Commentary on GB Hiring

Except that is a very simple-minded interpretation of that phrase and a red herring. The insinuation is that gender plays a role in the hiring decision instead of pure merit. When people say "We should hire based on merit, not gender" they are very plainly saying gender should have nothing to do with hiring. They are certainly not saying that people are picking people off the streets because of their gender. Stop quoting this. I assume this Jenn Frank person has better insights but this one makes them seem incredibly obtuse.

@excast: some people think that they are speaking for the gb community an conduct themselves accordingly. They actually don't get the message that most people don't agree with them an that their actions are deplorable.

@video_game_king: @marokai: @hunter5024: @finaldasa: @goku13k@turboman

I think this is a great idea. Maybe a twitter hashtag campaign? Seeing as how that was the delivery vehicle for so much hate it would be nice to use it to deliver some love. Maybe everyone make a Vine with an agreed upon hashtag. The risk is it could easily get hijacked I guess. But we should definitely do something immediately that is positive and apologetic.

You, like myself, have been around this website for a long time (or so I've noticed). Do you remember when the big Nintendo fiasco broke out on this website years ago? It was the one where Jeff posted an article critiquing an official Nintendo magazine for a big multi-page spread of Mario Galaxy. His article was sarcastically pondering on whether or not the publication would give the game a high score. The Nintendo fanatics on the site back lashed very hard against Jeff, some of them even resulting to personal insults à la the 8.8 fiasco. Some people were banned for it, and I even remember writers of the magazine in question making GB accounts to address how upset they were with Jeff. The reason I bring this up is because we heard not a peep from anyone on the site after it happened. I'm not saying that addressing it would have been the right move per say, but I think it plays into the tradition you're referring to of Giant bomb not addressing heated topics.Obviously this time is a way bigger deal than a few fanboys who got their feelings hurt. Regardless about how I feel on this whole thing, I would like to see the staff formally address it, and like you said, not just a mention from Patrick in one of his Worth Readings.

To add to this, as someone who has been following since the Gamespot days, I don't doubt you guys for a second when it comes to being honest about the vetting process. However, if you remove that context I think it's pretty easy to see how people who aren't familiar with you guys jump to those sorts of conclusions, especially considering today's internet climate in regards to social awareness and diversity and stuff.

Jeff himself talks a lot about the tight-knit group of people in your line of work and how hard (nigh impossible) it is to break in. He's gone pretty deep into it in both podcasts and stuff like his Jar Time videos. I think it's an issue many people were/are acutely aware of and I think this sort of reaction was simply unavoidable when it came to you guys hiring people. I myself was pretty disappointed as I was looking for a more fresh new faces, although that doesn't mean I'm not excited to see what content comes around from Dan and Jason being on board. To be honest I'm incredibly stoked about the future of this site between the SF crew, the crazy people in Chicago with Patrick, and GBEast.

And I want to make special note to the mods and you in particular Rorie. It seems like every couple of months my respect and appreciation for you being here grows and I can't overestimate how happy I am to see you as part of the site, both in community/support roles and on camera. I look forward to whatever write-up comes from you guys. Keep on keepin' on duder.

@rorie: The term is generally used derogatorily to point out the fact that that individual is not transgendered, or homosexual, and therefore their argument has no merit.

http://thebicker.net/post/62744339786/dont-use-the-word-cishet

^is a good article to show how it is being used.

http://shutthefuckupstraightpeople.tumblr.com/usefulterms

http://littlestraightallythings.tumblr.com/faq

http://white-cishet-male-things.tumblr.com

^While some of the points are valid in this blog (to a very minute, overgeneralized degree) it shows the usual intent of the phrase.

http://sophialorens.tumblr.com/post/90409882001/orange-is-the-new-black-does-represent-men-tho-it

I'm not trying to beat a dead horse here, but as an openly gay male engaged to a transgendered woman, and part of the community as a whole, this is most definitely a slur. It wasn't intended to be at first, sure, but it certainly is now.

Edit: fixed links

I know this isn't the place (I'm as upset as all of you in regards to the entire situation, though I have nothing else to contribute since I'd just stress myself out ;_;) but I just wanted to put random sports updates here as a weird break from the heavy discussions and just to see how weird it'll look being out of place... Maybe it'll get flagged who knows!

