Pretentious Indie Developer Of The Day

Journey creator: "Games are not good enough for adults"

Most video games are just not stimulating enough for grown adults, so says Journey creator Jenova Chen.Speaking in an interview withGamasutra, Chen suggested that for games to appeal to a more mature audience they need to include more "relevant" themes."My biggest complaint for computer games so far is they are not good enough for adults," he said."For adults to enjoy something, they need to have intellectual stimulation, something that's related to real life. Playing poker teaches you how to deceive people, and that's relevant to real life. A headshot with a sniper rifle is not relevant to real life. Games have to be relevant intellectually."You also need depth. You have the adventure - the thrill of the adventure - but you want the goosebumps too."That's clearly something Chen is shooting for with thatgamecompany's next project, which is still under wraps."Can games make you and another human learn something intellectual and relevant from each other?" he asked."Can games make you and another human experience an emotion that's deep enough to touch adults? I'm working on all of that. Making emotional games and making them intellectually relevant; making games where people can connect and come together."Thatgamecompany's last release, thoughtful PSN downloadJourney, picked up a glowing 9/10 from Eurogamer earlier this year.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-05-18-journey-creator-games-are-not-good-enough-for-adults

I think this is not only insulting to gamers, inplying they are not adults and devoid of an adult mind. It's also insulting to other developers. He's not the first Indies developer to talk as if he is some sort of Citizen Kane amongst shit. It's fairly easy to find articles from Jonathan Blow, blowing a lot of old shit as well.

When it comes to sophisticated games designed for an adult mind with "depth" and "adventure" that pertain to "real life". It isn't fluttering leaves or a time manipulating platformer, it's total war. When the title reads "Total War" people typically assume it means "scale" due to thousands of units on screen. Or the fact it's turn-based as well as realtime. This isn't the the entire truth of title though, "Total War" is actually attempting to show every conceivable aspect of war as the examples below show...

• Sex is used as a weapon.
• 
• Religion is used as a weapon.
• 
• Internal corruption is used as a weapon.
• 
• Family integration is used as a weapon.
• 
• Hostages.
• 
• General Loyalty.
• 
• Starvation is used as a weapon.
• 
• Misdirection.
• 
• Foreign trade as well as local.
• 
• Becoming Vassal for a clan.
• 
• Even, weather is used as a weapon.
• 

Everything I mentioned above, doesn't involve or require physical combat. If we did take combat into account, this blog post would probably consist of multiple decisions you make in Total War are, in the context of gameplay, more important and arguably more felt than that supposed open ended titles such as "mass effect" . An experienced agent, can cripple an army, cause mass rebellion or outside turn a region to your own side. Unlike "twitch" games, the agents operate on stats, the higher a level an agent is, the higher the chances of success. When one of your agents dies, that potentially 20+ hours of leveling down the tube. Agents dying in Shogun 2 can cause you to loose, period. They not only die by being killed by other agents, they can outright turn against you. Likewise, Shogun 2 uses the illusion of turns to encapsulates an extended time period, agents can die of old age. Indeed any character can. Generals start as 16 year old boys and die 60 year old men. They leave offspring who themselves become generals or daughters you can marry off to strengthen relations with other clans or adopt generals as part of your family If you simply leave a general to sit in a base, or a general constantly looses battles, they developed negative traits, which effect their loyalty, standing within provinces, effectiveness on the battlefield and effectiveness in handling royalties, troop replishment and so fourth.

Keeping units, any unit, alive, matters. Aside from the time it takes to replenish, they level up. Becomes strong, faster, better trains. Moral strengthens, lessening the chance they will route during a battle. Likewise with generals, leveling and keeping them alive, matters. Significantly. To the point a well developed general, with well developed troops, can defeat enemy units of much greater magnitude in number.

