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Q&A: Sony Computer Entertainment's Shuhei Yoshida

Sony's Worldwide Studios boss talks about backward compatibility, new technology, and the challenges of communication.

Shuhei Yoshida speaking to reporters yesterday.
Shuhei Yoshida speaking to reporters yesterday.

The morning following Wednesday's PlayStation 4 announcement, Sony provided reporters access to Worldwide Studios head Shuhei Yoshida, who did not appear during the presentation, but nonetheless has been on-hand to talk to press about the company's direction for its new hardware.

Throughout yesterday's roundtable meeting, Yoshida was a mix of cagey and effusive, willing to talk at length about certain things left hanging following last night's announcement, and tabling others for a later date. Here's a brief overview of what was talked about, and how he chose to respond to those questions.

The Box

Much ado has been made about Sony's decision to not show the console box itself, instead opting to show the new DualShock 4 controller and the in-system interface. Yoshida was blunt about why this was the case, responding simply that the final design of the console is "not finalized." He was cagey about whether or not we'd see it, or really anything else regarding the PS4 prior to E3, opting to defer to his PR handler, who wouldn't confirm one way or the other.

The PlayStation 4 Eye

The new 3D camera peripheral, which was briefly touched on during Wednesday's presentation, is something Yoshida was happy to talk about and describe. "How it works is the PlayStation 4 Eye has two HD cameras," he said. "These two cameras can be used in several different ways. One way is to use as triangulation, so that the 3D space in front of the camera can be measured, and can separate the player image. Face tracking will be much more robust. Another way is to make our augmented reality games, like Wonderbook, look much nicer. Using one camera for the video streaming of the player image, and the other to focus elsewhere, two separate camera settings to optimize for whatever task."

He was, however, less willing to talk about how the Eye might be bundled with the system, saying only that "we are not ready to confirm what will or won't be in the box."

Used Games

Eurogamer effectively was able to get Yoshida to confirm last night that the PlayStation 4 won't feature any specific technology designed to prevent players from playing used games on their system. Since then, multiple quotes have popped up leading one to believe that maybe it's not as cut-and-dried as all of that. Yoshida's answer during our talk seemed to confirm his original statement, as he stated that "all disc games on PS4 will work with any PS4."

He was a bit more coy when addressing whether any such restrictions could be employed by other publishers, as with specific registration codes or other technologies designed to hinder the used market. All he would say was, "It's a publisher decision," and that "there are all sorts of capabilities."

Remote Play

"I would be heartbroken if this functionality wasn't available at launch," said Yoshida, regarding remote play capabilities for all PS4 games.

One of Sony's big tentpole features for the PS4 is the notion that all PS4 games will potentially be playable via the Vita using remote play streaming. Yoshida was asked about whether or not all games would support this at launch. His response? "The remote play side, we are saying virtually every PS4 game will be cross-play compatible with PS Vita. I would be heartbroken if this functionality wasn't available at launch. My feeling is that we have to have all games work with this."

Gaikai

Yoshida was asked whether the Gaikai infrastructure would be something we'd see on other relevant PlayStation platforms, such as the PS3. "That's the vision," he replied. "That's what Dave Perry said. In the future, the ultimate goal is everything everywhere. When we say everywhere, we mean every device, including the smart phones, TVs, what have you. That's our goal."

Backward Compatibility

Sony made it relatively clear last night that PS3 games and other PlayStation titles would not be natively supported on the PS4. However, he was less clear when discussing the possibility of future emulation for PS1 and/or PS2 games, saying only, "we are not talking about our Emulation plans yet" and that "there won't be native support for those games."

Region Locking

I asked Yoshida about the possibility of region locking going away in the next generation. However, he did not respond, saying only that he knows the answer to the question, but did not want to get an unhappy call from his PR department.

Peripheral Compatibility

When asked whether or not the PS4 would support previous hardware, Yoshida explained that the system will not support old DualShock controllers, but will obviously support PS Move controllers, as was briefly demonstrated last night.

