What Do You Think About Murder Crime Penalties? [Discussion]

In wake of the recent event, where a 40 year old stabbed a random victim in the neck around 50 times, and then cutting his head off, I want to talk about the death penalty.

I know, after reading many posts, comments, and blogs from around the net not this story, and other stories, that eveyone wants him to get put in jail for life, or receive the death penalty. Now, although I don't think the death penalty should be given to anyone, I do think there should be an alternative.

If we funded money into research on memory erasing, this could very well be an alternative for the death penalty, or even life in jail/many years in jail penalty.

But in order for this to work, the method would somehow have to be able to erase certain things, and keep certain things (ie name, etc). And since this has never been deeply researched before, we don't know the exact depth of difficulty this could be to achieve, or if it is even possible. But if it was possible, wouldn't it be a much better alternative then KILLING human beings? Or even putting someone in jail for 10 years?

Imagine being able to study a case, and the person in the case, and be able to remove the past 20 years of their lives memory, or if a case is sevrely bad, removing all lifes memory.

Many might say this in inhuman, but then you must thing about how humane the death penalty is. Which is worse?

So, do you think this could ever happen, should it happen even? Why or why not.

This could very well happen in the future, and I hope it does.  It seems much more humane to erase one's erase memory than to imprison them or kill them.  The punishment should be having your memory wiped.  Perhaps they can live a better life that way.  The only problem I see if the person's memory has been completely wiped; it must suck to relearn everything from starting to walk and talk to AT the very least high school education.

"This could very well happen in the future, and I hope it does.  It seems much more humane to erase one's erase memory than to imprison them or kill them.  The punishment should be having your memory wiped.  Perhaps they can live a better life that way.  The only problem I see if the person's memory has been completely wiped; it must suck to relearn everything from starting to walk and talk to AT the very least high school education."

An eye for an eye. You kill someone, you get killed, too. That is my opinion. Now, you can die for many other things in my mind, too. If they are willing to take the life of another human being, forget about (after all, they killed someone) what they think, and kill them. That is just my opinion here.

Easiest and cheapest way to kill someone, bullet to the head. I'm sure there are even more simplistic ways than lethal injection, or, a bullet to the head. But, in my opinion, you think that we should "erase" the persons mind, and what after that? Let them live? A murderer, not imprisoned, and not dead, just roaming the streets?

For instance, what about child molesters? Instead of the death penalty (which, I think, they should all die, absolutely disgusting crime), we could also use the alternative "erase" mind trick?

I'm probably coming off pretty harsh/hard, but the death penalty is a very touchy subject to me.

"An eye for an eye. You kill someone, you get killed, too. That is my opinion. Now, you can die for many other things in my mind, too. If they are willing to take the life of another human being, forget about (after all, they killed someone) what they think, and kill them. That is just my opinion here.

Easiest and cheapest way to kill someone, bullet to the head. I'm sure there are even more simplistic ways than lethal injection, or, a bullet to the head. But, in my opinion, you think that we should "erase" the persons mind, and what after that? Let them live? A murderer, not imprisoned, and not dead, just roaming the streets?

For instance, what about child molesters? Instead of the death penalty (which, I think, they should all die, absolutely disgusting crime), we could also use the alternative "erase" mind trick?

I'm probably coming off pretty harsh/hard, but the death penalty is a very touchy subject to me.
"

Memory Erasing?
I don't understand how erasing a killer's memory helps anyone.

"Karmum said:

"An eye for an eye. You kill someone, you get killed, too. That is my opinion. Now, you can die for many other things in my mind, too. If they are willing to take the life of another human being, forget about (after all, they killed someone) what they think, and kill them. That is just my opinion here.

Easiest and cheapest way to kill someone, bullet to the head. I'm sure there are even more simplistic ways than lethal injection, or, a bullet to the head. But, in my opinion, you think that we should "erase" the persons mind, and what after that? Let them live? A murderer, not imprisoned, and not dead, just roaming the streets?

For instance, what about child molesters? Instead of the death penalty (which, I think, they should all die, absolutely disgusting crime), we could also use the alternative "erase" mind trick?