This is a very brief rundown of some the the open ended variables in Shogun 2, I have missed out (and probably regret) adding many others. Shogun 2 is a multiplayer game epic in scope. Educational while entertaining. Demonstrating the incredible visual awe of war arguably better than any war movie can. From the huge, thousand upon thousands of men battles, to singular management of people it goes to lengths. Heck, even to the point of have horses aimlessly wander around in panic when the rider has been killed, they too, pile as corpses along with the humans.

Two of the best discriptions come from "EUROGAMER" and "EDGE"

Eurogamer discribed this title as -

"In some ways, it's the closest we've come to the enormous social novel from the period after that which Empire chronicles: it's a Tolstoy-esque War and Peace of a game. Its problems may be the inevitable problems of trying something with such sheer scope. As such, if you want the breathtaking vision of the game, you have to accept the flaws in the details - for now, at least..."

Edge discribed it as -

"No other game takes on whole eras of combat with such a combination of respect and fetishism for the rules and wisdom of battle, and no series treats history like such a serious playground of possibilities, yet features such comic-book characters..."

It's also one of the few games that has transcended being a entertainment product into the realm of being used as a educational tool. Replicating historical battles for the history channel. Being used in another BBC television program once again attempting to replicate and demonstrate epic battles. Flight simulators and army simulators are typically used a training before becoming an entertainment product. With Total War, this was the other way around.

To sum up, this fellow can easily be shot down with many not a few pc titles. I simply chose Total War because it seemed like the most obvious choice, one i'm very familiar with and talk about with enthusiasm. Both newer and very old titles can be used to shoot down what he is saying. Planescape Torment for example. If this Chen fellow attempts to claim it isn't designed for an adult mind, lacks depth or adventure, then he is on another planet. Probably the same one as Jonathan Blow and David Cage.

Journey creator: "Games are not good enough for adults"

Most video games are just not stimulating enough for grown adults, so says Journey creator Jenova Chen.Speaking in an interview withGamasutra, Chen suggested that for games to appeal to a more mature audience they need to include more "relevant" themes."My biggest complaint for computer games so far is they are not good enough for adults," he said."For adults to enjoy something, they need to have intellectual stimulation, something that's related to real life. Playing poker teaches you how to deceive people, and that's relevant to real life. A headshot with a sniper rifle is not relevant to real life. Games have to be relevant intellectually."You also need depth. You have the adventure - the thrill of the adventure - but you want the goosebumps too."That's clearly something Chen is shooting for with thatgamecompany's next project, which is still under wraps."Can games make you and another human learn something intellectual and relevant from each other?" he asked."Can games make you and another human experience an emotion that's deep enough to touch adults? I'm working on all of that. Making emotional games and making them intellectually relevant; making games where people can connect and come together."Thatgamecompany's last release, thoughtful PSN downloadJourney, picked up a glowing 9/10 from Eurogamer earlier this year.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-05-18-journey-creator-games-are-not-good-enough-for-adults

I think this is not only insulting to gamers, inplying they are not adults and devoid of an adult mind. It's also insulting to other developers. He's not the first Indies developer to talk as if he is some sort of Citizen Kane amongst shit. It's fairly easy to find articles from Jonathan Blow, blowing a lot of old shit as well.

When it comes to sophisticated games designed for an adult mind with "depth" and "adventure" that pertain to "real life". It isn't fluttering leaves or a time manipulating platformer, it's total war. When the title reads "Total War" people typically assume it means "scale" due to thousands of units on screen. Or the fact it's turn-based as well as realtime. This isn't the the entire truth of title though, "Total War" is actually attempting to show every conceivable aspect of war as the examples below show...