3D Support

Sony made a big push toward stereoscopic 3D gaming on the PlayStation 3, but hasn't mentioned up to this point any potential support for it in the PS4. Yoshida had this to say on the subject:

"It's not a focus. It does do [stereoscopic 3D], and it does do it better. Because of our basic capability is higher, more games will run in 1080p, 60 frames, etc, so it's an easier and better experience when you watch on a 3D TV. But the 3D was a big thing a couple of years ago, we made it a big thing, because it was led by the consumer electronics side of Sony. And you know, we like what you can do with 3D on the PS3. But now the consumer electronics side of Sony have shifted focus from 3D TVs to something else. So, if they're not talking about it, why are we?"

4K Support

Yoshida was asked about whether or not the PS4 would support Sony's proprietary high-resolution, titled 4K. According to him, the system will provide 4K output for TVs that support it, but that content will be "personal content," IE home movies and such. Games, video services, and the like will not run in the 4K resolution for the foreseeable future.

Hard Drive

We know the PS4 will have a local hard drive, but how upgradeable/interchangeable that hard drive might be is still a question mark. Yoshida's response? "We're not ready to talk about the exchangability of the hard drives, but it's our dream that people are filling up their hard drives on PS4. Because on PS3, not many people did."

An App Store?

When asked whether or not the PS4 might support a more developer-focused self-publishing system like the Apple or Android app store, Yoshida remarked that he would very much like to see something along these lines in the future. "Our network, PlayStation Mobile, is really targeting to do that," he said. "Small developers can publish from any country we support to everywhere we publish. We are discussing internally how we can make it a bit more open, a bit easier, especially for smaller developers to publish. We see the importance of supporting these smaller developers, because they provide some very unique and interesting ideas to the platform. So somewhere in between what we are doing with PlayStation Mobile, and the kind of console publishing model, we'd like to work toward for PS4."

A More Western Influence

I asked Yoshida about the stronger presence of western developers and figureheads at last night's event than in past years. More specifically, I asked whether this represented any kind of sea change at the company, or was simply more emblematic of what Sony had to show at this time. His response wasn't a direct acknowledgment of either answer, though it did provide a bit of insight into his and Mark Cerny's role in the current scope of PlayStation 4 development.

"More and more development is done outside of Japan. Mark Cerny is a game developer, but he's very knowledgeable about hardware, he speaks Japanese, he's a nice partner to have. Because it takes a certain kind of understanding to work with Japan. It's a very strange place.

"Depending on the developer, the performance can be really really important," said Yoshida, speaking in regards to trying to balance the needs of different developers.

It's hard. I moved from the US to Japan a few years ago. I used to work there, but there are many new people. I was away from Japan for eight years. Coming back to Japan, the communication is very intense. You have to be there to understand how it works. Mark is able to bridge the two different cultures, and it's amazing. I'm there not because I'm running the studios at all in Japan, we have Alan Becker, and he's been doing a great job in my mind. I'm there because I can join the hardware team to bridge hardware guys with our Worldwide Studio resources. Mark is doing that from the tech side, I'm doing that from the game development side, making sure that the hardware guys have all the resources we have outside Japan, so that they are able to design and build the PS4."

The Challenges of Messaging

Lastly, I asked Yoshida about the challenges inherent to trying to excite consumers about a device using methods other than just pure visual prowess. Wednesday's demos highlighted plenty of technical achievements, but many of them had more to do with interface, usability, and functionality, than graphical power. Yoshida acknowledged that balancing this message has been a challenge for Sony. "The simplest answer is we want both. People like David Cage, for him the higher performance is really important, because what he wants to do is make a digital character really look like a human being. So depending on the developer, the performance can be really really important. Some consumers are really socially addicted, like myself, those people, it's really important for them to be able to share what they are doing, or communicate and see what other people are doing in the community, and that's our focus. But some people are totally untied, they're like, 'why do you want to expose your privacy?' There are many different consumers and many different developer focuses, so we want to be able to cater to these different needs."

Alex Navarro on Google+

82 Comments

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bug9329

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I'm pretty confident that both PS4 and the next Xbox will allow publishers to easily gate used disks. Currently, with EA's "Project $10," you receive a code to access multiplayer content and you buy that code for used games. PS4 and Xbox-next will not need you to type in a code for a new game since they will know the disk is new (And the code will probably be on some tag embedded in the disk).

