Major Publishers Silent On Xbox One Used Game Policies [UPDATED]

Way to speak in absolutes, duder.

Honestly I'm fine with whatever Microsoft does, so long as Microsoft is fine with not having me as an Xbox customer.

I get that the Wii U is underpowered compared to these next-gen consoles. But it makes a lot more sense now why publishers like EA seem to vehemently hate the Wii U right now. Nintendo won't get into bed with them on this whole used game scheme.

There are basic rules to getting your product mass appeal and into the hands of millions.

1.Put up as few barriers as possible. The more hoops someone has to jump through to get your product, the less people that will care.

2. Do not exclude people needlessly. If cost, a feature, availability or the like keeps your product out of the hands of people, make damd sure the plus side far outweighs those you have excluded.

3. Respect the consumer. If you make the consumer feel like criminals or that you as a company do not care, you will eventually go away, no matter how popular you are. And good riddance.

Micro$oft may have forgotten these basic rules. Hell, the whole industry may be headed in the same direction. I hope Sony takes this to heart and makes any last minute changes they need to. I am NOT a criminal. My PC works fine. GOG is drm free. Tread lightly consoles.

The winners for Generation 8:

Smartphones

PC

Handhelds

Yup. Right there with you guys. If people are "early adopters", guaranteed they have internet and it certainly is apparent in all the other forums. Trolls ready to burn Microsoft to the ground aren't just getting online with their smart phone. I've said it once and I'll say it 10 times more, my PRINTER at home is "always online." My 500$ console damn well better be as well. And even if PS4 doesn't have this restriction, it will be extremely limited if condemned to an internet free home. I mean the damned thing has a "share" button just for the myface.

Only thing I am waiting for to ACTUALLY help make up my mind is the games announced this week. Exclusivity is key.

@waffles13: that's not the point. You name one other company that has the balls to tell a customer "oh if it goes offline it won't work at all but hey you can do something else in the meantime". No dah I can do something else but if I'm paying 400 to 500 bucks on a system, I would like to think I get to choose when I want to do something else.

You give any other device these policies and I bet you it would not fly with consumers.

@huey2k2: Are you not just guessing on that though. Has Sony even mentioned doing what MS is planning? Usually a company will leak a plan like this to see the reaction. I have heard nothing from Sony that their DRM will be any different then what it is now.

This will be remembered as the generation that killed the consoles as we knew them. In the future all of our consoles will look like TV optimized PC's and we will talk about the old days when you just had to insert a cartridge or a disc, press the start button and play!

Hell! with Microsoft it would seem that they even managed to make TV more complicated... Still, those new consoles seem like really cool boxes but I don't see the appeal to use them over a PC if I have to install the games and activate them online to play (not to mention about the existing issues with the updates and account management). I guess that is why Microsoft is pushing so hard on the TV stuff and their Kinect thing, to differentiate from the PC. Now how about Sony and their PS4? If they also introduce all these hurdles as expected what would they have left to differentiate themselves from a TV connected PC (except for drivers management)?

This has got to be the worst logic I've ever heard.

I've said it once and I'll say it 10 times more, my [cheap product] at home [has a bad feature]. My [expensive product] damn well better be [bad in the same way].

What is really ironic is that before the unveiling of the new consoles everybody was wondering what Sony and Microsoft will do to get people excited about the next generation as better graphics would definitely not be enough this time around.

Now it would seem that anything that Sony and Microsoft will have except for these better graphics are crazy DRM management (let's not count a share button on my controller and a better Kinect as a breakthrough feature)... Is DRM management supposed to get me excited?

Awesome! An article or effort like this was exactly what I've been thinking about and eventually straight up asked for after wading through yesterday's news and comments. I also figured it would likely result in this kind of very careful and spin driven response. Still, we can't just sit around like the devs and publishers Vinny was joking about at the end of the, "An Xbox One DRM Breakdown." Slyly looking at each other and trying to hedge every bet, we should straight up ask for answers. Even if the answers we get are poor the questions have value.

There are those of us out here, trying hard to make an informed and rational decision and efforts like these are appreciated. We aren't whining, we aren't spewing hate filled backlash at the Xbox One, we aren't freaking out. We see the differences between console style and Steam style delivery and customer expectations when dealing with these styles. We don't believe in unproven claims of used games destroying the industry. We don't fear change, in fact, we accept and desire change. Change for the better. Saying to accept all change because nothing is stagnant is akin, in my mind, to saying, "We're all gonna die so roll over and get on with it already."

In the aforementioned video Vinny also brought up the concept of a true change in digital rights management. The idea that the rights holder could be properly involved in the control of those rights, whatever they may be. Yes, the old chestnut about how we don't own the games and haven't for a long time due to EULA is a valid point in this topic but we also have to look at how the reality of that played out. If the effort to enforce that EULA didn't go beyond the words printed on the page what actual validity did it have?

