How do you feel about Dorian Pavus' homosexuality?

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joshwent

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@hunter5024: Maybe devs like Bioware can include a "don't ask don't tell" mode for the masses of sexually insecure gamers. If you try and chat up a character that is anything other than straight or talk with them about their past that has been in any way affected by their sexual orientation, you get a nice "..." in response. Everybody wins! ;)

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Anonymous_Jesse

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I disliked hearing Dorian was gay before playing the game. I mean I tried to stay away from coverage yet I heard that somewhere. The reason why I disliked it, was because before I met him, that was his set up and unlike all the other characters I already had notions about him, and if you followed Dorians story they pretty much were confirmed and wasn't all that interesting.

I suppose all that had little impact on my enjoyment of the game either way.

I romanced Sara and enjoyed her character, but I liked Claptrap so...

On the other hand I didn't know Iron Bull was bisexual, until he started joking with some of the guys in my party and it was pretty funny.

And the way they handled the transgendered character was quite good.

So I feel Bioware just slipped up with one character and really it was more to do with the writing than the actual content.

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Christoffer

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I think it was well done. Dorian's story is focused on his sexuality mainly because it's a big deal to his family and the society he comes from, and because of that, to him. It's a story of being the black sheep and trying to find peace and acceptance in that.

Maybe it's a bit too heavy handed. But that's like saying "Hey, I'm a straight man and I don't make a big deal about it". Because of society it IS a bigger deal. Whether he likes it or not, he's an outlier, and identifies as such.

But hey, what do I know.

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BabyChooChoo

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#54  Edited By BabyChooChoo

@christoffer said:

I think it was well done. Dorian's story is focused on his sexuality mainly because it's a big deal to his family and the society he comes from, and because of that, to him. It's a story of being the black sheep and trying to find peace and acceptance in that.

Maybe it's a bit too heavy handed. But that's like saying "Hey, I'm a straight man and I don't make a big deal about it". Because of society it IS a bigger deal. Whether he likes it or not, he's an outlier, and identifies as such.

But hey, what do I know.

I was going to write some big, long essay, but this sums up my own feelings pretty well. I think the way EA/Bioware sorta came out beforehand and had to stress the fact they had a gay character was a wee bit...iffy/questionable, but that's about it. The way it was handled in-game seemed perfectly fine and actually turned out to be one of the better companion storylines.

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spiritbomb

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For the record, the transsexual character in Bull's merc group is Krem, played by none other than Jennifer Hale herself.

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joshth

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#56  Edited By joshth

Dorian is not only an amazing character (way better than Iron Bull Jeff!), he is one of the few video game characters that deal with homosexuality well. He is not defined by it, but it does play a large effect on his life, and that is a realistic character. The only characters I can think of who come close to handling the issue this well is the sister from Gone Home and Kanji from P4.

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Jimbo

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Ha, I remember thinking that Krem's voice actor was exceptional for such a relatively minor character, but I had absolutely no idea it was Jen Hale.

As for Dorian, I think he's one of the best characters in the game. Is his homosexuality dealt with heavy handedly? It's Bioware so of course it is, but no moreso than how they deal with everything else. To be fair to them there's not exactly a shortage of gay people who feel the need to remind everyone of their gayness with every other sentence (kinda like firefighters in the respect), so it didn't strike me as that unbelievable. Also subtlety is just quite hard to pull off when you're trying to establish a character and give them an arc all in the space of ~half a dozen short conversations.

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Sessh

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#58  Edited By Sessh

I think he is a rather well written/done character, some obvious clichés (his parents not approving, the church being freaked out by him, him feeling the need to overcompensate sometimes) aside. He's my favourite character in the game anyway.

And yeah, they shouldn't have made a big deal out of him being gay, because it isn't.