This will make it easier for the users and while I am sure that some smaller publishers will use this feature to completely block used game sales, I suspect that EA and Activision will use this new seamless capability to blackmail Game Stop and other used game sellers into sharing the profits or at least not undercutting week 1 sales with used games. I like used games being available but I understand why EA would be angry with Game Stop convincing customers to buy a used game over a new game the first week of release.

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Hamabama

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Good read. Thanks- I know the text doesn't get the same love as video.

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IzunaDrop

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Edited By IzunaDrop

I cannot imagine the whole region locking structure suddenly being abandoned.

Persona 4: Arena was the most recent game to bring this issue to the fore, and one reason behind region-lock seems to be to allow sales projections by region to have at least a chance of being accurate. For instance if ATLUS wants to sell Euro distribution rights to someone, and there is no region-lock, how are they meant to negotiate a price for this? The other issue is that the publishers maximise their total sales by regionally pricing.

As an Aussie, I would love to have been playing P4A for months and Fire Emblem for almost a month at this point. Instead I have to wait for line upon line of text to be translated to 6 languages for the PAL release.

Sure, I would prefer region-lock gone, but I do not see this changing.

The one that really gets me on edge is region-locked game lobbies, way to kill the multiplayer community for your game...

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KamasamaK

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Edited By KamasamaK

@alex said:

I asked Yoshida about the possibility of region locking going away in the next generation. However, he did not respond, saying only that he knows the answer to the question...

Earlier in the article...

Yoshida said:

all disc games on PS4 will work with any PS4.
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happypup70

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I cannot imagine the whole region locking structure suddenly being abandoned.

Persona 4: Arena was the most recent game to bring this issue to the fore, and one reason behind region-lock seems to be to allow sales projections by region to have at least a chance of being accurate. For instance if ATLUS wants to sell Euro distribution rights to someone, and there is no region-lock, how are they meant to negotiate a price for this? The other issue is that the publishers maximise their total sales by regionally pricing.

As an Aussie, I would love to have been playing P4A for months and Fire Emblem for almost a month at this point. Instead I have to wait for line upon line of text to be translated to 6 languages for the PAL release.

Sure, I would prefer region-lock gone, but I do not see this changing.

The one that really gets me on edge is region-locked game lobbies, way to kill the multiplayer community for your game...

That's some great insight. I cannot see region locking going away completely until we are a one world nation. Maybe this will happen, probably it won't. The world market is still and will be for the foreseeable future be a collection of smaller markets. each market with it's own demands and costs. The video game industry is an international industry but has to do business in these regional markets. Region locking seems to be the best option right now. Maybe with time and the propagation of digital releases other options will be considered.

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KamasamaK

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@alex said:

Yoshida was asked about whether or not the PS4 would support Sony's proprietary high-resolution, titled 4K.

I do not think this word means what you think it means.

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GaspoweR

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Btw 4k isn't Sony proprietary tech like Blu-Ray

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Devil240Z

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Edited By Devil240Z

What loser hasn't filled up a ps3 hard drive? I have a 320 gig and its full as fuck. ive been upgrading them since day one. its too dam easy to fill those tiny ass drives with big ass games.

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NTM

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@insidioustuna:@thebiolover: What?

@jams: Hm. Interesting. Yeah, it still says two messages, but I did at least get the new ones that have been posted towards this one, though it was somewhat garbled 'cause I couldn't quite tell who was saying what. Thanks. I hope it's fixed sometime soon.

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SasquatchRuby

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Edited By SasquatchRuby
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IndoAssassin

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If you guys are looking for a little insight into the ps4 specs. Pcper.com has a podcast discussing it. They go into some good detail about the architecture.

http://www.pcper.com/news/General-Tech/Podcast-239-NVIDIA-GTX-TITAN-PlayStation-4-Hardware-SSD-Endurance-and-more

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Rupee

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do people really care what the box looks like

it's a box that you don't look at it except when you turn the console on

if it was shaped like a giant penis and covered the entire wall i can see why it'd be a problem but it doesn't, so why do people care about the box

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mattclassic

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I'm still blown away by the 8GB of RAM, and GDDR5 at that. That's an insane leap over the PS3/360.

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DedBeet

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@rupee said:

do people really care what the box looks like

it's a box that you don't look at it except when you turn the console on

if it was shaped like a giant penis and covered the entire wall i can see why it'd be a problem but it doesn't, so why do people care about the box

Apparently they do. Much of the negative press I've seen was about them not showing the PS4 hardware. So stupid. No one expected them to show this early at all and, when they do, they complain they didn't show everything.