• Sex is used as a weapon.
• 
• Religion is used as a weapon.
• 
• Internal corruption is used as a weapon.
• 
• Family integration is used as a weapon.
• 
• Hostages.
• 
• General Loyalty.
• 
• Starvation is used as a weapon.
• 
• Misdirection.
• 
• Foreign trade as well as local.
• 
• Becoming Vassal for a clan.
• 
• Even, weather is used as a weapon.
• 

Everything I mentioned above, doesn't involve or require physical combat. If we did take combat into account, this blog post would probably consist of multiple decisions you make in Total War are, in the context of gameplay, more important and arguably more felt than that supposed open ended titles such as "mass effect" . An experienced agent, can cripple an army, cause mass rebellion or outside turn a region to your own side. Unlike "twitch" games, the agents operate on stats, the higher a level an agent is, the higher the chances of success. When one of your agents dies, that potentially 20+ hours of leveling down the tube. Agents dying in Shogun 2 can cause you to loose, period. They not only die by being killed by other agents, they can outright turn against you. Likewise, Shogun 2 uses the illusion of turns to encapsulates an extended time period, agents can die of old age. Indeed any character can. Generals start as 16 year old boys and die 60 year old men. They leave offspring who themselves become generals or daughters you can marry off to strengthen relations with other clans or adopt generals as part of your family If you simply leave a general to sit in a base, or a general constantly looses battles, they developed negative traits, which effect their loyalty, standing within provinces, effectiveness on the battlefield and effectiveness in handling royalties, troop replishment and so fourth.

Keeping units, any unit, alive, matters. Aside from the time it takes to replenish, they level up. Becomes strong, faster, better trains. Moral strengthens, lessening the chance they will route during a battle. Likewise with generals, leveling and keeping them alive, matters. Significantly. To the point a well developed general, with well developed troops, can defeat enemy units of much greater magnitude in number.

This is a very brief rundown of some the the open ended variables in Shogun 2, I have missed out (and probably regret) adding many others. Shogun 2 is a multiplayer game epic in scope. Educational while entertaining. Demonstrating the incredible visual awe of war arguably better than any war movie can. From the huge, thousand upon thousands of men battles, to singular management of people it goes to lengths. Heck, even to the point of have horses aimlessly wander around in panic when the rider has been killed, they too, pile as corpses along with the humans.

Two of the best discriptions come from "EUROGAMER" and "EDGE"

Eurogamer discribed this title as -

"In some ways, it's the closest we've come to the enormous social novel from the period after that which Empire chronicles: it's a Tolstoy-esque War and Peace of a game. Its problems may be the inevitable problems of trying something with such sheer scope. As such, if you want the breathtaking vision of the game, you have to accept the flaws in the details - for now, at least..."

Edge discribed it as -

"No other game takes on whole eras of combat with such a combination of respect and fetishism for the rules and wisdom of battle, and no series treats history like such a serious playground of possibilities, yet features such comic-book characters..."

It's also one of the few games that has transcended being a entertainment product into the realm of being used as a educational tool. Replicating historical battles for the history channel. Being used in another BBC television program once again attempting to replicate and demonstrate epic battles. Flight simulators and army simulators are typically used a training before becoming an entertainment product. With Total War, this was the other way around.

To sum up, this fellow can easily be shot down with many not a few pc titles. I simply chose Total War because it seemed like the most obvious choice, one i'm very familiar with and talk about with enthusiasm. Both newer and very old titles can be used to shoot down what he is saying. Planescape Torment for example. If this Chen fellow attempts to claim it isn't designed for an adult mind, lacks depth or adventure, then he is on another planet. Probably the same one as Jonathan Blow and David Cage.

Actually, if I may ask, could you give me a list of only 5 games that encompass every aspect he mentioned?

total... war?

whats a total war?

Total War is the best game ever created, you guys.

I find this entertaining due to the fact that Journey is barely a game.

Everything is a weapon!

I dont usually play games because I want something that I can get by watching tv the discovery channel or the news, I play games because I want to escape from the world. Realism is fine if you want me to relate to the world im in, but I dont want to have my real life problems chase me into the game world.

Also Kane was the guy in the movie, the guy who made the movie was Orson Welles.

Jenova Chen is smarter than you. Get over it.

