DoubleFine's Broken Age being cut in half (steam early acc).

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Avatar image for truthtellah
#51 Posted by TruthTellah (9821 posts) -

@grantheaslip: I can understand your perspective as an uninformed outsider, but I just think you're wrong in the extent of your statements. You don't seem to understand just how much they have kept backers aware of how the project is going, and to suggest "mismanagement" with such limited information is irresponsible. I can appreciate your concerns for how Kickstarter projects are managed, and it's true that it isn't as established and clear as it should be. It has improved even since when this specific Kickstarter occurred. So, while there do need to be even more efforts to manage expectations on what projects like this are like, I believe Double Fine has given great effort to keep people as aware of their progress as possible and manage expectations. For those with access to their forums and regular updates, I believe they have been given more than enough information to understand this decision.

I know you mean well with your concerns, and I agree that some backers will have had different expectations. But I believe Double Fine has done as much as possible for people to understand this and not be too surprised by it. They have given a continually honest and open impression of the process, and I appreciate their efforts to do what's necessary to make the best final game for those who have supported them.

Avatar image for darji
#52 Posted by Darji (5412 posts) -

@grantheaslip: I can understand your perspective as an uninformed outsider, but I just think you're wrong in the extent of your statements. You don't seem to understand just how much they have kept backers aware of how the project is going, and to suggest "mismanagement" with such limited information is irresponsible. I can appreciate your concerns for how Kickstarter projects are managed, and it's true that it isn't as established and clear as it should be. It has improved even since when this specific Kickstarter occurred. So, while there do need to be even more efforts to manage expectations on what projects like this are like, I believe Double Fine has given great effort to keep people as aware of their progress as possible and manage expectations. For those with access to their forums and regular updates, I believe they have been given more than enough information to understand this decision.

I know you mean well with your concerns, and I agree that some backers will have had different expectations. But I believe Double Fine has done as much as possible for people to understand this and not be too surprised by it. They have given a continually honest and open impression of the process, and I appreciate their efforts to do what's necessary to make the best final game for those who have supported them.

Keeping them informed does not means there was or is mismanagement happening. These things are totally different things. Double fine is actually known for not delivering on time and also for using up way to much money in the end. But now this directly affects people who already paid for the game and supported them.

Avatar image for truthtellah
#53 Posted by TruthTellah (9821 posts) -

@darji said:

@truthtellah said:

@grantheaslip: I can understand your perspective as an uninformed outsider, but I just think you're wrong in the extent of your statements. You don't seem to understand just how much they have kept backers aware of how the project is going, and to suggest "mismanagement" with such limited information is irresponsible. I can appreciate your concerns for how Kickstarter projects are managed, and it's true that it isn't as established and clear as it should be. It has improved even since when this specific Kickstarter occurred. So, while there do need to be even more efforts to manage expectations on what projects like this are like, I believe Double Fine has given great effort to keep people as aware of their progress as possible and manage expectations. For those with access to their forums and regular updates, I believe they have been given more than enough information to understand this decision.

I know you mean well with your concerns, and I agree that some backers will have had different expectations. But I believe Double Fine has done as much as possible for people to understand this and not be too surprised by it. They have given a continually honest and open impression of the process, and I appreciate their efforts to do what's necessary to make the best final game for those who have supported them.

Keeping them informed does not means there was or is mismanagement happening. These things are totally different things. Double fine is actually known for not delivering on time and also for using up way to much money in the end. But now this directly affects people who already paid for the game and supported them.

If you keep people informed of how it is going, they have a better perspective on how that management is. It's not like they've announced that the game isn't happening. They've said they're opting for a solution that helps them avoid getting publisher support and avoid cutting back on their bigger vision. I can understand some concern, but uninformed allegations of mismanagement are simply out of line.

As far as Double Fine's management of money, somehow they've made a profit on every game they've released despite varying levels of success, and that's thanks to -good- management of budgeting. While their projects do tend to grow a bit over time, that's part of their process. They have been able to make it work for them and their publishers in the past, and they have given nothing but reason to have faith in the fact that they will deliver for backers. If they didn't have a good history worthy of trust, I could understand more skepticism, but they are about as trustworthy as a game developer goes. They've earned that trust, and when they say this is the best way forward for the game, I believe them. I hope that it is indeed the case and we see an even better game thanks to all of this.