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Bollard

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@gaspower said:

@chavtheworld said:

@hassun said:

@leebmx: When in doubt about technical stuff, go to Richard Leadbetter at Digital Foundry (hosted on Eurogamer). It still amazes me he is one of the only people out there doing this kind of thing.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/df-hardware-spec-analysis-playstation-4

Just reading that article it occurred to me they glossed over the whole "unified" part of the RAM. URAM is really interesting from the research journals I've just been reading, it's like DRAM combined with flash memory. Which basically means you can choose whether you want it to be volatile, and have super fast read/write like DRAM, or non-volatile and store for up to years with no power on.

That's how Sony is gunna be doing the whole put your machine into sleep mode, with no power thing. And that's pretty cool. I have no idea what the performance implications are gunnna be on it, I mean, theoretically the URAM should be as fast as normal DRAM. But this is the first time I've ever heard of it being used in a commercial device.

And GDDR5 to boot, it has to be so damn expensive right?

John Carmack also had something interesting to say on Twitter regarding the Sony hardware.

It's a shame he can't talk freely, he'd provide a better insight than anyone on the matter. Plus I'm still curious about this whole URAM thing. I want to know if what Sony is calling "unified RAM" really is the same as this URAM, which would be awesome.

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probablytuna

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Please let the PS4 be region free.

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platina32

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Edited By platina32

"We're not ready to talk about the exchangability of the hard drives, but it's our dream that people are filling up their hard drives on PS4. Because on PS3, not many people did."

That seems to hint to a big HDD, which is good. PS3 HDD was too small in the beginning (40GB, I still have it and I can only install 5 games or so). I hope for 1TB or more. Under that:

No Caption Provided

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striderno9

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Edited By striderno9

Great write up Alex. I really appreciate how candidly he speaks. Obviously he is just as much a suit as the next guy but he comes off sort of humble and human. Which I prefer to the canned ones we tend to get sometimes.

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dropabombonit

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Yoshida is a great dude, he was very candid on the couple of Podcast Beyond's that he has appeared on. He also properly cares about what those guys think because he will bring up things that they have said on the podcast before. I just can't imagine a op level MS employee listening to a podcast in this way

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dezvous

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Edited By dezvous

@spartyon: I wouldn't be so worried, these things are always sold at a loss.

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leebmx

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@gaspower said:

@chavtheworld said:

@hassun said:

@leebmx: When in doubt about technical stuff, go to Richard Leadbetter at Digital Foundry (hosted on Eurogamer)

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/df-hardware-spec-analysis-playstation-4

....theoretically the URAM should be as fast as normal DRAM. But this is the first time I've ever heard of it being used in a commercial device.

And GDDR5 to boot, it has to be so damn expensive right?

John Carmack also had something interesting to say on Twitter regarding the Sony hardware.

It's a shame he can't talk freely, he'd provide a better insight than anyone on the matter. Plus I'm still curious about this whole URAM thing. I want to know if what Sony is calling "unified RAM" really is the same as this URAM, which would be awesome.

"theoretically the URAM should be as fast as normal DRAM. But this is the first time I've ever heard of it being used in a commercial device."

would it be the same style of functionality present in the PSP , where you get to turn it off mid-pause , then when-EVER you turn it back on , instantly on the game ? because that would be cool and it is a commercial device that has that feature , if that is the type of thing everyone is talking about .

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FesteringNeon

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Edited By FesteringNeon

@quarters said:

Sounds like their heads are in the right place. Awesome.

agreed.

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Bollard

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@chavtheworld said:

@gaspower said:

@chavtheworld said:

@hassun said:

@leebmx: When in doubt about technical stuff, go to Richard Leadbetter at Digital Foundry (hosted on Eurogamer)

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/df-hardware-spec-analysis-playstation-4

....theoretically the URAM should be as fast as normal DRAM. But this is the first time I've ever heard of it being used in a commercial device.

And GDDR5 to boot, it has to be so damn expensive right?

John Carmack also had something interesting to say on Twitter regarding the Sony hardware.

