Tim Rogers Cyberpunk review

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tartyron

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#1  Edited By tartyron

After about a year of delays, Cyberpunk 2077 as reviewed by Tim Rogers has finally debuted. I glanced at the runtime of 1 hour and thought, wow, that is fairly subdued compared to his 5 hour review of Tokimeki Memorial.

I then read in the description that there is a playlist of the entire review, which is broken into 7 parts. In total, it is roughly 9 hours long.

I don't have a point to this post, just putting it up there in case anyone else enjoyed his brand of obsessive compulsive insanity and had 9 hours to kill.

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noboners

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I have been very much looking forward to watching this and kind of appreciate it being broken down.

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BisonHero

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I appreciate Tim Rogers' comically long-form style of delivery. I feel like everyone who is passionate about something probably has a several hours rant/treatise about some topic, but either a) you have no one in your life who is reasonably going to sit there and hear you out, or b) you have an audience as a professional writer, but once again there is no world where your boss is possibly going to let you publish an article or video that takes 2+ hours to consume. But enter Tim Rogers, who does the latter and keeps getting away with it.

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frytup

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Yeah, finally.

Hopefully he actually follows through on his current plan to start making videos of a sane human length. At this point it just feels like I'm financing his self harm.

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Humanity

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Tim Rogers is a mad man but thats part of the charm. I couldn't get into the previous review because the subject matter didn't interest me and it was like 7 hours long at that, but I'm down to see his thoughts on Cyberpunk.. and all the tangents along the way.

(He beat Watch Dogs TWICE just to prepare for the review)

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cikame

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#6 cikame  Online

That's far too long for a review, analysis or documentary.

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Efesell

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I am an avid listener of Hardcore History and still I look at this guys work and say can we just tighten this up a little maybe.

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emospacemonkey

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It's not a review. Tim Rogers broadcasts are not 8 minute GameSpot reviews but in depth mini series on a chosen videogame. I watch them and can find time. Worth finding the time to watch if you love video games. I have 30 minutes a day on a mind numbing treadmill I use cause staying healthy is important . Tim Rogers is a genuine person who cares about videogames.

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ll_Exile_ll

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I appreciate Tim Rogers' comically long-form style of delivery. I feel like everyone who is passionate about something probably has a several hours rant/treatise about some topic, but either a) you have no one in your life who is reasonably going to sit there and hear you out, or b) you have an audience as a professional writer, but once again there is no world where your boss is possibly going to let you publish an article or video that takes 2+ hours to consume. But enter Tim Rogers, who does the latter and keeps getting away with it.

In the video game youtube critic space, there has been an increasing trend of video being insanely long. Some of them justify the length, such as Rogers, but often it seems like some folks are making unreasonably long videos just to generate interest since seeing a youtube review of a video game with a 5+ hour runtime just naturally elicits curiosity. I'm down to watch a well written long form video essay of an hour or more, but I have a hard time accepting that a 7 hour review of Pokemon Ruby needs to exist.

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clagnaught

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I watched their review of Tokimeki Memorial, and while I did enjoy it (and kinda wish those games came out in English), that review was just exhausting. Yeah, it was long, but the thing that got to me was how it felt like I could just stop at the last 30-60 minutes.

I’ll be curious to see what people think of the Cyberpunk review since this has had a lot of buildup.

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Humanity

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Well what is interesting is that there are 7 parts and Tim Rogers said that he structured it in such a way that you should watch any two parts and then skip to the concluding video. So technically it’s not a wall to wall 10 hour long video, unless you decide to watch all of it. Definitely a curious approach.

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Nodima

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I watched their review of Tokimeki Memorial, and while I did enjoy it (and kinda wish those games came out in English), that review was just exhausting. Yeah, it was long, but the thing that got to me was how it felt like I could just stop at the last 30-60 minutes.

That is essentially the entire exercise, though. All of these reviews have a "The Bottom Line" section that summarizes everything else he said in a more coherent, non-arbitrary fashion that gets rid of most of the self-mythologizing for people who aren't into that. Pretty much everything else is in there for people who like his personality and turns of phrase. I know I come to these reviews as much as a comedy podcast to have on in the background as an actual video review (which is why my personal pet peeve is all the small jokes he inserts via one-second text prompts!).

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slax

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I'm excited to jump back into this. Also they are designed more as a series of documentaries about a topic dropped all at once. It's even easier with this one split into different videos, but he always suggests taking breaks between each part!

