Expansion 2 releases May 8th, randomized weapons + "weapon slot changes" in September

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#1 Edited by tds418 (478 posts) -

Although it's nice to see Bungie confirm that randomized weapons are returning, I'm also a little disappointed because I was holding out some hope that the upcoming expansion would make some big changes to the game. Seems like it will largely be similar to Curse of Osiris in scope.


On May 8, with the beginning of Season Three, we’re also launching the second expansion to Destiny 2. It’s called Warmind, and it will send you to new places to meet new heroes and battle new enemies. You’ll earn new loot and master new activities. Today, we’re naming it and dating it. You’ll learn more in a reveal stream on April 24. Mark your calendars and follow us on Twitch.

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Thoughts? I'm impressed they manage to say "new" five times in two sentences.

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#2 Edited by Do_The_Manta_Ray (1636 posts) -

And still no new Raid means no purchase for me. I just cannot even begin to fathom this decision. Their entire arguement for the bite-sited "Raid Lairs" was so they could add more to the game, and have additional variety in them. That just flat out didn't happen.

Now, I don't think anyone will disagree that the raids have been the high-light of that series, and for them to seemingly have no intention in adding more kills any desire I might have in playing more of it.

I REALLY liked Destiny 2 at launch, and for quite some time after, but their post-launch support has just left me cold.

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#3 Posted by tds418 (478 posts) -

What's in the existing raid lair is all very cool, but yeah, it's not enough. There's basically one boss that has two phases, and a light platforming puzzle beforehand. The decision to wait over four months simply to release the prestige version of the CoO raid lair baffles me.

I purchased the expansion pass so I'll play the new raid lair, but I'm expecting to bounce off this expansion about as quickly as the first.

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#4 Posted by Dispossession (158 posts) -

I bought the season pass and I probably won’t touch D2 again.

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#5 Posted by VeggiesBro (220 posts) -

I won't be touching Destiny 2 till September at the earliest, and even then it's going to take a significant effort on Bungie's part to bring me back in. I see no mention of new raid loot/systems, or additional crucible sandbox changes. Those are my two biggest gripes, but I also see there is a continued lack of content in this game which is absurd given how many people work at the damn studio.

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#6 Posted by MeesterO (112 posts) -

Sad part about all of this, I would probably still be playing if not for the fact Bungie's anti-cheat system is real bad and managed to ban a friend in my group indefinitely for running a process in the background that didn't jive with it. But now i have yet another season pass I bought that... isn't getting the worth i spent.

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#7 Posted by OurSin_360 (6177 posts) -

Sound like i made the right decision skipping this one.

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#8 Edited by Hestilllives19 (1253 posts) -

I just want to point out that, while I agree with the sentiment here, I think a few people have some misconceptions on exactly what is coming on May 8th with Warmind. They bumped it back a few months to, supposedly, deepen the story beyond that of Curse of Osiris. A story which, in my mind, and that of several people in the community like My Name is Byf, was actually rather alright, just far too short and had a mechanic in the Infinite Forest that didn't meet expectations Bungie gave us for it. The really important line from yesterday about Warmind is "Battle New Enemies". It's been long rumored, especially after PSN posted the "Gods of Mars DLC" page, that we will have a new race of enemies, Charlemagne's Remnants, to fight. In addition to this, as announced yesterday, a much needed feature is being added henceforth for PvP with DLC Crucible Maps being added to the general pool for all players, regardless of DLC ownership. This will increase player pool populations by allowing all players to play in the same playlists again, which is a great thing. Finally, there will be a new Raid Lair launching with this DLC. And if their first idea's thrown at us for Raid Lair Prestige Modes are any hint, Raid Lair 2 will be a Close Quarters scenario, which will be a nice change of pace. Since it has been pulled from the current Roadmap, I don't think that is still their current plans for Raid Lair Prestige Modes, as after the backlash from this idea it's been pulled, but I'm sure we will hear more about it coming April 24th to confirm that or not. If it is, I could get behind that, it's at least an interesting idea.