1. The USMNT lost to Belgium, which I am particularly sad about since Tim Howard gave a performance of a lifetime. Too bad the US couldn't get their offense going.

2. NHL free agency has started so lots of stuff going on there though nothing that is super notable has happened yet

3. NBA free agency started last night too with the first big news being Carmelo Anthony made his first team visit to Chicago today. (SIDE NOTE: GOD, I HOPE he ends ups going there)

4. MLS is getting a boost of viewers from the World Cup. I do hope that in the next few years we'd have developed a legitimate soccer/football program and also develop more players who are good enough to play in international leagues and also raising the quality of MLS in general.

So there's my weird sports news break brought to you by CBS Sports! I know some or most of you here don't care about sports but I hope reading that anyway helped ease some of that internet-induced tension. Hehe! :D

I would support this. Regardless of whether this was GB members or not, it would still be good to express kindness and support when people have used the name of this site in harming her. I don't care if anyone here thinks she "deserved" it; she didn't. We can disagree with her on many things and still feel for the crappy way in which people have treated her.

I'm not quite sure what we can do, but I'd be on board with a shared gesture supportive toward her.

@sarisa: I feel people are yelling at you instead of responding to you, so I'll say that I disagree with simply 3 groups - or even 4, 5, 6.... who knows how many, because people have have varying opinions. They can agree with people on some points and disagree regarding other things, even if they are minute differences.

To give some examples, how about:

1. People who say they're disappointed and leave it at that.
2. People who say they're angry and it's the same typical BS white men with their He-Man Women Haters Club or Get Rid Of Slimy girlS.
3. People who are so upset, they no longer want to support the Giant Bomb, either cancelling their subscription solely because of this or no longer want to listen to the Bombcast. (Personally, my feelings towards this group are the same as if it had been people leaving because Giant Bomb had hired a woman - only one group is more politically correct.)
4. People who don't really have an opinion one way or the other. They're happy with Jason and Dan, and would've been equally as happy if it had been a white woman and a Latino man.
5. People who disagree with 1-3, but don't think people should attack them, and don't think they asked for it.
6. Terrible people who make threats and use homophobic slurs instead of actually discussing things civilly.
7. And more groups that I'm forgetting.

This is mainly about your "That's really about it" if you meant it to be those 3 groups and not like a Cronkite's "And that's the way it is."

I'm not discounting you're experiences, but I have heard the phrase used many many times without it being a slur.

@yyziggurat: I'm deleting this just because what Samantha has said in the past isn't really relevant to the outlash that people have sent her way today, especially death and rape threats, and I don't want to derail this conversation about the Giant Bomb community by bringing that up. Her previous blog posts may have been incendiary, but if she's deleted them than I'm going to respect that that indicates that she perhaps doesn't feel that they're relevant to this discussion. At any rate I hope that we can all agree that her criticisms of the Giant Bomb hires doesn't indicate that she deserves any of the many horrific tweets that have been thrown her way today.

@gaspower: Tim Howard deserves a golden statue in the middle of Washington D.C after that game.

@tom_scherschel: I worry about using Twitter, since that was so stained by the day's events. Some sort of appreciation thread would be more directly modded and controlled, and perhaps show her that GB as a site truly doesn't tolerate shittiness like what she experienced on Twitter?

Seriously this. It is 10:40pm California time and Rorie is still responding to assholes like me who are fuzzy on the details. Much respect.

Eh, like you said, anything on a public forum with no control has the chance to be taken advantage of.

Maybe try to figure out what charity she's into and set up a community stream towards it?

A State of the Site livestream might be a good idea. Just like an explanation of what's expected of the community(Thought it should be obvious), and like what's going to happen in the future to possibly combat this type of thing.

Like some horrible feminist dracula, I return.

@chrisharris "cishet" means cisgender/heterosexual. (Hi I'm sarisa and I am a laaaaaazy typist.) It is absolutely not the same as "moron, idiot, retarded, etc."

@cabbagesensei: I kind of want to hug you for that youtube! I needed something not-depressing.

@clonedzero: So...you have sympathy for someone who has, again, *been threatened with rape and murder by men* and p. much flooded with vitriol by men until they said they were wary of men? Uh....