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Onemanarmyy

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#14  Edited By Onemanarmyy  Online

This reminds me of the Purge dota2 patch analysis streams. it started out as a meticulous person spending considerable time to weed through all the changes and ruminating what it would do to the game. Naturally him doing this blew up, and it became some sort of patch spectacle where the length of the stream itself became the thing that got people hyped and drove traffic. So naturally the guy ended up with a bunch of 9-10 hour analysis sessions. Only for Valve to patch the game a few days later to sand off the hard edges of the big patch and invalidate a chunk of these hours.

Saw a bit of the same hype around this thing, with Tim tweeting out how much work it all took, how long it takes for it to pop on youtube and stuff. People talking with eachother how they will be tackling getting through this all. At some point it comes across like it's more about upping the writers profile by doing something that stands out, than it's about the video itself. But then again, maybe this is what reviews should be in 2021? Not something written for others to base their purchasing decisions on, but a spectacular bonkers thing in itself that stands out and creates hype & memes by its very existance. Something like those youtube videos of someone sitting on a chair for 24 hours or something. There's no other Cyberpunk review that has so much attention directed towards it after all.

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Kyary

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#15  Edited By Kyary

I'm interested to find out what "path" everyone picked. Personally I watched the Graphics and Discourse segments. I thought it was interesting. Yes I get that writing a long ass post about a long ass video about a long ass game is like, 3 levels of stupid, please be nice lmao

I think it's extremely cool to make a critique of a game that features a lot of player choice itself hinge on some viewer choice. For me, I don't really care about the plot of the game, but I did want to hear what he thought about the endless pursuit of better graphics, and how he feels about The Discourse, so I picked those two. I thought he had some interesting things to say about crunch (basically, he talks about crunching on the video about a game infamous in part on its crunch, and how it affected him, which was interesting). I liked the idea in the wrap-up video that Cyberpunk as this giant game trying to be every other game kind of mirrors his own personal mid-life crisis where he tries to do brain dump everything instead of picking the stuff he really, really cares about and polishing the hell out of it was smart and really self-aware. I liked hearing what he had to say about open world games, the hype train, glitch compilations, analytics and youtube views, and his vintage stock car t-shirt. I thought Videoball was kind of disappointing.

I get that at some level, a 4 hour review of a game would be pretty excessive. But I want to push back on the "it's too long" crowd a little bit because I feel like that's not really the point, because it's kind of an art piece (or...choose your own adventure essay?) than a review in the traditional sense. if nothing else, I think Tim Rogers at least does the "ultra review" thing better than anyone else, and at least in this series he gets into the merits and costs of trying to do fucking everything in a single piece of media. He's a smart guy! Also, people here used to go apeshit for the 25 hour GOTY podcasts. Maybe it's less that the Action Button videos are too long, and more than you just like GB hosts and GOTY discussions more? That's fine, but don't pretend the length is itself intrinsically unacceptable.

Look, if you want a tightly edited review telling you if the game is "worth playing" or not, Tim Rogers is not your guy. But we're all here because we listen to weekly2+ hour discussions about games, and I mean, if you added up all the time the crew talked about Cyberpunk I'm sure it would go for over two hours at least. So the idea that someone couldn't possibly have a bunch to say about the game, and the stuff around the game is kind of silly I think. I mean, one of my favorite articles ever written is this 22,000 word history of a failed world wide web competitor. Sometimes it takes a lot of words to get your thoughts out on something.

I also kind of get the "too long" crowd, I don't watch twitch because it feels like I'm getting this completely unedited thing that just goes way too long, so I guess nobody's immune from feeling that way about something.

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Nodima

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This bit is insane. Hate to spoil the culmination a couple minutes after this URL timestamp, but, man...

"Feels slightly too much like 2020's idea of 2077 and just barely not enough like 2020's idea of 2005's 1990's 2020's 2035's 2077. A subtle distinction to be sure, though a vital one."

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Efesell

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@kyary: A too long podcast is a very different thing from a too long video.

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LapsarianGiraff

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I wouldn't mind the length at all if that length were well-utilized? The podcast point has come up, and that's fair, but Giant Bombcasts are very much just conversations, and conversations can pleasantly ramble -- there's something that rubs me the wrong way about having about a dozen hours of footage, *deliberately edited* and it still having that rambling quality. Even following the prescription of only watching 2 sections between the first video and "the bottom line," I felt this, like a lot of Tim Rogers' work, had the comical length of modern video essays with little of the incisiveness that format usually provides.

