I have no idea what DICE are doing and why they're so goddamn terrible at post-release support (WHERE IS THE GODDAMN PATCH SPRING IS NOT A MONTH AGO WHEN IT WAS NEEDED), but I'll check it out. Seems kind of terrible but it's more BF, a series I used to love.

Probably not. I was reading some of the stuff they were talking and then wondering how the hell any of it was suppose to run on the Xbox version which already runs like crap. When is the patch coming out? Before this DLC I hope.

@Akrid said:

@Seppli: If I was playing on consoles, I'd probably have similar feelings. You really can't lone wolf it in BF3. But voice chat over PC with a good group of guys makes this into the best multiplayer experience you could ever ask for. Your squad, working as one, makes the kind of difference that you had in BC2, and it's all the more amazing because you did it with friends! If you ever go to PC, I can guarantee you a good time.

Anway, this map pack intrigues me. I'd probably prefer more standard maps, but I'm interested to see what they do with these. I think that clip gives a partial look, because from what you see there there's no reason to not use a MP7 or shotgun or whatnot. There must be more to it then that - I have faith that DICE can balance it well and make it interesting.

I am playing on PC. It's not about that. It's about MY power. I hate 'forced' teamplay. I'm helpless against XYZ, so I have to rely on others. Most kits in the Bad Company games were able to do AT. In BF3 much fewer loadouts are effective against vehicles.

Perfect example is small arms damage on helicopters as seen in BF:BC 1 and BF:BC 2 Vietnam. I LOVE SMALLARMS DAMAGE ON VEHICLES. In BF3, smallarms are ineffective against pretty much every vehicle. I can't even shoot dudes in a Humvee. I HATE THAT.

That's what I'm harping on. That shitty shitty balancing taking away my power. I never want to be put in a position where all I can do is keep my head down. Empower kits. Give every kit options to deal with any situation. Just with different flavors. That's what I want.

Nope. I come to Battlefield for Battlefield maps. Not Call of Duty. I'll buy the later map packs.

@Seppli: Oh, you are?! Then why aren't ya playing with us?

But yeah, I completely understand your sentiment. It's really annoying that half the classes have no power against vehicles (Though I have a super secret technique for medic). But that's just how the game is! Don't try and fight it, just embrace it and try and have some fun. It works in it's own special way.

Have you tried playing with a good squad with chat? Next time you're up for some BF3, hit me up and we'll play - as a team. It'll be fun!

@sideshow said:

ill buy it.. more for the weapons than for the maps though..

Damn you.

I hate the idea of this map pack, but I'm a sucker for new weapons, didn't even think about that.

@Seppli said:

@Akrid said:

@Seppli: If I was playing on consoles, I'd probably have similar feelings. You really can't lone wolf it in BF3. But voice chat over PC with a good group of guys makes this into the best multiplayer experience you could ever ask for. Your squad, working as one, makes the kind of difference that you had in BC2, and it's all the more amazing because you did it with friends! If you ever go to PC, I can guarantee you a good time.

Anway, this map pack intrigues me. I'd probably prefer more standard maps, but I'm interested to see what they do with these. I think that clip gives a partial look, because from what you see there there's no reason to not use a MP7 or shotgun or whatnot. There must be more to it then that - I have faith that DICE can balance it well and make it interesting.

I am playing on PC. It's not about that. It's about MY power. I hate 'forced' teamplay. I'm helpless against XYZ, so I have to rely on others. Most kits in the Bad Company games were able to do AT. In BF3 much fewer loadouts are effective against vehicles.

Perfect example is small arms damage on helicopters as seen in BF:BC 1 and BF:BC 2 Vietnam. I LOVE SMALLARMS DAMAGE ON VEHICLES. In BF3, smallarms are ineffective against pretty much every vehicle. I can't even shoot dudes in a Humvee. I HATE THAT.

That's what I'm harping on. That shitty shitty balancing taking away my power. I never want to be put in a position where all I can do is keep my head down. Empower kits. Give every kit options to deal with any situation. Just with different flavors. That's what I want.

just shoot the drivers.. works with jeeps, humvees, choppers, boats and even jets (if you are that good).. but yeh, armored vehicles is a different story.. thats why they are armored lol. but still, nades do damage, M320 does damage.. just not as much as rockets or c4.. BF3 just needs more teamwork to achieve the goal. im all for teamwork but i to can get angry if my team doesnt do anything and i keep dying because im the only one trying to take out tanks. you just need the right people to play with. if me and 2 or 3 friends form a squad its usually a guaranteed win

@Akrid said:

@Seppli: If I was playing on consoles, I'd probably have similar feelings. You really can't lone wolf it in BF3. But voice chat over PC with a good group of guys makes this into the best multiplayer experience you could ever ask for. Your squad, working as one, makes the kind of difference that you had in BC2, and it's all the more amazing because you did it with friends! If you ever go to PC, I can guarantee you a good time.