@turboman said:

This...maybe isn't the best idea. At least, in my opinion. After being swamped with hate from Giantbomb folx and "I don't want anything to do with this community, this is some of the worst abuse I've ever gotten, I'll stop talking about video games entirely if you just leave me alone" how do you think she'd feel about more of you coming along and going "oh we're the nice ones, here's a gift (or whatever) to show it?" I mean, idk, I'm just one person with one opinion and I could be wrong, but...

The solace I take with me, in full recognition that it could have been really cool if GB hired a lady for instance, is that I choose to trust Jeff and the crew to have taken the issue to heart as they made their decision. They chose Dan and Jason and despite the fact that it is two more white guys, I think it goes without saying we expect nothing less than a continuation of the balance the site takes between the humorous and serious in this industry. We may (and certainly have) abstract it out beyond into a discussion of the issue writ large, and certainly the industry as little to truly refute the effort if one understandable chooses to do so, but amidst all this I know these gentlemen too well and consider them too savvy to not trust they took this seriously.

Today, I think the response that stuck with me was left by one Alex Navarro speaking to being a site plenty capable of taking criticism. It's one that recognizes a reaction is out there, and reasonable, and that they are accountable in the industry they hold quite a bit of respect in but it's also one that I think leaves Giant Bomb with many of those friends in tact. Can't speak as much for the community, however deserved or not it is, which comprised the second part of that message, the one about the unnecessary and unwelcome harassment that followed.

@notlikelytocare: Thanks for these. I'll try to read them when I get a chance.

Well, such is often the case with ethnic/racial/gender terms.

There's a difference between observing that somebody is "cishet," and doing so while sardonically proposing that due to their typical gamer dude cishet-ness that their argument is somehow invalid. Deployed as such it's no less pejorative than "SJW."

I really appreciate what you do with the community and i especially don't want to diminish what you do or will do but i really believe more than ever that something meaningful needs to come from Jeff directly. It's his site, it was born from a place of great injustice after his firing from gamespot, it's even named after him! Jeff is the heart and soul of this site and its most influential and respected voice. When Jeff speaks, people listen.

@irvandus: Fuck yeah, a statue of Tim and HIS BEARD. That bald head + beard combination just makes him seem like the meanest motherfucker out there.

She in fact does explain further in her article. But one of the main points is that *clears throat* "merit" based hiring has institutionalize and subconscious bias towards straight while males.

I know it doesn't make sense. But there's a belief held by some that this is somehow a commonplace thing in the business world. I can say from first-hand experience working at a large company that I have never, ever seen this happen myself. Where I work, there is a referral program, so if there's an open position listed on the company's career site and I refer a candidate to HR for one of those publicly listed positions, that candidate is immediately put through the vetting process. However, that does not guarantee anything more than your resume getting a good look in HR. Depending on qualifications, you still might not get past that initial vetting stage. Even if you have twenty years of experience in your field and are the ideal candidate for the position, you still have to go through the same process as everyone else.

Although there's nothing wrong with the fact that Giant Bomb made two "safe" veteran hires this week - particularly in light of the fact that the SF office was critically understaffed, and they surely wanted some kind of return to normal functioning after this past year (and I'm sure Dan and Jason will be great!) - I hope they also stop amid all this commotion to think about whether the site has become more insular then they'd like it to be.

And if it has, then to come up with some great new plan to react to it. A plan that is their idea, and no one else's. Freelancers? Recurring guests? Perhaps another new hire, somewhere down the road? I don't know, and it'd be foolish for me to guess!

But the appeal of the site has always been to be fun, to be real, and to make it look easy. Having that foundation creates a unique opportunity to bring new voices into play in a way that isn't bullshit. And to show a whole lot of people that such a thing is possible. It'd be pretty cool.

After all is said and done, I would much rather see a real, live positive example of a different point of view than a million angry conceptual debates about it.

Funny thing about that, all these links are some of the first, on the first page of google if you search "cishet tumblr". The fact that's the case kinda proves my point. I urge you to do that search as well, and peruse some of the blog entries.

Edit: @rorie No problem man, this is a travesty to say the least. If we're going to be telling people not to use some derogatory terms, it should apply to all terms, not only selective ones. (I know you agree, just wanted to point out why I went through the trouble).

P.S. Thanks for working so hard on all this, especially in such a sensitive time of year, you guys are easily the best thing to happen to VG journalism in the past 10 years, and I'm proud to be a part of such an expansive and diverse community.