More shogun 2 ranting...

I think you two should get married, you and that game that you so dearly love.

Gamelover

seriously do you work for Sega/Creative Assembly?

Oh Spocky...

...Indie developers came to save the day! But yeah, their statement was very dumb. My father is 41 years old and loves Gears Of War. And that's not counting the number of adults who play Angry Birds. And i doubt Angry Birds can be related to real life.
Also:

Total War has its place. Journey has its place. 
 
thatgamecompany has its place. Creative Assembly has its place. 
 
The best thing about this industry is that so many different mindsets can co-exist and find commercial and critical success. 
 
Being insulted that essentially an 'idea guy' has different ideas to you seems silly. Though I agree that, to me, his use of the term 'adult' and 'mature' is misplaced, his sentiments and intentions are genuine and are what lead him to work on his games. That's good enough for me, he doesn't live in a vacuum and he'll be exposed to more and more as he continues to work in the industry, let him live. 

He was attacking shooters and other mainstream violent games. Total War isn't about headshots or any of that so I don't see your point.

You sound pretty butthurt over this.

@Dagbiker said:

I dont usually play games because I want something that I can get by watching tv the discovery channel or the news, I play games because I want to escape from the world. Realism is fine if you want me to relate to the world im in, but I dont want to have my real life problems chase me into the game world.

Also Kane was the guy in the movie, the guy who made the movie was Orson Welles.

With "realistic" titles you can escape from the world. How many 25 million dollar sports cars will you drive today? Will you be able to fight as a Japanese pilot attacking Pearl Harbour any time soon? No. Movies are not interactive. They cannot give you on screen what these video game titles can give. Videogames can give you that fantasy, as well as a realistic experience. Also Citizen Kane was a highly rated movie. Considered one of the best in American movie history. Way above 90% of the crap round about it. Thus the very excellent comparison was made.

@whyareyoucrouchingspock said:

PRETENTIOUS INDIE DEVELOPER OF THE DAY

Journey creator: "Games are not good enough for adults"

Most video games are just not stimulating enough for grown adults, so says Journey creator Jenova Chen.Speaking in an interview withGamasutra, Chen suggested that for games to appeal to a more mature audience they need to include more "relevant" themes."My biggest complaint for computer games so far is they are not good enough for adults," he said."For adults to enjoy something, they need to have intellectual stimulation, something that's related to real life. Playing poker teaches you how to deceive people, and that's relevant to real life. A headshot with a sniper rifle is not relevant to real life. Games have to be relevant intellectually."You also need depth. You have the adventure - the thrill of the adventure - but you want the goosebumps too."That's clearly something Chen is shooting for with thatgamecompany's next project, which is still under wraps."Can games make you and another human learn something intellectual and relevant from each other?" he asked."Can games make you and another human experience an emotion that's deep enough to touch adults? I'm working on all of that. Making emotional games and making them intellectually relevant; making games where people can connect and come together."Thatgamecompany's last release, thoughtful PSN downloadJourney, picked up a glowing 9/10 from Eurogamer earlier this year.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-05-18-journey-creator-games-are-not-good-enough-for-adults

I think this is not only insulting to gamers, inplying they are not adults and devoid of an adult mind. It's also insulting to other developers. He's not the first Indies developer to talk as if he is some sort of Citizen Kane amongst shit. It's fairly easy to find articles from Jonathan Blow, blowing a lot of old shit as well.

When it comes to sophisticated games designed for an adult mind with "depth" and "adventure" that pertain to "real life". It isn't fluttering leaves or a time manipulating platformer, it's total war. When the title reads "Total War" people typically assume it means "scale" due to thousands of units on screen. Or the fact it's turn-based as well as realtime. This isn't the the entire truth of title though, "Total War" is actually attempting to show every conceivable aspect of war as the examples below show...

If you can do this every day though, I'll be amused.

