No games until day One Patch

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#101 Posted by Gnorbooth (288 posts) -

This is definitely kind of crazy. We're talking about the most basic functionality that this $500 machine is supposed to do, and until you grab that firmware update from the internet, it's a brick. I guess it's the principle of it that just kind of irks me a bit. I can understand patches and all that goodness to "enhance" what our shit can do, but basic functionality like this has to be patched in before it works at all? Fuck guys, this all internet future is already looking grim, and we're not even there yet.

To be fair here, I think it's dumb that the PS4 won't have blu-ray playback and stuff until it updates as well. Just across the board a bummer on what's going on with these launches. Jeff wasn't kidding, these things are coming in HOTT!

#102 Edited by BigJeffrey (5187 posts) -

Patch is apparently live, 500mb. Marketplace is not live though.

#103 Posted by OurSin_360 (947 posts) -

Next Gen - 500$ bricks

#104 Edited by Sooty (8082 posts) -

Wow, talk about being Xboned!!

Is this thing on?

#105 Posted by captain_clayman (3328 posts) -

They better hope that patch downloads and works immediately for everyone, or they'll never hear the end of it.

#106 Posted by awesomeusername (4218 posts) -

All of you arguing entertains me. Feed me your anger.

#107 Edited by awesomeusername (4218 posts) -

@bigjeffrey: Why is Dead Rising 3 19GB and Knack FUCKING 37GB WHAT?!!!

#108 Posted by joshwent (2353 posts) -

@awesomeusername: Dead Rising 3 is 720p, Knack is 1080p. So it's most likely just all of the larger textures.

#109 Edited by BigJeffrey (5187 posts) -

@awesomeusername said:

@bigjeffrey: Why is Dead Rising 3 19GB and Knack FUCKING 37GB WHAT?!!!

I think it's a compressed file? The retail disk install is 35GB

#110 Posted by awesomeusername (4218 posts) -

@bigjeffrey: Oh man Next gen is screwed when it comes to HDD space. Not looking forward to downloading games at all.

#111 Posted by Captain_Felafel (1602 posts) -

Not a big deal for 95% of us, but... damn. That's bizarre, and could potentially blow up.

#112 Posted by xyzygy (10078 posts) -

@joshwent: That last paragraph wasn't meant for you personally. Meant to put it above my quote of yours but the formatting wouldn't let me :( Sorry. I can see how you'd think it was a personal attack or something.

#113 Edited by Chaser324 (6744 posts) -

This next gen hardware is coming in hot from both MS and Sony, and as a result, they're both including a lot of functionality in these day one system updates. The Xbox One's lack of game playing functionality out of the box is definitely crazier than anything in Sony's update, but MS admitted that this would be the case back when they pulled their initial policy reversal.

It's pretty safe to assume that all PS4 and Xbox One units beyond these initial batches will have those updates pre-installed.

Moderator
#114 Posted by ryanwhom (290 posts) -

Not everyone has the internet or can connect their console to the internet. People projecting their privilege on the world, the world isn't your mom's house. Not everywhere on earth has great internet infrastructure and some people flatout have no access to internet. There's a world outside of the bubble you live in. Xbox got rid of its "always on" angle specifically for this reason, and putting a mandatory update out day one kind of resurfaces the problem. Its pretty indefensible. They'd be better delaying the launch and updating the software themselves so they're not shipping bricks.

#115 Edited by gike987 (1780 posts) -
@ryanwhom said:

Not everyone has the internet or can connect their console to the internet. People projecting their privilege on the world, the world isn't your mom's house. Not everywhere on earth has great internet infrastructure and some people flatout have no access to internet. There's a world outside of the bubble you live in. Xbox got rid of its "always on" angle specifically for this reason, and putting a mandatory update out day one kind of resurfaces the problem. Its pretty indefensible. They'd be better delaying the launch and updating the software themselves so they're not shipping bricks.

The thing is that if you don't have access to internet Microsoft simple don't care about you. You won't be paying for gold, you won't buy DLC and digital games, you won't see ads. You are a useless costumer to them.

They only got rid of the always on thing because it made people that actually mattered to them upset.