@sarisa: Do you think organizing some kind of actual apology, written/photo/video, would be too much? It feels shitty to just leave things as they are, but I understand your point.

@sinisterraven: She has a tendency to slant the truth and bend reality. It's a misguided superhero complex.

I can sympathize because there is no way to justify threats of rape or murder being directed at Samantha Allen or others. I can also think that she and others went out of their way to be exceedingly negative about Giant Bomb and it's staff before any of those threats got sent their way. It's important not to see the latter as justification for the former.

There has indeed been a very ugly undertone of passive aggressive commentary directed at the site from folks like Leigh Alexander, Maddy Myers, Elizabeth Simins, and Allen ever since E3. They went out of their way to paint the site as a group of misogynists and some even went as far as to try to organize developer and journalist boycotts. It didn't come off as productive or an attempt to have a discussion. It came off as a group of women involved in games journalism ganging up and lashing out.

I sent a message of support to Allen early this afternoon. Not because I agree with the things she and others have said about Giant Bomb or it's community, but because I don't feel anyone should have to deal with the level of bile they have been receiving, regardless of their over the top commentary about the site.

That's good to hear, Rorie. And while I'm hesitant to bring it up, I think it's worth mentioning that many people seem to only care about what Jeff in particular has to say about things. When Patrick has stood up against things in the past, many have dismissed it as not really representing the views of the site(aka. the head honcho, Jeff).

I appreciate all you continue to do in dealing with this, but in my opinion, if a staff statement is going to be made, Jeff weighing in would be the best way for most people to accept it. He's basically the face of Giant Bomb, and while his tweet about this was helpful, him personally being clear on this so that there is no getting around it would mean a lot to me and many members here.

You can post that in reply to me all you want (I think you or someone else has at least twice today already) but you're completely missing my point. I don't care about what gender you are. I don't care about your sexual preference is. I don't care what your socio-political views are. All that I care about is that you do the job that your are hired to do and you do it well. You don't have to be a minority, and you don't have to be in the majority (ie "straight white guy") to do it.. However I know just as well as you do that people are hired because a diversity quota. It sucks, but it happens. And yes, there are people saying hire a woman regardless, instead a competent, qualified person.

It's bad any way you slice it.

@marokai: To be honest starting public show of support like a thread would probably end up getting derailed as well IMO. To be honest, I think US having these discussions here is probably good enough instead of starting something else with good intentions that could still end up getting tampered and derailed with. :D

I wanted to come by today and express my thanks to the moderators of the community, and @rorie in particular, for the huge amount of work they've done towards keeping things civil. I can't imagine what a hard job it is, and I'm sure it wears on you all personally.

I do not post here, in general, and this thread reinforces that decision strongly. Criticizing the decisions of a company you support - especially one you pay money to - is an essential component of the relationship between those two entities. The inability of the Giant Bomb audience at-large to accept (100% legitimate) criticism of the site, even if they do not agree with it, is embarrassing to me personally, as a part of that audience. The way many of them reacted is disgusting. While all of those who said reprehensible things to Samantha Allen (and others) certainly were not truly dedicated members of the site, some of them certainly were. Using the "it's not all of us" excuse is tired, and is a way to hand-wave this very real problem that reflects on all of us who enjoy the site.

Giant Bomb is a site that has paid serious attention in fits and starts to the issues of minority representation in games journalism and the industry at-large. They had an opportunity to do something uniquely good in that vein. They chose not to take that opportunity, which I found extremely disappointing given their previous record. This does not mean the hiring decision they did make was "bad". It does not imply a bias on my part against white males. It is an opinion I have a right to have, and to express, as does EVERYONE, without being subject to grotesque harassment.

I hope that the people in this thread who are deliberately misinterpreting and twisting the very reasonable positions of those who've been critical all take a step back and ask themselves what sort of effect they're trying to have on this community.

@liquidsnakegfer9 said:

Complaining is rarely an effective tool for change, it's much better to let the strength of your work be the agent of change.

Did a black man become president by pointing out how we never had a black president at every turn, or did he become president by making better arguments and interpreting the wants of the voter better than his competitor?

People complaining about the race and gender of who was hired are hypocritical and self-defeating. Argue why someone else would have been better for the job based on the merits of their work and not just because you wanted someone "different."