He's just making a controversial statement to try to create buzz for his new game.

Total War is the Citizen Kane of video games. You heard it here first.

@GabrielNox said:

Actually, if I may ask, could you give me a list of only 5 games that encompass every aspect he mentioned?

intellectual stimulation

something that's related to real life

adventure

Depth

Also, I have to ask. What "depth" has Journey got? How is it more relevant than human history?

I suppose I can see the adventure aspect but really, thats about it.

@whyareyoucrouchingspock said:

@Dagbiker said:

I dont usually play games because I want something that I can get by watching tv the discovery channel or the news, I play games because I want to escape from the world. Realism is fine if you want me to relate to the world im in, but I dont want to have my real life problems chase me into the game world.

Also Kane was the guy in the movie, the guy who made the movie was Orson Welles.

With "realistic" titles you can escape from the world. How many 25 million dollar sports cars will you drive today? Will you be able to fight as a Japanese pilot attacking Pearl Harbour any time soon? No. Movies are interactive. They cannot give you on screen what these video game titles can give. Videogames can give you that fantasy, as well as a realistic experience. Also Citizen Kane was a highly rated movie. Considered one of the best in American movie history. Way above 90% of the crap round about it. Thus the very excellent comparison was made.

Calm down, I was just saying why I play games. I too like Citizen Kane, i was just commenting on this sentence:

He's not the first Indies developer to talk as if he is some sort of Citizen Kane amongst shit.

@Animasta said:

total... war?

total... war

@Cloudenvy said:

Total War is the best game ever created, you guys.

Of course! A first person shooter with dating sim elements, what else could you ask from a game?

Nobody cares.

@Napalm said:

Nobody cares.

Your reply at attempting to seem hip and cool dude by saying "you dont care" purposefully showing an attempt at displaying apathy in front of other people i (like mentioned before to try look like a cool dude) shows you care very much. Also the cool dude attempt has failed since the MTV generation attitude is rather redundant. It was redundant about a decade or so back.

@whyareyoucrouchingspock said:

@Napalm said:

Nobody cares.

Your reply at attempting to seem hip and cool dude by saying "you dont care" purposefully showing an attempt at displaying apathy in front of other people i (like mentioned before to try look like a cool dude) shows you care very much.

Or as you usually put it he's trying to be a hipster nihilist.

@AlexanderSheen:

You have no idea how happy that game would make me.

And games, in general, are like Total War. 
 
As a whole, all videogames share those characteristics?

I can see where he's coming from- the problem here being as with many statements: he seems to be only looking at things from one perspective.

He only provides one perspective/definition for 'intellectual stimulation,' which is a heavily subjective theme. As such, he doesn't seem to consider that there are as many interpretations/levels of desire regarding this as there are people in the world.

"A headshot with a sniper rifle is not relevant to real life." Perhaps not... But whether the real-life link is there or not doesn't matter to everyone, as he doesn't seem to consider that there are millions who play to ESCAPE reality rather than find more connections to it. So these headshots could take entertainment/attention priority over 'intellectual stimulation' or even provide enough of their own style of 'intellectual stimulation' for one person, but not for another. Or maybe someone could look at 'intellectual stimulation' as being already present in other areas of the medium- as WhyAreYouCrouchingSpock seems to with Total War. :)

Why would Call of Duty be the complete dominating force that it is? :P Or the Total War series be as successful as it is for that matter?