#116 Edited by Excast (1041 posts) -

@gike987 said:

The thing is that if you don't have access to internet Microsoft simple don't care about you. You won't be paying for gold, you won't buy DLC and digital games, you won't see ads. You are a useless costumer to them.

They only got rid of the always on thing because it made people that actually mattered to them upset.

And that shitty attitude is why Microsoft is finding itself in a huge hole with consumers out of the gate.

#117 Posted by Chaser324 (6744 posts) -

@excast said:

And that shitty attitude is why Microsoft is finding itself in a huge hole with consumers out of the gate.

Sure, but in a few months this day one update issue is probably gone, and 6-12 months from now, nothing that happened prior to launch will even matter.

Moderator
#118 Posted by pweidman (2364 posts) -

If the day one patch works properly, and is of a reasonable size, this is absolutely a non-issue. Same for PS4. Anyone who's buying knows the online component is essential to the new gen experience.

People still need to rage anything MS I spose.

#119 Posted by Nekroskop (2786 posts) -

All those CoD-drones and Madden-bros are going to be so pissed off. I feel really bad for all the Gamestop employees who have to explain everything to angry customers without an internet connection.

What MS should to to remedy this is put the update on an USB stick(1GB sticks are 10 cents wholesale) and have retailers give them out to people who don't have the opportunity to update via internet.

#120 Edited by Sooty (8082 posts) -

@chaser324 said:

@excast said:

And that shitty attitude is why Microsoft is finding itself in a huge hole with consumers out of the gate.

Sure, but in a few months this day one update issue is probably gone, and 6-12 months from now, nothing that happened prior to launch will even matter.

What will matter is the bad rep the console is going to get if it continues to be the One (hehehehe) that gets the inferior ports of games. Everyone loved to dump on the PS3 for that, I wonder if Microsoft will just embargo everything like they have been doing with ACIV, BF4 and Ghosts. In the long run, I think sales will end up quite close for the system, but Microsoft may well lose out on the licensing fees when people who own both opt for the PS4 versions. (outside of picking the version your friends all have)

It's still early yet, but so far it seems the PS4 is the platform all developers are showing their games on, even Activision who have that DLC/business relationship with Microsoft were showing Ghosts only on PS4.

I don't get why they had to include the Kinect as standard, should've put more money into the system's hardware and let people who want Kinect freaking buy one. There's no reason the voice commands can't be done with a half-decent headset instead. One (hehehehe) of the reasons I don't want an Xbox One at the moment is because I'm paying a premium for a Kinect that I know I will never use; awkward university room, and even at home my TV is too low down to the floor to stand up ideally for a Kinect game.

I'm still surprised I am feeling so negative towards the Xbox One, I thought the PS3 was a total waste of space for the first few years, and even long after it collected dust in my room a lot because of how much worse most multi-platform games turned out on it. Street Fighter IV (original release) was flat out broken on PSN with horrid connection issues, then there's all the games that had shitty framerates and horrible tearing. I only used my PS3 for a handful of exclusives in the end. It's a shame because I sunk so many hours into the Xbox 360 and the successor seems just plain middling right now.

At least Forza looks kinda nice, albeit not a big leap over 4.

#121 Posted by MidNVis (23 posts) -

How does this even matter? Were you planning on not connecting it to the internet? haha

#122 Edited by Hailinel (25205 posts) -

@excast said:

And that shitty attitude is why Microsoft is finding itself in a huge hole with consumers out of the gate.

Sure, but in a few months this day one update issue is probably gone, and 6-12 months from now, nothing that happened prior to launch will even matter.

Six to twelve months down the line, the people that got stung with a $500 purchase on day one because they bought a console that they never intended to hook up to the internet are not going to care.

#123 Edited by GrantHeaslip (1606 posts) -

I find this stuff really hard to get worked up about. There are specific groups -- like those in the military and those living in really remote areas -- for whom this will matter, and I'm guessing Microsoft will have some (albeit inconvenient) way to help those people, even if it means shipping the console to support. For the other 99.99%, this is a total non-issue. 300 MB is the kind of bandwidth consumed by a longer YouTube video -- this will probably take a couple of minutes to download for most people.