All in all, Destiny 2 has had the most support for any year in the lifetime of Destiny. Does that excuse the absolute terrible state the game launched in, really for no reason that anyone can tell other than just really bad decision making on the part of the Development Team, no. But a lack of content hasn't really been the problem (just the lack of replay-ability of that content, and incentive), at least not in so much as it will ever be a problem Bungie will ever be able to fix if what they've done this year isn't enough. The problem has been the state of that content, and their numbers have indeed suffered for it (Only 270k players yesterday! At it's absolute worst after 3 years and during the D2 Beta Destiny had 2x that). Not rewarding dedicated players for their time investment, choosing boring balance over exciting moment to moment gameplay in every aspect of the game, pushing Microtransactions way too hard, and not balancing the Sandbox quick enough have all led to players abandoning the game in droves and flocking to easy to choose alternatives that do many of those same things right like Fortnite (it also doesn't help that Fortnite became a cultural phenomenon at the same time).

For players returning on May 8th, who haven't touched Destiny 2 much since Curse of Osiris, or even Vanilla, there will be a lot to do in Destiny 2, and there have been a ton of improvements made or that will be made by the time May 8th comes around that make it a much better game than at the launch of Curse of Osiris.

  • Weapons and Armor Masterworks, and the launch of Exotic Weapon Masterworks on May 8th.
  • Raid Reward Improvements and Raid Mod Adjustments (Gauntlets and especially Class Mods extremely Powerful).
  • Nightfall Scoring System, Unique Nightfall Rewards (these leave a bit to be desired), Emblem/Aura Rework, and Heroic Strike Modifiers.
  • Sandbox Tuning Adjustments (Go Fast Changes), Mod Adjustements (1.33x, 1.67x, and 2x performance), and Exotic Sandbox Changes (look pretty significant for Exotics).
  • Private Crucible Matches, Crucible Ranking, and Competitive Crucible Quitter Penalties.
  • Weekly Rotating Crucible Playlist: Rumble (6 player after adjustments due to overcrowding), Mayhem, and Iron Banner 6v6.
  • Exotic Repetition Reduction, Exotics as Rewards in Heroic Strikes, and Seasonal Vendor Progression Changes.
  • Vault Space Increase, Multi- Emote, PC Public Text Chat, Reduced Patrol Beacon Interaction to 1s, and Fireteam viewable on Destination Map.
  • Changes to the way Microtransactions have been handled in Live Events, like Crimson Days.
  • Many bug fixes (Tower Black Screen fixed, Raid Spawn in Glitch fixed, Colony tracking fix for PC, Ikora Waypoint fix, Promethius Lens fixed, etc).

All of these changes do make Destiny 2 a better game. Is Crucible where it needs to be, no. And I don't think it will be until September with the Weapon Slot Changes, Weapon Randomization, and another Sandbox Pass. But what is here for PvE is better, and the new Raid Lair will be great just like Eater of Worlds was. It's worth giving it a shot on May 8th, especially if like me, you already own DLC 2 anyways.

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#9 Posted by soulcake (2774 posts) -

Wait you cant clan chat in the pc version ( in-game ) ....... WHY !

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#10 Edited by Hestilllives19 (1253 posts) -

@soulcake: There is Fireteam Voice Chat, meaning you only hear players in your Fireteam at any given time. On PC you also have a Whisper system to Whisper Specific Players. What they are adding is probably a Clan Text Chat on PC, though I have no idea why they don't just put the Bungie Clan Chats in game, since those already exist, and they should just do that for all Platforms as part of a Clan Update. Either way, on PC, it's generally just easier to just use Discord, at least that's what I found while I was playing Destiny 2 on PC.

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#11 Posted by sammo21 (5971 posts) -

'memba when Bungie was a great developer that made good games and also focused on their community? I 'memba.