I'm probably coming off pretty harsh/hard, but the death penalty is a very touchy subject to me.
"

Yeah, you are coming off as disgusting, actually. Your logic is why the problems in this world exist the way they do. It's ignorance.

You must keep in mind that NO ONE kills someone else for no reason. NO ONE is born a killer. They are raised and a series of events which can happen in trillions of different combinations, play thought a persons life, triggering who they are as a human being. Erasing those aspects of a human erases all aspects of what influenced them to commit the crimes that they did.

They killed someone because they were made a killer, or a bad person, throught their lives, not born as it. So that person should not be killed for killing. Because they were not born a killer, they were born a human like everyone on this planet was born. It's what happened throughout their lives that made them become that way.

So your logic is just really sickening to the stomach, IMO, where you don't think of people as humans, but as just another person who did something bad so they should automatically suffer. Thats nasty.
"

"Manks said:

"This could very well happen in the future, and I hope it does.  It seems much more humane to erase one's erase memory than to imprison them or kill them.  The punishment should be having your memory wiped.  Perhaps they can live a better life that way.  The only problem I see if the person's memory has been completely wiped; it must suck to relearn everything from starting to walk and talk to AT the very least high school education."

Yeah, totally. But that is the point when I say SOME things can be erased. Money should be funded in researching if it is possible to erase certain times in ones life. Or the past X hours, X years of your memory. So things like your family, and whatnot, wouldn't be erased. Also, that person wouldn't be told they committed a crime, or else it could trigger the crime to come again. Being told 'you killed a man' and then thinking deeper into that, and tying it into your past, could trigger you to move towards that direction, you know.

Obviously they would need to know what happened, but not in the form of 'you were a killer'.
"

this reminds of the movie the Number 23 lol.

We'll probably never be able to erase crap like that.

"We'll probably never be able to erase crap like that.
"

To quote the late George Carlin:

"People now a days are willing to give up their freedom just for a bit of fucking security"

Since this is a video game site, let's look at a game with a powerful message, Metal Gear Solid 4. The Patriots create this Sons of the Patriots program to monitor each and every single minute detail on the battlefield. Soldiers in the battlefield lose all of their "freedom" to do as they see fit, and are fully under control. Near the end of the game, it says that this program was in the stages of being used on the actual civilian population.

What does that say? Something as little as erasing this here and there, could end up become something, which looking into the future, would disgust us. You need to ask yourself the question, what is the cause of this? Because all you're doing is attempting to solve a problem through a method that does not fix the root of all of it. It's like attempting to fix a dam that has holes on the side were the water is coming out by creating some kind of new material to plug it up. All that does is just spread the problem, making it acceptable to have holes, because there is an easy solution to it, in the end though, it's still a persistant problem that continues to rear it's head. Instead you should fix the other side in order to lower the possibilty, or just outright stop any holes from being created.

What I'm getting at is that this is just a patchwork solution, to a much deeper problem. Minority Report does a good job of outlining this.

I'm iffy on the death penalty.
but murderers don't deserve to just have their memory's erased, and inserted back into society.
If its even possibly to selectively erase different parts of our memories

I think that if you kill somebody and if there is undeniable evidence that you killed that somebody, you should be killed as well. Unless it was an accident obviously.

Oh, and about the memory removing thing, that could be kind of risky.  They might still have that part of the brain that gives them the urge to kill and there is now way of knowing for sure if the procedure worked.  They could lie about losing their memory. 

i think we should not kill them but make their lives hell put them in texas in a prison with no ac, no tv, well ok nothing just a room and feed them nothing but the bare minimum and thats how they live. im not really for the death penalty, but letting them walk free is not an option.

"Memory Erasing?
I don't understand how erasing a killer's memory helps anyone."

"Sentry said:

"Karmum said:

"An eye for an eye. You kill someone, you get killed, too. That is my opinion. Now, you can die for many other things in my mind, too. If they are willing to take the life of another human being, forget about (after all, they killed someone) what they think, and kill them. That is just my opinion here.

Easiest and cheapest way to kill someone, bullet to the head. I'm sure there are even more simplistic ways than lethal injection, or, a bullet to the head. But, in my opinion, you think that we should "erase" the persons mind, and what after that? Let them live? A murderer, not imprisoned, and not dead, just roaming the streets?

