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#1 Edited by Malawi1321 (62 posts) -

Not sure if this was reported elsewhere earlier, but I just came across this news on the BBC, but it looks like twin galaxies has officially kicked out Billy Mitchell as well as instituted a ban on him.

I find it not very surprising considering the crummy defense (non-defense?) he gave. But considering how tough some of that stuff was to verify, the speed and decisiveness is pretty impressive.

Link to article: http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-43752171

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#2 Posted by Boonsong (1744 posts) -

Good thing he has that hot sauce to fall back on.

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#3 Posted by ll_Exile_ll (2953 posts) -

It is my understanding that it was, in fact, pretty easy to verify. An emulated Donkey Kong has telltale signs that a genuine arcade board does not. The videos of his DK high scores show pretty definitively that they were played on MAME, which is absolutely against the submission rules. Also, this stuff started coming out back in February, I wouldn't exactly say Twin Galaxies' response was all that swift.

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#4 Posted by Fezrock (547 posts) -

My primary reaction through most of this saga was to confuse Twin Galaxies with Iron Galaxy and wonder how Dave Lang ended up responsible for the Donkey Kong high score records.

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#5 Edited by Rahf (388 posts) -

@ll_exile_ll: I can understand their discretion, considering Mitchell's profile and his garnered notoriety. Even though this may have started cropping up in February, they were seemingly wise enough to investigate and interrogate before officially announcing a decision.

It's terribly easy to immediately jump onto an internet bandwagon. Many times without getting a proper view of the whole picture.

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#6 Posted by devise22 (607 posts) -

This is such a weird story.

Like, on the one hand we have zero idea if Billy Mitchell legitimately played these video games, or was just using MAME and upping scores to gain notoriety. Remember he was involved in that Documentary that did pretty well too. Plus I imagine all the celebrity increased his hot sauce sales or BBQ sauce or whatever it is.

A part of me wonders that the point of a boycott is now. I'm not defending his actions or anything, but bocyotting him now just feels....like a waste of time. I'm okay if they remove any of his scores and records for integrity sake. But Mitchell already won guys. If his end game was to manipulate something, and leverage that to gain more money. Guess what? He gained money. His noncaring response to it is probably exactly indicative of his own personal care/non care about this stuff. Again though I'm just speculating, but still.

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#7 Posted by SSully (5540 posts) -

Get fucked Mitchell

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#8 Posted by BladeOfCreation (852 posts) -

This story has been marinating for a while, so I'm not surprised at this spicy ending.

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#9 Posted by Torrim (409 posts) -

USA USA USA

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#10 Posted by CatMeat (68 posts) -
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#11 Edited by Onemanarmyy (3457 posts) -

@devise22: The boycott is just there to show that they're taking this stuff seriously. Not only to prevent Billy from returning to a game and attempt to cheat his way to the top again, but also to send a 'don't even try buddy... We will catch you and you will be banned' message to newcomers.

From what i've heard Twin Galaxy is not taken seriously in the speedrun community and apparently have been shady at times, but if you're part of that organization you want to do everything you can to look legit. If they were very soft about this whole situation, no speedrunner would trust them to keep the competition fair.

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#12 Edited by xanadu (1711 posts) -

This feels like a good excuse to re-watch one of the greatest documentaries ever filmed...it's funny how everyone said, "oh they just edited Billy Mitchel to look like such a jerk so the movie would have suspense."

Guess it wasn't far from the truth after all.

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#13 Posted by Splodge (2545 posts) -

He cheated so good riddance.

There's too many cheaters getting away with shit.

This is somewhat cathartic.

Go screw, Billy.

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#14 Posted by killacam (1342 posts) -

@xanadu: Apparently they edited it to make him look like LESS of a jerk, if you can believe that, as they wanted the focus to be on Steve Weibe.

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#16 Posted by Heycalvero (277 posts) -

@xanadu: Woo boy, thanks for sharing that doc. It's... Something special.

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#18 Posted by Mikemcn (8438 posts) -

I need to watch king of kong, does it hint at any of billy's sketchiness? Or is it just a straightforward documentary.

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#19 Posted by Rahf (388 posts) -

@mikemcn: If you mean given the recent news, maybe there's stuff one can infer. My understanding, though, is that Billy's considered the champion during that period, and nobody's the wiser.

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#20 Posted by xanadu (1711 posts) -

@heycalvero: oh have you never seen it? If so, you definitely need to watch all of it. It's incredible.