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Mortuss_Zero

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Hmmm, I barely cared he was gay? I mean, I cared a bit when he said his father tried using blood magic to "fix" him, because that's repugnant. I cared a little that he was uninterested in me, but I cared more that Varric wasn't interested. Only because they're a couple of my favorite men in the game. Finally I cared enough to let one of my best friends know how cool Dorian is, because he's totally going to want to date him when he's done riding the Iron Bull.
There you go, I cared on 3 occasions. Dorian's dope.

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deactivated-5e49e9175da37

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@joshwent said:

@hunter5024: Maybe devs like Bioware can include a "don't ask don't tell" mode for the masses of sexually insecure gamers. If you try and chat up a character that is anything other than straight or talk with them about their past that has been in any way affected by their sexual orientation, you get a nice "..." in response. Everybody wins! ;)

I actually hit on Cullen and he got all queerded out and I felt a weird swirl of social anxiety that is probably not too far removed from the real social anxiety when you get your orientation wires crossed with someone else.

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gunninkr

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I think its pretty gay...HEYOOOOOO! He is my favorite character and I liked how it was all handled.

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OurSin_360

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Publicity stunt, Sera is the exact same but it's not even a big deal apparently.

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Moonshadow101

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#63  Edited By Moonshadow101

Dorian is easily one of the best characters in the game. His sexuality takes center stage for precisely one cutscene, it's not really a dominating aspect of his character. His alienation from is family is a dominating aspect, and his sexuality is a part of that, but it's hardly the only part.

And as for the cutscene itself, I have to applaud bioware. Including homosexuality in games is easy. Including homophobia in games is much, much harder. It's a far more nuanced and responsible depiction that DAII's approach of "everyone is bi and nobody talks about it." That approach was nice for the larger array of possibilities it opened up, but it was narratively lazy.

Incidently, I had no idea whatsoever that he was gay before playing the game.

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Jonathan

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#64  Edited By Jonathan

Continuing my need to flirt with absolutely everyone in Dragon Age, I actually considered making my character gay when the romance dialogue option starting popping up. Of course I have no issue with his sexuality, but my one problem with the whole LGBT focus of this game is that, in Bioware's quest to be as inclusive as possible, they forgot to include any decent straight male options. You have Cassandra, whom I think is a fantastic character, but not in the least bit attractive, and Josephine, who can't even join you on the field. While straight women have 4 options, and bisexual women 6. Just make the characters playersexual, like in Dragon Age 2.

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_Zombie_

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I think it needs to be advertised. Gay guys need characters they can identify with. Do I wish he'd had more to his personal storyline aside from his sexuality? Yeah. But it's a good step forward for gaming.

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Marz

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didn't have a problem with him, seemed like a bro and i always had him in my party despite his preferences.

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AlexanderSheen

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#67  Edited By AlexanderSheen

To me, him being gay didn't add or took away anything from his character. And I don't think he needs to be labeled as a representation of anything. He's just Dorian. I liked him because he was a charming bastard and his banter with the others was great.

@jonathan said:

...You have Cassandra, whom I think is a fantastic character, but not in the least bit attractive...

I will fight you... to the death.

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thelastgunslinger

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I adored and romanced Dorian. His sexuality is very important to his character but doesn't completely define who he is.

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CaLe

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#69  Edited By CaLe

He was the best all-round character in this particular game and the best gay character in any game I've played. I was legitimately disappointed that I chose to play as a woman because once I found out he was gay I knew I'd miss out on getting more dialogue out of him.

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splodge

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Wait, dorian is gay?! I had no idea! I roll with him as a permanent member of the crew, and I play as a lady inquisitor so maybe he never got flirty with me or something. I romanced josephine and have never strayed (I aint no cheater!). Is there any way I can get him and Solas to hook up? Maybe that will cheer him up a bit, Solas needs to get laid.

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ArtisanBreads

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#71  Edited By ArtisanBreads

@zevvion said:

First, I didn't realize if a character was written as gay he was immediately meant to be a representation of gay men. I haven't played Inquisition, but does that mean that if this Dorian character is evil, all gay men are seen as evil? Doesn't make sense to me.