Anway, this map pack intrigues me. I'd probably prefer more standard maps, but I'm interested to see what they do with these. I think that clip gives a partial look, because from what you see there there's no reason to not use a MP7 or shotgun or whatnot. There must be more to it then that - I have faith that DICE can balance it well and make it interesting.

I am playing on PC. It's not about that. It's about MY power. I hate 'forced' teamplay. I'm helpless against XYZ, so I have to rely on others. Most kits in the Bad Company games were able to do AT. In BF3 much fewer loadouts are effective against vehicles.

Perfect example is small arms damage on helicopters as seen in BF:BC 1 and BF:BC 2 Vietnam. I LOVE SMALLARMS DAMAGE ON VEHICLES. In BF3, smallarms are ineffective against pretty much every vehicle. I can't even shoot dudes in a Humvee. I HATE THAT.

That's what I'm harping on. That shitty shitty balancing taking away my power. I never want to be put in a position where all I can do is keep my head down. Empower kits. Give every kit options to deal with any situation. Just with different flavors. That's what I want.

I have no idea what DICE are doing and why they're so goddamn terrible at post-release support (WHERE IS THE GODDAMN PATCH SPRING IS NOT A MONTH AGO WHEN IT WAS NEEDED), but I'll check it out. Seems kind of terrible but it's more BF, a series I used to love.

@big_jon said:

Yes, but just because I play the game a lot, these are NOT the maps I wanted...

Pretty much how I feel as well. I don't much care for Karkand, but it's still nice to get a fresh environment once in a while.

If DICE really wants to impress the community with a map pack, they should get us some more Destruction 2.0.

Battlefield 3? mod-tools, or it didn't happen.

that's a little disappointing that it will only support 16 players but i'll still buy them, smaller infantry encounters are still fun.

I think the CQB DLC said it was going to have new weapons? If they are weapons you can use in the rest of the multiplayer I might consider it depending on the price. But yeah, 16 player maps is not want you would want from Battlefield 3.

yes most likely i will. but im more looking forward to 2nd dlc pack, and am curious about the last one titled end game. i want a 1943 style dog fighting only mode. that be pretty fun. even if the maps suck at least we get new guns!

I don't know. I'll wait until we have more than a minute of shaky cam footage and a few images before I make my choice. If it includes new weapons I'll probably get it because I love guns.

@sideshow said:

@Seppli said:

@Akrid said:

@Seppli: If I was playing on consoles, I'd probably have similar feelings. You really can't lone wolf it in BF3. But voice chat over PC with a good group of guys makes this into the best multiplayer experience you could ever ask for. Your squad, working as one, makes the kind of difference that you had in BC2, and it's all the more amazing because you did it with friends! If you ever go to PC, I can guarantee you a good time.

Anway, this map pack intrigues me. I'd probably prefer more standard maps, but I'm interested to see what they do with these. I think that clip gives a partial look, because from what you see there there's no reason to not use a MP7 or shotgun or whatnot. There must be more to it then that - I have faith that DICE can balance it well and make it interesting.

I am playing on PC. It's not about that. It's about MY power. I hate 'forced' teamplay. I'm helpless against XYZ, so I have to rely on others. Most kits in the Bad Company games were able to do AT. In BF3 much fewer loadouts are effective against vehicles.

Perfect example is small arms damage on helicopters as seen in BF:BC 1 and BF:BC 2 Vietnam. I LOVE SMALLARMS DAMAGE ON VEHICLES. In BF3, smallarms are ineffective against pretty much every vehicle. I can't even shoot dudes in a Humvee. I HATE THAT.

That's what I'm harping on. That shitty shitty balancing taking away my power. I never want to be put in a position where all I can do is keep my head down. Empower kits. Give every kit options to deal with any situation. Just with different flavors. That's what I want.

just shoot the drivers.. works with jeeps, humvees, choppers, boats and even jets (if you are that good).. but yeh, armored vehicles is a different story.. thats why they are armored lol. but still, nades do damage, M320 does damage.. just not as much as rockets or c4.. BF3 just needs more teamwork to achieve the goal. im all for teamwork but i to can get angry if my team doesnt do anything and i keep dying because im the only one trying to take out tanks. you just need the right people to play with. if me and 2 or 3 friends form a squad its usually a guaranteed win

I do know what works. Doesn't mean I like it. I don't. In fact I hate how it's balanced. Don't get me wrong, if a well-balanced game is what DICE were going for, they have mostly succeeded. I'm looking for fun balance though, and this ain't it. At least measured by the standard set by the Bad Company games.

PC- Maybe.

@Seppli said:

I do know what works. Doesn't mean I like it. I don't. In fact I hate how it's balanced. Don't get me wrong, if a well-balanced game is what DICE were going for, they have mostly succeeded. I'm looking for fun balance though, and this ain't it. At least measured by the standard set by the Bad Company games.

It sounds like you just need some decent squadmates. Playing on the PS3, I can hardly recall a single instance of the members of my team saving my ass from being roasted by a tank, but I can state with confidence that the converse has occurred many times with my squadmates.