It's a shame he can't talk freely, he'd provide a better insight than anyone on the matter. Plus I'm still curious about this whole URAM thing. I want to know if what Sony is calling "unified RAM" really is the same as this URAM, which would be awesome.

"theoretically the URAM should be as fast as normal DRAM. But this is the first time I've ever heard of it being used in a commercial device."

would it be the same style of functionality present in the PSP , where you get to turn it off mid-pause , then when-EVER you turn it back on , instantly on the game ? because that would be cool and it is a commercial device that has that feature , if that is the type of thing everyone is talking about .

Yeah that's pretty much what it should be able to do, if they are using actual URAM. The first thing I wanna do if I get my hands on a PS4 is put it on standby and unplug it, then plug it back in and see if it still resumes. Cause that would be awesome.

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yukoasho

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Edited By yukoasho

"all disc games on PS4 will work with any PS4."

He was a bit more coy when addressing whether any such restrictions could be employed by other publishers, as with specific registration codes or other technologies designed to hinder the used market. All he would say was, "It's a publisher decision," and that "there are all sorts of capabilities."

Seemed pretty clear-cut to me. The discs will work, and EA will keep putting their stupid online passes in them.

Really, what I'm curious about is whether Sony will continue with Online Passes. Ubi's been a bit back and forth, Warner seems to have abandoned them after the Arkham City fiasco (notice no online pass for Arkham City GOTY, MK Komplete, or Lego Batman 2 Vita), Activision only tried it once with Prototype 2 and presumably didn't see whatever increase in new sales for the title as being worth the effort, and THQ no longer exists, leaving EA as the only third-party that uses the scheme on a regular basis.

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@lively said:

I think he's saying all the right things at this point. From what's been announced, the PS4 will be a huge leap forward in hardware. 512MB of memory was way too small for the PS3. 8GB of unified GDDR5 is practically an embarrassment of riches by comparison.

Microsoft has their work cut out for them if they want to keep up.

I'm sure he's telling the truth that the console will play used disc-based games, but I'm hopeful that they get their act together and start deeply discounting the digital editions. That would under-cut Gamestop, if they're really so worried about losing profits to the second-hand market. PC Gamers / Steam users have been living in the future, it's time console peasants joined us.

I think what they will do with digital games eventually add it to PSN+ free subscriber game thing, but at the same time discount it maybe 10%-20% off for digital downloads. Or maybe they will do the Steam thing with sales and all.

That does remind me, I really do wonder what happened to that thing Valve and Sony had going when Sony allowed Steam on the PS3. I wonder if Valve and Sony decide to pursue it further since Gabe Newell has less than nice things to say about Microsoft, Windows 8, and their push to integrate it into altogether in one environment.

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Edited By kosayn

Glad to have this info.

I think they will come up with some sort of plan for backwards compatibility, for 'greatest hits.' They'll definitely want their high selling digital titles to carry over no matter what. It hasn't been great for back compat on the PS3 - very few good PS2 games are available digitally, and the people with launch PS3s have tiny hard drives. I suppose the only folks who have a nice large Sony library on one console are people who reinstalled hard drives to launch PS3s and carefully babied the system to make it last, or pirates.

The big problem on PS4 is whether back compat games could be bug-free in light of the new proposed features. Suspend/Resume, recording gameplay, incremental downloads to start playing faster, and sharing - I think the new PS4 games might have to be custom designed with supporting those features in mind, and the old emulated games would have to be reworked, either that or say 'no new features for emulated games.' That's no good - they want active, connected users if their grandiose network concepts are to succeed. It'd be especially tough for PS3 games, which almost all have online components, installed portions, updates, and so on of their own to manage, on a new system with a different architecture.

Basically it sounds like it would be a lot of work, an unreasonable amount. They need to prioritize the new content, as much as I and others want to retire our old consoles.

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BoFooQ

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@platina32: I was fine with the small HD is ps3 cause when I bought my 60GB second time I filled it up I pulled it out and replaced it with 500GB. It only cost me $70 for the harddrive but the differance in cost if I had bought larger HD from sony to start with have been over $100 probably.

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Edited By BasketSnake

How much ram can a ram ram into if a ram rams some ram?

I've been thinking about for a few minutes and I think I know the answer: 4k.

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datarez

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Wow, Yoshida is really honest. I'm enjoying this new Sony.