If Vinny commented on this, it'd be even bigger. ha. People respect Jeff, but they idolize Vinny. If he was out front and center defending the values of the site, that would be something else.

Regardless of the original intentions behind the term, it is most certainly frequently used in a pejorative context - particularly to silence the opinions of others on tumblr and the like. The same applies to 'shitlord' and dubbing a situation 'problematic'.

I don't know man, I'm just saying the way I've heard the word used is generally neutral.

Hopefully, this thread has not gone too far off of the rails from its topic, but I'd love to share my thoughts on the new hires.

I was certainly looking forward to the new hires, to say the least. I know that change is difficult to adjust to, and that some people really resist change. I also knew that a lot of the community would probably be resistant to whoever it was that was selected, no matter how familiar the GB audience was with them. I am certainly still going to give them a fair shake. They've earned it. I look forward to seeing what they bring to the table for UPF this week in particular.

That being said, I am still a little disappointed in the hires. I think I was under the impression, along with some others, that these positions would literally be filled with fresh meat, like a couple of talented and rising unknowns as opposed to some industry vets that the staff are already friendly with. I viewed the new hires as a potential to mix up the current chemistry between the staff members. That potential is still there, but certainly seems less likely because they already have a history together. Jeff even noted in his talk in New York (I forget the name of the school) that it can be difficult to not enclose yourself in a bubble when you've been working with the same people for so long. It's not very entertaining when you have a group of people sitting around agreeing with each other. One way you can change up that chemistry is by hiring some diverse individuals with different viewpoints than your own. Patrick has already touched on this point by expanding his Rolodex, and hopefully Giantbomb will eventually do so.

But, all in all, I have a weird mixed emotion of anticipation and disappointment.

@gaspower: what about something moderated. Like a combined video of members of the giantbomb community apologizing or something. It couldn't be fucked with because it'd be curated.

@gaspower: Perhaps you're right, duder. Still! Here's to hoping that we can prove to individuals outside of GB that even if we disagree (sometimes very very strongly) with ideas, many of us still really do try to keep things productive and welcoming.

@stonyman65 said:

I think @cabbagesensei is constantly using that reply in hopes people will click the link. Basically, what she's saying is that yeah, in an ideal world we really should hire by merit. The thing is, institutionally, that means hiring white dudes, and by extension, inadvertently excluding everyone else. It's not inherently anyone's fault, and nobody is claiming to know the exact answer to what we should do. It's just a call for people to look at a bigger picture.

Seconded top to bottom.

@rorie@notlikelytocare neither cisgender nor cishet are derogatory terms. The prefix cis- (meaning the same as, opposite being trans-) is *Latin*. Cisgender is a scientific term meaning that your sex and gender are aligned. (Transgender is...well, y'know.) Cishet is an abbreviation of two descriptors, not a slur, and nobody uses it as a slur outside of...maybe a few snooty queer people on tumblr. And I'm pretty sure that thebicker link is satire.

Related: http://genderterror.com/2014/01/07/dear-cis-people/

I think the problem with it is that the majority of people it describes don't know what it means and therefore would not describe themselves with it, so it's primary usage is for people it does not describe to refer to people it does describe, and if they are airing grievances about them the general usage of the word can end up being predominantly negative.

For the record, but me squarely in Group 4. On second thought, put me in the "fuck this noise I wanna talk about video games!" group.

@tdot: Is there an easy way to send one person a video clip? Then assemble them into an apology video or something? Put it on youtube and turn off comments. Something.

To a certain degree that is true (name origin/callback ration, subconscious reactions to in person interviews, etc). I'd argue there is little to no institutionalized bias towards straight white males since hiring practices vary between organizations and are generally pretty organic. There are many ways around it all but when it comes right down to it it is impossible to remove that sort of bias without completely removing all visual/vocal communication between organization and applicant. That sort of subconcious bias exists everywhere. Nearly everyone is biased towards attractive people and female teachers give female students higher grades than male students (same vice versa but there is a very low percentage of male teachers). In the end there should be no weight given to any applicant for their physical characteristics and the issue is not solved by trying to unbalance natural bias

Thirded for sure.

Where has anyone said they should have hired an incompetent, unqualified woman instead of a competent, qualified person?