If you look at the game more holistically, you can see that every position is well-balanced, but only if the team works together. I've yet to see a universal soldier, who could overcome the teamwork of an effective enemy squad single handed.

Incidentally, the only time I'm not having fun in BF3 is when I'm not playing with people on my Friends list.

@bwmcmaste: The game has some pretty big balance issues.

Probably not, I've been pretty satisfied with the default maps and Karkand with over 60 hours logged in. Maybe if I was pushing 200+ and still played regularly I'd be more willing, but I never got any of the BF2 expansions either. I do like infantry only maps, so things may change, maybe if it went on sale or something.

@bwmcmaste said:

@Seppli said:

I do know what works. Doesn't mean I like it. I don't. In fact I hate how it's balanced. Don't get me wrong, if a well-balanced game is what DICE were going for, they have mostly succeeded. I'm looking for fun balance though, and this ain't it. At least measured by the standard set by the Bad Company games.

It sounds like you just need some decent squadmates. Playing on the PS3, I can hardly recall a single instance of the members of my team saving my ass from being roasted by a tank, but I can state with confidence that the converse has occurred many times with my squadmates.

If you look at the game more holistically, you can see that every position is well-balanced, but only if the team works together. I've yet to see a universal soldier, who could overcome the teamwork of an effective enemy squad single handed.

Incidentally, the only time I'm not having fun in BF3 is when I'm not playing with people on my Friends list.

It's not about that. It's about the design of BF3's balance. I know it's well balanced (at least by Battlefield standards). I just hate how it's balanced. I like small arms damage on vehicles (other than tanks), because it feels better and is a lot more fun. Invulnerable jeeps and choppers and what have you feels wrong and from a fun-perspective - it's retarded. Couldn't care less about balance, if the oh-so-well and fair balance isn't fun. And it isn't to me.

I like it when Battlefield promotes me to 'open up fire', rather than to 'hunker down and pray'. That's just dumbass design.

it's funny... people were complaining at one point how there would be a division in the community if some people get access to weapons and others don't, during BF3's pre-order period where some retailers offered weapons and ammo.
 
So you have these people: "OMG, I'm not going to be pre-ordering BF3 from [store XYZ], and I won't be getting those weapons!! MOTHER FUCKER!." 
They then sat elegantly down and wrote on forums: 
"Dear DICE, 
 having some people gain access to weapons/ammo will divide the community. It would be in your interest to keep the community united. 
 
Your chap, 
TheManWithaPlan
 
-----
there is no spoon
"
 
The DICE guy later announces that everyone will get access to the items at a future date. *crowd calms*
 
"B2K comes free with pre-order". It came with access to new weapons, and was also part of the map rotation. Can everyone access those weapons, even without the B2K?  
People didn't complain about anything. "You didn't pre-order, your fuckin' problem" was the attitude. So much for community... for unity.
 
What community? what division? just a bunch of children. No consistency. 
 
B2K was part of the rotation, so if you didn't have the map you'd be removed from the server. Will these new maps be the same? Will the weapons be accessible for all? Will future DLC introduce maps part of the rotation and include weapons for those who purchased? You will see that many of the ideals of the community, of the past, are being eroded right in front of their eyes.
 
Battlefield has been marketed as the anti-COD game, but EA's actions with Battlefield are clearly pro-COD. They've mind-fucked many people. 
 
You see how the trick works? Do things gradually. If you do them suddenly and equally, there will be backlash. But now is there backlash? Nope, not really. The BF3 player numbers have gradually declined, but still there are many people playing it even if declined. 
 
They told you up front what their objectives were/are, to make their games a service; to provide micro-transactions/subscriptions.  There was a massive uproar with Battlefield and selling weapons, in the past. Today it seems okay.   Slowly you will see that there will be straight up weapons for sale in the main Battlefield. 
 
Why grind to unlock scopes and attachments? pay a few bucks and get access to it today!   First they must make you work through it to experience the.... investment. Later they will introduce an 'easy way'.  Hey... Pay for maps, pay for factions. So on-top of the $60, you pay for accessories, DLC, weapons, etc.  Is there a name for these type of games? I'm thinking along the lines of a free-to-play hybrid; where you make the initial payment [to unlock the standard items] and then you are able to 'play for free', and you have the ability to add to your experience by purchasing items... the F2P-ification of gaming, free and non-free.
 
In the past we got so much more content. Today companies are seeking to monetize everything, not that it is necessary. It's also just a way, an excuse, to make money off of old content. A sneaky way to not have to create new things to earn money. This way game developers don't always have to one-up what they made. They just milk what they have by charging for every aspect of it.

@Evilmetal said:

B2K was part of the rotation, so if you didn't have the map you'd be removed from the server. Will these new maps be the same?

My impression is that no, these will work like Bad Company 2 Vietnam (an "expansion") with completely separate matchmaking. Back to Karkand was a "map pack," and I can understand it going into the general map rotation since it's a piece of content that every paying customer gets anyway.

Also PC.