For instance, what about child molesters? Instead of the death penalty (which, I think, they should all die, absolutely disgusting crime), we could also use the alternative "erase" mind trick?

I'm probably coming off pretty harsh/hard, but the death penalty is a very touchy subject to me.
"

Yeah, you are coming off as disgusting, actually. Your logic is why the problems in this world exist the way they do. It's ignorance.

You must keep in mind that NO ONE kills someone else for no reason. NO ONE is born a killer. They are raised and a series of events which can happen in trillions of different combinations, play thought a persons life, triggering who they are as a human being. Erasing those aspects of a human erases all aspects of what influenced them to commit the crimes that they did.

They killed someone because they were made a killer, or a bad person, throught their lives, not born as it. So that person should not be killed for killing. Because they were not born a killer, they were born a human like everyone on this planet was born. It's what happened throughout their lives that made them become that way.

So your logic is just really sickening to the stomach, IMO, where you don't think of people as humans, but as just another person who did something bad so they should automatically suffer. Thats nasty.
"

Excuse me? You think its fair for somebody to just kill someone, then have the alternative option to just have it all go away? Does the victim have that same option, too? What about the narcissistic assholes that appear in court and try and plead not guilty? Do those people get a second chance? Its just OK to kill someone?

Hypothetical situation, if not one person is killed by someone, but mass amount of people, do the same rules apply there? The person has an option to decide to kill someone or not. Everyone does. Obviously, most of us make the decsion not to do something as sinister as that.

You have the ability to do make decisions, and if you decide to make the decsion to kill somebody who did nothing wrong, may that person burn in hell.
"

"Sentry said:

"Manks said:

"This could very well happen in the future, and I hope it does.  It seems much more humane to erase one's erase memory than to imprison them or kill them.  The punishment should be having your memory wiped.  Perhaps they can live a better life that way.  The only problem I see if the person's memory has been completely wiped; it must suck to relearn everything from starting to walk and talk to AT the very least high school education."

Yeah, totally. But that is the point when I say SOME things can be erased. Money should be funded in researching if it is possible to erase certain times in ones life. Or the past X hours, X years of your memory. So things like your family, and whatnot, wouldn't be erased. Also, that person wouldn't be told they committed a crime, or else it could trigger the crime to come again. Being told 'you killed a man' and then thinking deeper into that, and tying it into your past, could trigger you to move towards that direction, you know.

Obviously they would need to know what happened, but not in the form of 'you were a killer'.
"

Yea we dont want prisoners to wake up vegtable. You erase someones mind they cant even speak."

"I think memory erasing would just drive them to insanity rather than help the situation.I don't care what Ghandi says, imo an eye for an eye makes people think twice about making a stupid decision. Humane forms of death penalty (lethal injection, even the guillotine was somewhat humane other than the fact that it was publicly displayed) are the way to go. If we have harsher punishment for crime, less crime occurrs. We just need to balance it so that we don't get abusive law enforcement."

"AmericanPegasus said:

"We'll probably never be able to erase crap like that.
"

I cannot imagine how much money that would cost, too. Its not like the US isn't in any debt at all, to all the other regions.
"

"I'm iffy on the death penalty.
but murderers don't deserve to just have their memory's erased, and inserted back into society.
If its even possibly to selectively erase different parts of our memories"

By killing someone who's killed another person, you are doubling the wrong...ness. Ity.

It is never okay to kill another human. It- like religion- is archaic and childish.

"By killing someone who's killed another person, you are doubling the wrong...ness. Ity.

It is never okay to kill another human. It- like religion- is archaic and childish.
"

I like the idea of a total memory wipe out.

As opposed to death penalty, which is mainly giving murderers a ticket out of their miserable lives, or prison, in which our tax money goes to keeping them alive and well fed.
They would simply be new people, with a second chance.