Seriously though, I own this new DLC and I don't even think this is going to get me to reinstall the game. I really wanted Destiny 2 to be a turning point for Bungie but they are just too disorganized and without a sail over there. Nothing they have done post-launch has been good and they can't even offer a worthwhile competitive experience to keep me busy. I guess if I want to play a good Bungie game I'm booting up a pre-Halo4 Halo game...

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#12 Edited by tds418 (478 posts) -

I can't say I agree with you @hestilllives19 about the Curse of Osiris story being alright. The base game's story got off to a good start but I was disappointed with it by the end, and Osiris just felt like doubling down on the worst parts of the base game's story. D1 built up Osiris as a very powerful and mysterious guardian, and when we meet him he's just a bumbling fool trapped in some Vex device? And then the whole campaign is just getting him out of said device, providing plenty of opportunities for the cheesy one-liners that were tired by the end of the base game? And then the raid lair is entirely unrelated to anything that happens in the campaign? Meh.

For my money Osiris is the worst Destiny expansion since The Dark Below, and even then I think I enjoyed the Dark Below more. At least then we got something that felt more like a full raid (glitch-filled as it was), a full prestige mode along with it, and some actually interesting lore about the Hive gods (even though it was largely hidden in grimrorie cards). Everything in that expansion was also thematically related and built up to the raid. And I'm not sure any gear in D2 looks as cool as those Dark Below raid weapons.

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#13 Edited by Hestilllives19 (1253 posts) -

@tds418: I completely agree with you about the vanilla story. It started out really well, hit some high notes on Titan in the New Pacific Archology, but fell rather flat afterwards, especially everything after the back together scene before the attack on the last city. However, Byf's video I linked earlier does a great job of explaining exactly why Curse of Osiris was actually a rather good, but flawed campaign, even if the final Panoptes fight felt like it came about too quickly and was rushed. I would have to disagree entirely with the assumption that Osiris was shown as just some "bumbling fool trapped in some Vex device", though the whole player Guardian breaking fate aspect of many of the Destiny storylines is getting a bit repetitive and stale. I get it, we are special snowflakes, who defy the laws of nature constantly, yada yada. Being able to make copies of one's self that both explore an infinite amount of possible realities and also communicate with each other to make adjustments, and communicate other changes to those realities to himself like when your Guardian arrives isn't something every Guardian would be capable of. In my mind though, Osiris wasn't the star of Curse of Osiris, that was Sagira, who was played wonderfully by Morena Baccarin. Also played well, was Ikora and Brother Vance. I also found Golden Age and Dark World versions of Mercury to be extremely stunning, I just wish we got more time spent in those realities. As a side note, I also enjoyed the Adventures, especially the Heroic Adventures, and while I hated the grind to unlock it, the Saint-14 mission was pretty good as well. Overall, Curse of Osiris blows both The Dark Below and House of Wolves story Campaigns out of the water. I would rank it almost exactly on par with Rise of Iron, and below that of Destiny 2 vanilla and none of which were on par with The Taken King (we are going to pretend Vanilla D1 Story didn't exist).