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#21 Edited by Boonsong (1744 posts) -

@mikemcn: I mean he totally comes off like an asshole in the film, because surprise he is, but it doesn't hint on him in any way being a cheater. Just a bloated ego.

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#22 Posted by Mikemcn (8438 posts) -

@boonsong said:

@mikemcn: I mean he totally comes off like an asshole in the film, because surprise he is, but it doesn't hint on him in any way being a cheater. Just a bloated ego.

@rahf said:

@mikemcn: If you mean given the recent news, maybe there's stuff one can infer. My understanding, though, is that Billy's considered the champion during that period, and nobody's the wiser.

Well still worth a watch I suppose, especially with this to consider.

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#23 Posted by DasaKamov (761 posts) -

@devise22 said:

Like, on the one hand we have zero idea if Billy Mitchell legitimately played these video games, or was just using MAME and upping scores to gain notoriety. Remember he was involved in that Documentary that did pretty well too. Plus I imagine all the celebrity increased his hot sauce sales or BBQ sauce or whatever it is.

I think it's a case of Billy Mitchell being a legitimately GREAT Donkey Kong player, but a combination of his ego ("I'll prove to you how great I really am"), the pressure of maintaining his records and an addiction to being famous (as much as one can be famous for playing arcade games) pushed him over the brink.

It's not an excuse of course, but I don't think the "he's a total fraud" argument holds much water. After all, he did score 990,000+ in front of a live audience with dozens of witnesses on an actual, vintage DK arcade machine.

Online
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#25 Posted by devise22 (607 posts) -

@dasakamov: That is fair. I think it's always tough when you see people leverage celebrity to make money in other ways right. Like when a talented musician creates a clothing line and stops making albums.

Perhaps in this case Billy Mitchell isn't a complete fraud, but he's more of a business man than he is a game player, and provided he wasn't using MAME there wouldn't really be anything wrong with that approach. Similar to the example above, not all musicians have to love what they do, I just like it better when they upfront present that they are more business than they are anything else.

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#26 Posted by Torrim (409 posts) -


It's not an excuse of course, but I don't think the "he's a total fraud" argument holds much water. After all, he did score 990,000+ in front of a live audience with dozens of witnesses on an actual, vintage DK arcade machine.

Except that, I guess when you get determined to be fraud, it's pretty total to everything you were ever involved in.

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#27 Posted by afabs515 (1987 posts) -

@fezrock said:

My primary reaction through most of this saga was to confuse Twin Galaxies with Iron Galaxy and wonder how Dave Lang ended up responsible for the Donkey Kong high score records.

Yup. I was in exactly the same boat. Good to know I wasn't the only one

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#28 Edited by Quantris (1140 posts) -

As far as I'm concerned TG was basically complicit and I shall continue to not attribute them any credibility or trust.

I like the idea of putting Dave Lang in charge because you know this shit wouldn't fly in the Langzone.

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#32 Posted by OurSin_360 (5963 posts) -

I like how the gb crew beat all his official high scores on upf, amazing!

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#33 Posted by BladeOfCreation (852 posts) -

Update: Billy Mitchell just made a statement in which he said that he'll be making everything transparent and available to people for review.

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#34 Posted by pauljeremiah (192 posts) -

@xanadu: It is a fantastic film and I love showing it to non-gaming friends, just to see how they react to it.

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#35 Posted by andythemeZ (287 posts) -

There’s something extra sinister and “oooh, Burn!” about the fact that he is also kicked out of the arcade itself.

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#36 Posted by devise22 (607 posts) -

@bladeofcreation: Yeah was just reading that. I'm curious if anything he can do at this point will change anything? I suppose if they have video records, witness statements, and can prove without a shadow of a doubt that his scores were not submitted with any emulators.

But I thought that was what already happened? Didn't the new Admin at Twin Galaxies prove that they were using emulators for his scores? I'm not surprised to see him respond in such a professional manner though, again the guy was a restaurateur and sauce guy too, he screams business guy not "gamer" and always has. So to see him respond as if he's a lawyer in this instance seems pretty on brand.

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#37 Edited by BladeOfCreation (852 posts) -

@devise22: Apparently an independent party that Mitchell got to look into this on his behalf ALSO came to the conclusion that MAME was used. From what I've read, this seems like it's been going on for a long time, with at least one person raising questions about Mitchell for years now.