This is a maddening thing about how people react to media now. Everything must be a statement about something bigger and total conclusions must be drawn. You have say a sexually promoiscous female character? So the author is slut shaming and hates women. Those kind of jumps are routinely drawn. A character in a work should be assumed to represent nothing but themselves. Not that they can't represent more obviously, but like you point out, this mindset is a leap that is not reasonable.

@hunter5024 said:

I like that Dorian's backstory is heavily influenced by his sexual preference. I don't understand why people want characters who "just happen to be" gay (or black, or transexual or whatever). If you're going to make a character gay, it's more interesting if you do something with it. Isn't the whole point of asking for a more diverse set of characters so we can get more varied and unique stories?

And props for this post. It makes logical sense too. Sera is a rogue in a group of misfits. Dorian is from a very traditional background.

It's funny to see a game be so inclusive and tackle so many interesting subjects and still get heavily criticized for it. Subjects hardly any games have even touched. And this game on takes on multiple ones head on. I applaud it. Really cool to see them do things like this in such a huge game.

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splodge

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@artisanbreads: For the me, the most interesting part is how much it ADDS to the game. This is what diversity in games looks like. Dragon Age Inquisition has completely hit the nail on the head, I think. Games are increaingly becoming more and more diverse with lots of different choices to make based on culture, ethnicity, gender and sexual orientation. We have a way to go, sure, but things are going in the right direction.

Unfortunately, no one seems to get props for doing things right. People scream from rooftops they want more diversity, then when they get it, they pick it apart and denegrate it for not being the specific kind of diversity they want for themselves.

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ArtisanBreads

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#73  Edited By ArtisanBreads

@splodge: Well put man. I am against a forced feeling diversity but the fact that Dragon Age did so much and tackled things in a very head on way made it all matter. I think it works well. It works into the political and social aspects of the game and what you have to shape the Inqusition to be as you go.

Because it tackles so much it ends up feeling pretty profound and makes the world feel real, to me.

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deerokus

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#74  Edited By deerokus

This is a really weird topic topic. He's gay and he's a really interesting character. Cool. I can't see how anyone can be perturbed by that.

Is it because I'm not American and so I live in a country where gay people have equal enough rights that it isn't a politically-charged issue that I find it strange? I don't know. Odd.

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Jonathan

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@deerokus said:

This is a really weird topic topic. He's gay and he's a really interesting character. Cool. I can't see how anyone can be perturbed by that.

Is it because I'm not American and so I live in a country where gay people have equal enough rights that it isn't a politically-charged issue that I find it strange? I don't know. Odd.

Fantastic comment until the xenophobic nonsense that's quite clearly coming from the position of someone who's perception of America is shaped exclusively by the movie Deliverance. Massachusetts legalized gay marriage over a decade ago; San Francisco is arguably the most gay-friendly city in the world. America isn't a single gun-toting, bible-thumping entity.

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Random45

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I'm a bit late to the party, but I actually really liked Dorian, it's seriously the first time I EVER considered doing a gay romance in a video game despite being straight myself. I didn't find his character arc that heavy handed at all, since it's a good reflection of how it's viewed by a lot of people in our life right now.

The only real issue I have about the game as far as relationships go is the fact that as a male character, I only get two choices for a heterosexual relationship, whereas female characters potentially have double that amount... Also you can't have a romantic relationship with Varric - again!

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GoldenAvenger2

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I was sadly unsurprised by the backlash against Dorian. There was always going to be backlash. But it's stupid and propelled by simple bigotry.

I love the fact that Dorian's gay, I love the fact that it was promoted, i.e advertized as a reason to go get the game (it would not have increased sales 10 years ago), I love that the fact he's gay wasn't just brushed off and they actually addressed it, I love him and his gorgeous moustache.

Forced? Heavy-handed? This is Bioware we're taking about, they've always had queer characters. You'd think by 2014 we'd have stopped asking these kinds of questions.