Well obviously a lot of you have a nasty way of thinking, in a way where a human should suffer for being a killer. When actually, that person was LEAD to that state, not born in that state, therefore returning them to a time where they were not influenced to be this person, rather then KILLING them, would be the best thing for humanity in general. But people these days think an eye for an eye is right, when it really isn't when you have this option.
"

I dont foresee this ever happening.
Besides, even assuming it happens, psychopathic tendencies can be formed as the result of chronic stress on the brain. That permanently warps the brain's composition. You cant just flip a switch and make it go away.

"I like the idea of a total memory wipe out.

As opposed to death penalty, which is mainly giving murderers a ticket out of their miserable lives, or prison, in which our tax money goes to keeping them alive and well fed.
They would simply be new people, with a second chance.
"

"id say at least 20 years before we get this.  I'm sure they have something that wipes it out and testing with animals, but i bet they're hitting problems with it destroying the brain tissue. Eventually they should be able to be more specific so id imagine they could wipe out mental disorders and whatever."

"Sentry said:

Well obviously a lot of you have a nasty way of thinking, in a way where a human should suffer for being a killer. When actually, that person was LEAD to that state, not born in that state, therefore returning them to a time where they were not influenced to be this person, rather then KILLING them, would be the best thing for humanity in general. But people these days think an eye for an eye is right, when it really isn't when you have this option.
"

i just think I need to interrupt:  They lead themselves to that state.
"

I think that if someone kills someone else, they should be put into prison for life. If it was self defense or an accident then it should be a little different, well I don't know...

Seems like a plan that might happen...

No comment

"In wake of the recent event, where a 40 year old stabbed a random victim in the neck around 50 times, and then cutting his head off, I want to talk about the death penalty.

I know, after reading many posts, comments, and blogs from around the net not this story, and other stories, that eveyone wants him to get put in jail for life, or receive the death penalty. Now, although I don't think the death penalty should be given to anyone, I do think there should be an alternative.

If we funded money into research on memory erasing, this could very well be an alternative for the death penalty, or even life in jail/many years in jail penalty.

But in order for this to work, the method would somehow have to be able to erase certain things, and keep certain things (ie name, etc). And since this has never been deeply researched before, we don't know the exact depth of difficulty this could be to achieve, or if it is even possible. But if it was possible, wouldn't it be a much better alternative then KILLING human beings? Or even putting someone in jail for 10 years?

Imagine being able to study a case, and the person in the case, and be able to remove the past 20 years of their lives memory, or if a case is sevrely bad, removing all lifes memory.

Many might say this in inhuman, but then you must thing about how humane the death penalty is. Which is worse?

So, do you think this could ever happen, should it happen even? Why or why not.
"

Not only that - but if you know for a fact that all that is going ot happen is that your mind is going ot be wiped, - Surely people could thjen just go out and kill someone they didnt like - knowing they aint gonna die for it

And at the end of the court case - *zing* and its all a bad dream

I don't think the death penalty is punishment enough, life in prison would be far more irritating.

As for the death penalty, I think if a state wants to implement it, they should at least make it an available option ONLY and ONLY for recidivists. A person who kills (for no good reason) or rapes for the first time should simply go to prison for a set amoun of time (I say 15 years MAX; keeping inmates in prisons is expensive). If that person comits the same crime again, then give him the death penaltly. Because the truth is: everybody can change. Even the lowest common denominator. There are a lot of people who regret what they have done in their past. But there are also people who simply won't change and will continue to kill or rape. I say these people are undesirable to our society. I don't believe that if they are sent to prison for a second time they are going to come out good boys. If 10 or 15 years of your life didn't change you the first time, it won't the second time. Again, I restate my point: death penalty only available to recidivists.

just kill them...what the hell would a mind eraser do...it dont even make sense.

It would actually benefit some people that want to forget traumatic things...

Hey dont kill him! Or I will make you forget things!

The moment governments invent a mind control substance which they can truly control and use as they wish then I'm running away to the hills, far, far away from civilisation.

The CIA tried this decades ago with MK-ULTRA, it was a mind control program (no it's not a conspiracy but declassified documentation), and they ended up failing with that, thankfully. Who knows what the US government researches into, they've done it in the past so a precedence has already been set.

I'm sorry, but if you kill someone you don't deserve to die. Maybe they could torture you beforehand, but that's it.