Which is a shame, because, his actual opinions and impressions and thoughts on the design of the open world, I find interesting. But we can't just go into that from the jump because we're going through the third epic catalogue of his PC gaming rig, because... because? I honestly don't know. Could be a satire of how much "gamer merch" Cyberpunk moved, PC enthusiasts' predilection for specs in general, or just another way to pad the run time because he pretty much outright says "yeah I like making these bits as long as possible to annoy commenters who want me to get to my opinions faster?"

Anyway, not for me. Glad some folks are enjoying it, though.

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99bajakid

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I'll have to check it out - never heard of him, and i've been patiently waiting for this game to become playable/enjoyable. So it would be nice to see if now would be a good time to jump in.

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FinalDasa

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#20 FinalDasa  Moderator

I appreciate that Tim Rogers goes the extra, extra, extra, extra mile for his reviews. And I think excessive information and passion are actually good things rather than the typical bite-size 10-minute review we get for more Youtube video game reviews.

However when I listen to his reviews, and he even often mentions the length of the reviews himself, I can't help but think of the many moments or mentions that could've been edited down. Spots get repetitive or off track somewhat routinely.

Again I do like what he's aiming for and think he's most of the way there. But I'd rather consume a happy medium rather than hours upon hours about a single game.

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UranalTruce

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Watching Story 5 most of it is about how he cut Story 5 but it also gets you the true ending and watching Story 6 half of it is an hourlong diatribe about where he gets cool jackets and glasses.

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VikingRk

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@uranaltruce:

It's long yes, but I feel like he makes it clear it can be read as a metaphor for video games.

I can't say whether I think his videos would be better if they were shorter, but the length is a negative for me, personally. Also, I like how often he jumps into autobiographical stuff, because his opinion on whatever game isn't really the point. (Borrowing one of his phrases: these are videos you can "luxuriate" in).

I can understand the tangents being seeming extraneous if you're waiting for him to get to the point, but honestly, I find his stuff feels incredibly cohesive on a long enough scale.

There's also just a lot of joy in seeing a guy do things so differently than anyone else. The length of these videos, the detail, the repetativness, the tangents, the particular way he narrates, etc., it's clear these are on-purpose stylistic choices. Ones I happen to like a lot.

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whitegreyblack

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I wouldn't mind the length at all if that length were well-utilized?

An endless stream of "everything" Tim Rogers experienced in and around this game, in a video review about how Cyberpunk 2077 is a game containing and endless stream of "everything" from modern games, seems kind of like the point? At least, that's how I'm currently interpreting it for myself. Who knows!

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bybeach

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From everything I have heard and read, I do not think Cyberpunk is a game deserving of a 9 hour review. Of course, at least for me.

Perhaps what this Tim Rogers is actually doing is art?

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MindBullet

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#25  Edited By MindBullet

Releasing a 9 hour review in a world where a good chunk of people think a 2 hour video essay is too much is pretty audacious, but then setting a guideline of how to best enjoy it while admitting that a bunch of those hours are redundant in a separate HOUR LONG INTRO is pretty deep into "fuck you" territory.

However

It's pretty clear Tim is doing a thing here. I mean, he's always doing a thing, right? I suppose it's up to you whether you're into that or not. I don't always agree with his points, but I think he mostly does a decent job justifying his wordiness and I respect the level of (ABSOLUTELY BUCKWILD INSANE) dedication he has for organizing and presenting his ideas. I still think about "The Trinket Ultimatum" from time to time.

The Cyberpunk review is every other Action Button review, but with a bit of flourish on it's structure, and if you know what Tim Rogers is like you probably have a good idea before even watching it whether you even want to engage with it. If you don't, just watch the HOUR LONG INTRO and decide for yourself from there.

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Junkerman

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#26  Edited By Junkerman

Never heard of this dude before - watched the hour long intro and thought it was pretty entertaining. He clearly knows what he's doing and I find the polite-audaciousness of the entire premise to be rather endearing.

Also its nice to know Cyberpunk was playable with a whoknowshowmanydollars sponsored gaming PC.

Holding out hope I'll at least be able to check it out myself one day on the Series S or PS5.

Anyway I'll be diving into two of his six review adventures over the next week and find myself surprisingly really looking forward to it.

It reminds me of the classic RedLetterMedia reviews. There is value in witnessing the unfathomably indepth views of a creator who studies the material with an intimacy beyond what the normal person would or should engage with.

