of games have been better when it comes to dropping its price just a few months after release, but you can expect that to become a rarer trend if new copies of games don't have to compete with used game prices.

I still highly doubt this is true though. Both MS and Sony will piss off customers and Gamestop without a guarantee that new game copy revenue would increase.

@Sooty said:

I dunno if a used game buyer is really much better than a pirate, after all, you aren't helping that game make a profit, just like a pirate isn't. Does paying some guy on eBay money make it ethically better than pirating? I'd say noooooot really.

It doesn't bother me at all, I just find it funny some people lament pirates but buy used games. It's a funny contradiction.

If you wanna support the industry you buy new, if you want to be cheap you either buy used or pirate, there's just no need to take the moral highground if you're not contributing to the development of these damn games!

I buy used sometimes, I buy new most of the time, and as for piracy, well I'm saying nothing. I've been all over the place!

That is such a terrible mindset for a consumer to have though. "Buy a product because you want to support the company!" No. You buy a product because you want the damn product. Why should a consumer be wary how where they buy something affects the overall industry? In no other market is a buyer being constantly preached to buy things new. No one questions a persons moral stance when they buy a TV off of Craigslist, making Samsung lose potential revenue. I bought my current car off of a relative. Did I just rip off Honda?

While I'm not going to disagree that financially game companies are affected by used games and piracy in the same manner, to have consumers think they are a pirate for buying games used is absolutely absurd. The console makers have barely made any attempt to have their prices reflect demand and have spent more time pointing the finger at their own userbase saying "It's kinda your fault for not buying new."

@Andorski said:

@Sooty said:

I dunno if a used game buyer is really much better than a pirate, after all, you aren't helping that game make a profit, just like a pirate isn't. Does paying some guy on eBay money make it ethically better than pirating? I'd say noooooot really.

It doesn't bother me at all, I just find it funny some people lament pirates but buy used games. It's a funny contradiction.

If you wanna support the industry you buy new, if you want to be cheap you either buy used or pirate, there's just no need to take the moral highground if you're not contributing to the development of these damn games!

I buy used sometimes, I buy new most of the time, and as for piracy, well I'm saying nothing. I've been all over the place!

That is such a terrible mindset for a consumer to have though. "Buy a product because you want to support the company!" No. You buy a product because you want the damn product. Why should a consumer be wary how where they buy something affects the overall industry? In no other market is a buyer being constantly preached to buy things new. No one questions a persons moral stance when they buy a TV off of Craigslist, making Samsung lose potential revenue. I bought my current car off of a relative. Did I just rip off Honda?

While I'm not going to disagree that financially game companies are affected by used games and piracy in the same manner, to have consumers think they are a pirate for buying games used is absolutely absurd. The console makers have barely made any attempt to have their prices reflect demand and have spent more time pointing the finger at their own userbase saying "It's kinda your fault for not buying new."

Again though I have no problem with people buying used, just the people who talk down about pirates when they buy used games themselves. It's just silly to say pirates are hurting the industry then you go out and buy a used game yourself, of course it's not as in your face / obvious that your used game sale is harming the industry and that's fine.

This has been a long time coming really though, PCs have been expected to be connected to the Internet for a while and now that has carried over to consoles. I have no issues with used games going away because I'm used to that on PC, it doesn't really bother me whichever way it goes.

I won't be surprised if the next consoles have even higher levels of piracy if the used game blocks are actually coming. Eradicating used games is a pretty massive victory for these people so I'm sure they don't care about pissing people off.

@ssj4raditz said:

How will it be able to tell the difference?

My guess: Disks you buy are more "install media" than games. Once you install it to the box, the disk is worthless to stick in any other box beyond another install that needs to be paid for.

Use keys. Like they used to do on the PC.

I don't see the hardon corporations have with always-on DRM. (Not that I honestly see this happening for a console.)