"I don't think the death penalty is punishment enough, life in prison would be far more irritating."

"Sentry said:

"In wake of the recent event, where a 40 year old stabbed a random victim in the neck around 50 times, and then cutting his head off, I want to talk about the death penalty.

I know, after reading many posts, comments, and blogs from around the net not this story, and other stories, that eveyone wants him to get put in jail for life, or receive the death penalty. Now, although I don't think the death penalty should be given to anyone, I do think there should be an alternative.

If we funded money into research on memory erasing, this could very well be an alternative for the death penalty, or even life in jail/many years in jail penalty.

But in order for this to work, the method would somehow have to be able to erase certain things, and keep certain things (ie name, etc). And since this has never been deeply researched before, we don't know the exact depth of difficulty this could be to achieve, or if it is even possible. But if it was possible, wouldn't it be a much better alternative then KILLING human beings? Or even putting someone in jail for 10 years?

Imagine being able to study a case, and the person in the case, and be able to remove the past 20 years of their lives memory, or if a case is sevrely bad, removing all lifes memory.

Many might say this in inhuman, but then you must thing about how humane the death penalty is. Which is worse?

So, do you think this could ever happen, should it happen even? Why or why not.
"

It's a good idea for our justice system, but a technology like this has a huge potential to be abused. Erasing people's memory is a almost god-like power, and the government would surely make it into a tool of oppression."

"Not only that - but if you know for a fact that all that is going ot happen is that your mind is going ot be wiped, - Surely people could thjen just go out and kill someone they didnt like - knowing they aint gonna die for it"

"As for the death penalty, I think if a state wants to implement it, they should at least make it an available option ONLY and ONLY for recidivists. A person who kills (for no good reason) or rapes for the first time should simply go to prison for a set amoun of time (I say 15 years MAX; keeping inmates in prisons is expensive). If that person comits the same crime again, then give him the death penaltly. Because the truth is: everybody can change. Even the lowest common denominator. There are a lot of people who regret what they have done in their past. But there are also people who simply won't change and will continue to kill or rape. I say these people are undesirable to our society. I don't believe that if they are sent to prison for a second time they are going to come out good boys. If 10 or 15 years of your life didn't change you the first time, it won't the second time. Again, I restate my point: death penalty only available to recidivists.
"

"just kill them...what the hell would a mind eraser do...it dont even make sense.

It would actually benefit some people that want to forget traumatic things...

Hey dont kill him! Or I will make you forget things!"

"I'm sorry, but if you kill someone you don't deserve to die. Maybe they could torture you beforehand, but that's it.
"

That's the dumbest idea ever....really, even if we had the technology, you'd watch the rate of murders soar through the roof. Which sounds worse, life in a prison with the scum of society. Or having your memory erased?

I'm an advocate of a choice of either sterilization and life in prison or lethal injection.

"Demyx said:

"Memory Erasing?
I don't understand how erasing a killer's memory helps anyone."

Are you serious? Erasing someones past years of which have created them to be a killer. No one is just BORN a killer, they are made a killer.

Karmum said:

"Sentry said:

"Karmum said:

"An eye for an eye. You kill someone, you get killed, too. That is my opinion. Now, you can die for many other things in my mind, too. If they are willing to take the life of another human being, forget about (after all, they killed someone) what they think, and kill them. That is just my opinion here.

Easiest and cheapest way to kill someone, bullet to the head. I'm sure there are even more simplistic ways than lethal injection, or, a bullet to the head. But, in my opinion, you think that we should "erase" the persons mind, and what after that? Let them live? A murderer, not imprisoned, and not dead, just roaming the streets?

For instance, what about child molesters? Instead of the death penalty (which, I think, they should all die, absolutely disgusting crime), we could also use the alternative "erase" mind trick?

I'm probably coming off pretty harsh/hard, but the death penalty is a very touchy subject to me.
"

Yeah, you are coming off as disgusting, actually. Your logic is why the problems in this world exist the way they do. It's ignorance.

You must keep in mind that NO ONE kills someone else for no reason. NO ONE is born a killer. They are raised and a series of events which can happen in trillions of different combinations, play thought a persons life, triggering who they are as a human being. Erasing those aspects of a human erases all aspects of what influenced them to commit the crimes that they did.