@nettacki: The only people who are "directly affected" are the ones who don't buy games new. Those are the SAME people who caused this to happen because they don't contribute to anyone's success except for Gamestop's

At least Japan was polite enough to send a "fuck you, that's what our used game policy is."

The funny thing was, Konami was never asked for their input.

I couldn't give less of a shit about the used game thing. I haven't bought a used game in like 5 years. I prefer to buy them new months later when the price has dropped a bit. That way I'm happy and the publishers are happy.

@rebgav: I used to work at a magazine where the friggin EIC used to make this mistake all. The. Time. And I pointed it out to him, yet it kept slipping into the copy. Maddening.

Grammar-Nerd Out.

Just... what a mess

My question to all those fine with these policies is; what are you getting in return for giving up the ability to play offline and to sell your games to whomever you want?

Probably skipping the XBONE this gen. Hope Sony does better. If not I've got my PC.

Me too. Happy publishers (hopefully) means better games. I've got the internet, I have a 4g phone. There will never be a time where I'm without an internet connection. I don't believe that a bunch of people circlejerking on the internet will really have that much of an impact when these things launch and they're pretty much the same console anyway. Really excited to see what's up at E3

I have a decent gaming rig but there is no way in hell I am willing to miss out on the likes of Uncharted, The Last of Us, Ni No Kuni and many many exclusives I love on my PS3.

The comments from PC snobs in some of these threads is ridiculous, I loved Bioshock Infinite and FarCry 3 etc on the PC but if you love games I cannot see how you can ignore the tremendous stuff that comes out exclusively on console. For all the great games I have enjoyed on PC, I cannot imagine never playing Uncharted, Ratchet & Clank, MGS or Infamous etc.

All this bellyaching will make not one bit of difference once the games start getting released. People will buy the console and the games - its a cold hard fact. The publishers know this, they will take the PR hiding now and a year from now will be rolling in our cash.

I don't like it any more than anyone else, but its inevitable.

The Great Nightmare Continues!

I always buy my games new, but it still affects me because I take those games back and trade them in for more new games. The only people it doesn't affect are those that buy their games new and keep them forever. A gamer may no longer have the ability to trade in last weeks new game for this weeks new game. I won't be able to (near as often anyway) contribute to publishers/devs new game sales.

@cusseta: o no those people are just sooo dispicable taking advantage of the market

I have to wonder how much of this was driven by the publishers.

Okay, that's almost a stupid question. I'm sure a very large portion of this was driven by the publishers. Probably something along the lines of, "If you don't implement these policies like we want, we're willing to not port multi-plat games to your system." I can imagine Microsoft being the first to get on board with this, probably snagging a few exclusives in the deal, and really putting the screws to Sony & Nintendo. Maybe Sony balked. But they have to know that the major sellers are still shooters, and that their native shooters have only penetrated so much of the market (so far). Nintendo, obviously, just bowed out of the whole thing and is waiting for it to explode in the faces of Sony & Microsoft.

Then again, maybe I'm completely off. I'm just wildly speculating.

This gives a new story to why publishers may be abandoning the Wii U, if you're into conspiracy theories. Given there is no such policy about used games or mandatory online with that console, they could be leaving it do to greater ability to control their IPs.

Just thought of something. Does anyone know, or think this might conflict with the First Sale Doctrine? Considering you will essentially not be able to directly sell your games without some sort of intermediary?

First Sale Doctrine (Justice.gov)

First Sale Doctrine (Wikipedia)

@spydrmrphy: Depends on the EULA and other Terms around the sale. If they aren't actually "selling" the game but rather licensing your usage of it (as with lots of digital media) then there wasn't an initial sale so you have no ownership over the product and therefore cannot sell it.

All of this stuff just makes me feel like I'm probably coming to the end of my time with gaming, and I'm fine with that.

We'll find out by the end of the year but I feel the heyday of console gaming is over. The industry has been shrinking the last few years and a new crop of hardware might be just what it needs. I'm worried things will continue trending downward despite the best efforts of all the big players.

Good Lord, do you honestly believe that used games are "killing" the industry?

This isn't a real thought. It can't be.

In the event that you're not joking, this is ridiculous. I buy new games when the game is something I really want to play. Like Tomb Raider, I traded in to buy new if it's something I am not sure about or I know I won't hold on to for a while. I can buy it full price and then flip it in a private sale for $40 a week or so later. Then I use that $40 to buy another new game. I rent or buy used when it's something I'm interested in but wary of like Dead Island Riptide. Removing my ability to buy used or rent games does affect the publisher because I will buy less games knowing I have to either keep the game or sell it to a "participating retailer" for what will most likely be far less that $40. So instead of buying 6 big titles a year I buy 3. Who do you think that affects? Me?