I mean, look at the iPad. It's a $500 mass-market consumer electronics device that is nearly useless without an internet connection. Nobody cared in 2010, and they sure as hell don't care now. Yes, some people don't buy video game systems with any intention of using the internet with them, but is that because they can't, or because they never felt the need to?

This obviously isn't ideal, and it's pretty goofy at first glance, but come on.

#124 Edited by Excast (1041 posts) -

@pweidman said:

If the day one patch works properly, and is of a reasonable size, this is absolutely a non-issue. Same for PS4. Anyone who's buying knows the online component is essential to the new gen experience.

People still need to rage anything MS I spose.

And people still seem to be forgetting that a fairly sizeable portion of current generation PS3s and 360s are not connected to the internet. Why? Do you believe these consumers are going to vanish overnight? Some seem to want to pretend they don't exist. We are also told that the majority of these folks do not pay attention to the minutiae that folks on video game forums care about. Well, how many people do you think are planning to buy an Xbox 1 and have absolutely no idea it needs to be hooked up online to even play games? How many are going to buy this thing and have no easily available means of patching it? Thousands? Tens of thousands?

#125 Posted by alwaysbebombing (1651 posts) -
#126 Posted by Hailinel (25205 posts) -
#127 Edited by Chaser324 (6744 posts) -

@hailinel said:

Six to twelve months down the line, the people that got stung with a $500 purchase on day one because they bought a console that they never intended to hook up to the internet are not going to care.

Yeah, there are going to be some people that buy on day one that have no internet access that will end up just having to return their unit or go through some inconvenient process to get the update. That is definitely unfortunate and is going to be a major shock and pain in the ass for some people. I was just saying that once this day one patch is coming pre-installed on units, it won't be an issue on purchases from that point forward.

Moderator
#128 Posted by WickedFather (1733 posts) -

@hailinel said:

@alwaysbebombing said:

@hailinel said:

@alwaysbebombing: What if you can't download it?

Wait till you can?

What if you live in a household that doesn't connect game consoles to the internet?

Then the 360 is for you. With its extensive range of games and online multiplayer and entertainment applications we'll sure you'll be happy with the best gaming solution's older brother. Now go get some!

#129 Edited by Zelyre (1275 posts) -

Well, at least Comcast is getting it out of their system before the One's launch.

http://forums.xbox.com/xbox_forums/xbox_support/xbox_360_support/f/9/t/1617554.aspx?PageIndex=1

Looks like there are a few people who are unable to connect to XBL via xFinity.

#130 Posted by PhilESkyline (784 posts) -

I'm just thinking outside the box but could this patch be due to MS rushing the console out? Remember Sony struck first blood with their release date. I gather MS had to hustle and figured through the box out dead on arrival and we'll add all the functionality through a patch. I hope they paid their admins bonuses, I'm sure they'll be running around like crazy on launch day.

#131 Edited by Excast (1041 posts) -

I'm just thinking outside the box but could this patch be due to MS rushing the console out? Remember Sony struck first blood with their release date. I gather MS had to hustle and figured through the box out dead on arrival and we'll add all the functionality through a patch. I hope they paid their admins bonuses, I'm sure they'll be running around like crazy on launch day.

I've seen this argument around, but I honestly can't believe that a company the size of Microsoft didn't have some idea that the next generation was starting this year. Everyone else did, didn't we?

#132 Edited by TruthTellah (9475 posts) -

Unless you're an active serviceman or woman in the military, you probably wouldn't be plunking down $500-600 on these systems and their games at launch without some level of access to the Internet. Heck, they've said you can even use your cellphone's connection if need be. It's unfortunate that their backtrack on always online requires this day one update, but it isn't exactly unique. The Wii U's day one update was even bigger, and as long as they don't have a problem with servers sending the update quickly, I don't foresee this being a significant issue for most people.

I do wish they could have at least included the update as a disc in the package, but as long as they can deliver it quickly to everyone connecting to them, it should turn out better than some people are fearing.

#133 Edited by PhilESkyline (784 posts) -

@excast: I'm referring to the actual day. MS never released a launch date and with the backtracking of the original plan I would guess more changes needed to be made and fast. So instead of delaying the console until Dec probably Christmas they just put it out and make you download a huge patch. Having a patch just to play games sounds risky, I wouldn't be shocked if many consoles brick.