Avatar image for darji
#54 Edited by Darji (5412 posts) -

@darji said:

@truthtellah said:

@grantheaslip: I can understand your perspective as an uninformed outsider, but I just think you're wrong in the extent of your statements. You don't seem to understand just how much they have kept backers aware of how the project is going, and to suggest "mismanagement" with such limited information is irresponsible. I can appreciate your concerns for how Kickstarter projects are managed, and it's true that it isn't as established and clear as it should be. It has improved even since when this specific Kickstarter occurred. So, while there do need to be even more efforts to manage expectations on what projects like this are like, I believe Double Fine has given great effort to keep people as aware of their progress as possible and manage expectations. For those with access to their forums and regular updates, I believe they have been given more than enough information to understand this decision.

I know you mean well with your concerns, and I agree that some backers will have had different expectations. But I believe Double Fine has done as much as possible for people to understand this and not be too surprised by it. They have given a continually honest and open impression of the process, and I appreciate their efforts to do what's necessary to make the best final game for those who have supported them.

Keeping them informed does not means there was or is mismanagement happening. These things are totally different things. Double fine is actually known for not delivering on time and also for using up way to much money in the end. But now this directly affects people who already paid for the game and supported them.

If you keep people informed of how it is going, they have a better perspective on how that management is. It's not like they've announced that the game isn't happening. They've said they're opting for a solution that helps them avoid getting publisher support and avoid cutting back on their bigger vision. I can understand some concern, but uninformed allegations of mismanagement are simply out of line.

As far as Double Fine's management of money, somehow they've made a profit on every game they've released despite varying levels of success, and that's thanks to -good- management of budgeting. While their projects do tend to grow a bit over time, that's part of their process. They have been able to make it work for them and their publishers in the past, and they have given nothing but reason to have faith in the fact that they will deliver for backers. If they didn't have a good history worthy of trust, I could understand more skepticism, but they are about as trustworthy as a game developer goes. They've earned that trust, and when they say this is the best way forward for the game, I believe them. I hope that it is indeed the case and we see an even better game thanks to all of this.

I am really skeptical and it will look really strange if Project Eternity will be released earlier than this game. A Game as big as a Baldurs gate 2 is way more ambitious than a normal Adventure game. It is not that you will have choices and that the story will change. I really can not see how they can not handle the game with 4 million and such a time period while other developers can do it with 800K for an adventure game like the Broken sword or Gray Matter kickstarter for example. If it were an other type of game but a Point and Click Adventure?

Avatar image for truthtellah
#55 Posted by TruthTellah (9821 posts) -

@darji said:

@truthtellah said:

@darji said:

@truthtellah said:

@grantheaslip: I can understand your perspective as an uninformed outsider, but I just think you're wrong in the extent of your statements. You don't seem to understand just how much they have kept backers aware of how the project is going, and to suggest "mismanagement" with such limited information is irresponsible. I can appreciate your concerns for how Kickstarter projects are managed, and it's true that it isn't as established and clear as it should be. It has improved even since when this specific Kickstarter occurred. So, while there do need to be even more efforts to manage expectations on what projects like this are like, I believe Double Fine has given great effort to keep people as aware of their progress as possible and manage expectations. For those with access to their forums and regular updates, I believe they have been given more than enough information to understand this decision.

I know you mean well with your concerns, and I agree that some backers will have had different expectations. But I believe Double Fine has done as much as possible for people to understand this and not be too surprised by it. They have given a continually honest and open impression of the process, and I appreciate their efforts to do what's necessary to make the best final game for those who have supported them.

Keeping them informed does not means there was or is mismanagement happening. These things are totally different things. Double fine is actually known for not delivering on time and also for using up way to much money in the end. But now this directly affects people who already paid for the game and supported them.

If you keep people informed of how it is going, they have a better perspective on how that management is. It's not like they've announced that the game isn't happening. They've said they're opting for a solution that helps them avoid getting publisher support and avoid cutting back on their bigger vision. I can understand some concern, but uninformed allegations of mismanagement are simply out of line.