See, I've avoided PC gaming for this very reason.

PC gamers use "adieu" instead of "ado."

Don't go for it. It too is kinda crappy. Or at least overpriced.

Obviously I am just guessing, and so are you.

But let's think about this logically for a second, you're a big publisher, EA/Activision/Whatever. You are pushing really hard for MS and Sony to let you decide whether or not people are allowed to buy/sell used games. MS agrees and gives you what you want. Sony says "fuck you" and refuses to let you make those decisions for them.

What is to stop you, the publisher from giving a big fuck you back and simply refusing to make 3rd party games for that platform?

It's not unprecedented. EA has all but abandoned the WiiU. If you are Sony, do you really want to take the risk that a big publisher will just abandon your platform for your biggest rival?

Do you really think the shareholders would allow that?

It's easy to live in this fantasy world where Sony is the console white knight who rides in to save you from DRM, but they are a multi billion dollar publicly shared company. They are just as evil as Microsoft. In the end they are going to do what makes the most sense for their business and their shareholders.

Not you.

@huey2k2: You underestimate the power being a hero. Look at Valve. BS business practices with Steam badges and trading cards, but they get a free pass, because Gabe Newell is so well renowned.

After reading some comments, I'm surprised at how many people are ready to lie down and take this. I love gaming on my PC, but there was a reason I loved consoles so much more. I do prefer a controller. Beside that, consoles were plug and play and you owned the games! No CD keys. No running the game in compatibility mode, if it will even work on your OS. No mapping keys to the controller. No hassles. Just bust out your SNES, PS1, Dreamcast, PS2, or original Xbox from storage, throw in a game and go! Sometimes I still want to play a 10 plus year old game. I don't have to connect to the SNES or Dreamcast network to do it, either. I could not care less about used games, but these new draconian policies are what they are, and only take away your right to play what you purchased. A lot of games released on previous operating systems do not work on newer versions of windows and require work arounds only possible on an open ended PC because Micro$oft does not give a danmd. Micro$oft will not be adding backwards compatibility the the Xbone. So keep your 360's. They do not require an internet connection to play what you bought. When the Xbone 2 comes out, your Xbone one games may be useless. All that cash in the trash. Don't worry. Micro$oft may let you buy them again if they can get the rights from the 3rd party publisher. If not, your not only out of cash, your Xboned.

You are comparing apples to oranges.

Valve has exactly the DRM that everyone is scared of. Publishers don't give free passes, consumers do.

@huey2k2: You severely underestimate the power of the consumer. Micro$oft and Sony are not in charge, YOU are. There are presidents for when big companies take a stand. I remember Rockstar being Playstation only, and then one day a bigwig must have asked "How many Xbox consoles are on the market?" "Introducing the GTA collection for Xbox!" Console makers as well. Mortal Kombat released with gore on the Genesis and not on the SNES. Nintendo made a statement how they would not allow that filth on their console. The genesis MK sold like hotcakes. MK2 on SNES now had all the gore of the Genesis version. Vote with your dollars and they will adapt or die.

These are doomsday scenarios. Publishers would not be willing to risk losing their game sales to spite a publisher. What happens if the XBONE fails and they have NO sales all of a sudden? Who's shareholders are going to be complaining now?

Not to say that I don't agree that publishers would put pressure on the console holders, Mircrosft and Sony both, just that the idea they would not publish for the PS3 is pretty crazy for a business that wants to cover all angles. They're only pulling out of Wii U NOW because it's proven to be such a failed system.

THIS

Those soccer moms are finna RAGE

That's all anyone really needs.

Sony's console, so far as we know, does not connect once every 24 hours, so it literally cannot have the same policies. Why does everyone keep saying it will?

Thanks for your work Patrick

Keep bothering them!

@n2nother: Because you've never made a mistake before. Pedant.

First they came for the socialists,

and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,

and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,

and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me,

and there was no one left to speak for me.

- Martin Niemöller

This is not a good sign at all folks. Time to bail out.

Except that Microsoft has weekly sales(Deals of the Week) on stuff in the Markletplace as well as seasonal sales and promotions. And Microsoft has been taking so many ques from Steam already that I'm expecting them to pretty much copy it whole hog come launch or shortly after. And they might also remove the requirement of indi developers forced to have a publisher to release their games on XBL to make it friendlier since that has been a big source of bad industry publicity. And they probably will move away from the 2 arcade games a week policy and the release queue since now that everything will be released on the Marketplace, having restrictions on arcade games make no sense. I think publishing and pricing games on the XBLM will get a big overhaul on the Xbox One.

@edgarallanpwn: You realize this is all on the publishers right? This isn't something the XBO decides