#134 Posted by ripelivejam (4878 posts) -

This will make the GB stream really fun.

XBONE DAY 1 LIVE STREAM BUT MOSTLY WINDJAMMERS :rock:

#135 Posted by jasbir (107 posts) -

If u have internet u should be fine but the ones who don't have internet r going to run into big problems.

#136 Posted by PandaBear (1384 posts) -

If they have a server crash...

#137 Edited by Chaser324 (6744 posts) -

@excast said:

@phileskyline said:

I'm just thinking outside the box but could this patch be due to MS rushing the console out? Remember Sony struck first blood with their release date. I gather MS had to hustle and figured through the box out dead on arrival and we'll add all the functionality through a patch. I hope they paid their admins bonuses, I'm sure they'll be running around like crazy on launch day.

I've seen this argument around, but I honestly can't believe that a company the size of Microsoft didn't have some idea that the next generation was starting this year. Everyone else did, didn't we?

I assure you that even with an approximate target date, Sony and MS were still waiting until the last possible moment to lock down both the hardware and system level software. These new consoles are both coming in SUPER HOT!

The PS4 may be able to play disc based games out of the box, but there's still a 300 MB day one update that includes a lot of functionality with other features not coming until 2014. The software devs working on the PS4 even had the advantage of not completely rearchitecting major components six months before launch, and they still didn't get it all done before production started.

Moderator
#138 Posted by Sergio (2257 posts) -

@excast: I'm referring to the actual day. MS never released a launch date and with the backtracking of the original plan I would guess more changes needed to be made and fast. So instead of delaying the console until Dec probably Christmas they just put it out and make you download a huge patch. Having a patch just to play games sounds risky, I wouldn't be shocked if many consoles brick.

There was no way MS would delay it past black Friday, or even that Thursday, with some retailers opening on Thanksgiving. The latest I could see them launching was the 26th. They're also not waiting a week or so before launch to get these things ready to ship. By the time they did a 180 on their policy, it was probably already too late to do anything with the systems in production, if you include the time it would have taken to produce the code changes and test them out.

#139 Posted by confideration (442 posts) -

I'm a little shocked that you need an update before it will play a game, and a bit skeptical that this could be a case where someone's words were taken out of context.

I think in Sony's case it has to do with licensing fees, just like they said on the bombcast. If people remember clearly... Years ago you had to activate a feature on the PS3 online before your console would stream WMA/WMV files from your PC. It's probably still the case.

With Microsoft, if it's true about the games not being playable, I would lean more towards security and copy protection. It's given them a lot more time to work on the EXACT build of the OS that will allow games to be played out of the gate. Remember there is a pretty robust piracy scene still on current gen consoles that publishers still want to put a dent in.

I do feel for those internet challenged locations though, however, trust me... Those folks are used to improvising even for day to day stuff like the challenge of having enough fuel, food, easy access to health services, hostile wildlife, you name it. If they want an Xbox One and it needs to connect to the internet once, I bet they will find a way to make that happen.

#140 Posted by Spongetwan (202 posts) -

Not a big deal to me. Can't wait for the system!!

#141 Posted by ch3burashka (5256 posts) -

So if you live in a podunk town with no internet (or dial-up), you're pretty Xboned?

#142 Edited by Franstone (1156 posts) -

Doesn't really matter to me, even if the One had 100% functionality right out of the box the first thing I would do is update it.


#143 Edited by project343 (2838 posts) -

We've known about this since June 13th. It is not an 'always on' console, but it is a console that does not truly function until it is connected to the internet. If the purchaser does not have access to the internet, they basically have a fat brick.

*Edit: Just saw that it's 500mb. That's massive for a patch, and because it's mandatory, Microsoft's servers are going to melt. I don't think any amount of prep is going to brace for that impact. I predict things to be significantly worse than PSN's current state on the PS4.

#144 Posted by John1912 (1977 posts) -

Seriously people fucking whine about the dumbest shit these days.

#145 Posted by big_jon (5788 posts) -

This has been stated for months.

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