So only time will tell how successful any push for Chen's brand of 'intellectual stimulation' will be- if it materializes at all. He already has a good sized audience though. And since trends and levels of desire change all the time- who knows how successful such a push could be? :O

@whyareyoucrouchingspock:

Out of all of those the only game I'd consider mature is Deus Ex. The rest are all censored to appeal to the younger audience. Even Portal, a great game and contains a certain amount of symbolism but that went out the window with Portal 2 which became considerably more easy in order to appeal to the wider audience. I think the problem here is that for some reason people consider that adult=mature. It does not, if I ware to express my views on Call of Duty, for example, chances are 50/50 that a 40 year old would show up to yell at me for not thinking it's the best game ever. There are a few games that are made for mature audiences, Witcher being one of the prominent ones but honestly that's about it. The market for mature games is small simply because a mature player wants to experience a story, immersion and debth in his/her own time, alone, while most of the games today are a glorified Facebook with Steam, PSN, XBL, GFWL and the necessity to put multiplayer into everything thus spending less time on the single player game which is these days a thing that they "have" to put in rather then a thing that the whole game is about. Also, Planescape and Deus Ex ware both made when the people using computers required actual knowledge to use the computer and it was viewed as some "weird thing" that people ware wasting time on. The "old generation" games are a rare thing these days so the guy is right, on the other hand his game is not mature but rather a gimmicky "art piece" that allows snobs to go "Ohhh yes, simply splendid.".

@Cloudenvy said:

@AlexanderSheen:

You have no idea how happy that game would make me.

The game would resemble the dating parts of San Andreas but in first person and with more depth to the characters and the relationship itself. It's set in modern day Japan, where the protagonist have to menage the different factions, making friends and making enemies. The love interests part of the factions. The story is in working progress.

@whyareyoucrouchingspock said:

@GabrielNox said:

Actually, if I may ask, could you give me a list of only 5 games that encompass every aspect he mentioned?

...

Also, I have to ask. What "depth" has Journey got? How is it more relevant than human history?

I suppose I can see the adventure aspect but really, thats about it.

AFAIK, Journey's gameplay depth is very limited. It's a nice mood and emotive visual storytelling, maybe a deep message.

I actually think there's more than enough intellectual stimulation in a technically well designed, smart game. Even if it's gamey and doesn't teach me how to get over dead loved ones.

"A headshot with a sniper rifle is not relevant to real life"

And neither is a goal kicked into a net, neither is a good chess tactic, but whaddya know, people sure seem to take those seriously. Sometimes, a great game can just be a great game. I say this as someone who also likes cerebral stuff with messages applicable to real life. But for fuck's sake, quit being so elitist.

@AlexanderSheen said:

@Cloudenvy said:

@AlexanderSheen:

You have no idea how happy that game would make me.

The game would resemble the dating parts of San Andreas but in first person and with more depth to the characters and the relationship itself. It's set in modern day Japan, where the protagonist have to menage the different factions, making friends and making enemies. The love interests part of the factions. The story is in working progress.

I will give you all of the rare treasures, money and minions I have.

Now make the game come out!

@GunstarRed said:

Everything is a weapon!

YOU'RE A WEAPON.

@Cloudenvy said:

@AlexanderSheen said:

@Cloudenvy said:

@AlexanderSheen:

You have no idea how happy that game would make me.

The game would resemble the dating parts of San Andreas but in first person and with more depth to the characters and the relationship itself. It's set in modern day Japan, where the protagonist have to menage the different factions, making friends and making enemies. The love interests part of the factions. The story is in working progress.

I will give you all of the rare treasures, money and minions I have.

Now make the game come out!

My inner Molyneux has awakened. Is there actually a game like this out there? Now that I made up this nonsense, I want to play it.

C.S. Lewis comments on Jenova Chen:

“Critics who treat 'adult' as a term of approval, instead of as a merely descriptive term, cannot be adult themselves. To be concerned about being grown up, to admire the grown up because it is grown up, to blush at the suspicion of being childish; these things are the marks of childhood and adolescence. And in childhood and adolescence they are, in moderation, healthy symptoms. Young things ought to want to grow. But to carry on into middle life or even into early manhood this concern about being adult is a mark of really arrested development. When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.”