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Humanity

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@junkerman: Just as a sidenote: Cyberpunk was playable even without a top end gaming PC even around launch. I realize that maybe I was just extremely lucky as it sometimes happens in PC gaming, but I bought the game the day it came out and had a "meager" GeForce 1080 with an i7 7700 and only 16gb of ram. The game ran perfectly fine with a mix of Medium-High details. Not only did it perform fine but I didn't encounter any serious bugs or for that matter any of the graphical glitches that you see in the myriad of meme-video-compilations. I had exactly one very minor sidequest bug out and some weapon descriptions would scroll off screen but thats about the bulk of it.

So I might have been part of a very small minority but game worked perfectly fine for me. Rough in some spots but definitely playable and, for me at least, enjoyable.

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Junkerman

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@humanity: Thats good to know!

I dont think I'll be in possession of a gaming PC for a decade or two - so I'm hoping I'll be able to experience it for myself on console in some form thats more palatable. I dont really have much in the way of expectations. If I get to slowly walk down some rainy, Bladerunner-esque street while a synth track plays over me I'll probably be content.

That being said if anyone on Series S whose played it and has any feedback I'd be happy to hear from you.

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Humanity

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@junkerman: Here’s hoping for those next-gen versions to actually work well.

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Shindig

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#30  Edited By Shindig

The thing I got from the intro (aside from the erm ... mammoth undertaking) was that Tim really likes to spend money on stuff. $7000 on a PC I can kind of understand but an $800 modded Playstation. On a 77" screen?

Madman.

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sandra5

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I really want to see

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Nodima

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@junkerman: I'm someone who gave the PS4 version a shot and barely experienced the game before accepting the refund. By barely experienced I mean gave in to almost 15 hours of glitch and bug induced madness. I accepted the premise of the review and watched the intro, part 2 and part 6. Nothing I didn't already know about the game was spoiled, I felt like I got a lot out of those segments, and I also felt a weird urge to re-purchase the game until I saw the headlines reminding me an actual PS5 version was in the works.

If you want to steer clear of a lot of the nuts and bolts of the game and remain in the theoretical/conceptual phase of the conversation, I think that's a good place to be. The second hour of Part 6 in particular is just great cultural criticism pure and simple, almost tangentially related to CP2077.

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Junkerman

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@nodima: Thanks for the tip I'll probably do just that; or go back and watch his older stuff - I dig this guy's style.

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tartyron

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#34  Edited By tartyron

I have now finished a week and a half long bonanza of playing through Cyberpunk specifically because I wanted to watch this review as intended, and then watched the review today as intended watching only two parts plus intro and conclusion (what he liked, and what he didn’t like). I’m probably going to watch the other clips that he didn’t want me to watch, but I have to say, that Tim’s observations and conclusions of the game are supremely spot on (of course, that is also likely colored by my extreme digging of his shtick and the freshness of my own play through.) The statement that this is the mid life crisis of video games frames this bizarre journey of playing a 70 hour open world game just to watch a multi-hour long review has made me feel like I’ve just had a microcosm of a midlife crisis of my own.

My lack of wordsmithery (ok, his language has worked it’s way into my brain) isn’t nearly as verbose as his. My conclusion is that this is a game with extreme problems, godawful marketing that killed it’s own ambitions and needless amounts of filler. It has some of the best character work in a game I’ve seen sprinkled on a meat pie otherwise made entirely of raccoon musk glands and glazed with CakeBoss caliber fondant icing art. Essentially, a beautiful thing with beautiful moments that if separated from mediocre to poor gameplay and frat boy humor, would have been a great AAA point and click adventure game/interactive fiction. If a game of this budget had the balls to be a 15 hour dating sim in this setting, it might have gone down as something other than an unachievable disaster.

And like Tim, I think I need a break from games for a while after this. Like, a long break.

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wollywoo

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My god, I thought I was watching the review but it turns out it was just the hour-long intro? I like Tim Rogers a lot, and I *loved* his FF7 translation videos, but this level of self-indulgence I can't handle right now.

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LonelySpacePanda

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Going to wait for the next gen patch before watching. Patch for game, not Tim to be clear.

Wish he had a bit more variety in videos like in the Kotaku days. 1 video per year is not something that can be maintained and then if you have no interest in that game that's more like 0 video per year.

More than anything though, I miss him on Insert Credit podcast. He's really funny on there.