As far as Double Fine's management of money, somehow they've made a profit on every game they've released despite varying levels of success, and that's thanks to -good- management of budgeting. While their projects do tend to grow a bit over time, that's part of their process. They have been able to make it work for them and their publishers in the past, and they have given nothing but reason to have faith in the fact that they will deliver for backers. If they didn't have a good history worthy of trust, I could understand more skepticism, but they are about as trustworthy as a game developer goes. They've earned that trust, and when they say this is the best way forward for the game, I believe them. I hope that it is indeed the case and we see an even better game thanks to all of this.

I am really skeptical and it will look really strange if Project Eternity will be released earlier than this game. A Game as big as a Baldurs gate 2 is way more ambitious than a normal Adventure game. It is not that you will have choices and that the story will change. I really can not see how they can not handle the game with 4 million and such a time period while other developers can do it with 800K for an adventure game like the Broken sword or Gray Matter kickstarter for example. If it were an other type of game but a Point and Click Adventure?

Maybe you can check out the early look at it and see what backers have been seeing developed since the Kickstarter ended(since they only started making it once it finished and they could consult with backers). Right now, considering how big it is, it is moving along rather briskly. I look forward to seeing even more from it soon. :)

Avatar image for chaser324
#56 Posted by chaser324 (8642 posts) -

@darji: You keep bringing up Project Eternity, but I don't think that's necessarily a 1:1 comparison. Obsidian originally set their contribution goals much higher (i.e. they probably didn't have to significantly adjust scope), and they're a much larger studio. Also, Obsidian has delayed plenty of games in the past (currently in development South Park: Stick of Destiny for example), so your confidence in them hitting their announced date might be misplaced.

Comparisons to the Broken Sword and Moebius don't jive for me either. First, those projects have both missed their originally announced release date. Their Kickstarter funding didn't massively outpace their target and require a big rescope. They also aren't trying to make a multi-million dollar game that lives up to the Double Fine adventure game legacy and their high standards.

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Avatar image for eladren
#57 Posted by eladren (348 posts) -

I honestly believe that just watching the documentary has been an amazing experience, and the emotional peak that i felt when i saw the trailer was tremendous. I'm still really psyched for the game and for being a part of all of this.

As for the sales, I'll say this: when the game is out i will probably buy a couple copies more and gift them to friends that are not much into games but have loved the little bits of monkey island they have seen me play.

Avatar image for nephrahim
#58 Edited by Nephrahim (1258 posts) -

I will say, how this project has expanded and needed more money has put Tim's "I am a games veteran who cannot get his games funded" claim into a lot clearer and less flattering statement.

Avatar image for darji
#59 Edited by Darji (5412 posts) -

@chaser324 said:

@darji: You keep bringing up Project Eternity, but I don't think that's necessarily a 1:1 comparison. Obsidian originally set their contribution goals much higher (i.e. they probably didn't have to significantly adjust scope), and they're a much larger studio. Also, Obsidian has delayed plenty of games in the past (currently in development South Park: Stick of Destiny for example), so your confidence in them hitting their announced date might be misplaced.

Comparisons to the Broken Sword and Moebius don't jive for me either. First, those projects have both missed their originally announced release date. Their Kickstarter funding didn't massively outpace their target and require a big rescope. They also aren't trying to make a multi-million dollar game that lives up to the Double Fine adventure game legacy and their high standards.

First of all Eternity was all along a way more ambitious game than the Double fine one and you really have to wonder how long the their game would have been with only the 400k. 10-20 minutes? As for the staff. I am pretty sure there are lke 12 people working on the game not more. Obsidian has a lot of project going on including an unannounced Next gen RPG. And for the delay of course delays are common but not like this. Now they need 2 parts because they hope they would get money from it for part 1 to make the second part of the game.

And again we are talking here about a "simple" and linear Point and Click adventure. It is not like it will be a 20+ hours game in the first place. Schaefer or double fine just does not know how to manage a budget and a timeline. Hell they even had Irobrigade or how it was called almost canceled by Microsoft because they could not hold to their budget and timeline.

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