I have never played a game with the same level of intellectual stimulation as, say, middling literary fiction. The audience is just too wide, and the common denominator too low. The most 'intellectual' games are just aesthetic-focused, pseudo-mystical experiences. I'm guessing this game = lots of profound third-rate philosophising masquerading as intellectual, which is fine, because as a student I find that real adult intellectualism is fucking boring

@GabrielNox said:

@whyareyoucrouchingspock:

Out of all of those the only game I'd consider mature is Deus Ex. The rest are all censored to appeal to the younger audience

Dont agree at all. IL-2 Sturmovik is clearly designed for an adult audience. Likewise Napoleon is designed primarily for history buffs. Planescape Torment is absolutely designed for an adult mind. Also, a game can be aimed at adults and children. Portal is probably the best example of this. A 65 year old grand-dad or a 7 year old child can enjoy it. Much like how anyone can enjoy a pixar movie. Portal is nigh unverisal in appeal regardless of age, gaming experience or gender. This is because it is one of the greatest titles ever made. Not because it is for dummy dums who go and shoot peoplez in da face.

@GabrielNox said:

@whyareyoucrouchingspock:

Portal 2 which became considerably more easy in order to appeal to the wider audience

Journey is about as easy a game as you can get. Also a game doesn't need to be hard or easy to appeal to adults. Hardcore flight sims and casual motion games have both targeted at adults.

@GabrielNox: @GabrielNox said:

The market for mature games is small simply because a mature player wants to experience a story, immersion and debth in his/her own time

Why would a mature player automatically give a shit about story? It might be a 45 year old adult who enjoys rally cars or golf. Immersion can be acheived in any game. Likewise with depth.

Story, depth and immersion don't equal mature or "not" mature. I only used Total War as an example because thats the argument he was using.

@GabrielNox said:

today are a glorified Facebook with Steam, PSN, XBL, GFWL and the necessity to put multiplayer into everything thus spending less time on the single player game which is these days a thing that they "have"

Thats not true at all. Alot of these arty farty hipster indie games aimed at mature minds exist because of steam. As far as chin stroking indie titles go, steam is where it's at.

@GabrielNox said:

Also, Planescape and Deus Ex ware both made when the people using computers required actual knowledge to use the computer and it was viewed as some "weird thing" that people ware wasting time on. The "old generation" games are a rare thing these days so the guy is right,

Again, I don't agree at all. Games are now diversified. AAA games cost more money to make. And digital distribution is now prominent allowing basically any game, of any quility or size to exist without physical retail or publisher hassle.

@AlexanderSheen said:

@Cloudenvy said:

@AlexanderSheen said:

@Cloudenvy said:

@AlexanderSheen:

You have no idea how happy that game would make me.

The game would resemble the dating parts of San Andreas but in first person and with more depth to the characters and the relationship itself. It's set in modern day Japan, where the protagonist have to menage the different factions, making friends and making enemies. The love interests part of the factions. The story is in working progress.

I will give you all of the rare treasures, money and minions I have.

Now make the game come out!

My inner Molyneux has awakened. Is there actually a game like this out there? Now that I made up this nonsense, I want to play it.

I feel like I can confirm that such a game does not exist. Sadly.

I want to play it too! why do you torture me by coming up with awesome game ideas that will never get made?

You sure do like Total War.

Jenova Chen.. sounds like something straight out of Final Fantasy 7 or something.

I think a lot of these indie devs are just a little too full of themselves. They may not be stupid, but some of the things they blurt out kinda makes them look like a bunch of shit flinging monkeys.

I also just love how some people fail to grasp that the video game industry is about variety more than anything else. Sure, you´re not going to find your adult themes or self reflecting author stories in Rayman Origins.. but these themes do exist in games, and there have been and always will be games that cover those as well. But I guess indies like their attention. There you go Jenova, mission accomplished!

My sex is definetly a weapon!

@Cloudenvy said:

@AlexanderSheen said:

@Cloudenvy said:

@AlexanderSheen said:

@Cloudenvy said:

@AlexanderSheen:

You have no idea how happy that game would make me.