As for the comparison of Crota's End to Eater of World's, I would have to completely disagree as well. Unless we are talking about post Age of Triumph, where Bungie remade a lot of the worse parts of Crota's End (Bridge Encounter is currently one of the best Raid Encounters after AoT, and Ir Yut is actually fun if you do Challenge Mode) and made it a significantly better Raid, because that's more a conversation worth having. The Stills or Lamps is about the only encounter in launch Crota's End worth talking about for being interesting. Crota himself was just a painful slog while being underleveled due to Delta Scaling, and is even to this day extremely 1 note. 1 player kill Swordbearer, goes to platform, calls for Rockets, runs Combo on Crota, jump down, repeat, then start the cycle over until he is dead. I did it 126 times, and it's easily the worst Raid content ever published for Destiny/Destiny 2. Now if we want to compare it to Wrath of the Machine, Vault of Glass, or even Leviathan itself, I will gladly agree with you that those pieces of content are far superior, but they also each required at least a year of development. Eater of World's has two rather simply to decipher puzzles (1 much like the Thrallway that isn't much of a Puzzle, move of just a rather easy obstacle), and then two extremely well done encounters based in the same room. Encounters that put anything in Crota's End to absolute shame. In all honestly, of all 21 Destiny Raid Encounters (VoG - 4, CE - 2, KF - 4, WotM - 5, Lev - 4, EoW - 2), I would probably only rank The Siege Engine from Wrath of the Machine higher in terms of quality, so Argos Phase 2 would take my #2 spot and Phase 1 my #3. I would also probably say Vosik Phase 1 as my #4 and Aksis Phase 2 as my #5 (which gives you a good idea why I still think Wrath of the Machine is easily the best Destiny/Destiny 2 Raid). But make no mistake, I have a very high opinion of Eater of World's as well. Now, these are the opinions of just the Raids themselves, without all of the other things that go into that such as loot (which nobody really argues hasn't been even remotely as good since Vault of Glass and Crota's End) and Bungie's dispersal of it (something which was handled awfully in Destiny 2 up until recently with the changes to Raid Rewards and Raid Mods). I will also say that Bungie really bungled their handling of both Leviathan and Eater of World's after what they did with Wrath of the Machine in relation to the Arg and Outbreak Prime, and that's a real big letdown. I do also agree that not seeing both Challenges and a Prestige version Eater of World's is a bit of a punch to the gut, because both of those were highly anticipated and things the community just assumed would exist. But what is there for Eater of World's is fantastic, and it leaves me very excited to see what is in store for us shortly after May 8th when a new Raid Lair launches.

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#14 Edited by tds418 (478 posts) -

@hestilllives19 Haha well we'll have to agree to disagree I suppose about the Osiris story. Your points about Crota's End are well taken – it definitely is the weakest of the D1 raids and what is in Eater of World's is almost certainly better content. But I spent dozens of hours and had a lot of great times doing the hard mode Crota's End weekly between Dark Below and House of Wolves because I really wanted all of the raid loot and I just don't feel that same pull for anything that EoW offers in terms of rewards.

I didn't play Rise of Iron (which I now regret) because I wanted to play some other things and then go all-in on D2 when it launched, so I would rank the raids as:

VoG > King's Fall >> Leviathan >> Crota's End

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#15 Edited by MrPlatitude (207 posts) -

Only played vanilla D2, didn't buy the expansion pass yet. Trying to decide if I want to play these new expansions now or just wait until this fall for the big expansion...it sounds like they've made some improvements, but I don't know if it enough yet.

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#16 Edited by Hestilllives19 (1253 posts) -

@tds418: I mean, if we are being honest, we are talking about Destiny's story points. So I also wouldn't call being adequate for an FPS a really high bar on Story Content. I was just trying to say there are things to enjoy about Curse of Osiris, even if it was extremely short, and the last couple missions, similar to D2's Vanilla Campaign felt rushed. Missing Rise of Iron is sad, because is really was a good time, and Wrath of the Machine is great, especially all of the stuff with the Arg and how the community discovered Outbreak Prime. For King's Fall, I really liked my first run of that Raid, but I feel like my thoughts on it have soured over time, because it really is such a slog anymore to play through, it's just so long and many of the fights are actually rather uninteresting mechanically.

@mrplatitude: I'd say it's more a question of what are you interested in with Destiny. If Raids, absolutely get the expansions, because the Raid Lair was great, just keep in mind you will need to find others to do it with. If Story and Lore, it's probably also worth getting. But outside of that, if you just plan to go solo and run through it, it's probably not worth the $35 asking price. Just wait for this big DLC in September. I hope that helps.

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