They killed someone because they were made a killer, or a bad person, throught their lives, not born as it. So that person should not be killed for killing. Because they were not born a killer, they were born a human like everyone on this planet was born. It's what happened throughout their lives that made them become that way.

So your logic is just really sickening to the stomach, IMO, where you don't think of people as humans, but as just another person who did something bad so they should automatically suffer. Thats nasty.
"

Excuse me? You think its fair for somebody to just kill someone, then have the alternative option to just have it all go away? Does the victim have that same option, too? What about the narcissistic assholes that appear in court and try and plead not guilty? Do those people get a second chance? Its just OK to kill someone?

Hypothetical situation, if not one person is killed by someone, but mass amount of people, do the same rules apply there? The person has an option to decide to kill someone or not. Everyone does. Obviously, most of us make the decsion not to do something as sinister as that.

You have the ability to do make decisions, and if you decide to make the decsion to kill somebody who did nothing wrong, may that person burn in hell.
"

Of course the same rules would apply. We are ALL HUMAN BEINGS on this planet, and the day you think someone was destined to kill people or born a murder, is when everything you should know is failed. How is the decision to kill someone not wrong, when you can make them NOT a killer anymore? No human should have the right to kill another human, whether its someone killing someone innocent, or someone killing a killer. Why should that person "burn in hell" when they can be made a good person again? Erase what made them this bad person.

sculsoldi3r said:

"Sentry said:

"Manks said:

"This could very well happen in the future, and I hope it does.  It seems much more humane to erase one's erase memory than to imprison them or kill them.  The punishment should be having your memory wiped.  Perhaps they can live a better life that way.  The only problem I see if the person's memory has been completely wiped; it must suck to relearn everything from starting to walk and talk to AT the very least high school education."

Yeah, totally. But that is the point when I say SOME things can be erased. Money should be funded in researching if it is possible to erase certain times in ones life. Or the past X hours, X years of your memory. So things like your family, and whatnot, wouldn't be erased. Also, that person wouldn't be told they committed a crime, or else it could trigger the crime to come again. Being told 'you killed a man' and then thinking deeper into that, and tying it into your past, could trigger you to move towards that direction, you know.

Obviously they would need to know what happened, but not in the form of 'you were a killer'.
"

Yea we dont want prisoners to wake up vegtable. You erase someones mind they cant even speak."

Yeah exactly, that would be horrible.

infect999 said:

"I think memory erasing would just drive them to insanity rather than help the situation.I don't care what Ghandi says, imo an eye for an eye makes people think twice about making a stupid decision. Humane forms of death penalty (lethal injection, even the guillotine was somewhat humane other than the fact that it was publicly displayed) are the way to go. If we have harsher punishment for crime, less crime occurrs. We just need to balance it so that we don't get abusive law enforcement."

How would erasing someone past drive them to insanity? It's like being born again, or waking up on the day that you erased their memory back to. And again, thats ignorance, pure stupidity to think that someone should pay for a crime they did with DEATH, when they could just be reset instead to the day where they weren't a killer. Eye for an eye is just the stupidity behind the human thinking, IMO. No offense.

Karmum said:

"AmericanPegasus said:

"We'll probably never be able to erase crap like that.
"

I cannot imagine how much money that would cost, too. Its not like the US isn't in any debt at all, to all the other regions.
"

Yeah, but we spend money doing research on other things of stupidity, but something that could erase crime from streets is of no importance.

Demyx said:

"I'm iffy on the death penalty.
but murderers don't deserve to just have their memory's erased, and inserted back into society.
If its even possibly to selectively erase different parts of our memories"

Why not? It's better then them being killed. At one point in that persons lives, they were a good person, return them to that point and what goes wrong?

Well obviously a lot of you have a nasty way of thinking, in a way where a human should suffer for being a killer. When actually, that person was LEAD to that state, not born in that state, therefore returning them to a time where they were not influenced to be this person, rather then KILLING them, would be the best thing for humanity in general. But people these days think an eye for an eye is right, when it really isn't when you have this option.
"