The game would resemble the dating parts of San Andreas but in first person and with more depth to the characters and the relationship itself. It's set in modern day Japan, where the protagonist have to menage the different factions, making friends and making enemies. The love interests part of the factions. The story is in working progress.

I will give you all of the rare treasures, money and minions I have.

Now make the game come out!

My inner Molyneux has awakened. Is there actually a game like this out there? Now that I made up this nonsense, I want to play it.

I feel like I can confirm that such a game does not exist. Sadly.

I want to play it too! why do you torture me by coming up with awesome game ideas that will never get made?

If any game dev reading this: the idea is free, just make something with it, please.

P.S.: Guess what, we start derailing this one too :D

@AlexanderSheen said:

@Cloudenvy said:

@AlexanderSheen said:

@Cloudenvy said:

@AlexanderSheen said:

@Cloudenvy said:

@AlexanderSheen:

You have no idea how happy that game would make me.

The game would resemble the dating parts of San Andreas but in first person and with more depth to the characters and the relationship itself. It's set in modern day Japan, where the protagonist have to menage the different factions, making friends and making enemies. The love interests part of the factions. The story is in working progress.

I will give you all of the rare treasures, money and minions I have.

Now make the game come out!

My inner Molyneux has awakened. Is there actually a game like this out there? Now that I made up this nonsense, I want to play it.

I feel like I can confirm that such a game does not exist. Sadly.

I want to play it too! why do you torture me by coming up with awesome game ideas that will never get made?

If any game dev reading this: the idea is free, just make something with it, please.

P.S.: Guess what, we start derailing this one too :D

Oh jebus, you're right. I guess we just can't help ourselves.

...Indie developers came to save the day! But yeah, their statement was very dumb. My father is 41 years old and loves Gears Of War. And that's not counting the number of adults who play Angry Birds. And i doubt Angry Birds can be related to real life.
Also:

@whyareyoucrouchingspock

I can see this going for a long time, alas, this is my final post as I'm still under restrictions so I shall take my leave. Before I go though:

You are a person who has made a rage post about another persons opinion and have insulted the said person several times because of it. Furthermore you wrote a whole ode towards a game that shows a rather light side of the era it's set in. This is my personal opinion but I consider a mature game a game that sometimes doesn't let you win, doesn't let you save, doesn't let you be the "badass mofo" you play these games for. All the games you mentioned, do (Not including Planescape and IL-2 which I did not play all that much so I'd rather not form an opinion on them).

Be that as it may, at the end of the day, maturity is in the eye of the beholder and I doubt you'd be able to find many people who'd claim they are not mature. Games are games, would a mature person really play a game of war and find it "fun"? Wouldn't a mature person know more about war and would be offended by people glorifying it as a form of entertainment? Who cares? Maturity is an opinion and a belief. It is not fact and can not be proven thus this whole "My game is more mature then your game" bit is quite pointless.

How is what he said offensive to gamers? If you read between the lines all he's saying is that games in general rely too heavily on violence, and he is making strides to provide an alternative to fill the perceived gap that's left.

While I enjoy violence in my media as much as the next guy, there is definitely plenty of that to go around, and thank goodness for Chen, Blow, Cage and anyone else trying to do something new or different. Even if their games aren't new or different, it's still necessary to have alternatives to the norm (which is of course gun-based M-rated violence).

And for the record, he's also said in the past that he enjoys competitive first person shooters, and takes pride in being good at them. So, again, I don't see who he's offending here, seeing as he's an adult gamer who enjoys games which are --as a pedant might say-- 'not good enough for himself'.

and journey was suppose to be for adults?

God I loved time commanders.

@EarlessShrimp said:

@GunstarRed said:

Everything is a weapon!

YOU'RE A WEAPON.

I AM THE WEAPON, FUCK YES.

Phew, for a minute there, I lost myself, I lost myselffffffff